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My MBP 17" logic board failed again......

D

dealmaker

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Sep 24, 2010
270
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So Apple repaired the video card issue on my late 2011 MBP 17" with a new logic board.....but now the logic board is failing again...so back to the Apple store it goes.........this happened to a colleagues Retina 15" MBP and they ended up building him a new machine (to latest specs) as they couldn't fix it...

Question is.....what if they can't fix my 17"?? Will they offer me a 15" Retina in its place? ......or a refund/store-credit of the original purchase price ?
 
The logic board that you get is "refurbished".

In other words, Apple just resoldered the GPU onto the logic board.

Apple did not fix the design flaw hence the replacement logic board will continue to fail with the same problem.

The real solution is to replace the logic board with a redesigned one that doesn't have the flaw.

With hundred of billions in the bank, you think that Apple would spend a few millions ACTUALLY fixing the issue, but no, Apple is too greedy to do that.

I FEEL YOUR PAIN. I also have a Late 2011 MacBook Pro 17-inch. :(
 
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When does your Apple Care run out? I'd imagine they would replace it with a retina 15.
 
My late 2011 17" is still going strong a year after the repair.

The refurb logic board has more chance of success if it was re-soldered using lead based solder vs the original that uses lead-free solder, which becomes brittle with thermal cycling.

BTW, these GPU's impacted a good few manufacturers - all caught by the "go green" campaign.

I have heard of 17" MBP's being replaced with latest spec 15" units if three failures in a row occur.
 
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OP ron1004 has it spot on they will "fix it again and again before replacing it. However the repair extension runs out after this year so I'd hope for a couple more quick failures if I was you.
 
Ive heard the 3 and then replace policy as well. I would try and get it fixed again then try and get the replacement board to fail before the extension runs out. Apple really screwed the pooch on this one. They should have offered replacement machines from the very beginning instead of putting a bandaid on the problem then sending you out the door.
 
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If they offer you a new 15" retina, TAKE IT WITH A NICE SMILE.

You'll get used to the slightly smaller display...
 
ron1004 said:
My late 2011 17" is still going strong a year after the repair.

The refurb logic board has more chance of success if it was re-soldered using lead based solder vs the original that uses lead-free solder, which becomes brittle with thermal cycling.

BTW, these GPU's impacted a good few manufacturers - all caught by the "go green" campaign.

I have heard of 17" MBP's being replaced with latest spec 15" units if three failures in a row occur.
Click to expand...

I think it's clear that Apple's cooling system (with the CPU and GPU sharing the heatpipe) is too inefficient. The Mid-2010 has the exact same cooling system, yet it doesn't have this issue.

satinsilverem2 said:
Ive heard the 3 and then replace policy as well. I would try and get it fixed again then try and get the replacement board to fail before the extension runs out. Apple really screwed the pooch on this one. They should have offered replacement machines from the very beginning instead of putting a bandaid on the problem then sending you out the door.
Click to expand...

You know Apple. Deny. Deny. Deny. When you can't deny any longer, push out the cheapest fix that will fail in a few months.

Fishrrman said:
If they offer you a new 15" retina, TAKE IT WITH A NICE SMILE.

You'll get used to the slightly smaller display...
Click to expand...

If only you are the lucky one!

Apple sold you a lemon and refuses to actually replace it.
 
tubeexperience said:
I think it's clear that Apple's cooling system (with the CPU and GPU sharing the heatpipe) is too inefficient. The Mid-2010 has the exact same cooling system, yet it doesn't have this issue.



You know Apple. Deny. Deny. Deny. When you can't deny any longer, push out the cheapest fix that will fail in a few months.



If only you are the lucky one!

Apple sold you a lemon and refuses to actually replace it.
Click to expand...

A few issues with this post.

Apple had exactly the same GPU issues on the 2009 and 2010 MacBook pros and it was all down to the use of non-leaded solder in an attempt to go green, not only that the same issue happened in a lot of laptops from the time using the same solder and similar graphics cards.

Apple are the only company to acknowledge the issue and to continue to support and repair the issue 2 years past their warranty, legally they could have told everyone to go hang afterwards their warranty was up (just like everyone else did).

There is little they can do 4-5 years on they can't get those parts anymore and retooling a site and paying to have them made again is just bad business sense even if the parts were there to do it (NVIDIA, the logic board old Intel processors out of date everything to be honest you just can't get the sort of quantity they would need) and it wasn't pointless as they still can't use leaded solder and stick to the environmental regulations.

Lastly anyone who EXPECTS any laptop (or any peice of consumer electronic equipment for that matter) to last more than 5 years has a seriously limited understanding of technology and built in redundancy, you may not like it (who does) but that's the world we live in.
 
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Samuelsan2001 said:
A few issues with this post.

Apple had exactly the same GPU issues on the 2009 and 2010 MacBook pros and it was all down to the use of non-leaded solder in an attempt to go green, not only that the same issue happened in a lot of laptops from the time using the same solder and similar graphics cards.

Apple are the only company to acknowledge the issue and to continue to support and repair the issue 2 years past their warranty, legally they could have told everyone to go hang afterwards their warranty was up (just like everyone else did).

There is little they can do 4-5 years on they can't get those parts anymore and retooling a site and paying to have them made again is just bad business sense even if the parts were there to do it (NVIDIA, the logic board old Intel processors out of date everything to be honest you just can't get the sort of quantity they would need) and it wasn't pointless as they still can't use leaded solder and stick to the environmental regulations.

Lastly anyone who EXPECTS any laptop (or any peice of consumer electronic equipment for that matter) to last more than 5 years has a seriously limited understanding of technology and built in redundancy, you may not like it (who does) but that's the world we live in.
Click to expand...

I can say right now that the problem is due to Apple pushing pass the thermal limit.

How else can the Mid-2010 model that have the exact same cooling design, but cooler processor and cooler GPU, not have the same issue?

Also, you act like it's out of generosity that Apple offer this "repair program" 4-5 years later. Fact of the matter is that the GPU failure is so common that there was a class action lawsuit. Apple should have acknowledged the issue and redesigned the logic board & cooling years ago, not 4-5 years later.

Alternatively, if Apple doesn't want to redesign the logic board & cooling, Apple should have replaced the defective laptop models with the next newest model that doesn't have the issue.
 
It is out of generosity they have offered the extension. They are gaining market share and have a great image that this has failed to be tarnished in any significant way by this issue. They were within their rights to fight the class action lawsuit and could well have won.


They had no idea of the scale of the problem until long after they stopped making the 2011 MBP, yes they could have acknowledged it sooner but if you want a new spec every year then you have to accept that there is very little manufacturers can do when widespread issues crop up 2-3 years after they stop making a specific machine, that is the nature of the beast.

All the terms and conditions are set out for repair and replacement, including using refurbished parts when you buy the machine and they always scrupulously abide by them.

I am not saying that Apple have covered themselves in glory here but they have supported the machines for 2 years longer than any other manufacturer has and been very good about keeping them running for a reasonable amount of time.

I am sure you are angry because you bought one but hey life lesson learned electronic equipment can and will fail spectacularly, and they only have limited warranty times for a reason. If you want to avoid this you have one choice don't buy them.
 
Samuelsan2001 said:
It is out of generosity they have offered the extension. They are gaining market share and have a great image that this has failed to be tarnished in any significant way by this issue. They were within their rights to fight the class action lawsuit and could well have won.
Click to expand...

Wow, I am speechless. Apple sold me a piece of ****, but you think that Apple shouldn't even have to fix it.

It's SO generous that Apple is even attempting to fix a piece of **** that it sold me.

Remind me again why I paid Apple almost 3K for this computer.

Samuelsan2001 said:
They had no idea of the scale of the problem until long after they stopped making the 2011 MBP, yes they could have acknowledged it sooner but if you want a new spec every year then you have to accept that there is very little manufacturers can do when widespread issues crop up 2-3 years after they stop making a specific machine, that is the nature of the beast.
Click to expand...

Well, that's strange. There has long been numerous complains on Macrumors and other places. Some people have had 1..2 logic replacement in that time.

Samuelsan2001 said:
All the terms and conditions are set out for repair and replacement, including using refurbished parts when you buy the machine and they always scrupulously abide by them.

I am not saying that Apple have covered themselves in glory here but they have supported the machines for 2 years longer than any other manufacturer has and been very good about keeping them running for a reasonable amount of time.

I am sure you are angry because you bought one but hey life lesson learned electronic equipment can and will fail spectacularly, and they only have limited warranty times for a reason. If you want to avoid this you have one choice don't buy them.
Click to expand...

If, for example, my LCD failed, then I don't blame Apple: these things happen with age.
I certainly wouldn't expect Apple pay to replace my LCD.

The problem with the GPU is clearly caused by faulty design and definitely not something that just happens with regular wear and tear.
[doublepost=1460565797][/doublepost]
Samuelsan2001 said:
They are gaining market share and have a great image that this has failed to be tarnished in any significant way by this issue. They were within their rights to fight the class action lawsuit and could well have won.
Click to expand...

Are you really using "image" to defend something?

So If someone scam you, it's okay if that person has a great image?

One word: Bernie Madoff
 
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tubeexperience said:
Wow, I am speechless. Apple sold me a piece of ****, but you think that Apple shouldn't even have to fix it.
Click to expand...

So here's the deal. I am VERY sympathetic to 17" owners because I was one, but i cut my losses. We can sit here and debate about what they should do or could do, but here's what will likely happen:

They will replace the motherboard with another one. The replacement will have the same defective design as the original and it will fail again in time. It may take a week or a year, but it will fail. You will be warranted 90 days from the installation of the new board. This is where it gets more fluid:

If you are under warranty (my Applecare was until 2017) and you have had three major repairs, you can request that they replace the computer with the closest modern counterpart. You would end up with a 15" Retina Macbook Pro with the 1TB SSD, but you may have to fight them for discrete graphics since the Iris Pro is faster than the Radeon in the 17". This is what happened to me.

If you are not under warranty, you can continue to have it fixed until you are no longer eligible to do so, which is 4 years from the date of purchase or until 12/31/16, whichever happens first. You can request that they replace it with a new one, but they rarely do out of warranty.

The simple fact is that you are using a 5 year old machine. It isn't that long ago that a 5 year old machine would be virtually unusable based on performance. Most states don't even require companies to stock the parts to repair machines that long. Frankly, It's time to cut your losses and either move to a retina 15" or move to Windows 10 where you can still get a workstation class 17" notebook.
 
Samuelsan2001 said:
Lastly anyone who EXPECTS any laptop (or any peice of consumer electronic equipment for that matter) to last more than 5 years has a seriously limited understanding of technology and built in redundancy, you may not like it (who does) but that's the world we live in.
Click to expand...
- Just to add: UK law provides the consumer with 6 years in which to make a claim as to any fault with a product and have it repaired or replaced free of charge. Arguably the most favourable consumer protection warranty laws in the world and very well suited to this GPU issue. So at least in the UK, expecting 5 years isn't unrealistic.

http://www.apple.com/uk/legal/statutory-warranty/
 
JTToft said:
- Just to add: UK law provides the consumer with 6 years in which to make a claim as to any fault with a product and have it repaired or replaced free of charge. Arguably the most favourable consumer protection warranty laws in the world and very well suited to this GPU issue. So at least in the UK, expecting 5 years isn't unrealistic.

http://www.apple.com/uk/legal/statutory-warranty/
Click to expand...

I know I live in the uk lucky for me.

I also agree it's not unrealistic however if you buy under certain conditions as everyone does then you know what you are getting into. Again if you don't like that buy from someone else.

As for your other comments, I do think Apple should fix it and they have but I don't think they have to do that indefinitely or replace the machine.

Every computer you buy is basically being beta tested unless you use only proven 5 year old technology in the machine, that is the price of having new cutting edge technology in machines every year. I for one am willing to take this risk if you are not don't buy them.

Yes people did have failing graphics cards in the first couple of years but that is normal and the same as every other computer it did not become a widespread problem until later.

GPU's also fail with age, yes Apple tested the limits of the thermals on this model and they came up short that's what happens with cutting edge technology.

I am not using image to defend anything, in fact I'm not defending anything.
I'm just pointing out the realities of the tech industry and the realities of the world we live in Apple have behaved better than just about any other tech company has about this sort of issue. Is this good enough?? Maybe not. Is it part of modern consumerism and nothing anyone can do about certainly is.

We are never going to agree on this, I am not personally affected so I'm sure my philosophical approach is just annoying, let's leave it at that.
 
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I don't really have an opinion one way or the other. I had mine repaired and am covered for this issue, as of right now, until Feb 2018. That's 7 years after buying the machine. If I have another repair before then, I'll be covered for another three years from that date.

I'm satisfied, and this machine is still the best electronics purchase I've ever made.
 
My 2011 17" was 'repaired' for the video issue 4 times. On the 4th time, Apple sent me back a refurbished computer - as in my computer (with palm guards and a perfect screen) was taken and I was given a different computer. I waltzed into the Apple store where I originally dropped the computer off at and demanded my computer back, not this POS they tried to pawn off on me. They ended up giving me a brand new (mid 2014) rMBP with 16GB RAM, 2.8GHZ and 1TB SSD. For free.
 
nikhsub1 said:
I actually wanted my 17" back and not a new machine... but since they couldn't do that this was the next best thing.
Click to expand...

Actually heres the rub- I don't really WANT a 15 rMBP if they can't fix my 17" machine - I think under that scenario I'd rather have the original purchase price back as a credit (or the equivalent value of the 15" rMBP credited) - that I can use as a when a new updated MBP surfaces (ideally with a 16" screen) - I wonder if they'd do that?
 
dealmaker said:
Actually heres the rub- I don't really WANT a 15 rMBP if they can't fix my 17" machine - I think under that scenario I'd rather have the original purchase price back as a credit (or the equivalent value of the 15" rMBP credited) - that I can use as a when a new updated MBP surfaces (ideally with a 16" screen) - I wonder if they'd do that?
Click to expand...

I actually laughed until I realized you are probably serious. They aren't giving you a dime. Period. Even if they did it would be the depreciated value of the machine, not what you paid for it. What does a 5 year old notebook go for these days?
What you can do is negotiate to have them give you a high spec Macbook Pro (demand dedicated graphics) and sell that yourself. Or if you want the next machine, wait until a few weeks after it is released and the old stock has depleted.
 
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