My letter to Apple. . .

[e-coli]

Originally posted by shecky
AE and DDR fall into the "need" category. DDR for the obvious reasons

Okay, need we go over this YET AGAIN, people.

The G4, in ANY of it's many iterations are completely incapable of taking advantage of DDR memory. So you don't need it. You simply want it. It doesn't benefit you in any way, shape, or form on the G4 machines.

 

[MacFan25]

I think that Apple realizes that the 15" Powerbook needs to be updated. I don't know why they haven't done it yet. Maybe because of the heat issue.?.

But, when new Powerbooks do come out, I think that we will be in for a treat.

 

[jzieske]

Originally posted by MacFan25
But, when new Powerbooks do come out, I think that we will be in for a treat.

After waiting this long we better be in for something very cool. Above and beyond 12/17 features. As for what it might be I have no idea.

 

[jxyama]

iPC -
unlike some PC vendors, Apple includes most things as "standard." BTO options are fairly specific and targeted. (most popular being Superdrive over Combo Drive?) so there's some (not all) defense as to why Apple doesn't allow BTO returns.

waiting continues... though i find it rather pointless for one individual to complain to Apple. i applaude the initiative but you have absolutely no leverage to force them to take action. if you got together 1,000 people who are deciding between 15" PB or a dell equivalent, you may have a shot.

I think Apple wants comments regarding their products/problems/new ideas. i don't want to sound completely dismissive, but i doubt they are very interested in listening to pleas for new hardware due to personal circumstances. Apple already knows that months leading to Sept. is a big back-to-school sale time...

i personally subscribe to the theory that Apple's actually having trouble with updating 15" and that the delay is not just due to Apple's "stupidness."

 

[Frohickey]

Re: My letter to Apple. . .

Originally posted by shecky
Just sent this to Apple. I am sure many of us feel the same way.

What makes you think the people at Apple read letters like this without first filing it in the round file... err... /dev/null.

 

[Megaquad]

If they could bring laptops faster, they would, so there is no point in complaining. It is for our own good! (G5G5G5)

 

[jayscheuerle]

XXXX?

I didn't even know they had porn schools...

Should have changed my major... - j

 

[shecky]

from agreenster

" They have their reasons for not announcing or releasing a new 15 PB. Its about economics and their own timetable, not some whiny kid going to junior college without a bleeding-edge aluminum 15 inch powerbook. Get over it already."

1st of all, im not some whiny kid, im some whiny adult. second of all, you are completely clueless about me. I go to what many consider to be the best art & design school in the country (so they say), on a scholarship, no less. Since where i go to school does not need to be public knowledge, nor is it relevant in terms of the core issue of the letter, i threw in the X's. So, if you want to make an attempt to insult me, at least do it based on soemthing you have accurate info on, my stupid knickname, my poor scentence structure, etc... Don't categorize me based on what you think you know, which, you quite evidently do not. I'm dropping $2500 on hardware, i will not "get over it" i will damn well get the most i can for my money.

from e-coli:

"The G4, in ANY of it's many iterations are completely incapable of taking advantage of DDR memory. So you don't need it. You simply want it. It doesn't benefit you in any way, shape, or form on the G4 machines."

Now, someone PLEASE explain to me how DDR RAM on a G4 is absoloutly not faster than PC133. If you are right, you are right, but i would like an explination in layman's terms if you dont mind. If this is accurate, then i will be the 1st to admit that sways my opinion a good bit. I also want the advantage of a faster system bus as well, i thought that had something to do with the magic of DDR?

And as for the rest of the generally negative type comments, so what if they don't read the letter? it took me 10 minutes, it was worth it. That kind of "don't bother" attitute is a bad one, in my opinion. Maybe i'll get a response, maybe i will not. Maybe Steve will call me and ask me to do lunch so he can get my thought on how to run Apple better, maybe he won't. At least i am not mindlessly bitching and moaning, i am bitching and moaning with some assertive direction.

 

[jzieske]

Unlike many people here I think that even large companies like Apple need to hear from customers. Will one single letter make a difference porbabally not. However, Apple needs to know what customers want/expect from them. If Apple hears from hundreds/thousands of people it WILL make a difference in how they do business in the future. I am not saying that it will make them do business like we may want them too, but if nobody tells them what they think they will continue as they are.

 

[jxyama]

Originally posted by shecky
from agreenster
And as for the rest of the generally negative type comments, so what if they don't read the letter? it took me 10 minutes, it was worth it. That kind of "don't bother" attitute is a bad one, in my opinion. Maybe i'll get a response, maybe i will not. Maybe Steve will call me and ask me to do lunch so he can get my thought on how to run Apple better, maybe he won't. At least i am not mindlessly bitching and moaning, i am bitching and moaning with some assertive direction.

first of all, i can tell you steve will not be inviting you for lunch anytime soon nor will he be asking you how to run apple. (i assume this was meant as a joke.)

i think the point is, most of us have heard of a post like this before. it is more or less the same mindless moaning because to me, at least, the points in your letter offered nothing new. i've seen many threads on why apple needs to release the updated 15" and the reasons you sited were nothing new. the only difference is that you sent a copy to apple. good for you, but i can't help be dismissive and pessimistic about this because i've seen them before.

it is our choice to wait. apple never told us to wait. they don't owe an announcement. it is good to give feedbacks, yes, but i feel they should be more constructive than "you are due for an update and i need a new machine before i go to school."

[edit] i wanted to clarify one thing here... as you said, you are completely free to write apple and state your case. i applaude your initiative, as i said before. however, what i wouldn't like is for you to come back later complaining about their lack of responsiveness, etc., and state how apple "sucks." chances are, apple will announce and offer 15" update on their terms... they don't owe an explanation and at the same time, you don't owe them a sympathy when their "bad" and "sucky" update cycles and business plan do them in as a company. [\edit]

 

[agreenster]

Originally posted by shecky
from agreenster

" They have their reasons for not announcing or releasing a new 15 PB. Its about economics and their own timetable, not some whiny kid going to junior college without a bleeding-edge aluminum 15 inch powerbook. Get over it already."

1st of all, im not some whiny kid, im some whiny adult. second of all, you are completely clueless about me. I go to what many consider to be the best art & design school in the country (so they say), on a scholarship, no less. Since where i go to school does not need to be public knowledge, nor is it relevant in terms of the core issue of the letter, i threw in the X's. So, if you want to make an attempt to insult me, at least do it based on soemthing you have accurate info on, my stupid knickname, my poor scentence structure, etc... Don't categorize me based on what you think you know, which, you quite evidently do not. I'm dropping $2500 on hardware, i will not "get over it" i will damn well get the most i can for my money.

Yeah. You're right. I certainly have no reason to make fun of you anymore.

 

[Thirteenva]

Originally posted by jxyama
first of all, i can tell you steve will not be inviting you for lunch anytime soon nor will he be asking you how to run apple. (i assume this was meant as a joke.)

i think the point is, most of us have heard of a post like this before. it is more or less the same mindless moaning because to me, at least, the points in your letter offered nothing new. i've seen many threads on why apple needs to release the updated 15" and the reasons you sited were nothing new. the only difference is that you sent a copy to apple. good for you, but i can't help be dismissive and pessimistic about this because i've seen them before.

it is our choice to wait. apple never told us to wait. they don't owe an announcement. it is good to give feedbacks, yes, but i feel they should be more constructive than "you are due for an update and i need a new machine before i go to school."

[edit] i wanted to clarify one thing here... as you said, you are completely free to write apple and state your case. i applaude your initiative, as i said before. however, what i wouldn't like is for you to come back later complaining about their lack of responsiveness, etc., and state how apple "sucks." chances are, apple will announce and offer 15" update on their terms... they don't owe an explanation and at the same time, you don't owe them a sympathy when their "bad" and "sucky" update cycles and business plan do them in as a company. [\edit]

I agree with this post 100%.

Shecky the letter is written as if apple owes you something. Which of course they do not.

You say in a later post that you want the most for you $2500 and you can have it, in the form of a 15" tibook.......

I wonder if these same people write to car companies and tell them that they need to release the next years models months sooner because they need a car now and since the update is "innevitable" they should release it now. And then go and accuse them of waiting till current inventory is diminished.....

 

[primalman]

OMG!

OK, I have one for ya, I went to one of the best design schools in the country, got a better education in graphic design than most, have won more awards in 10 years than most designers will win in 50, been teaching it, and you know what, your choice of computer has about ZERO to do with how well you do design.

Last year, and for the last 5 years, I did super on a 200mhz 604e, making many tens of thousands of dollars doing GOOD WORK. So, whining about a slightly updated PB will get you nowhere.

Previous posters are right, we have all heard this before, to the limit. Everyone is tired of it. Apple is not trying to jack us around, they are making business decisions. That is all.

I do think that the OS 9 issue is a BIG part of it, even though they are not gonna say that, for obvious reasons.

So, when they update the line, it will be great, but it is not the end-all of what a person needs to be good at what they do. If you can't wait, and might fell ripped off by the TiBook, buy the 12", it will be plenty nice, plus you get your annemities you want.

BTW, I bought a 15" 1ghz and could not be happier. And I am going back to school for my MFA, slightly more advanced, but am I whining about my 'not-updated-yet-woe-is-me" Powerbook G4. No way.

 

[Thirteenva]

Re: OMG!

Originally posted by primalman
OK, I have one for ya, I went to one of the best design schools in the country, got a better education in graphic design than most, have won more awards in 10 years than most designers will win in 50, been teaching it, and you know what, your choice of computer has about ZERO to do with how well you do design.

Last year, and for the last 5 years, I did super on a 200mhz 604e, making many tens of thousands of dollars doing GOOD WORK. So, whining about a slightly updated PB will get you nowhere.

Previous posters are right, we have all heard this before, to the limit. Everyone is tired of it. Apple is not trying to jack us around, they are making business decisions. That is all.

I do think that the OS 9 issue is a BIG part of it, even though they are not gonna say that, for obvious reasons.

So, when they update the line, it will be great, but it is not the end-all of what a person needs to be good at what they do. If you can't wait, and might fell ripped off by the TiBook, buy the 12", it will be plenty nice, plus you get your annemities you want.

BTW, I bought a 15" 1ghz and could not be happier. And I am going back to school for my MFA, slightly more advanced, but am I whining about my 'not-updated-yet-woe-is-me" Powerbook G4. No way.

Amen! its not the wand its the wizard...

I'm designing on my 500mhz tibook and love it.

 

[agreenster]

I think the biggest point everyone here is trying to make (in a not-so-nice way, myself included) is that Apple ALREADY knows they need and/or are going to update the 15inch Powerbook...

...But your letter isnt going to change their timetable, or their plans.

Now, if you wrote a letter to them expressing something that Apple didnt already have plans for, or were complaining about a bug you discovered, then maybe they would listen. But as it is, they already know they need to update the PB, and probably have been working a long time on it, and therefore dont give a crap about your letter.

The reason people here are giving you such a hard time is because we all already know all of this, and are tired of hearing people whine about it.

[edit: just read primalman's post after posting and couldnt agree more]

 

[shecky]

Re: OMG!

Originally posted by primalman
OK, I have one for ya, I went to one of the best design schools in the country, got a better education in graphic design than most, have won more awards in 10 years than most designers will win in 50, been teaching it, and you know what, your choice of computer has about ZERO to do with how well you do design.

Last year, and for the last 5 years, I did super on a 200mhz 604e, making many tens of thousands of dollars doing GOOD WORK. So, whining about a slightly updated PB will get you nowhere.

Previous posters are right, we have all heard this before, to the limit. Everyone is tired of it. Apple is not trying to jack us around, they are making business decisions. That is all.

I do think that the OS 9 issue is a BIG part of it, even though they are not gonna say that, for obvious reasons.

So, when they update the line, it will be great, but it is not the end-all of what a person needs to be good at what they do. If you can't wait, and might fell ripped off by the TiBook, buy the 12", it will be plenty nice, plus you get your annemities you want.

BTW, I bought a 15" 1ghz and could not be happier. And I am going back to school for my MFA, slightly more advanced, but am I whining about my 'not-updated-yet-woe-is-me" Powerbook G4. No way.

the hardware has nothing to do with the quality of work, agreed.

its MY goddamn money and i want to spend it wisely. So if you prefer not to hear me "whine" the ignore the damn thread. I am not attacking anyone, including Apple, so why dont you all do me a personal favor and stop attacking me. If you all in your infinite wisdon have heard it all before then you should have known to ignore this post from about the 4th scentence.

I have certainly learned to keep my big mouth shut around here, thanks for the not so subtle lesson.

 

[jxyama]

schecky:

this is a freely accessible forum. if you post here, you'll get people to respond to you. (conversely, you shouldn't post if you don't want any responses!) though biased and completely opinionated, replies to the thread are some indicator of the "public" opinion based on the MR membership.

just as you took time to post your thoughts, there are people who will take their time to post their thoughts. it's really not fair for you to ask those only in favor of your opinion to post replies. just as you felt compelled to share your original letter with others here, many of us feel compelled to share our thoughts.

replies are not "personal." they are not personal "attacks." it's differing opinions. don't take them too personally. there are a lot of diverse and interesting people here - you should take advantage of them and contribute.

 

[agreenster]

Re: Re: OMG!

Originally posted by shecky
I have certainly learned to keep my big mouth shut around here, thanks for the not so subtle lesson.

Woo hoo!! Victory!

Seriously though, dont take it so personally man. Its just a discussion forum.

 

[Snowy_River]

Shecky,

I think that what most people are responding to (myself included) is the tone of your letter. There is a tone of indignation and entitlement. I think that this is the failing of most letters of this kind. It promotes the response of "here's one more customer whining about things that he doesn't understand."

If you want to write an honest 'concerned customer' letter to Apple, and get a good response, then you have to avoid this kind of an attitude. Also, I'd strongly recommend not sending such a letter via the web. Despite the ever growing popularity of e-commerce and such, a real, hard-copy letter with a real signature on it still carries more weight with most, if not all, companies.

In any event, I hope that you get a product that you are satisfied with in the end. With a little luck, it might be an updated 15"G4 PowerBook....

Originally posted by shecky
Now, someone PLEASE explain to me how DDR RAM on a G4 is absoloutly not faster than PC133. If you are right, you are right, but i would like an explination in layman's terms if you dont mind. If this is accurate, then i will be the 1st to admit that sways my opinion a good bit. I also want the advantage of a faster system bus as well, i thought that had something to do with the magic of DDR?

Alright, here's an attempt...

DDR RAM nominally doubles the data transfer rate from the RAM to the system Bus, where it's distributed throughout the system. The primary destination for most data coming from RAM, however, is the CPU. The G4 CPU does not support double data rate (DDR) transfers, so the data flowing to the CPU can only maintain a single data rate speed.

Now, does this mean that having DDR RAM in the G4 based computers is worthless? Actually, no. But it does mean that you don't get anywhere near the performance boost that you would see from a DDR enabled processor (G5). The G4 systems (iMac, eMac, PowerBook, Power Mac), based on bench mark testing, gain about a 25% performance boost on highly memory intensive tasks, which, as I indicated earlier, is a far cry from the nearly 2x boost you'd expect from a better processor.

So, given what you're doing, I can understand why you'd want DDR RAM high on your list of 'wants'.

However, here's a thought for you, if your machine's performance is worth that much to you, why don't you consider getting a new G5 and one of the current 12"PowerBooks. You might spend a little more, but you'd get an incredible set-up...

Originally posted by primalman
If you can't wait, and might fell ripped off by the TiBook, buy the 12"...

This is, in fact, what I've ended up doing, and I haven't regretted it one bit. I love my little 12". The only thing that I really want is to get a nice flat screen display to use as a second monitor while I'm at my desk...