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wmy5

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Oct 27, 2012
309
39
upstate NY
The metal performance of A12 is less than A10X. Does this mean the new aTV 4K is less capable than last gen. aTV 4k in terms of graphics? I am curious why Apple chose to do so, especially considering Apple is pushing Apple Arcade...

Screen Shot 2021-04-20 at 4.18.14 PM.png
 

FNH15

macrumors 6502a
Apr 19, 2011
531
532
The metal performance of A12 is less than A10X. Does this mean the new aTV 4K is less capable than last gen. aTV 4k in terms of graphics? I am curious why Apple chose to do so, especially considering Apple is pushing Apple Arcade...

View attachment 1760749

I wonder if the A12 in the Apple TV isn’t clocked a bit higher or something. I agree that it’s more than a bit odd though...
 

priitv8

macrumors 68040
Jan 13, 2011
3,839
563
Estonia
I wonder if Metal is relevant for bitmapped graphics - the main usecase for aTV (decoding and rendering of H.264 and H.265 video streams. Now with added Dolby Vision from iPhone 12 Pro capability)?
What's the relative increase in CPU and GPU power due to this move now?
Does it look like they needed to beef up the CPU more than GPU?
 

007p

macrumors 6502a
Mar 7, 2012
966
582
The ATV has a fan, so its possible it gets slightly better scores than the XS iPhone. But I agree, I always assumed it would be an A12X as the standard A12 would be a downgrade, graphics wise.

I'd also have thought they would have had a few A12X/A12Z left over from the old iPads too :confused:
 

Realityck

macrumors 68020
Nov 9, 2015
2,347
3,350
Silicon Valley, CA
Apple TV 4K is now built with the A12 Bionic bringing a new level of performance that will be a massive upgrade to your TV.
Well outside the minor change of processors, some HDMI 2.1 support, and possible faster frame rates. All they did was was swap the remote out. The same color matching is available with the previous models (4K and HD). So maybe they had to update to the A12, because the A10x were EOL.
 
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gnomeisland

macrumors 65816
Jul 30, 2008
1,020
718
New York, NY
I wonder if Metal is relevant for bitmapped graphics - the main usecase for aTV (decoding and rendering of H.264 and H.265 video streams. Now with added Dolby Vision from iPhone 12 Pro capability)?
What's the relative increase in CPU and GPU power due to this move now?
Does it look like they needed to beef up the CPU more than GPU?
I do think (although I haven't done a deep dive to verify) that the video decoding capabilities of the A12 are superior to the A10. The 'X' variants just more cores, not better cores so the A10 doesn't even have an NPU (which I don't see meaning much in the short term regardless).

AFAIK, Apple did once fab an old chip on a newer process. Perhaps that's what we'll see here, a 5nm A12, which will clock higher.

All-in-all, a very lateral upgrade. Perhaps more functionality will be unlocked with the TvOS updates in June.
 

Neo_Hunt

macrumors member
Jan 16, 2017
41
17
Not only there is a 25% difference in GFLOPS (576 vs 768), but also the Memory bandwidth on the A12 is 2/3 compared to the A10X (34.1 vs 51.2 GB/s).
 
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wmy5

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Oct 27, 2012
309
39
upstate NY
I do think (although I haven't done a deep dive to verify) that the video decoding capabilities of the A12 are superior to the A10. The 'X' variants just more cores, not better cores so the A10 doesn't even have an NPU (which I don't see meaning much in the short term regardless).

AFAIK, Apple did once fab an old chip on a newer process. Perhaps that's what we'll see here, a 5nm A12, which will clock higher.

All-in-all, a very lateral upgrade. Perhaps more functionality will be unlocked with the TvOS updates in June.
I think for video decoding both A10X and A12 are overkill. They both decode HEVC, 4K HDR, Dolby Vision just fine.
 

priitv8

macrumors 68040
Jan 13, 2011
3,839
563
Estonia
Cheap parts, expensive price. Checks out.
I was under the impression these were introduced at lower price than original 4K model back in the day?
I think for video decoding both A10X and A12 are overkill. They both decode HEVC, 4K HDR, Dolby Vision just fine.
They just had not yet implemented the support for this weird Dolby Vision profile coming out of iPhone 12 Pro. At this moment they will play back in SDR on native player. Only Infuse manages to render it in HDR.
 

Devin Breeding

macrumors regular
May 2, 2020
176
135
Conway SC
I know this thread is a bit earlier this year but I’m going to coppy my response on another thread over to here in case someone comes across this thread and is deterred from buying the newest generation Apple TV and opting for the A10X version.

I’m not sure about benchmarks and all that but I can say from experience. I recently just upgraded my TV from Samsung 75” to LG 86”. Asking the previous gen Apple TV 4k with A10X to handle DOLBY Vision on an 86” screen was the first time I’d ever seen it struggle. I upgraded to the newer Apple TV 4K and it is noticeably quicker and is able to handle the better screen.
 
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mikepro

macrumors 6502
Sep 3, 2010
432
21
I know this thread is a bit earlier this year but I’m going to coppy my response on another thread over to here in case someone comes across this thread and is deterred from buying the newest generation Apple TV and opting for the A10X version.

I’m not sure about benchmarks and all that but I can say from experience. I recently just upgraded my TV from Samsung 75” to LG 86”. Asking the previous gen Apple TV 4k with A10X to handle DOLBY Vision on an 86” screen was the first time I’d ever seen it struggle. I upgraded to the newer Apple TV 4K and it is noticeably quicker and is able to handle the better screen.
Don't know how screen size can affect performance? The image resolution and data content is the same regardless of how big your display is.
 
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priitv8

macrumors 68040
Jan 13, 2011
3,839
563
Estonia
It is also Dolby Vision capable screen which the other is not. I believe that is what noticeably taxed the previous gen Apple TV.
With my Sony Bravia (player-led LLDV only!) the first-gen 4K (bought in 2017) has had no trouble with DoVi playback.
Could it be the TV-led DV that LG supports, that makes the difference?
 

Devin Breeding

macrumors regular
May 2, 2020
176
135
Conway SC
With my Sony Bravia (player-led LLDV only!) the first-gen 4K (bought in 2017) has had no trouble with DoVi playback.
Could it be the TV-led DV that LG supports, that makes the difference?
Maybe. But the new Apple TV 4k powers it flawlessly
 
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