Mod G4 iMac with Intel Mac mini innards?

[jberg44]

Speakers

Hey MacOdyssey: very smart to replace only the lcd glass and I'm glad youre not having any loss of power to the backlights. Good luck with the soldering I know how horrible those wires are. I saw how you cut the ends off, I may have an extra intact 17 inch neck - let me know if you feel like the solder is unstable and would like me to try to dig it up.

Similar to the LCD controller being on the mobo, the amp for the speakers is also on the mobo. So you could either build your own amp or buy a compatible amp. The only two with a minijack that I know of are the iFire (expensive) - needs a firewire port or the griffin powerwave adapter. While a sealed box will usually run $100 on ebay, you do not need the speaker wires or cd so you can get it a used one for considerably cheaper. I used the powerwave, its small, can fit in the base, and uses USB.

The machine its hooked up to is a hackintosh, I just wanted to play around with the windows 7 touch features

 

[MacOdyssey]

RE: Speakers

Wow jberg44, that's really generous of you to offer. I did have one of the wires break, but I think I'll be able to fix it. Other than that though, my soldering of the neck cables seems to be successful. Again, thanks for the offer though.

I knew about the iFire and have ebay set up to send me an email every time a somebody posts one, but like you said, they go for way over $100. I've looked around online for the Griffin PowerWave but haven't been able to find it for sale anywhere. Any ideas on that?

I would also love to build my own amp. I have no experience in the area but am confident I could find a good tutorial online. What are the specs it would need though? Do you know the power requirements of the Apple ProSpeakers?

 

[jberg44]

Pro Speakers

They are 10W speakers, but can handle up to 18W. I got a used powerwave for $50 on ebay, that was a long time ago though. The cheapest and easiest solution may be to buy a cheap pair of 10W-15W powered USB speakers and use the amp in them. You'd end up having to cut and splice the 2.5mm jack, but if you make your own amp you'd have to do that anyway.

 

[jindor]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PgISUgKtHCA

Putting a mac mini in the base is possible, but you will have to open up your mini or modify the faraday cage inside the imac g4 (its thick metal) for it to fit.

If you want to use the existing TMDS lcd you will need a TMDS controller
this is the only one i've been able to find:

http://agilentpixel.com/product.php?id_product=76

It does work with the 17" panel (LM171W02 A4) and it is possible (although difficult) to change the pin layout and use the existing wires in the neck. However, I was not able to get the existing inverter to work with it. Because there is no room for other inverters in the monitor case, it would have to be mounted on the back of the monitor.

For me, the solder of the TMDS cable was unstable and kept breaking (there are 16 wires - and they are very thin when stripped). My solution was to replace the whole monitor. Initially I tried using an apple cinema display, but it was too heavy for tilting. I ended up getting an LG monitor, putting it into the 20 inch housing and making a shelf on the back for the inverter, touch controller, and lcd controller. I've included pics of the shelf, which is currently temporary, until I decide what to make the final version out of (maybe plexiglass) on the back.

I also had bought a 17 inch hp monitor to create a 17 inch version, but I actually liked the look of the monitor so decided to paint the base black. It has a resistive touch screen.

I'm also one of those who have been watching this thread for a long time, looking forward to someone making a breakthrough. It is so nice to see jberg44 made it even though it might not be exactly the way most of people would expect.

My wish is simple: I don't want sell off my beautiful 20" iMac G4, nor do I want to keep it in the corner of my room just gathering dusts; I want to use it everyday. I also wanted to be able to cram Mac mini innards into G4 but I kept lowering my expectation down to the point where I would be content if I could just use its screen part; I wouldn't mind taking all the guts of G4 if it's necessary; I wouldn't mind putting a Mac mini next to it, hooked up to iMac screen through external cable.

jberg44, I don't know much about all this hardware - but do you think it would be possible to keep iMac screen as-is, not replacing it with LG monitor like you did, and connect it to external Mac mini? You said there's not enough room for the extra TMDS controller. Would it be possible to put it inside G4 body if I took all the guts out?

 

[MacOdyssey]

My wish is simple: I don't want sell off my beautiful 20" iMac G4, nor do I want to keep it in the corner of my room just gathering dusts; I want to use it everyday. I also wanted to be able to cram Mac mini innards into G4 but I kept lowering my expectation down to the point where I would be content if I could just use its screen part; I wouldn't mind taking all the guts of G4 if it's necessary; I wouldn't mind putting a Mac mini next to it, hooked up to iMac screen through external cable.

Hey jindor, Your simple wish is exactly what I've been working on the past month. I've gone the rout of replacing the iMac's monitor with a new off the shelf unit. I almost done modding the screen and preparing to move on to the Mac mini part of the mod. I'm just troubleshooting some sort of weird issues with the video signal.

Check it out: http://thegreatmod.blogspot.com/

 

[jberg44]

Use existing screen

Jindor - you can use the existing screen, you just need a TMDS controller like the one I mentioned earlier (only ever used it for the 17 inch panel, so I can not confirm that this controller will work for the 20 inch panel) just email them the panel number and they can program it for you. By switching 2 pins you can use the existing wires in the neck. And yes tyhe controller would easily fit in the base. The problem is with stability. The wires are very fragile - they break very easily. The TMDS controller and inverter are very small (I can show you pics) - if you don't mind putting it on the back of your monitor - you can very easily connect it with a separate cable to any DVI or VGA source you like.

Alternatively, if a TMDS controller is a problem, the 20 inch imac G5 uses the same exact panel, but with a standard LVDS connection. If you could find a iMac G5 panel you can always swap them and then use a standard LCD controller. This can quickly become very expensive, so be careful.

 

[jindor]

Hey jindor, Your simple wish is exactly what I've been working on the past month. I've gone the rout of replacing the iMac's monitor with a new off the shelf unit. I almost done modding the screen and preparing to move on to the Mac mini part of the mod. I'm just troubleshooting some sort of weird issues with the video signal.

Check it out: http://thegreatmod.blogspot.com/

MacOdyssey - thanks a lot! I wasn't knowledgeable enough to appreciate what you're doing. Please keep up good work and share the good news with us.

Jindor - you can use the existing screen, you just need a TMDS controller like the one I mentioned earlier (only ever used it for the 17 inch panel, so I can not confirm that this controller will work for the 20 inch panel) just email them the panel number and they can program it for you. By switching 2 pins you can use the existing wires in the neck. And yes tyhe controller would easily fit in the base. The problem is with stability. The wires are very fragile - they break very easily. The TMDS controller and inverter are very small (I can show you pics) - if you don't mind putting it on the back of your monitor - you can very easily connect it with a separate cable to any DVI or VGA source you like.

Alternatively, if a TMDS controller is a problem, the 20 inch imac G5 uses the same exact panel, but with a standard LVDS connection. If you could find a iMac G5 panel you can always swap them and then use a standard LCD controller. This can quickly become very expensive, so be careful.

Is the TMDS controller the one in the link http://agilentpixel.com/product.php?id_product=76 ? I wonder how big it actually is. Is it about the size of cigarette pack? If it worked with 20" screen maybe it would be the first thing I'd like to try out. I'm all thumb at this stuff. Could you kindly point me some info about how this module should be hooked up to the LCD screen? Clueless as to how to open up the screen part in the first place, and what those two pins you mentioned are...

Anyhow I'm so glad we finally have two guys shedding us lights! Thank you MacOdyssey and jberg44!

 

[newspimp]

Sorry I haven't been around much to contribute too much to the proceedings lately. I have been working on this project of mine (getting a standard 20" iMac screen, with existing base and cables and panel, to accept a standard DVI signal)

Good news was in that researching the panel and the DVI spec (which uses TMDS signalling) was that the TMDS input of the panel appears to be VERY DVI compliant. Except for one thing, which I haven't found a way around yet. DVI spec shows a TMDS signal at 165MHz. The IDTech panel accepts TMDS signalling at 117.5MHz.

Still haven't given up, but a new house, new job and the process of building an IT department and gearing up a manufacturing line has sucked my free time away like no other lately.

 

[Clive At Five]

Wow, I'm incredibly impressed with all the progressing going on here...

I'm especially interested in your findings, newspimp, as it sounds like a more "natural" solution. By no means to understate your awesome mod, MacOdyssey... 'Wow' all around!

-Clive

 

[greg88]

The card sold at agilentpixel.com looks pretty straightforward.

jberg: A few questions...

Your'e saying that I need to inform someone at agilentpixel.com of my panel number before ordering, switch around two pins and I'll be in business?

 

[jberg44]

TMDS controller

Jindor and greg88,
I can confirm that the controller works with the existing 17 inch panel. I have included a picture next to a pack of gum so you can judge the size. The inverter is located at the bottom of the picture. In addition there is a rather long keypad needed to supply power and menu buttons.

I will look to see if I saved the pin layouts, but essentially what you'll see is that there are 16 wires connected to a 20 pin connector that goes into the monitor. First confirm that the board works (my first was DOA). Then label the wires and where they connect to on the controller board. You'll see there are 8 larger wires (red and black) and paired smaller wires (blue and white). You need to essentially make the same cord using the existing wire in the neck. Two wires have to be moved (I believe it was the larger white and black wires on the existing cable running through the neck to mimic the positions on the cable included with the TMDS controller). You'll see that the imac cable has 8 paired wires - 4 pairs - (red and green) - these correspond to the blue and white wires on the controller. Then you have to carefully get the hollow pins out of the part of the imac cord that connects to the g4 motherboard. The main problem is that the pins on the tmds controller are too big to fit into the hollow pins on the existing wire in the imac neck. So you can either solder on new pins or forcibly press the the pins into the board (like I did), which results in a high chance of breaking them.

Problems:
1) The inverter - when I wired the inverter to backlight wires through the neck I had a noticeable drop in brightness. MacOdyessy did not have this same problem, this may be related to that particular inverter, I can't be sure.
2) The keypad - you either need to solder up new buttons or find a place to put the keypad.
3) Stability - These wires break easily, I had successful video for probably 20 minutes - I moved it - one wire broke - and then another etc It is very easy to damage both the controller and the lcd panel. (I did both) Eventually I decided that I couldnt get it stable enough to count on and changed my design.

Again, I only ever used this with the 17 inch version and was never able to get video that was consistently stable. I also burnt out both an lcd panel and a controller before I got any success - so proceed with caution and good luck.

 

[cosmic-kid]

bummer

I know it's disheartening, but it sounds like this idea is dead. With that board costing over $65, and the problems experienced trying to get it to work, it sounds more feasible to just buy a well-fitting 17" lcd and replace it. That really sucks for me. LOL

Oh well, time to look for a decent monitor to go in there...

 

[jberg44]

It's been done

This gentleman got it working and wired through the neck of a 17" iMac G4 using a similar controller with a TMDS channel and the existing LCD. It can be done, but it just takes serious wiring and soldering skills and a lot of patience.

http://www.insanelymac.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=194409

http://blugray.tistory.com/

If he can fit a mini ITX Zotac Board in there, a mac mini shouldnt be a problem.

Also, he was able to wire an extension for the inverter to backlights (the inverter appears to be the exact same type i used) without a drop in brightness, so it appears the inverter I used was likely faulty.

 

[MacOdyssey]

Screen Blinking

So I've asked on my blog, but I figured I put the question to the presumably larger audience here.

I have having a major problem with my replacement LCD. So I had it all working Perfectly. Then I used the wires in the neck of the iMac to extend the video and backlight wires. All the connections are good (multimeter tested 3 times) and all the wires were in the right place.

However, when I plug the VGA cable into my MacBook's DisplayPort, The backlight comes up for 1 second before turning off. The picture displayed on the screen remains but it blinks on and off erratically. When I unplug my MacBook, The backlight turns on again for 1 second and the standard "No input detected" message comes up crystal clear and remains up without blinking for several more seconds after the backlight turns back off.

Any ideas?

 

[jberg44]

Are you still using the existing wires in the imac neck?

Are you sure that the 20 pin connector that plugs into the back of the monitor is making good contact with the pins in the monitor? Sometimes when you press that connector in you can actually displace the pins downward. Also if you've been handling them a lot the grease from your fingers can interfere with the signal, try cleaning them with some alcohol.

These video cables are just very sensitive and even one problem connection can cause what your describing. Good luck.

 

[jindor]

This gentleman got it working and wired through the neck of a 17" iMac G4 using a similar controller with a TMDS channel and the existing LCD. It can be done, but it just takes serious wiring and soldering skills and a lot of patience.

http://www.insanelymac.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=194409

http://blugray.tistory.com/

If he can fit a mini ITX Zotac Board in there, a mac mini shouldnt be a problem.

Also, he was able to wire an extension for the inverter to backlights (the inverter appears to be the exact same type i used) without a drop in brightness, so it appears the inverter I used was likely faulty.

This is a great find! Thanks a lot jberg44. What's incredible in his story is that he claims he never has done any soldering before. Since he is a Korean (so am I), I might be able to get closer help from him. Can't wait to see my 20" iMac reincarnated!

He also mentioned the first inverter he used got broken, had to replace it with a new one.

 

[Rhetro]

Any luck with the innard swap of an imac g4 lampstand?

Hello.

I just realized how old this thread was and I'm hoping that someone has found a more recent way to do this other than what's posted in the link above:

http://www.insanelymac.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=194409

I agree, the old mac iLamp is the coolest model I've seen, and it really lights up (no pun intended) ones desk.

Thanks in advance.

 

[ballin805]

does any one know what kind of Inverer?????

Hello i am new at this thread and was very interested on what exact model was the inverter on Mr.Blugray's setup i have three imacs to spare and i have already ordered the exact same mother bord along with hard ware if someone is out their that could translate with Mr.Blugray and let us know then we cuold congratulate the man for solving a thread that has gone for years.
i just want to know what inverter along with the controller and pin setup all i have is this (rtd2033v) as inverter i am very desperate to know what model along with controller plz. thank you for your time and thank you guys for all your hard work out their.

 

[ravenvii]

Wow, I realize this is an old thread, but boy is that cool!

I loved my iMac G4 way back when. I was blown away by the unveiling of the 17"er back in 2002. That there's the old days.

 

[Pitrako]

Hi!

Another one interested in rebirth a Imac G4 20" with include a Mac mini inside!!!

I want to keep the original LCD panel in my surgery, but my question is if the AP-CTRL-GNS-DVI/VGA-TMDS controller from Agilentpixel will work with the 20" panel!!!...

Do you have information about the controller used by http://blugray.tistory.com/ ???

Do you know the brand of the 20" panel? joust to ask to the Agilentpixel crew if will works with his controller...

Well, a soon as know if the Agilentpixel controller will works wint the 20" panel I´ll start to do my mod.

Here you can check it out another G5 case mod I did.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rXKN6Kqz4xo

Cheers

 

[fertilized-egg]

The LCD, according to blugray, is the LG LM171W02(A4)(M1). He bought the controller off an auction site in Korea. Apparently the tricky part was extending the display signal cables all the way to the body part of the iMac by soldiering the cables. The original circuit was a petite thing tiny enough to be placed right beside the LCD panel, but the one he used wasn't.

On the surface it looks like a fun little project but according to blugray the whole thing still took him three months and a considerable amount of cash. I briefly entertained the idea of hawking around my town to see if there's any old broken iMac being sold for peanuts but after reading his story again, it surely doesn't look like I'm quite dedicated enough to pull it off. Of course, I'm sure blugray did it all for his children, trying to be a good daddy giving the young'uns the gift of iMac. Otherwise why would a person spend so much effort and money on such project, amrite?

Who knows, maybe Apple will bring it back one day, along with the old Cube. Ummmm, Cube.....

 

[jindor]

Hi!

Another one interested in rebirth a Imac G4 20" with include a Mac mini inside!!!

I want to keep the original LCD panel in my surgery, but my question is if the AP-CTRL-GNS-DVI/VGA-TMDS controller from Agilentpixel will work with the 20" panel!!!...

Do you have information about the controller used by http://blugray.tistory.com/ ???

Do you know the brand of the 20" panel? joust to ask to the Agilentpixel crew if will works with his controller...

Well, a soon as know if the Agilentpixel controller will works wint the 20" panel I´ll start to do my mod.

Here you can check it out another G5 case mod I did.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rXKN6Kqz4xo

Cheers

Did you contact him? I also have a 20" iMac, sent him an email as instructed in his site about the steps for ordering the controller, but haven't got any response back. From what I found about the LCD panel in G4, it's same as the one in iMac G5 http://bit.ly/6F9ToJ though it's based on LVDS not on TMDS...

Hello i am new at this thread and was very interested on what exact model was the inverter on Mr.Blugray's setup i have three imacs to spare and i have already ordered the exact same mother bord along with hard ware if someone is out their that could translate with Mr.Blugray and let us know then we cuold congratulate the man for solving a thread that has gone for years.
i just want to know what inverter along with the controller and pin setup all i have is this (rtd2033v) as inverter i am very desperate to know what model along with controller plz. thank you for your time and thank you guys for all your hard work out their.

Blugray says he didn't have to worry about the inverter since what he purchased was a controller kit which includes both the AD controller and the inverter matched to it.

 

[ballin805]

Blugray says he didn't have to worry about the inverter since what he purchased was a controller kit which includes both the AD controller and the inverter matched to it.

thanks for the reply jindor my question was what exact controller and inverter did he used because it worked really good if you do have contact with Mr.Blugray can you ask him to enlighten us on what inverter along with controller he used to make the screen work. there are a lot of people who still own these machines and want to get a few more years out of their screens rather than to pay $800 to $1000 us dollars why not build your own for under $400 i will be receiving my mother board and hard drive this Tuesday i payed $210 with shipping all i need is the inverter and controller and i don't want to mess it up.
thanks for your time Mr.jindor

 

[jindor]

thanks for the reply jindor my question was what exact controller and inverter did he used because it worked really good if you do have contact with Mr.Blugray can you ask him to enlighten us on what inverter along with controller he used to make the screen work. there are a lot of people who still own these machines and want to get a few more years out of their screens rather than to pay $800 to $1000 us dollars why not build your own for under $400 i will be receiving my mother board and hard drive this Tuesday i payed $210 with shipping all i need is the inverter and controller and i don't want to mess it up.
thanks for your time Mr.jindor

Hm, this is the online shop (ebay-owned Korean auction site. Maybe best viewed with IE) where blugray got the kit. It has a listing of the panel models they support. Unfortunately it doesn't have detailed descriptions as to what model number the inverter and controller have. All the orders are done based on the panel model only. The ad says "AD boards for your laptop screen panel are available. Give us the description of the LCD panel, and we'll get the right one customized and ship out to you. The kit includes corresponding cable, inverter". I think you had better try out Agilent Pixel. The shop owner seems to be back after a long break.

 

[ballin805]

LOOK at what i found....

Hm, this is the online shop (ebay-owned Korean auction site. Maybe best viewed with IE) where blugray got the kit. It has a listing of the panel models they support. Unfortunately it doesn't have detailed descriptions as to what model number the inverter and controller have. All the orders are done based on the panel model only. The ad says "AD boards for your laptop screen panel are available. Give us the description of the LCD panel, and we'll get the right one customized and ship out to you. The kit includes corresponding cable, inverter". I think you had better try out Agilent Pixel. The shop owner seems to be back after a long break.

i found the pin out to the 15" imac g4 LCD

http://hidekyan.cocolog-nifty.com/blog/2009/07/index.html