My faith is rapidly dwindling (help)

Discussion in 'MacBook Pro' started by bollweevil, Sep 23, 2008.

  1. bollweevil macrumors 6502

    Feb 1, 2008
    I used to have faith in Apple's ability to make functional and beautiful technology. I used to have faith that I wanted a MacBook Pro. Lately, I have been questioning those core beliefs, and my entire techno-spiritual landscape has descended into chaos.

    Do I really want a MacBook Pro, or could I be happy with a MacBook? I wanted a Pro for two reasons: The screen is 2" bigger, and it is matte. I hate glossy screens. I don't care about the color, I don't want glare! I like more screen real estate. I am beginning to wonder whether those two reasons are enough to justify the extra $700 (base MBP versus upgraded MB). The processor is the same speed. I might make use of the better GPU, especially if Photoshop starts using the GPU to accelerate computation, but I am not a gamer. I might code a lot of TV shows into DivX, would the Pro be much better at that than a MacBook with comparable processor and RAM?

    I am starting to think I might get an IBM laptop and run Vista and Linux. I can get a 15", matte screen IBM with a MacBook Pro processor and RAM for much cheaper than a MBP. It would be thicker and uglier than a MBP. This is especially tempting because I'm not a big fan of Apple software, despite their really nice hardware.
  2. bollweevil thread starter macrumors 6502

    Feb 1, 2008
    Reasons I like Apple and want to buy a laptop from them:

    1. Beautiful industrial design.

    2. A physical, bricks-and-mortar store with decent hours and Geniuses there to help me if need be.

    3. A history of solid customer service.

    4. The Apple Store in New York City is 24/7. That's visionary.

    Is there any chance I can get 2 and/or 3 from another laptop seller? Perhaps IBM? I don't love the Apple operating system, but I do love the Apple Store.

    Ways that Apple software has annoyed me recently:

    1. My iPhone is slow. So is everyone else's, it's not just mine.

    2. Numerous specific iPhone bugs and missing features. Where's the Flash? Where are the background apps?

    3. Apple's calendar software is terrible. How come I can't set the volume of a calendar alert? How come I can't make every single event have an alert by default?

    4. Why doesn't the iPhone have a VoIP client? I would have to Jailbreak it to get VoIP, and I don't want that.

    5. Why doesn't the iPhone recognize that it has cellular and Edge signal when it does? Why does it only sync 50% of the time when I plug it in to my computer? Why can't it stream music from my own personal iTunes library and play it through my headphones when I am in my own house on my WiFi, like an AirPort?
  3. NT1440 macrumors G4


    May 18, 2008
    Hmm seems like the majority of your qualms are with the iphone.

    I wish apple would focus more on their other products now. They can have an iphone team, but should focus mainly on getting the rest of their products hailed as the jesus <insert product here>.

    I'm sick of the 24/7 iphone coverage.
  4. MowingDevil macrumors 68000


    Jul 30, 2008
    Vancouver, BC & Sydney, NSW
    Knock your self out.
    My days of convincing people Macs are better are long over. I came to realize you're either a Mac user or you're not. Software is one of the main reasons to use a Mac, since you said you're no fan of Mac software you'll probably be happier on a PC.
  5. hogfaninga macrumors 65816


    Aug 16, 2008
    Chestnut Tree Cafe
    Great post. I agree.
  6. upsguy27 macrumors 65816


    Jun 25, 2007
    To answer this: Go here.
  7. CaptainChunk macrumors 68020


    Apr 16, 2008
    Phoenix, AZ
    I've come to the exact same conclusion. Trying to convince a die-hard PC user to switch to the Mac platform is a fruitless effort. Despite the atrocity (of course, that's my skewed anti-Windows opinion) that is Windows Vista, they have still found a way to embrace it one way or another. If it works fine for them, so be it.

    The truth is that one platform really isn't better than the other in all areas. While Apple may have a superior OS and arguably better overall hardware ergonomics, PCs are open architecture and are thus not plagued by hardware expansion limitations. I should be able to put any PCIe graphics card I want into my Mac Pro (which anymore, essentially has the same hardware as a PC), but I can't. However, in my line of work, these drawbacks don't outweigh everything I find better on the Mac platform (the operating system, the software, etc.).

    I've just always found it funny how it's okay to boot into a legal copy of Windows with a Mac, but it's not okay (at least officially) to boot a PC into Mac OS. Then again, I suppose that if Apple were to allow this to happen in the future, it would would render hardware development pointless.

    On to the iPhone....

    I had an iPhone for all of 3 months and I switched back to Sprint and my Treo 700P. I have beefs with the iPhone, and most of them even apply to the new 3G model:

    1. Exclusive carrier (AT&T). This means no competition and AT&T can get away with charging whatever the heck they want for service. An individual unlimited plan (voice/data/text) adds up to $149.99 per month. I get the same with Sprint on my Treo 700P for $99.99 per month with their Simply Everything plan. Come on, a 50% price premium?

    2. The touchscreen is an awesome achievement in product design, but I still don't think it's a suitable replacement for a hard QWERTY keyboard when it comes to text messaging. I can write text messages 3-5x as fast on my Treo.

    3. Buggy/unstable and lacking applications/features... No flash support in iPhone Safari. No cut and paste. Frequent slow downs. The Bluetooth is useless to me because I can't use it in my factory car system, yet every other Bluetooth-enabled phone I've owned works flawlessly. Hello?

    4. I like having an interchangeable battery for when I travel and have to be on the phone a LOT away from a computer or power source. This is no big deal on an iPod, but unacceptable for a phone that may have to be used for business.

    Trust me, I'd really WANT to like the iPhone, but I think they overlooked a lot of important things that are generally taken for granted with competitor handsets while making some revolutionary advances.
  8. JPIndustrie macrumors 6502a


    Mar 12, 2008
    Queens, NY

    OP, I really don't get what you're trying to prove with this thread. Something about how we should convince you, a 'die-hard' PC user to switch to a Mac, I guess? So bottom line, you want us to do your research for you. No.

    I have an idea. It's called Google. Here, I'll save some of your precious time: copy and paste this: "PC vs Mac". |Done.
  9. hogfaninga macrumors 65816


    Aug 16, 2008
    Chestnut Tree Cafe

    Yep. It just isn't worth it unless Apple decides to pay me to do it.
  10. Consultant macrumors G5


    Jun 27, 2007
    You might want to get Refurb

    Some MBP are available for $1449 right now.
  11. killerwhack macrumors regular


    Aug 5, 2004
    Los Angeles, California
    Kick this guy to the curb

    Wasting our time complaining about his I-phone. Send this guy back to school.
  12. Edmonal macrumors newbie

    Aug 11, 2008
    I'm wondering if this is post just an attempt at trolling. I really don't see the aesthetics of Mac hardware as being that overwhelming, however I do see OS X as being a more elegant personal computer OS.
  13. ManWithhat macrumors regular

    Jun 24, 2008
    The reason that Macbook/Pros attract me is their thickness to specs ratio. After I actually used the OS, it's a lot easier to use and a bit safer than my Vista counterpart. I do still use both Operating Systems on my system, however. I just wish there was a compiz version for OS X.
  14. itistoday macrumors newbie

    Sep 24, 2008
    Silly, it's the software! ;)

    You can't run Mac OS X, or any of its applications, on your IBM laptop. That does it for me.
  15. UltraNEO* macrumors 601


    Jun 16, 2007
    Umm.... Wait. Shouldn't this thread be filed in the "iPhone" category? The OP is clearly moaning and ranting about his/her iphone, yet this is the NoteBook section and last I look the iPhone is a smartphone.
  16. monkey86 macrumors 6502


    Aug 5, 2008
    looks like he was trying to decide on a mb or mbp - then went off on one about the iphone.. random.
  17. newbie jnr macrumors member

    Mar 10, 2008
    In my opinion, the macs win aesthetics hands down. But that's irrelevant if the computer won't do what you want it to.

    One could say the majority of the mac experience is the software. If you don't like it, i'm sure you'd find a lot of the same hardware in other notebooks.

    In the end, go for what best suites your needs, for the best price. Your best bet is to just do some homework before you buy whatever.

    *P.S. i don't think iphones & MBPs aren't really that comparable
  18. bollweevil thread starter macrumors 6502

    Feb 1, 2008
    I see that a lot of people got thrown off by me talking about the iPhone. Let me clarify: I have an iPhone and an iPod, but I don't own anything else made by Apple. I am trying to decide whether to get a laptop made by Apple. I am trying to make this laptop purchasing decision based on data, but the only personal data I have about Apple products is about the iPhone.

    I notice certain problems with the iPhone, and that makes me worry that the other products made by Apple might have similar shortcomings. I realize that iPhone problems don't necessarily imply MacBook problems, and for this reason I am asking OTHER PEOPLE (you) for information about the MacBook and MacBook Pro.

    If I already knew what problems and benefits the MacBook Pro had, I wouldn't have to ask. In retrospect, I probably shouldn't have listed the iPhone problems, because it confused people. That list of complaints was somewhat relevant, though, because it shows the kinds of things that bother me.

    Also please note that I love my iPhone, in spite of all its flaws. The iPhone is a visionary piece of technology, and it literally changed my life because I use the internet in all sorts of places every day, and I take the nationwide internet for granted now. My father used to have a Treo with nationwide internet, and it wasn't nearly as groundbreaking because it was obnoxious to surf the web.
  19. bollweevil thread starter macrumors 6502

    Feb 1, 2008
    A number of you have said that the Mac benefit is "all about the software." What do you mean? Here are some possible interpretations, please tell me which ones sound true:

    A. "It just works" more often. The Mac software is easy to set up, hard to mess up, and/or it is less buggy than the PC software.

    B. The Mac software is more capable. (If you assume that a Mac and a PC both work and neither has bugs, the Mac can do more than the PC, or the Mac can do it faster.)

    C. The Mac software is easier to use. (For example, the iPod is very easy to use. Note that ease of use is often, although not always, the opposite of raw capability. The one-button computers in museums are very easy to use, which is in stark contrast to some geeks' Linux computers that are incredibly capable but cryptic. Improving ease of use while maximizing capability and UI efficiency is very hard, although the iPod comes close.)
  20. alphaod macrumors Core


    Feb 9, 2008
    I'll put it bluntly.

    The iPhone is a POS compared to other stuff Apple makes. Or rather, the iPhone is simply a POS by itself.
  21. synth3tik macrumors 68040


    Oct 11, 2006
    Minneapolis, MN
    I have been encountering a huge increase in issues over the past year or so with Apple. I can say with absolute certainty that my old Powerbook was much more solid of a computer then this MBP. However, that being said I think you'll be hard pressed to find better HW/SW integration. Apple has fumbled on QA lately, I hope they snap out of it soon, but their QA is still above the rest of the industry -IMO
  22. Sirus2400 macrumors regular

    Jun 25, 2008

    Fring does VoIP, so I would get it ASAP in case it gets taken down (Plus its free).

    Other than that, just remember that the iPhone is a really dumbed down OSX, the real version is much more polished (and has copy and paste;))
  23. e12a macrumors 68000


    Oct 28, 2006
    i'd politely disagree, at least on the fact that their QA was good in the past.. Apple hasn't been so hot in that department..

    Titanium powerbook: weak as snot hinges, pink display from failing backlight.

    a flavor of the iBook: solder cracking GPUs

    Laptops (ibook, 12" powerbook) with built in RAM: RAM corruption among other things.

    PowerMac G5: very, very high failure rate of liquid cooling systems (just fixed one today in fact.) I probably wouldn't be overstating if i said nearly 100% of these things leak. The extent of damage resulting varying. Some people continue to operate the machine and only realize there's a problem when the computer freezes or stops working altogether.

    Powerbooks: display bruising.

    Early macbook(Pros): random shutdown issue, cracking and staining palmrests (still not entirely fixed), overheating, etc.

    New/Current MBPs: the alleged nVidia debacle.

    there are probably much more, but i'm tired.

    my point: any PC manufacturer will have problems. Apple included.

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