how does he use it to improve his mixing? or is it for when clients come a'calling?
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new home for my control room
- Thread starter zimv20
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Well both.
When I use his set up, I normally do the general mixing at my house. I then take the mix to his studio, and first adjust stuff with just his two monitors. Then I turn on the sub and play around some more. And if I am really into the track I listen to it on some of his 'test speakers' (car stereo set up, headphones, ear buds, small single speaker...).
But thats just me, I only do this stuff as a hobby.
The studio I am talking about is more or less private. He is renting an apartment in this old bunker because his wife, daughter and neighbors don't appreciate all the 'noise' in the wee hours of the morning. Anyway, clients go to the 'real' studios he works with.
When I use his set up, I normally do the general mixing at my house. I then take the mix to his studio, and first adjust stuff with just his two monitors. Then I turn on the sub and play around some more. And if I am really into the track I listen to it on some of his 'test speakers' (car stereo set up, headphones, ear buds, small single speaker...).
But thats just me, I only do this stuff as a hobby.
The studio I am talking about is more or less private. He is renting an apartment in this old bunker because his wife, daughter and neighbors don't appreciate all the 'noise' in the wee hours of the morning. Anyway, clients go to the 'real' studios he works with.
what i mean is: i've never mixed with a sub, and i don't understand how adding one would improve my mixes. (not saying they don't need improvement, btw. not saying that *at all*).
everything i'm doing with this room is with the idea of isolating the sound coming out of the speakers from everything else. if i added a sub, it would cause the floor, walls, et. al. to resonate. i don't see how that would help me mix, and for those who do mix with a sub, i'm curious as to what i'm missing or what i'm not thinking of.
iow, how does a sub help you?
everything i'm doing with this room is with the idea of isolating the sound coming out of the speakers from everything else. if i added a sub, it would cause the floor, walls, et. al. to resonate. i don't see how that would help me mix, and for those who do mix with a sub, i'm curious as to what i'm missing or what i'm not thinking of.
iow, how does a sub help you?
Okay, I think I understand the question now.
To tell you the truth, I have only used that sub on maybe half a dozen mixes. And I know most people say that a subwoofer for stereo mixes is no good. I used it for basically two thing:
I like to think that I can seperate the low frequencies better from that sub. And I think the mixes turned out better, especially the dance music. In both cases the mixes ended up with a very clean, tight but rich bass. Maybe its those last few Hz that just go under in my speakers.
Anyways, that sub is a lot of work and very moody(for lack of a better word)! Placement is really hard, it sounds different in every position and christian is always testing it with an SPL meter.
To tell you the truth, I have only used that sub on maybe half a dozen mixes. And I know most people say that a subwoofer for stereo mixes is no good. I used it for basically two thing:
- For audio that will be played on a home theater system with a sub (mostly music for family videos). Yes, even though I only mix in stereo and not 2.1.
- For that dance music.
I like to think that I can seperate the low frequencies better from that sub. And I think the mixes turned out better, especially the dance music. In both cases the mixes ended up with a very clean, tight but rich bass. Maybe its those last few Hz that just go under in my speakers.
Anyways, that sub is a lot of work and very moody(for lack of a better word)! Placement is really hard, it sounds different in every position and christian is always testing it with an SPL meter.
the session starts saturday! so i'm in the final stretch and working my butt off here.
tonight, the wiring began in earnest, and of course i'm racking and reracking like mad:
but at least i've got the lava lamps keeping me in the mood:
tonight, the wiring began in earnest, and of course i'm racking and reracking like mad:
but at least i've got the lava lamps keeping me in the mood:
Wow that looks really nice so far. Be sure to get some completed pictures up and soem in session pics!
Good luck with the completion.
Good luck with the completion.
so, the session starts tomorrow, and though i'm not completely done, i'm in good shape. the biggest outstanding task is setting up another patchbay and getting the remainder of the pieces hooked in. but i've got enough "cheater" cables that i don't actually have to do it, it's just a nice-to-have.
in the first post, i posted some photos of the room. i took a few more, from roughly the same spot/angles, for comparison:
from the closet / machine room:
from the south / front wall:
from the doorway, towards the closet:
in the first post, i posted some photos of the room. i took a few more, from roughly the same spot/angles, for comparison:
from the closet / machine room:
from the south / front wall:
from the doorway, towards the closet:
we've been mixing for a couple days now, and i wanted to write a bit about the experience.
overall, i'm extremely pleased. besides the new room, this is the first i'm mixing w/ the pieces i picked up recently: adam a7's, api 2500 and a folcrom. this combo is pretty kick ass, i must say.
before, mixing ITB, i'd always get to a point where adding a track to the mix would start The Collapse -- each track would make the song smaller overall, and it'd be a fight to carve a space sonically for the new track. with the folcrom, even after adding (say) a new backing vocal to 20 other tracks, i can hear it and place it properly. love love love it.
so far, i'm using the 2500 exclusively on the mix buss. typically, i'll get the kick, snare and bass happening before i enable the 2500. everything else is mixed into the 2500. i set it to take off just 1-2 dB, so it's not noticeable -- until you get the whole mix going and hit bypass. then the balls just drop off the song. so i'm loving what the 2500 is doing.
regarding the a7's, the mixes are translating very well to both my home and car stereos, even after being subjected to the mp3 encoding of itunes. the high end, in particular, is sounding quite nice.
overall, i'm extremely pleased. besides the new room, this is the first i'm mixing w/ the pieces i picked up recently: adam a7's, api 2500 and a folcrom. this combo is pretty kick ass, i must say.
before, mixing ITB, i'd always get to a point where adding a track to the mix would start The Collapse -- each track would make the song smaller overall, and it'd be a fight to carve a space sonically for the new track. with the folcrom, even after adding (say) a new backing vocal to 20 other tracks, i can hear it and place it properly. love love love it.
so far, i'm using the 2500 exclusively on the mix buss. typically, i'll get the kick, snare and bass happening before i enable the 2500. everything else is mixed into the 2500. i set it to take off just 1-2 dB, so it's not noticeable -- until you get the whole mix going and hit bypass. then the balls just drop off the song. so i'm loving what the 2500 is doing.
regarding the a7's, the mixes are translating very well to both my home and car stereos, even after being subjected to the mp3 encoding of itunes. the high end, in particular, is sounding quite nice.
i've put up an mp3 of a sampler of sorts of the 8 songs we've mixed to date. some will be strung up again (so to speak) for tweaks.
file is here. sorry 'bout the mp3 compression.
also -- i've had so many problems w/ the a7's (i like mixing through them, but all 3 units shipped to my house have had noise floor and crackling issues) that i was sent a pair of p11's. just now installed them and had a listen and they sound a good deal different than the a7's. we'll finish the mixing session (3 more songs) w/ the p11's.
file is here. sorry 'bout the mp3 compression.
also -- i've had so many problems w/ the a7's (i like mixing through them, but all 3 units shipped to my house have had noise floor and crackling issues) that i was sent a pair of p11's. just now installed them and had a listen and they sound a good deal different than the a7's. we'll finish the mixing session (3 more songs) w/ the p11's.
I guess that the mixes sound good but the recording and performances of the vocals seem weak on these tracks (granted they are just excerpts.) Once I hear the poor vocals it's hard to even think about the mix, if it's strong or not.
nearly everyone in the group sings, some are stronger than others. if it's the woman to whom you're referring, then i beg to differ.
Zim, for your sake I hope you have strapped those rack-flight cases together and anchored them to the wall. Where I live we don't have earthquakes very often but... geez I'd hate to be on the underside of a gear-valanche.
that's all my "band". we're actually a collection of songwriters who perform and produce our own stuff, but when you've got 7 different people writing songs, there's a good variety of styles.
the samples are all from stuff that we've been recording over the past few years and mixed over the past 9 days.
I don't hear anything in the mix that stands out. It all sounds well proportioned. Good job man!
Here's what I meant about that first comment.
In the first track the intonation is a bit off at times. Her voice (the lead) sounds good but the recording session for the vocals sounds unproduced. The first phrase homophonic BACKING VOCALS I think are the weak link here. Sometimes the upper voice paralells in fourths and sometimes thirds. Intonation is iffy when it comes to two part harmony and perfect intervals from my experience. The unison on the word "drives" (D note) sounds too amatuer - I think an F note would have been better for the backing vocals on that word. I think that is really the moment that sticks out for me. Maybe that is what they are going for though, I don't know.
In the second phrase the counter-melody is good though. I like that part.
Same thing in the second clip. The two-part backing vocals (the "doo's") are in perfect intervals and the intonation is a little off. They are a pain in the ass to get right.
The third clip is awesome!
I love how the vocals melt into the guitar work in the fourth clip.
Here's what I meant about that first comment.
In the first track the intonation is a bit off at times. Her voice (the lead) sounds good but the recording session for the vocals sounds unproduced. The first phrase homophonic BACKING VOCALS I think are the weak link here. Sometimes the upper voice paralells in fourths and sometimes thirds. Intonation is iffy when it comes to two part harmony and perfect intervals from my experience. The unison on the word "drives" (D note) sounds too amatuer - I think an F note would have been better for the backing vocals on that word. I think that is really the moment that sticks out for me. Maybe that is what they are going for though, I don't know.
In the second phrase the counter-melody is good though. I like that part.
Same thing in the second clip. The two-part backing vocals (the "doo's") are in perfect intervals and the intonation is a little off. They are a pain in the ass to get right.
The third clip is awesome!
I love how the vocals melt into the guitar work in the fourth clip.
oh yeah -- i tracked exactly zero of the lead vocals, but did track some of the backing. at least 3 of the lead vox were recorded:
1. with a cheap rode mic
2. ... through a cheap tube pre
3. ... through bad converters
4. ... in a tiny live room ("bedroom verb")
... and it took quite a bit of effort to make them sit well w/in the songs. but because we're spread throughout the US and to london, i don't have the opportunity to control many of the recordings.
I see. Seven writers? Wow, that sounds like it could be chaotic at times! Are you going to make available to us the complete versions of these tracks. I really want to hear the complete version of a few of them!
we're going to master and release them, so we're not posting full versions. sorry!