New Apple Podcasts Rating Prompt Artificially Boosts App Store Score

[LeadingHeat]

It’s a little scary, the power that macrumors (and other rumor sites I guess as well, but this is arguably the biggest/most credible aggregator of rumors and news) has over apple stock. Apple car rumors: apple stock soars. Apple about to release child porn inhibitors: stock plummets. “Podcast app has FAKE REVIEWS!”: everyone banding together to put out 1 star reviews to try and “balance” the scales.

 

[TVOR]

So you believe anything that fulfils the most basic functionality of its product type is well represented by a near maximum score, even if it only achieves that through reviews that even a cursory reading show are completely misleading. Ok.

I didn't mention anything about the score, I was simply saying that you were positioning your experience and expectations as the de facto standard. Why should somebody not rate the app highly if - to them - it gives them what they want? The fact that there are a lot of reviews about the podcasts themselves rather than the app...well...I have already covered that! But that's not what my comment to you was about...

 

[TVOR]

Easily. If there isn’t some reasonable degree of integrity to ratings then remove them altogether. The price is irrelevant to having standing to expect it on a review. Openly undermining the rating confidence of one product undermines them all.

Integrity to ratings???? When people on here have been openly advocating flooding the App Store with 1 Star reviews...just because?! I do agree with you though...remove the reviews and let people try things and make up their own mind rather than being pre-conditioned by the thoughts of others.

Also, the price is absolutely relevant! Have you never heard of a price/performance ratio? You wouldn't judge the performance of a $30k Honda against a $1 million Bugatti...or at least, you wouldn't expect parity between them. If you have particular needs...then find a product that satisfies those needs...irrespective of price. But if you just need something very basic, of course price will be a factor and if you can get a free app that does what you need then that it a big plus. The fact that others may have different requirements and may need something with a bigger feature set doesn't in any way diminish the validity of the opinions of those for whom it is a perfect fit!

 

[TVOR]

For those who make the claims that people are "idiots" or "stupid" — I hope you are not doing anything related to customer relations or any sort of app development! Saying you are smart and others are stupid is itself enough to express your negative personality. There are no educational or minimum level IQ requirements when it comes to using Apple devices, so developers and UX/UI designers must do their best to provide an experience that is equally accessible and understandable for everyone. If that many people are getting misled, it either has been done on purpose or it is a poor-quality decision that needs rethinking.

I believe that I am one of those your comment targets, and I am pleased to inform you that I do not build apps, or have a direct customer relations role. However, I do deal with customer relations in the sense of having clients to deal with, and while I might not build apps, I do build websites (as a part of what I do at least). And one of the reasons why I do what I do is because I get to choose my clients this way. I have turned down MANY jobs because the client just seemed like they were going to be a bloody nightmare!

So yes, you are right, there are no educational requirements when it comes using Apple devices. However, neither is there any legal or moral obligation for me - were I to be a developer - to cater for people who simply can't be bothered to actually read the information that I present them with.

If I present the end user with information, and they don't take the time to actually understand what I am presenting them with, I will feel absolute no remorse if they get it wrong. After all, we are talking about people being asked to rate an app...we aren't asking our app users to understand spooky action at a distance...so the bar really isn't being set that high!

 

[TVOR]

I gave the Apple Podcasts app a low review because it wasted my time and I want Apple to make it better.

It’s been garbage for a long time but recently with the new MBP I gave it another go. The MBP speakers are great and I would actually use them to listen to podcasts rather than constantly wearing earphones.

That dream lasted less than 48 hours. The Podcasts app completely failed to keep my 2021 iPhone podcasts synced with my 2021 MBP, even with the benefit of a paid iCloud account.

In comparison, PocketCasts successfully keeps my iPhone synced with my Android phone for free and with no iCloud.

So it’s literally easier and a better user experience to use PocketCasts on iPhone and AirPlay to MBP speakers than to play the podcasts using the native MBP app. That’s abysmal from Apple.

It wasted your time? Why? Because it wasn't what you wanted? Get over it! And as for wanting Apple to make it better...again...why? You have an app that works for you...why try to force somebody else to change their app to be what YOU want it to be when you have a perfectly serviceable alternative?

If your view was that you felt that the app was bad because it didn't meet your requirements, but that you acknowledge that it might be OK for some users wanting just a very basic app...then it would be OK! Equally, prior experience told you the app was "garbage"...but you tried it again...and complain that your time was wasted...that's on you buddy!

The app is what it is...I can fully accept that it might not fill the needs of some...but that it does of others. Why is it so impossible for some people to understand that others may have a different - and yet equally valid - opinion??

 

[TVOR]

And many thousands of people all making the same mistake doesn’t make you think that maybe the prompt needs to be revised or clarified?

From what I understand of the article, it's the same prompt that is available to other developers. So why should Apple be held to a different standard when using the exact same prompt? People seem to be mentioning OverCast on here a lot...does that have a rating prompt? If so, is it the same one that Apple use or is it somehow different? If somebody can get screenshots of both to compare then I think we can make a more informed decision...until then, we have the usual people accusing Apple of some sort of grand nefarious intent without - seemingly - any justification at all.

 

[citysnaps]

It wasted your time? Why? Because it wasn't what you wanted? Get over it! And as for wanting Apple to make it better...again...why? You have an app that works for you...why try to force somebody else to change their app to be what YOU want it to be when you have a perfectly serviceable alternative?

If your view was that you felt that the app was bad because it didn't meet your requirements, but that you acknowledge that it might be OK for some users wanting just a very basic app...then it would be OK! Equally, prior experience told you the app was "garbage"...but you tried it again...and complain that your time was wasted...that's on you buddy!

The app is what it is...I can fully accept that it might not fill the needs of some...but that it does of others. Why is it so impossible for some people to understand that others may have a different - and yet equally valid - opinion??

Aggrievance and outrage at the drop of a hat is now the new normal. It's a badge of honor.

 

[Sullivan0930]

i dont get why they dont just incorporate it into apple music. Having my podcasts and music together is one of the reasons keeping me tied to spotify.

 

[CartesianProduct2014]

Integrity to ratings???? When people on here have been openly advocating flooding the App Store with 1 Star reviews...just because?! I do agree with you though...remove the reviews and let people try things and make up their own mind rather than being pre-conditioned by the thoughts of others.

Also, the price is absolutely relevant! Have you never heard of a price/performance ratio? You wouldn't judge the performance of a $30k Honda against a $1 million Bugatti...or at least, you wouldn't expect parity between them. If you have particular needs...then find a product that satisfies those needs...irrespective of price. But if you just need something very basic, of course price will be a factor and if you can get a free app that does what you need then that it a big plus. The fact that others may have different requirements and may need something with a bigger feature set doesn't in any way diminish the validity of the opinions of those for whom it is a perfect fit!

As absurd as it is I understand your logic.

 

[boss.king]

From what I understand of the article, it's the same prompt that is available to other developers. So why should Apple be held to a different standard when using the exact same prompt? People seem to be mentioning OverCast on here a lot...does that have a rating prompt? If so, is it the same one that Apple use or is it somehow different? If somebody can get screenshots of both to compare then I think we can make a more informed decision...until then, we have the usual people accusing Apple of some sort of grand nefarious intent without - seemingly - any justification at all.

I use Overcast, never seen a review prompt in the app though.

Like I've said elsewhere in the thread, the issues are that

a) people are clearly confused about what they are rating in a way that doesn't seem to happen with this same prompt in other apps. Whether this is due to a lack of detail in the prompt or a weird context in which it appears, it's clearly not getting the responses it's meant to be collecting.

b) these ratings are still there (as of yesterday at least) and pouring in by the thousands every day. Ratings that don't represent people's opinions of the app are raising the score well beyond what it was at before, whether intentionally or not.

I'd love to see this prompt and examples from other apps for comparison. The only one I can recall seeing was in GoodNotes on my iPad, but there's not really any way to confuse what I'm rating there (and I'm not even sure if they're using the standard Apple prompt or their own custom one).

 

[bookofxero]

If it is the same prompt following the same mechanism, then I do not see how people are claiming this is "sketchy" or "shady". I saw someone mention Apple controlling when the app request was allowed to result in a prompt to the end user, implying that 3rd party apps were prompting less frequently, and I have to wonder how such a control mechanism would work.

If people read the prompts and that they were reviewing the app, this would be a non-issue. Is Apple supposed to add in obstacles for reviewing their apps seemingly do not understand what they are reviewing? "Thanks for the great rating! Before we post it we want to be sure that you are reviewing the app and not the content."

My best guess? People see "Enjoying Podcasts?" and that is what is confusing users into reviewing the podcasts themselves and not the Podcasts app.

ETA: screen capture, courtesy of https://spin.atomicobject.com/2019/07/22/ios-review-prompt-customize/

-----

"Apple confirmed to The Verge that it is using a new prompt, the same one available to all developers. "With iOS 15.1 released last month, Apple Podcasts began prompting listeners to leave a rating and review just like most third-party apps -- using the standard Rating & Review prompt available to all developers," a spokesperson said."

 

[bsolar]

So why should Apple be held to a different standard when using the exact same prompt?

I don't think they should be held to a different standard, but this means they should curate their own App the same way other Apps are curated. This IMHO should include removing erroneous reviews, investigating how those reviews happened and if necessary implementing measures to prevent this from happening again.

 

[ericwn]

Tons of apps may do it, but it's definitely sketchy.

Having idiots do ratings is not necessarily sketchy. The standard applies across the board doesn’t it?

 

[ericwn]

Apple has no shame anymore.

Tim Cook needs to go.

You forgot “Apple is doomed! DOOMED!”

 

[boss.king]

Having idiots do ratings is not necessarily sketchy. The standard applies across the board doesn’t it?

I'll be honest, I misunderstood what was going on when I made that comment. I think this is less of Apple being sketchy as it is their review prompt just being bad.

The thing with design is that it should be idiot-proof. If thousands of people are misunderstanding what they're rating then the design or wording of the prompt might need to be updated to make that more clear.

The reviews that are clearly about a podcast rather than the app should probably also be removed.

 

[ericwn]

Google Play Store does the same thing.

Careful don’t apply real world arguments here when it’s hating time!

 

[ericwn]

Read the article. An overwhelming majority of the positive written reviews are about specific podcasts, not the app. The fact that so many people seem to think they're reviewing a show rather than the player indicates that Apple's implemented a very bad review prompt.

It probably just reflects the user base.

 

[ericwn]

Definitely something has to be fixed.

Maybe implement an iq test when activating a smartphone?

 

[boss.king]

It probably just reflects the user base.

Good design and clear messaging shouldn't leave room for this sort of mass misunderstanding.

 

[ericwn]

Anticompetitive practices at its finest, it’s really about time for laws.

When all apps use the same prompts it’s now anticompetitive? Good one.

 

[ericwn]

That logic is simply appalling.

Because it isn’t logic but a simplistic opinion piece.

 

[ericwn]

i dont get why they dont just incorporate it into apple music. Having my podcasts and music together is one of the reasons keeping me tied to spotify.

Because combining functionality into one app lead them to blow up iTunes to do more than music and that was too much to handle for plenty users hence they broke it all up after years of doing the opposite, at least on the Mac.

 

[davidako]

It wasted your time? Why? Because it wasn't what you wanted? Get over it! And as for wanting Apple to make it better...again...why? You have an app that works for you...why try to force somebody else to change their app to be what YOU want it to be when you have a perfectly serviceable alternative?

If your view was that you felt that the app was bad because it didn't meet your requirements, but that you acknowledge that it might be OK for some users wanting just a very basic app...then it would be OK! Equally, prior experience told you the app was "garbage"...but you tried it again...and complain that your time was wasted...that's on you buddy!

The app is what it is...I can fully accept that it might not fill the needs of some...but that it does of others. Why is it so impossible for some people to understand that others may have a different - and yet equally valid - opinion??

Strange comment. You seem to be implying that your experience of Podcasts being acceptable is somehow “more equal” than my experience of it being a complete waste of time.

Reality is that many people have serious problems with the Podcasts app and hence the Podcasts app was rated low in the App Store. Now Apple has used misleading reviews (whether intentional or otherwise) to boost their rating and certain Apple fans think that is somehow a Good Thing.

 

[ericwn]

I'll be honest, I misunderstood what was going on when I made that comment. I think this is less of Apple being sketchy as it is their review prompt just being bad.

The thing with design is that it should be idiot-proof. If thousands of people are misunderstanding what they're rating then the design or wording of the prompt might need to be updated to make that more clear.

The reviews that are clearly about a podcast rather than the app should probably also be removed.

As per usual, a clear and grown up response, thank you. In fairness, even if the design is bad (I personally left the Apple podcast app behind long ago) the prompts will apply to every podcast app and any other app where people tend to rate content rather than software.
Customer reviews are often garbage, regardless of the platform, to a degree it’s the nature of the beast.

 

[Krizoitz]

i dont get why they dont just incorporate it into apple music. Having my podcasts and music together is one of the reasons keeping me tied to spotify.

Having them separate is something I prefer about the Apple approach. I definitely don't interact with them in the same way at all, but I also recognize there are others like you who do.