Networking Question

[Flipadelphia26]

The Hardware

6th Gen Airport Extreme

Air port Express

Belkin N 600 Router


The plan - if possible

Setup the Airport extreme as my main router.

Connect the airport extreme to it as a repeater/music player in my poolside shed.

I have CAT 6 Cable running upstairs. Is it possible to connect my old Belkin router to my new Airport extreme via CAT 6 and setup new separate wireless network upstairs and/or use it as a switch for wireless connections?

So there is wireless and wired connectivity throughout the house??


Thank you

 

[Bruno09]

A possible setup : a roaming network.

- Belkin remains the router

- Airport Extreme is connected to the Belkin via Ethernet
- Airport Extreme is in bridge mode
- Airport Extreme creates a wireless network with the same SSID, same security and same password than the Belkin

- Airport Express may :
- connect to the wireless network for Airplay
or :
- extend the wireless network for Airplay + increased wifi coverage.

Any client device will connect wirelessly to the access point (Belkin, AExtreme, AExpress) it gets the best signal from.

 

[Flipadelphia26]

A possible setup : a roaming network.

- Belkin remains the router

- Airport Extreme is connected to the Belkin via Ethernet
- Airport Extreme is in bridge mode
- Airport Extreme creates a wireless network with the same SSID, same security and same password than the Belkin

- Airport Express may :
- connect to the wireless network for Airplay
or :
- extend the wireless network for Airplay + increased wifi coverage.

Any client device will connect wirelessly to the access point (Belkin, AExtreme, AExpress) it gets the best signal from.

So Only

Belkin
|
Extreme
|
Airport


It cant go

------ (upstairs)
Extreme -> Cat 6 -> Belkin (Separate wifi upstairs)
|
Airport (repeater / Airplay)


And thank you for your help !

The issue here is - The Airport express wont repeat the belkin signal only the extreme, and the current location of the belkin is closest to the pool. Also the wifi upstairs is not so good. I thought I could kill 2 birds with one stone

 

[Bruno09]

You can have 2 different wifi networks if you prefer.

 

[Flipadelphia26]

You can have 2 different wifi networks if you prefer.

Cool, and thank you. I am sure I will bump this when I fail to figure out what I am doing

 

[waw74]

I'm assuming you meant put the express in the pool shed.

if you don't need to extend the range of the network, have the express join the main network instead of extending. It can join the wireless network from any manufacturer.
extending has some downsides (reduced speed is the main one)
Join is what your computer or phone does, so the express would just be another device on the network.


If the n600 has a bridge or access point mode (i can't seem to find one in the manual) that would be ideal, it basically turns off the router functions, and just creates a wireless network that is connected to your wired network.
This will allow something connected to the wireless from the n600 to talk to something connected to the wireless from the extreme
If you do set it up this way, and give your wireless networks the same name and security settings as on the extreme, your devices should automatically switch to the stronger signal as you move around the house. which is the ideal way to do this. so you don't have to constantly change networks.

Your upstairs network will probably be visible but weak downstairs. If your device moves from upstairs to downstairs, it will try to connect to it's last network, which will be the poorer upstairs network. Giving the networks the same name and security will fix this.

if it's the play version of the N600 (model F7D8302) then you can install dd-wrt which will give you bridge mode. It doesn't look like the non "play" version (model F9K1102) has this.

----
as Bruno suggested, there are 2 options

1.
belkin as main router
express joined to the belkin wifi.
extreme upstairs wired to the belkin and in bridge mode.

2.
extreme as main router
express joined to the extreme. (or extended if you need it)
belkin upstairs wired to the extreme preferably in bridge mode.

 

[Flipadelphia26]

I'm assuming you meant put the express in the pool shed.

if you don't need to extend the range of the network, have the express join the main network instead of extending. It can join the wireless network from any manufacturer.
extending has some downsides (reduced speed is the main one)
Join is what your computer or phone does, so the express would just be another device on the network.


If the n600 has a bridge or access point mode (i can't seem to find one in the manual) that would be ideal, it basically turns off the router functions, and just creates a wireless network that is connected to your wired network.
This will allow something connected to the wireless from the n600 to talk to something connected to the wireless from the extreme
If you do set it up this way, and give your wireless networks the same name and security settings as on the extreme, your devices should automatically switch to the stronger signal as you move around the house. which is the ideal way to do this. so you don't have to constantly change networks.

Your upstairs network will probably be visible but weak downstairs. If your device moves from upstairs to downstairs, it will try to connect to it's last network, which will be the poorer upstairs network. Giving the networks the same name and security will fix this.

if it's the play version of the N600 (model F7D8302) then you can install dd-wrt which will give you bridge mode. It doesn't look like the non "play" version (model F9K1102) has this.

----
as Bruno suggested, there are 2 options

1.
belkin as main router
express joined to the belkin wifi.
extreme upstairs wired to the belkin and in bridge mode.

2.
extreme as main router
express joined to the extreme. (or extended if you need it)
belkin upstairs wired to the extreme preferably in bridge mode.

So, right now. I get fairly strong signal at the end of my shed closest to the house, but it cuts out almost to unusable after just 10 feet.


So I was hoping to extend the signal out there a good bit by having the express be used as a signal extender, as well as use the Airplay functionality with the stereo system I have out there.

 

[Altemose]

So, right now. I get fairly strong signal at the end of my shed closest to the house, but it cuts out almost to unusable after just 10 feet.


So I was hoping to extend the signal out there a good bit by having the express be used as a signal extender, as well as use the Airplay functionality with the stereo system I have out there.

Your setup is just fine. It can go Extreme ---> Wireless Extension Express
Remember that the Express must be in a location where it gets a good and fast connection to the Extreme. AirPlay will work just fine in the "Extend" mode.

As for the Belkin, if the Extreme is offering connection upstairs, then it will only pollute the air with signals that can cause interference. It is possible to bridge the Belkin into being a wireless access point, which will either use the same network name or a different one. One would turn off DHCP on the Belkin, and all IP addresses will come from the Extreme.

 

[Flipadelphia26]

Your setup is just fine. It can go Extreme ---> Wireless Extension Express
Remember that the Express must be in a location where it gets a good and fast connection to the Extreme. AirPlay will work just fine in the "Extend" mode.

As for the Belkin, if the Extreme is offering connection upstairs, then it will only pollute the air with signals that can cause interference. It is possible to bridge the Belkin into being a wireless access point, which will either use the same network name or a different one. One would turn off DHCP on the Belkin, and all IP addresses will come from the Extreme.

Thank you for your feedback. I really appreciate it.

 

[Altemose]

Thank you for your feedback. I really appreciate it.

What is your plan on this? You should be fine with the Extreme and Express. If you must hook the Belkin up, let me know and I will find out if it can be fully bridged into an Access Point mode.

 

[Flipadelphia26]

What is your plan on this? You should be fine with the Extreme and Express. If you must hook the Belkin up, let me know and I will find out if it can be fully bridged into an Access Point mode.

Ok. So the full story is this.

The Cable and the modem are in my livingroom. Which is the closest room to the poolside shed. The shed has a TV bar stereo etc and everyone hangs there in the summer. It's nice to have WiFi out there. Only the signal goes from really good at bar seats closest to the house. To really bad, but 8 feet down the bar. Barely a signal.

So I want the express (Already purchased) to extend the signal out there, but also to connect into my stereo. I purchased a 10 foot Cable to connect to the stereo off the internet, so I have a ton of flexibility as to where my express to be located. I thought this would extend the signal from my Belkin, but I didnt do enough research, and it turns out it will only repeat a signal from an apple router.


I went ahead an also purchased an extreme (delivered tomorrow). The wifi signal in the master bedroom is spotty at best (opposite end of house and upstairs). I ran a CAT 6 cable from my office (room next door to master bedroom) through the walls, down to the basement and up into the living room so we could use a VOIP phone for a job previously held. Now the cable is not being used.

My hope was to connect the old belkin to this CAT-6 on on end, and connect the extreme on the other end to expand the network capability upstairs. Both in a wired and wireless capacity.


So in summary

extend the wifi by the pool as well as use the airplay for music with the express

use the extreme as my main router

use the belkin as secondary access point upstairs.


I hope this helps.

 

[Altemose]

Ok. So the full story is this.

The Cable and the modem are in my livingroom. Which is the closest room to the poolside shed. The shed has a TV bar stereo etc and everyone hangs there in the summer. It's nice to have WiFi out there. Only the signal goes from really good at bar seats closest to the house. To really bad, but 8 feet down the bar. Barely a signal.

So I want the express (Already purchased) to extend the signal out there, but also to connect into my stereo. I purchased a 10 foot Cable to connect to the stereo off the internet, so I have a ton of flexibility as to where my express to be located. I thought this would extend the signal from my Belkin, but I didnt do enough research, and it turns out it will only repeat a signal from an apple router.


I went ahead an also purchased an extreme (delivered tomorrow). The wifi signal in the master bedroom is spotty at best (opposite end of house and upstairs). I ran a CAT 6 cable from my office (room next door to master bedroom) through the walls, down to the basement and up into the living room so we could use a VOIP phone for a job previously held. Now the cable is not being used.

My hope was to connect the old belkin to this CAT-6 on on end, and connect the extreme on the other end to expand the network capability upstairs. Both in a wired and wireless capacity.


So in summary

extend the wifi by the pool as well as use the airplay for music with the express

use the extreme as my main router

use the belkin as secondary access point upstairs.


I hope this helps.

It does help. You do want to use the VOIP phone via Ethernet so plug that into the Extreme. You want the Express to be as close to the house as possible, so situate it closest to the exterior wall facing the house. The expansion should go past the bar and then some.

The Extreme is a powerful router. You may get by just fine with just the Extreme. You probably do not want to use the Belkin if you can avoid it. You can probably move the modem to another coax outlet if necessary in your home to make it a more centralized location.

 

[Flipadelphia26]

It does help. You do want to use the VOIP phone via Ethernet so plug that into the Extreme. You want the Express to be as close to the house as possible, so situate it closest to the exterior wall facing the house. The expansion should go past the bar and then some.

The Extreme is a powerful router. You may get by just fine with just the Extreme. You probably do not want to use the Belkin if you can avoid it. You can probably move the modem to another coax outlet if necessary in your home to make it a more centralized location.

I will give it a shot. Thank you. What would you say the WIFI range is on the Extreme? Ballpark. Walls are wood stud and drywall interior.

 

[Altemose]

I will give it a shot. Thank you. What would you say the WIFI range is on the Extreme? Ballpark. Walls are wood stud and drywall interior.

Well... My house was built in 1989 and is a Colonial style at about 2700 sq. ft. The Extreme is on the second floor dead center of the house but right up on the front wall; it covers the whole house including the basement with no issues.

 

[Flipadelphia26]

Hey, Just an update. I received the following information from belkin.

What you can you need to take note with connecting the N600 router with the Airport Extreme are the following:
1. If the Belkin router is the secondary router for the Apple, you need:
a. the Belkin to be connected wired to the ethernet port of the Apple.
b. the Apple router can be connected either to the LAN port of the Belkin router
(LAN-LAN; same network) or to the Internet/WAN port of the Belkin (LAN-WAN;
different network).
c. Set a different IP range on the Belkin router by changing the third octet (e.g. If
Apple uses 192.168.1.1, use 192.168.2.1 on the Belkin) for LAN-WAN. Or set
the Belkin router to Access Point Mode.
d. Create different Wireless network names (SSIDs) on Belkin and Apple.
2. If the Belkin router is the primary router for the Apple, you need:
a. to configure the Belkin router normally using standard configuration (use
setup software).
b. to configure the Apple router either to act as an access point or configure the
settings to have a separate network from the Belkin router. You will need to
inquire with Apple about the steps.

Let us know if you need more help.

Hopefully I can set this up without too many issues. For the final part, I am going to use an old computer as my music center. I have an old iPad 2, that I plan on using as the remote to control the music pool side.

 

[Altemose]

Hey, Just an update. I received the following information from belkin.









Hopefully I can set this up without too many issues. For the final part, I am going to use an old computer as my music center. I have an old iPad 2, that I plan on using as the remote to control the music pool side.

Have you setup the Extreme yet? It is more powerful than the Belkin and may be plenty for your house. Belkin's instructions tell you to set a new DHCP range on it rather than fully bridging it which is the correct way. In fact, by default the AirPort uses the 10.0.1.x scheme of addresses.

 

[Flipadelphia26]

Have you setup the Extreme yet? It is more powerful than the Belkin and may be plenty for your house. Belkin's instructions tell you to set a new DHCP range on it rather than fully bridging it which is the correct way. In fact, by default the AirPort uses the 10.0.1.x scheme of addresses.

I am going to set up the extreme this evening. I will post back with questions/results

 

[Altemose]

I am going to set up the extreme this evening. I will post back with questions/results

Sounds good. Those instructions from Belkin are inappropriate for what you want to do...

 

[Flipadelphia26]

Ok. Good to know. I will do your suggestion first. With just the extreme only. Then dig deeper if I find I need to add the Belkin to the equation.

 

[Altemose]

Ok. Good to know. I will do your suggestion first. With just the extreme only. Then dig deeper if I find I need to add the Belkin to the equation.

Good idea. If you want you can make it a roaming network where your clients will jump to either the Express, Extreme, or Belkin depending on what is closest and has the best signal.

 

[Flipadelphia26]

Needed to go ahead and hook the belkin up in the office. I put in the installation disk. It has the same name and pw as the AirPort Extreme and express. The disk had an access point Option and it seems to have worked. When I went downstairs my phone automatically switched to the stronger signal. The signal is strong throughout the house. I have the laptop I am using as the music server hardwired into the network at the belkin upstairs.


Thank you for all of your help.

 

[Altemose]

Needed to go ahead and hook the belkin up in the office. I put in the installation disk. It has the same name and pw as the AirPort Extreme and express. The disk had an access point Option and it seems to have worked. When I went downstairs my phone automatically switched to the stronger signal. The signal is strong throughout the house. I have the laptop I am using as the music server hardwired into the network at the belkin upstairs.


Thank you for all of your help.

So the Belkin is connected via Ethernet to the Extreme and is running in Access Point mode giving off the same network name and password as the Extreme? If so, great!

 

[Flipadelphia26]

No its showing 3 networks for wifi. But my phone has been switching automatically. The wired network shows as the same as the extreme.

 

[Altemose]

No its showing 3 networks for wifi. But my phone has been switching automatically. The wired network shows as the same as the extreme.

When in Access Point mode, you should be able to set the Belkin to the same wireless network name and password and the phones should roam natively. Then it will appear as one network (SmithWireless for Example) rather than SmithWireless Ext, SmithWireless Belkin, etc.

 

[Flipadelphia26]

When in Access Point mode, you should be able to set the Belkin to the same wireless network name and password and the phones should roam natively. Then it will appear as one network (SmithWireless for Example) rather than SmithWireless Ext, SmithWireless Belkin, etc.

Need to dig deeper into that.