New iPad Pro...first folding tablet....

jamezr

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I love my iPad Air and think it is the best tablet on the market.
I still have my eye on a iPad Pro 11 with celluar....

But gotta poke a little fun here.......thinner isn't always better....


 
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Tsepz

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I love my iPad Air and think it is the best tablet on the market.
I still have my eye on a iPad Pro 11 with celluar....

But gotta poke a little fun here.......thinner isn't always better....


This is insane. This is the problem with going too thin.

What actually makes this hilarious is when people defend this poor build quality. He does this exact thing to MANY devices and they DO NOT bend and break that easily.

The last device I remember that bent that easily for him was that poorly built Nextbit Robin "cloud phone".

It's all good and great to tell people to "just take care of your devices", but if a device can bend that easily it actually limits how you can carry it, to basically having to keep it in your hand whenever you move with it, and be very gentle if you place it on an uneven surface and balance it while using the pen as you could bend it there to.

Here's his Nextbit Robin test, the iPad broke like a cheap plastic phone:


OH and EverythingApplePro had the same finding as Zack from Jerry Rig, weaker than last year's model all-round:
 
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StellarVixen

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BendGate 2 - The Return.


Not a big deal, if I bought iPad now, I would just take extra precautions, but still, this is the price you get for going so thin. You can only go so much before things start falling apart. I think that they have reached the limit here, any further decrease in thickness will need some kind of compromise, for example materials which are stronger than aluminum, but then iPad would be significantly heavier.
 

840quadra

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This is insane. This is the problem with going too thin.

What actually makes this hilarious is when people defend this poor build quality. He does this exact thing to MANY devices and they DO NOT bend and break that easily.

The last device I remember that bent that easily for him was that poorly built Nextbit Robin "cloud phone".

It's all good and great to tell people to "just take care of your devices", but if a device can bend that easily it actually limits how you can carry it, to basically having to keep it in your hand whenever you move with it, and be very gentle if you place it on an uneven surface and balance it while using the pen as you could bend it there to.

Here's his Nextbit Robin test, the iPad broke like a cheap plastic phone:


OH and EverythingApplePro had the same finding as Zack from Jerry Rig, weaker than last year's model all-round:
He (like many YouTube “Professionals”) is also filled with a bit of bias, and tests without any scientific backing. We can’t actually say how much (or little) force he is using during his attempts, nor can we guarantee he is trying to bend them in the exact same places.

I think it is funny that the YouTubers that put in the extra work get buried by those who put followers above actual tests. Where are the digital force meters, linear actuators, and other tools used to measure flex, ductility, sheer strength, etc? As opposed to that, we have coutless videos (many accounts) of some dude’s hands and whatever force they decide to put into bending a device that day.

Don’t get me wrong, I have no doubts that you can bend an iPad Pro, just like any thin tablet such as the surface, Slate, etc. I just have little respect for YouTube stars that post such videos just for the views, as opposed to doing actual tests.

For whatever reasons, people love to break apple products (which honestly doesn’t bother me). But sadly, there are very few actual tests of them, or of competitive devices such as Samsung, Microsoft, and likely upcoming Google tablets.
 

Tsepz

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He (like many YouTube “Professionals”) is also filled with a bit of bias, and tests without any scientific backing. We can’t actually say how much (or little) force he is using during his attempts, nor can we guarantee he is trying to bend them in the exact same places.

I think it is funny that the YouTubers that put in the extra work get buried by those who put followers above actual tests. Where are the digital force meters, linear actuators, and other tools used to measure flex, ductility, sheer strength, etc? As opposed to that, we have coutless videos (many accounts) of some dude’s hands and whatever force they decide to put into bending a device that day.

Don’t get me wrong, I have no doubts that you can bend an iPad Pro, just like any thin tablet such as the surface, Slate, etc. I just have little respect for YouTube stars that post such videos just for the views, as opposed to doing actual tests.

For whatever reasons, people love to break apple products (which honestly doesn’t bother me). But sadly, there are very few actual tests of them, or of competitive devices such as Samsung, Microsoft, and likely upcoming Google tablets.
Yes, let's ignore the other devices from various OEMs that he has tested and the fact that he was also one the first to highlight Glue Gate with this very test for the Blackberry KeyOne which BB had to then address. I mean really

Him AND EverythingApplePro have taken a practical stance and both along with some posters here on this very forum have found that the device bends with little force, but yeah, let's ignore all that to.

We could argue that all reviews and build quality tests ever made are pointless going by your post as 99.9% of the time there are no scientific tests at some points in their reviews.

Can you actually point me to a Reviewer that doesn't use their own discretion and is 100%scientific?
 
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Klyster

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That appears to bend way too easily considering the price point.
I guess the real acid test will be time.
If there is a structural issue, then there will be more bent iPads popping up bent, the forums here have enough members to get a good sample, there's already a couple with slightly bent 2018 iPads.

I'm kinda glad my tablet is a glass sandwich now, can't see that bending lol.
 
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mi7chy

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For whatever reasons, people love to break apple products (which honestly doesn’t bother me). But sadly, there are very few actual tests of them, or of competitive devices such as Samsung, Microsoft, and likely upcoming Google tablets.
JerryRigEverything's Shelf of Shame includes popular brands like Google, Huawei, Oppo, etc. so it's highly doubtful he's biased against any one company.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL0vZL9uwyfOE6L-ZLShMnAx1qdJiba93o
 

840quadra

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Yes, let's ignore the other devices from various OEMs that he has tested and the fact that he was also one the first to highlight Glue Gate with this very test for the Blackberry KeyOne which BB had to then address. I mean really


Him AND EverythingApplePro have taken a practical stance and both along with some posters here on this very forum have found that the device bends with little force, but yeah, let's ignore all that to.

We could argue that all reviews and build quality tests ever made are pointless going by your post as 99.9% of the time there are no scientific tests at some points in their reviews.

Can you actually point me to a Reviewer that doesn't use their own discretion and is 100%scientific?
Let’s review what I posted since you decided to ignore that.

I have no doubts that you can bend an iPad Pro
On your question, the answer is no, because it is impossible to completely take out the human element. I am simply after some attempt at measurable / scientific method, which is commonly lacking on YouTube.

The most well known scientific test using a force meter was Consumer Reports. From there (some linked in watch next) others have done more scientific testing in an attempt to grab factual numbers regarding how much force is needed to bend a phone.



JerryRigEverything's Shelf of Shame includes popular brands like Google, Huawei, Oppo, etc. so it's highly doubtful he's biased against any one company.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL0vZL9uwyfOE6L-ZLShMnAx1qdJiba93o
Right,

But we have no recorded levels to indicate how much force is needed to bend such devices, which invalidates the tests.

We love specs here on the Android side, so I am amazed how many spec junkies accept these videos at face value.
 
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Tsepz

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JerryRigEverything's Shelf of Shame includes popular brands like Google, Huawei, Oppo, etc. so it's highly doubtful he's biased against any one company.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL0vZL9uwyfOE6L-ZLShMnAx1qdJiba93o
No no! He is only seen as biased if he has a negative thing to say about Apple, same thing as Lew from Unbox Therapy who is now hated in the Apple Community due to the iPhone 6 bend gate . Guy does not even get Apple invites anymore, even went as far as doing a whole setup to fully understand the non-existent (to some fanboys) but existent charge gate that Apple addressed.

I'm sure he is glad he didn't try bend this iPad or it would have been another nail in his Apple Comm. coffin.
Let’s review what I posted since you decided to ignore that.



On your question, the answer is no, because it is impossible to completely take out the human element. I am simply after some attempt at measurable / scientific method, which is commonly lacking on YouTube.

The most well known scientific test using a force meter was Consumer Reports. From there (some linked in watch next) others have done more scientific testing in an attempt to grab factual numbers regarding how much force is needed to bend a phone.

Fully understood what you said, but it has been clear from the onset that bias didn’t play anything here as even the Apple Fan from EverythingApplePro had the same finding, yet you still responded with the whole bias accusation to my post that:
1. Shows Zack bending another device that broke similarly to the iPad Pro
2. In the same iPad video Zack showed real experience by even pointing out the weak points, so he started off with a Hypothesis and that being he identified the weak spots as he has seen the same build mistakes from other manufacturers, he then goes on and does the test and just as expected it bends just as easily as a previous non-Apple device. Where is the bias here??? He has had multiple Androids don't this.
3. EverythingApplePro is in the same post you quoted and yet you focused on Zack, is it maybe that you don't like his channel?

I just don't get where your whole bias thing comes from in that video.
 

Strider64

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Sorry, I can never understand people doing these kind of tests. I even lost respect for Consumer Reports a long time ago with the way they do testing also. I lost interest when he took the knife just to open the box. People who say he isn't biased really didn't watch the video or will say that he said that with other brands. Any time he could take a shot at Apple he did. To me an unbiased review would be a control experiment without any comments one way or the other. Maybe saying it bend more than others, but I'll leave the final judgement to you. I used to take a laptop computer to college a long time ago and I never put it in my backpack. I also never lay my electronics around, so I minimize that to a great degree. Accidents do happen and I can understand when it ruins a high priced item that people get upset. I do agree with him when it comes to Apple being high in price.
 
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mi7chy

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But we have no recorded levels to indicate how much force is needed to bend such devices, which invalidates the tests.

We love specs here on the Android side, so I am amazed how many spec junkies accept these videos at face value.
Nobody is denying the scientific test. If anything, scientific tests done afterwards usually just end up confirming the quick and dirty tests done by hand by experienced personnel. Just like CR tests confirming the bend issues with iPhone 6 and HTC which also happens to be on JerryRigEverything Shelf of Shame hand test. Experience can often offer a high confidence substitute to scientific methods. If an experienced sushi chef tells me the new knife doesn't cut as well I'll take his word with high confidence and won't need to pull out the scientific test gear. :p

https://www.consumerreports.org/cro/news/2014/09/consumer-reports-tests-iphone-6-bendgate/index.htm
 
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Tsepz

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Sorry, I can never understand people doing these kind of tests. I even lost respect for Consumer Reports a long time ago with the way they do testing also. I lost interest when he took the knife just to open the box. People who say he isn't biased really didn't watch the video or will say that he said that with other brands. Any time he could take a shot at Apple he did. To me an unbiased review would be a control experiment without any comments one way or the other. Maybe saying it bend more than others, but I'll leave the final judgement to you. I used to take a laptop computer to college a long time ago and I never put it in my backpack. I also never lay my electronics around, so I minimize that to a great degree. Accidents do happen and I can understand when it ruins a high priced item that people get upset. I do agree with him when it comes to Apple being high in price.
I guess this guy is biased to yes? Maybe he liked the 2017 more than the 2018 and so made the 2018 look bad, yeah?
 

jazz1

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I guess I'll just keep my "Ritz Cracker" iPad Pro at home. Really, if I leveraged a laptop screen like that I'm sure I could destroy it. Maybe not bend it as it is hinged to a bottom case. I'm talking open laptop vs. closed of course.
 

840quadra

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No no! He is only seen as biased if he has a negative thing to say about Apple, same thing as Lew from Unbox Therapy who is now hated in the Apple Community due to the iPhone 6 bend gate . Guy does not even get Apple invites anymore, even went as far as doing a whole setup to fully understand the non-existent (to some fanboys) but existent charge gate that Apple addressed.

I'm sure he is glad he didn't try bend this iPad or it would have been another nail in his Apple Comm. coffin.
Fully understood what you said, but it has been clear from the onset that bias didn’t play anything here as even the Apple Fan from EverythingApplePro had the same finding, yet you still responded with the whole bias accusation to my post that:
1. Shows Zack bending another device that broke similarly to the iPad Pro
2. In the same iPad video Zack showed real experience by even pointing out the weak points, so he started off with a Hypothesis and that being he identified the weak spots as he has seen the same build mistakes from other manufacturers, he then goes on and does the test and just as expected it bends just as easily as a previous non-Apple device. Where is the bias here??? He has had multiple Androids don't this.
3. EverythingApplePro is in the same post you quoted and yet you focused on Zack, is it maybe that you don't like his channel?

I just don't get where your whole bias thing comes from in that video.
I said “a bit of bias”, which people glommed onto thinking that it was the main point of my post. My bad for even mentioning that, as it derailed the conversation from my main gripe, which is with unscientific tests that are now prevalent on YouTube.

Easiest way to eliminate the perception of bias (justified or not) is to gather some actual, and quantitative data.

Regarding my personal bias, I like Apple, but you can bash them all you like. I own android and Apple devices, and am an equal opportunity critic. Honestly lots of great posts and people “over here” have me leaning more in that ecosystem than I ever expected.
[doublepost=1542496695][/doublepost]
Nobody is denying the scientific test. If anything, scientific tests done afterwards usually just end up confirming the quick and dirty tests done by hand by experienced personnel. Just like CR tests confirming the bend issues with iPhone 6 and HTC which also happens to be on JerryRigEverything Shelf of Shame hand test. Experience can often offer a high confidence substitute to scientific methods.

https://www.consumerreports.org/cro/news/2014/09/consumer-reports-tests-iphone-6-bendgate/index.htm
That’s the video I also linked to.

I do agree with you to a point. The issue is, the test equipment is obtainable but takes a bit of time and planning to setup and properly use.

That type of detail takes too long in this world of “me first” posts on YouTube and forums where views and revenue count more than actual journalism. The videos are entertaining for sure, but they could have the total package if they put in a little more scientific methodology.

I know I am missing out, but I mostly refuse to watch the YouTube stars, and take posts on here, android forums, and respectable editorial more seriously.

That’s just me though. I think my years testing software and hardware makes me a bit more picky than the average reader.
 
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Tsepz

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I said “a bit of bias”, which people glommed onto thinking that it was the main point of my post. My bad for even mentioning that, as it derailed the conversation from my main gripe, which is with unscientific tests that are now prevalent on YouTube.

Easiest way to eliminate the perception of bias (justified or not) is to gather some actual, and quantitative data.

Regarding my personal bias, I like Apple, but you can bash them all you like. I own android and Apple devices, and am an equal opportunity critic. Honestly lots of great posts and people “over here” have me leaning more in that ecosystem than I ever expected.
How am I bashing Apple? I both iOS and Android daily, but I get sick of people trying to brush off what seems to be a big issue in the making as if it's not that big of a deal.

I am looking to replace my aging iPad Air 2 and was looking into the iPad Pro 2018 range, now if I have one bend I will have to deal with Apple's stupid 3rd party retailer down here in South Africa who are not very good and take forever to replace a device, believe it or not, outside of the USA dealing with Apple in some countries is not as seamless as it is over there so an issue like this can be very annoying and painful to get fixed, I know because I am waiting for my faulty MacBook Air to be replaced as we speak.

So now if I get a 2018 iPad Pro I'll have to get a super thick case that negates the whole point of it being slim and treat it like some sort of brittle object. Great.
 
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840quadra

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How am I bashing Apple? I both iOS and Android daily, but I get sick of people trying to brush off what seems to be a big issue in the making as if it's not that big of a deal.

I am looking to replace my aging iPad Air 2 and was looking into the iPad Pro 2018 range, now if I have one bend I will have to deal with Apple's stupid 3rd party retailer down here in South Africa who are not very good and take forever to replace a device, believe it or not, outside of the USA dealing with Apple in some countries is not as seamless as it is over there so an issue like this can be very annoying and painful to get fixed, I know because I am waiting for my faulty MacBook Air to be replaced as we speak.

So now if I get a 2018 iPad Pro I'll have to get a super thick case that negates the whole point of it being slim and treat it like some sort of brittle object. Great.
What am I brushing off?

Why is it wrong that I want statistics and numbers for how much force it takes to bend an iPad.

Again, not denying it is possible, and I do believe it is happening to people.
 
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jamezr

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What am I brushing off?

Why is it wrong that I want statistics and numbers for how much force it takes to bend an iPad.

Again, not denying it is possible, and I do believe it is happening to people.
But you have to admit here...you are being a little defensive about the iPad bending a little too easy for most people.

Look at the original video i linked. This is just a guy bending the iPad with his hands.
Anyone can objectively see that it does bend a little too easy.
Don't bring anything else into the discussion such as other product videos. Stick to the subject at hand.

By all accounts and reviews the 2018 iPads are performance beasts! I will probably get the 11 inch one with cellular....i don't need it...but I sure want it.
 
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mi7chy

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I do agree with you to a point. The issue is, the test equipment is obtainable but takes a bit of time and planning to setup and properly use.

That type of detail takes too long in this world of “me first” posts on YouTube and forums where views and revenue count more than actual journalism. The videos are entertaining for sure, but they could have the total package if they put in a little more scientific methodology.
Actually, that test should've been done in the design phase along with four corner testing, emissions testing, etc. and not post-ship.

Plus, the CR 'scientific test' isn't all inclusive since the hand test actually better simulates real world usage scenarios as the pressure is distributed like from in-pocket, falling asleep on device, hand on screen using pencil, etc. vs point concentrated. Furthermore, if a product fails a distributed pressure test then it will only perform worse with a point pressure test.

I know I am missing out, but I mostly refuse to watch the YouTube stars, and take posts on here, android forums, and respectable editorial more seriously.
If we're talking about trustworthiness then I agree. Someone with more experience, originality and fewer biases carry more weight than someone pretentious and a copycat especially when they respin other people's work for pay views.

That’s just me though. I think my years testing software and hardware makes me a bit more picky than the average reader.
Our views on a subject is largely influenced by experience level, biases and personal mishaps. I'm an Apple user since the 1980s but am also brand agnostic pro-consumer vs pro-big corp with experience in product development so my view will likely differ from others.
 
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jazz1

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I love my iPad Air and think it is the best tablet on the market.
I still have my eye on a iPad Pro 11 with celluar....

But gotta poke a little fun here.......thinner isn't always better....


Okay, I finally watched the entire video. I have to say the scratching of the back and front glass demo is the most unfair and stupid testing I've ever encountered on any product.
I love my iPad Air and think it is the best tablet on the market.
I still have my eye on a iPad Pro 11 with celluar....

But gotta poke a little fun here.......thinner isn't always better....


I love my iPad Air and think it is the best tablet on the market.
I still have my eye on a iPad Pro 11 with celluar....

But gotta poke a little fun here.......thinner isn't always better....


The scratch and burn test on the screen, and the scratch test on the back of the iPad Pro is totally "click bait". Really? I can't think of one thing I own that would stand up to this kind of abuse AKA testing. Well maybe the diamonds in my wedding ring might survive this idiotic testing.

I'm probably late to the game to criticize this video. I also feel guilty about even bringing up the obvious that this is a P.T. Barnum moment. Is the "Bearded Lady" back there?

The bending test is also something I question. I certainly believe the iPad Pro can be bent. So can my iPhone Xs, my iPhone 8 Plus. Hey, I'm about to grip my iMac 27" inch desk top and knee it in the center. Sheesh. In the end I have to say that I'd be more trustful who post cautions about real life use.
 
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