New iMac doesn't see my USB storage drive without going thru a hub

[Crotonmark]

Just powered up my new 2019 iMac. Moved all my information from my 2009 iMac via Migration assistant from a time machine backup. After all was moved over I plugged in my storage drive. the iMac doesn't see it. as a test I plugged the drive into my USB hub. It now sees the drive and mounts it

Any ideas why it needs the hub?

Im baffled


Mark

 

[Fishrrman]

Is your hub a "powered hub" (with its own power supply)?
Is the USB drive 3.5" or 2.5" ?
Is it a platter-based drive (not an SSD)?
Does it have its own power supply ?

When you plug in the drive WITHOUT the hub, if it's a platter-based HDD, do you hear the platters "spin up" inside?

 

[Crotonmark]

Is your hub a "powered hub" (with its own power supply)?
Is the USB drive 3.5" or 2.5" ?
Is it a platter-based drive (not an SSD)?
Does it have its own power supply ?

When you plug in the drive WITHOUT the hub, if it's a platter-based HDD, do you hear the platters "spin up" inside?

ok
It is a platter based HDD Seagate drive. It is powered and the front light is on without the Hub
The hub is also powered
On a 2009 iMac the external drive was seen and mounted on its own

 

[Lee_Bo]

Is your hub a "powered hub" (with its own power supply)?
Is the USB drive 3.5" or 2.5" ?
Is it a platter-based drive (not an SSD)?
Does it have its own power supply ?

When you plug in the drive WITHOUT the hub, if it's a platter-based HDD, do you hear the platters "spin up" inside?

Exactly what I was thinking. Does your storage drive also need power? If so that's probably why you see it via USB hub.

 

[Crotonmark]

The storage drive needs power but it has a power supply. When it is out of the hub I can hear it power up

 

[Lee_Bo]

ok
It is a platter based HDD Seagate drive. It is powered and the front light is on without the Hub
The hub is also powered
On a 2009 iMac the external drive was seen and mounted on its own

I also have a couple of the Seagate external drives. Does it only have the USB 3.0 connector on it:

 

[Crotonmark]

I was using it on a 2009 Mac so I was using the connector into a USB 2.0 port

 

[Fishrrman]

Another thought:
What FORMAT is the Seagate drive?

 

[Crotonmark]

I am not at my Mac at the moment
It was formatted using High Sierra - probably not the latest
Is this the issue?
Can this be solved?
Is being plugged into a hub a problem?

 

[NoBoMac]

What else is plugged in to the USB ports? One of those things might be sucking up most of the power. Could see that on my previous Macbook where when plugged in to the monitor, I'd use a wired keyboard: that ate juice, the phone plugged into one the keyboard ports pulled power, making the other USB port on the computer pretty anemic. Some drives fired up, others not (disk spins, but not seen), and the second keyboard port was pretty useless.

When at the computer, pull up the System Report from "About this Mac", go to the USB section and see what kind of power draw is going on and add it up. USB type A ports on a Mac will deliver 900-1100mA of total power.

 

[Crotonmark]

I will check when I am at the iMac - thanks
this is the draw
1 - Hub - has a elgato video capture attached as well as a scanner
2 - Time Machine external drive
3 - Photo Printer

Why would it be different on the 2019 iMac vs. 2009 iMac?
Does it hurt anything to be in a Hub?

 

[NoBoMac]

In theory, should be no difference between 2009 and 2019 re: power on the ports. That said, and I can't do the technicals justice, power across the ports, from what I've read (and seen), can be a bit variable.

In this case, for example purposes, maybe the 2009 was delivering a little more power across the ports (ie. out-of-spec) vs 2019. Or 2019 is a little under spec. And if the drive is pulling power a little more than spec, you have a conflict. Add in, it's basically first come, first served for power: everyone next in line gets a smaller slice, if any.

Since the hub is powered, should not be an issue. Printer is powered as well, so, not an issue there.

Might want to try different ports for the drive, see what happens. Or, unplug everything but the drive: if spins up, one of the other things is drawing a fair amount of power (strangely), so, back to System Report to see what's going on with the USB power draw.

When a device pulls more than spec power, you run into what is basically undefined behavior across the ports: sometimes works, sometimes not.

ADD: since a hub, if you have spare port there, plug the drive in that. Won't hurt anything and can use the Mac's USB ports for things like thumb drives (they use next to nothing re: power).

 

[Crotonmark]

as long as I can plug into the Hub port and not cause an issue I am happy
I will test the rest later
thanks

 

[Crotonmark]

Can someone interpret this for me?
How much power is my 8TB drive using that I have to go thru the Hub?


USB 3.1 Bus:



Host Controller Driver: AppleIntelCNLUSBXHCI

PCI Device ID: 0xa36d

PCI Revision ID: 0x0010

PCI Vendor ID: 0x8086



BUP Slim Mac SL:



Product ID: 0xab25

Vendor ID: 0x0bc2 (Seagate LLC)

Version: 1.00

Serial Number: NA7WBXAG

Speed: Up to 5 Gb/sec

Manufacturer: Seagate

Location ID: 0x14b00000 / 4

Current Available (mA): 900

Current Required (mA): 144

Extra Operating Current (mA): 0

Media:

BUP Slim Mac SL:

Capacity: 2 TB (2,000,398,933,504 bytes)

Removable Media: No

BSD Name: disk2

Logical Unit: 0

Partition Map Type: GPT (GUID Partition Table)

USB Interface: 0

Volumes:

EFI:

Capacity: 209.7 MB (209,715,200 bytes)

File System: MS-DOS FAT32

BSD Name: disk2s1

Content: EFI

Volume UUID: 0E239BC6-F960-3107-89CF-1C97F78BB46B

Seagate Backup Plus Drive:

Capacity: 2 TB (2,000,054,960,128 bytes)

Available: 352.66 GB (352,660,471,808 bytes)

Writable: Yes

File System: Journaled HFS+

BSD Name: disk2s2

Mount Point: /Volumes/Seagate Backup Plus Drive

Content: Apple_HFS

Volume UUID: CA2C54C9-A019-3295-8667-1D4A5821A693



PRO-100 series:



Product ID: 0x10de

Vendor ID: 0x04a9 (Canon Inc.)

Version: 1.04

Serial Number: 21357F

Speed: Up to 480 Mb/sec

Manufacturer: Canon

Location ID: 0x14700000 / 3

Current Available (mA): 500

Current Required (mA): 2

Extra Operating Current (mA): 0

1284 Device ID: MFG:Canon;CMD:BJL,BJRaster3,BSCCe,NCCe,IVEC,IVECPLI;SOJ:BJNP2,BJNPe;MDLRO-100 series;CLSRINTER;DES:Canon PRO-100 series;VER:1.040;STA:10;FSI:03;HRI:6;MSI:AON,B240,DCW,E3,FON,HASF,JOFF,K21000700;PDR:3;RRF:00;PSE:ACTC58685;CID:CA_IVEC1TYPE3_IJP;



FaceTime HD Camera (Built-in):



Product ID: 0x8511

Vendor ID: 0x05ac (Apple Inc.)

Version: 72.52

Serial Number: CCG909103R2H34FFF

Speed: Up to 480 Mb/sec

Manufacturer: Apple Inc.

Location ID: 0x14600000 / 2

Current Available (mA): 500

Current Required (mA): 500

Extra Operating Current (mA): 0

Built-In: Yes



Hub:



Product ID: 0x005a

Vendor ID: 0x0409 (NEC Corporation)

Version: 1.00

Speed: Up to 480 Mb/sec

Location ID: 0x14400000 / 5

Current Available (mA): 500

Current Required (mA): 100

Extra Operating Current (mA): 0



Backup+ Hub:



Product ID: 0xab44

Vendor ID: 0x0bc2 (Seagate LLC)

Version: 48.85

Serial Number: 18CA7307B1W8

Speed: Up to 480 Mb/sec

Manufacturer: Seagate

Location ID: 0x14440000 / 8

Current Available (mA): 500

Current Required (mA): 100

Extra Operating Current (mA): 0



Backup+ Hub WH:



Product ID: 0xab39

Vendor ID: 0x0bc2 (Seagate LLC)

Version: 1.00

Serial Number: NA8T8ALX

Speed: Up to 480 Mb/sec

Manufacturer: Seagate

Location ID: 0x14441000 / 9

Current Available (mA): 500

Current Required (mA): 0

Extra Operating Current (mA): 0

Media:

Backup+ Hub WH:

Capacity: 8 TB (8,001,563,221,504 bytes)

Removable Media: No

BSD Name: disk3

Logical Unit: 0

Partition Map Type: GPT (GUID Partition Table)

USB Interface: 0

Volumes:

EFI:

Capacity: 209.7 MB (209,715,200 bytes)

File System: MS-DOS FAT32

BSD Name: disk3s1

Content: EFI

Volume UUID: 0E239BC6-F960-3107-89CF-1C97F78BB46B

Seagage Media Drive:

Capacity: 8 TB (8,001,219,248,128 bytes)

Available: 7 TB (7,000,492,818,432 bytes)

Writable: Yes

File System: Journaled HFS+

BSD Name: disk3s2

Mount Point: /Volumes/Seagage Media Drive

Content: Apple_HFS

Volume UUID: F0ED26B9-9297-3822-9D56-AAA0028959BB



Video Capture:



Product ID: 0x0037

Vendor ID: 0x0fd9 (Elgato Systems GmbH)

Version: 40.01

Serial Number: 2VC309901000461011608

Speed: Up to 480 Mb/sec

Manufacturer: Elgato

Location ID: 0x14430000 / 7

Current Available (mA): 500

Current Required (mA): 500

Extra Operating Current (mA): 0



Perfection610 :



Product ID: 0x0103

Vendor ID: 0x04b8 (Seiko Epson Corp.)

Version: 0.01

Speed: Up to 12 Mb/sec

Manufacturer: EPSON

Location ID: 0x14410000 / 6

Current Available (mA): 500

Extra Operating Current (mA): 0

 

[Fishrrman]

Some USB drives are "quirky".
That is, they connect properly some ways -- but not via other ways.

It may have something to do with all the different "controller chips" and control boards that various USB devices have. Or it may be for other reasons.

If the drive in question connects ok "through the hub", but not when plugged directly into the Mac, well... "what works, works". And leave it at that.

A question:
Have you tried DISCONNECTING EVERYTHING except for the "problem drive"?
Does it connect and show up on the desktop if you do that?

 

[Crotonmark]

I DID do that
I shut down the Mac and unplugged all but the one drive
rebooted and no change
Plugged everything back in and once in the hub it appeared mounted
It is so weird that on the 2009 mac there was no issue
Anyway, it is mounted so I am not worrying.

Was anyone able to make sense of the post I put up from the system report?

 

[NoBoMac]

Well, looks like the 8TB drive needs 100mA out of the 500 available to it.

However, whatever is "Elgato Video Capture", that is needing all 500mA available. And the NEC hub appears to want 100mA. Add that up, that's 700mA with 500mA available.

As Fishrrman said, USB can be quirky, particularly HDDs that don't have their own power supplies. If works in the hub, so be it.

 

[Crotonmark]

Well, looks like the 8TB drive needs 100mA out of the 500 available to it.

However, whatever is "Elgato Video Capture", that is needing all 500mA available. And the NEC hub appears to want 100mA. Add that up, that's 700mA with 500mA available.

As Fishrrman said, USB can be quirky, particularly HDDs that don't have their own power supplies. If works in the hub, so be it.

Thanks. Weirdly the external drive in question has its own power supply. Weird but I’m in the hub for now.

Also weird it mounted on the 2009