New MacBook Air vs. refurbished MacBook Pro with Retina

[zipur]

The air is a waste of money. Unless you need the .5 pound weight loss and really bad screen. When you look at them check the viewing angle. The air has to be maneuvered perfectly and the retina looks good at all angles.

Not true. The MBA is a great machine, loaded with 8g of memory it will handle anything a normal student would need. There is no getting around the convenience of light weight and extended battery life of the MBAir. .5 pounds does add up and so does the hassle of opening you laptop to a Low Battery warning.

 

[falconeight]

Not true. The MBA is a great machine, loaded with 8g of memory it will handle anything a normal student would need. There is no getting around the convenience of light weight and extended battery life of the MBAir. .5 pounds does add up and so does the hassle of opening you laptop to a Low Battery warning.

My retina lasts for 7 plus hours. The macbook air does do things well. The screen is washed out and pixeled.

 

[Aluminum213]

Really ? I don't think so. Do you own one?

I don't own one personally, but have used one extensively


I tend to avoid staying away from first gen apple hardware, I was right to wait

 

[jread]

My retina lasts for 7 plus hours. The macbook air does do things well. The screen is washed out and pixeled.

Agreed. I think the new MBAs are absolutely wonderful machines, however the atrocious displays are deal breakers for me. I tried really hard to just look past it, but I just couldn't take it.

 

[tmiw]

I don't own one personally, but have used one extensively


I tend to avoid staying away from first gen apple hardware, I was right to wait

I'm only aware of the screen retention and the slowness issues. The former has a good chance of being resolved if you buy refurbished, so I hear. The latter is mostly software, and I heard that Mavericks fixes it. There may be other issues, just not as widespread.

That said, I'm struggling with the same choice and I'm willing to wait. The extra battery life and Retina would be worth it for me. I just don't know if I can justify $3k for the loaded 15" rMBP if I can pay less now.

 

[questionmark]

I'm only aware of the screen retention and the slowness issues. The former has a good chance of being resolved if you buy refurbished, so I hear. The latter is mostly software, and I heard that Mavericks fixes it. There may be other issues, just not as widespread.

That said, I'm struggling with the same choice and I'm willing to wait. The extra battery life and Retina would be worth it for me. I just don't know if I can justify $3k for the loaded 15" rMBP if I can pay less now.

I am having the same struggle. A fully-loaded MBA will be pretty much the same price as the refurbished rMBP. Which one will last me longer?

I went to the apple store today again and checked both machines out. The "extra" weight on rMBP is barely noticeable. At the end of the day, I go to school in New York and my campus isn't that big after all. Carrying a laptop won't be a problem for me.

The similar price point aside, the battery life won't really be a concern of mine. As I always carry the charger with me whenever I use my computer outdoors, longer battery life won't really change anything.

Has anyone used both machines before?

 

[Memole]

I am having the same struggle. A fully-loaded MBA will be pretty much the same price as the refurbished rMBP. Which one will last me longer?

I went to the apple store today again and checked both machines out. The "extra" weight on rMBP is barely noticeable. At the end of the day, I go to school in New York and my campus isn't that big after all. Carrying a laptop won't be a problem for me.

The similar price point aside, the battery life won't really be a concern of mine. As I always carry the charger with me whenever I use my computer outdoors, longer battery life won't really change anything.

Has anyone used both machines before?

As you said that you always bring charger with you, and that you dont mind extra weight of rMBP retina
i would go for rMBP as rMBP will last longer than MBA

15 incher is much better to look at then 13 incher
rMBP 15 have IPS screen and MBA have TN panel so rMBP wins here ( if Apple made IPS screen for MBA then for me MBA would be better than rMBP )

rMBP have more pixels so better screen estate than MBA as u can scale to any res you want/need

so if u dont mind TN panel and u like 13 inch screen and you need "faster" storage and AC wifi and if you are lazy to pick your charger then go for MBA 13

if you want better future proof laptop and if you dont mind extra weight and dont mind shoter battery life and lil slower SSD and not built in AC wifi but in exchange you get better preformance quad core CPU, better GPU as it have dGPU, bigger screen, Better resolution and better panel...

so yea 15 inch rMBP is clear winner for me

 

[fskywalker]

As you said that you always bring charger with you, and that you dont mind extra weight of rMBP retina
i would go for rMBP as rMBP will last longer than MBA

15 incher is much better to look at then 13 incher
rMBP 15 have IPS screen and MBA have TN panel so rMBP wins here ( if Apple made IPS screen for MBA then for me MBA would be better than rMBP )

rMBP have more pixels so better screen estate than MBA as u can scale to any res you want/need

so if u dont mind TN panel and u like 13 inch screen and you need "faster" storage and AC wifi and if you are lazy to pick your charger then go for MBA 13

if you want better future proof laptop and if you dont mind extra weight and dont mind shoter battery life and lil slower SSD and not built in AC wifi but in exchange you get better preformance quad core CPU, better GPU as it have dGPU, bigger screen, Better resolution and better panel...

so yea 15 inch rMBP is clear winner for me

Under the scenario described the rMBP is the clear winner ! My wife owns a 2012 13 inch MBA and it is a great machine, but it screen is not a match for the 15 inch rMBP

 

[sophiadales]

rMBP 13 inch is best choice ... new MBA is too good with new battery life but retina screen is best one : )

 

[questionmark]

As you said that you always bring charger with you, and that you dont mind extra weight of rMBP retina
i would go for rMBP as rMBP will last longer than MBA

15 incher is much better to look at then 13 incher
rMBP 15 have IPS screen and MBA have TN panel so rMBP wins here ( if Apple made IPS screen for MBA then for me MBA would be better than rMBP )

rMBP have more pixels so better screen estate than MBA as u can scale to any res you want/need

so if u dont mind TN panel and u like 13 inch screen and you need "faster" storage and AC wifi and if you are lazy to pick your charger then go for MBA 13

if you want better future proof laptop and if you dont mind extra weight and dont mind shoter battery life and lil slower SSD and not built in AC wifi but in exchange you get better preformance quad core CPU, better GPU as it have dGPU, bigger screen, Better resolution and better panel...

so yea 15 inch rMBP is clear winner for me

Thanks for your detailed evaluation. I am surely leaning towards to rMBP, but I have just read the news about back to school promo. I think I will probably wait for a couple more days and see how things go. Thanks again!

 

[questionmark]

rMBP 13 inch is best choice ... new MBA is too good with new battery life but retina screen is best one : )

I have also thought about getting the 13" rMBP, but their price points are really close.

As a student,

13" MBA with 8gb ram is $1339

13" rMBP is $1399

refurbished 15" rMBP is $1599 (it's the same rather you are a student or not),

if i were getting the 13" rMBP, I would definitely wait for the Haswell one coming out this september or later. But I can't wait that long :[, I NEED a computer by mid Aug for school.

Let's say the BTS promo is $100 gift card, do you guys think I should get the 13" MBA or 15" rMBP (since the difference is around $350 around the gift card.) Which one should I get?

My budget is around $1500, but I don't mind paying an extra $100 for the 15" rMBP. Is the retina screen worth it? Or should i just save that $350 and get a HDTV to watch TV/movies on?

 

[jread]

My budget is around $1500, but I don't mind paying an extra $100 for the 15" rMBP. Is the retina screen worth it? Or should i just save that $350 and get a HDTV to watch TV/movies on?

Yes, the retina screen really is worth it. Spend the extra money and get the 15" rMBP. You can watch TV/Movies on the rMBP and it is a much more beautiful screen than any HDTV.

 

[tmiw]

I had to walk around all day today with my 15" MBP in my messenger bag + other stuff. Yeah, I'm going 13" this time, probably rMBP. But it does mean that I'll need to wait for the Haswell ones since the 13" rMBP doesn't have the dedicated GPU to help things out. $1700 for the refurb i5/512GB is tempting, though.

 

[akdj]

This gen rMBp is gpu underpowered, os x annimations are laggy, safari is laggy, wouldnt buy it whatever the price is.. Oh, dont believe those who say it has been resolved by sw update, it wasnt, they are either lying to themselves or do not care about it att all, BUT lags are simply there. So, i would rather buy new mb air or wait for haswell rMBp. But choice is yours

Wrong. Wrong. Wrong. And even more wrong on every level....your entire post is actually one long false hood. As an owner of 2 rMBPs, both 15" 2012 models...and a 10-12 hour a day user...it's quite humorous how entirely wrong you are. Nothing 'lags'. Certainly on the 15". There were challenges previous to the mountain lion update. Not the case now. Bad display, Apple replaces without question. As far as Haswell...it may be nice little update to the 13". But it's not a big performance boost as far as the CPU. Again...in own two rMBPs. I'll be buying another pair this fall (we run a mobile audio and video production company). In two and a half decades owning computers of every shape and size...the rMBP is hands down the BEST computer...desk or laptop I've ever had the pleasure to own. It's I/O set makes it all the more remarkable. With a pair of thunderbolt ports, USB 3 ports, HDMI and SD, it's a tremendously flexible unit to boot. We sold two of our 2008 MacPros and have replaced them with the rMBPs. Along with thunderbolt breakout box and disk arrays...I've found it to be a game changer for us, our business and as a 'personal' computer.

I can't speak for the 13"....but I think the biggest boost we'll see from Haswell is battery life. The 15" is use routinely gets 6.5-8 hours pending my workflow in the field.

1st gen rMBP are underpowered and barely manage to keep up with the retina screen


wait for second gen rMBP or go with the new Airs

See above. Not only do they keep up with the retina screen but are able to simultaneously run two more monitors. What is this BS....did your mother tell you 'No! I'm absolutely not going to buy you one'?

I have owned a ton of macbooks including every revision of 13" air (of the current design), multiple 13" classic mbps of various generations, a 15" classic mbp(arrandale version) and a 15" retina mbp (2.7 quad with 16gb ram and 512ssd). The retina is awesome but for college portability and battery life are key. Get the 13" air. The retina 15 is the best of the bunch but if you are moving it around it still is too big and too heavy and the battery life isnt even close to the 2013 air. I would still own the air however I returned it to buy the retina because I need wired gigabit ethernet and an external display at the same time and would like a second external display and the air cant do that as it doesnt have enough ports (and I got the retina used for a sweet deal)

I graduated college in '95. I'd have given anything to have a 4.5 pound powerhouse like the rMBP to lug around campus! I think my Compaq at the time was close to 11 pounds with the charger! Lol....without the charger I could expect about 57 minutes 'unplugged'

I don't own one personally, but have used one extensively


I tend to avoid staying away from first gen apple hardware, I was right to wait

No you weren't....you'd have been enjoying the best computer ever built for the past year. I'm skeptical of your 'extensive use' as well. We use ours with extremely challenging software. Smoke, Premier and After Effects...PS and LR...Audition and Pro Tools....often several of those simultaneously with a VM and shared workflow through the office. To call the rMBP 'first gen hardware' to me is silly
Extensive laptop experience with the MBP and solid state storage with the Air and iPads/iPhones as well as high resolution monitors in the iPhone and iPads...collaborative effort with Intel on thunderbolt. USB 3 was new...but hardly an Apple thing. The form factor is phenomenal. Samsung and LG have been building and pioneering the industry in high resolution displays including 4k. The display really being the only factor you could consider a 'first' for Apple...but built by a third party known for excellence in display manufacture. Other than Haswell and a GPU update as well as PCIe memory....the rest will stay the same. Of course it'll be better hardware but that's the same every year. Why buy Haswell? Why not wait for Skylake is it? Always something better on the horizon....and IF you still believe your belief as a first gen product is warranted, you couldn't place your wager on a better company for post purchase support. I did have a LG monitor on one of mine. In four months it displayed some IR. replaced no questions asked in 24 hours.

Sorry....didn't mean to get carried away. But this is a student looking for his or her best value for their money. Keep your drivel to yourself. College folk don't have big budgets. Buying once should last several years and remain problem free. This is Apple....and right now, especially with the refurbished deals going, there isn't a better option than the rMBP. Period. I would also argue the 15" rMBP is the BEST laptop on the market. Period.

J

 

[Stealth777]

not my experience

This gen rMBp is gpu underpowered, os x annimations are laggy, safari is laggy, wouldnt buy it whatever the price is.. Oh, dont believe those who say it has been resolved by sw update, it wasnt, they are either lying to themselves or do not care about it att all, BUT lags are simply there. So, i would rather buy new mb air or wait for haswell rMBp. But choice is yours

I've got a refurb 13" 2.5g rMBP (got it last week, same price as a new MBA) that I'm typing on and next to it a new Haswell 13" Air. Both 8gigs ram. After reading so much on the internet about laggy scrolling and heat etc in the retinas I was fully expecting to have a dog of a computer.

This is not the case at all. The rMBP is noticeably faster than the Air in everything I've been trying. Opening web pages, opening things in finder, browsing network shares, streaming movies online and across my network etc. All of them start quicker than on the Air. I have no idea why, but I've had two Airs (both of them have problems with photoshop cs6 and volume fluctuation issues) and they are both slower than this 13" retina in most ways.

There are TWO areas where the Air with the i5000 graphics has been faster....when scrolling long and complex web pages it's "slightly" and I mean "slightly" smoother. The other area is when you have a very long and complex web page open and you increase the font size it does so a little quicker than the retina.

I have had no real issue with laggy UI or screen switching in the retina and I've tried to make it do so!

So, anyway, the one I've got here is really a great machine.

----------

I just did that today, the keyboard on rMBP feels MUCH BETTER than MBA, but I am just wondering if any longtime users have any thoughts on the keyboard.

----------



Will a loaded MBA be able to do basic Photoshop and Dreamweaver?

Funny, I find typing on the Air more comfortable because of the tapered edge. I do agree with you though that the rMBP keyboard and well the machine overall feels like better build quality. There is something about the tapered edge on the Air that is easier for me to type on though.

Photoshop and Dreamweaver will be fine on the Air btw.

 

[Serban]

I don't own one personally, but have used one extensively


I tend to avoid staying away from first gen apple hardware, I was right to wait

Thats why you bought the new first gen apple redesign iMac with 680MX ?

 

[mr.bee]

If you're going to be doing something more quantitative (science, digital arts, or quantitative finance) you'll be wanting at least the rMBP-13 and probably an rMBP-15.
___

quantitative finance needs a rmbp? lol

rmbp: rendering, digital arts, maaaybe some science programs, but check first with your professor for requirements. some science programs use the gpu to make calculations THAN it's useful
or if you can't stand the mba screen

mba: everything else

 

[tmiw]

quantitative finance needs a rmbp? lol

rmbp: rendering, digital arts, maaaybe some science programs, but check first with your professor for requirements. some science programs use the gpu to make calculations THAN it's useful
or if you can't stand the mba screen

mba: everything else

rMBP is also good for programming, no? Well, if you use the scaled resolutions, anyway.

 

[BR3W]

I am having the same struggle. A fully-loaded MBA will be pretty much the same price as the refurbished rMBP. Which one will last me longer?

I went to the apple store today again and checked both machines out. The "extra" weight on rMBP is barely noticeable. At the end of the day, I go to school in New York and my campus isn't that big after all. Carrying a laptop won't be a problem for me.

The similar price point aside, the battery life won't really be a concern of mine. As I always carry the charger with me whenever I use my computer outdoors, longer battery life won't really change anything.

Has anyone used both machines before?

My wife has a 13 MBA and I have a rMBP 15". I upgraded from a 13" MBP. All of my bags and sleeves from my MBP fit my rMBP...that's how close the 13" old design is to the new, slimmer retina design even with two more inches of screen.

The rMBP is miles above a MBA and barely larger. I can do a full day's work without a charge.

The question you should be asking yourself is what does the MBA have that you *need* over the rMBP? The screen is the single biggest factor of a laptop. You look at it every time you use the device. Just like you reasoned that you need a good keyboard since you interact with it all the time, so goes the logic for a better screen.

The MBA *was* the better screen because of the resolution compared to a classic macbook pro. But now that retina has come along there should be no contest. The only real consideration is whether you want a 13" or a 15" retina. I can not stress enough how important retina is. In terms of the future the screen is going to last the longest compared to the other components.

The MBA and rMBP both have SSD. Both will likely have 8GB of RAM in your configuration. What are you gaining by going with the objectively lower quality MBA screen? In terms of memory and features, the 15" has a dedicated graphics card that neither the 13" MBA or 13" rMBP have. The future of OS and programs is to make things more efficient...not powerful.

The newest features in Mavericks compress memory on the fly and page unused memory out. I have 16GB of memory on my desktop and struggle to find things to do to fill it up. As in, I often find myself running multiple VM's and leaving games open and making RAM drives *because* I have so much free RAM. Free RAM is wasted RAM.

8GB is sufficient for my 15" rMBP and trends indicate my memory will only become more useful in the future rather than less. That's a strange twist isn't it? Look at the supported devices list that Apple has printed for the upcoming OS X release. They include 2GB MacBooks. Even Microsoft has been doing this with their latest iterations. Windows 7 runs better on older computers and netbooks than previous iterations of Windows. Windows 8 is even more efficient.

The only time bigger is better nowadays is in storage space and resolution/screen sizes. And here's the funny part: the 15" screen isn't all that much larger than the 13" screen. Try it, I did, lay one on top of the other. The 15" bezel is thinner so the total screen size is close (within a half an inch) yet you get much more viewing area.


I love writing papers and grading exams on my retina. The text is clearer, crisper, and I can lay more pages out in front of me simultaneously. And I can write ridonkulously lengthy forum posts with ease...

 

[questionmark]

I had to walk around all day today with my 15" MBP in my messenger bag + other stuff. Yeah, I'm going 13" this time, probably rMBP. But it does mean that I'll need to wait for the Haswell ones since the 13" rMBP doesn't have the dedicated GPU to help things out. $1700 for the refurb i5/512GB is tempting, though.

It is just $1600! I think I will get it when it's back in stock!

 

[NewishMacGuy]

quantitative finance needs a rmbp? lol

rmbp: rendering, digital arts, maaaybe some science programs, but check first with your professor for requirements. some science programs use the gpu to make calculations THAN it's useful
or if you can't stand the mba screen

mba: everything else

Doesn't need the retina (could also be a uMBP-15), but definitely needs the quad core processor and 16GB RAM that you can't get in the MBA.


____

 

[NewishMacGuy]

...The MBA *was* the better screen because of the resolution compared to a classic macbook pro...

...I have 16GB of memory on my desktop and struggle to find things to do to fill it up. As in, I often find myself running multiple VM's and leaving games open and making RAM drives *because* I have so much free RAM...

The MBA displays have always been inferior to the uMBP displays. The MBA display is about equivalent to that of the old MacBooks. Yes, the MBA-13 has a higher native resolution than the uMBP-13, but I'd take the lower res along with better brightness, contrast, color balance, and viewing angle any day.

What are you doing with those VMs? Not much I suspect. If you're actually using them for work, you need 16GB.

Generally though, I agree with your points.


___

 

[BR3W]

The MBA displays have always been inferior to the uMBP displays. The MBA display is about equivalent to that of the old MacBooks. Yes, the MBA-13 has a higher native resolution than the uMBP-13, but I'd take the lower res along with better brightness, contrast, color balance, and viewing angle any day.

What are you doing with those VMs? Not much I suspect. If you're actually using them for work, you need 16GB.

Generally though, I agree with your points.


___

Yes, my point was that I am not doing much with the extra 8GB of RAM on my desktop compared to the 8GB of RAM total on my rMBP.

Unless someone has a specific need for 16GB of RAM my advice is to choose the better screen (retina) over the amount of RAM--assuming a choice must be made between 16GB and a retina (although there is no current MBA with 16GB so that point isn't particularly relevant currently).


There is one other thing worth mentioning: while the Air is more portable I have read reports of people breaking the screens while they are cycling around and/or banging around in a book bag. It's something to think about for an active student.

It might be a good idea to get a device that is portable *enough* without compromising durability. I think the rMBP's do an excellent job balancing the two concerns.

 

[gabberkooij]

The rMBP is miles above a MBA and barely larger. I can do a full day's work without a charge.

The question you should be asking yourself is what does the MBA have that you *need* over the rMBP? The screen is the single biggest factor of a laptop. You look at it every time you use the device. Just like you reasoned that you need a good keyboard since you interact with it all the time, so goes the logic for a better screen.

The MBA *was* the better screen because of the resolution compared to a classic macbook pro. But now that retina has come along there should be no contest. The only real consideration is whether you want a 13" or a 15" retina. I can not stress enough how important retina is. In terms of the future the screen is going to last the longest compared to the other components.

The only time bigger is better nowadays is in storage space and resolution/screen sizes. And here's the funny part: the 15" screen isn't all that much larger than the 13" screen. Try it, I did, lay one on top of the other. The 15" bezel is thinner so the total screen size is close (within a half an inch) yet you get much more viewing area.

Maybe I should stop reading those forums posts I had just convinced myself to go for the 13" Air and now I read some very good reasons to go for a rMBP 15" (I really loved the screen when I visited a Mac reseller yesterday)

I want to buy a Macbook (Air 13" or retina 15") before august. So I can start working on a Mac (Wineskin) version of my software. Because of this I can not wait for a Haswell update in october (if they update the 15" Retina within 14 days after I bought it, I will return it for a newer version)

Now I'm thinking again to get a 15" retina instead of the Air. But it is still a shame to spend that amount of money on a system that will be updated very soon. But maybe that is the story of all computer buyers...

Getting 6 hours is still nice, I just should not forget to take the adapter with me on my weekly travels (by train 4 hours).

 

[elefantrider]

Nobody has mentioned heat. The r does get significantly hotter in my view, but that is why I only use an IPad instead of a laptop when working away from a desk.