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New MacBook Pro (2010) and 24 LED Cinema Diplay
- Thread starter nyc4lifedt
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Its strange, ive been noticing a pattern with people complaining about heat from the i5s, I own a 17" i7 and it runs cool as a cucumber in-fact the coolest quietest Mac I have ever owned. using photoshop/lightroom its sitting at about 50 deg C, run flash tho and it spikes at about 75 deg C. Overall the machine is fantastic and have no regrets.
I would highly recommend going with a 17" i7, the bigger chasis will help the machine run cooler overall.
Most of the people complaining about heat have no idea what they're talking about. They look at the numbers and say "wow my computer must be overheating!" Never mind the fact that it's operating within spec.
This is an interesting thread... I too am contemplating purchasing either an i5 or i7 MacBook Pro with a 24" ACD (I don't need portability of a MacBook Pro but went through 5 new iMacs with terrible screen issues so I am pursuing a new configuration).
There is something interesting that I found when testing the graphics in the Apple store which would guide me to always run the discrete graphics card:
When launching iPhoto on the MacBook Pro, the icon would bounce a couple of times, freeze for a second, and then launch the app. I was surprised it would take that long (especially as my tests with the mac mini would open iPhoto immediately). I then went into System Preferences and changed it to always use the discreet graphics. I then launched iPhoto again and was IMMEDIATELY brought into the application - no waiting. Changed it back to automatic graphics switching and it took iphoto a few seconds to launch... hmm...
It does seem that there is a lag with the graphics switching, and for me I would always want the best graphics all the time. My configuration would be to always run the discrete graphics. BUT, I also want a quiet experience with the Mac, and if running discrete graphics all the time will cause loud fan noise and excessive heat, looks like that may be a deal breaker.
Someone mentioned the 17" manages heat a bit better, maybe that is an option?
There is something interesting that I found when testing the graphics in the Apple store which would guide me to always run the discrete graphics card:
When launching iPhoto on the MacBook Pro, the icon would bounce a couple of times, freeze for a second, and then launch the app. I was surprised it would take that long (especially as my tests with the mac mini would open iPhoto immediately). I then went into System Preferences and changed it to always use the discreet graphics. I then launched iPhoto again and was IMMEDIATELY brought into the application - no waiting. Changed it back to automatic graphics switching and it took iphoto a few seconds to launch... hmm...
It does seem that there is a lag with the graphics switching, and for me I would always want the best graphics all the time. My configuration would be to always run the discrete graphics. BUT, I also want a quiet experience with the Mac, and if running discrete graphics all the time will cause loud fan noise and excessive heat, looks like that may be a deal breaker.
Someone mentioned the 17" manages heat a bit better, maybe that is an option?
The new MBP is terrific and is very quiet. However, knowing your history, you might dislike the 24" Cinema Display. I've had a couple and they both "click" quite a lot, as if expanding/contracting with heat as they are used. Very annoying at times. Plenty of other people have experienced this:
http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1858815&start=30&tstart=0
Hi Sir Cecil,
Thanks for the heads-up, I had heard that somewhere (maybe in these forums) but did not see it mentioned often so was wondering if it was not a common occurrence.. It is good to know that you have had that happen with more than one.. Yes, based on our previous conversations regarding the dreaded noisy Seagate drives in our iMacs, you know my history well! A clicking monitor would drive me crazy...
I may just get the 17" MacBook Pro, and buy a 3rd party monitor for it...
I wish my experience with the iMacs had been better, it is the best fit for what I am looking for, but almost all of them had significant yellowing down the center of the screen and it was impossible for me to ignore..
My original post had nothing to do with "complaining" about the new MacBook Pro, but rather I was informing what was changed from the previous model and offering my experience with the MacBook Pro + LED Cinema Display combination.
Mid 2010 version MacBook Pro (whether it's i5 or i7) is the best made MacBook Pro ever. (Well, it's my opinion, anyway
) It performs great.
But the GPU switching method has changed and now it comes with automatic switching. For most of the users, my topic of this thread probably wouldn't matter too much. But when attaching an external monitor (LED Cinema Display in this case), it runs off of discrete GPU exclusively, like it or not.
Previously, I could choose to run strictly on integrated GPU when I had external display connected and was doing light load of work. That kept temperatures low and it performed great.
It wasn't just about running iStat and looking at temperatures and worrying about the number being too high. But rather it was an actual temperature increase, fan blowing louder and performance dragging. Worried about wearing out my cooling fans? That's not why. Who would want the fans to blow full blast even when browsing Safari? And maybe it doesn't bother a lot of people. (I know my friend who had an old Sony VAIO, which to my ears had an unbearable fan noise) But I am comparing to a MacBook Pro from a year and a half ago, after two upgrades later.
Engadget had a post today somewhat related to this post:
http://www.engadget.com/2010/05/08/macbook-pros-with-nvidia-geforce-gt-330m-graphics-get-discrete-s/
I have yet to test out whether integrated Intel HD Graphics could run Cinema Display, and I'll post a result after testing this out soon.
Mid 2010 version MacBook Pro (whether it's i5 or i7) is the best made MacBook Pro ever. (Well, it's my opinion, anyway
) It performs great.But the GPU switching method has changed and now it comes with automatic switching. For most of the users, my topic of this thread probably wouldn't matter too much. But when attaching an external monitor (LED Cinema Display in this case), it runs off of discrete GPU exclusively, like it or not.
Previously, I could choose to run strictly on integrated GPU when I had external display connected and was doing light load of work. That kept temperatures low and it performed great.
It wasn't just about running iStat and looking at temperatures and worrying about the number being too high. But rather it was an actual temperature increase, fan blowing louder and performance dragging. Worried about wearing out my cooling fans? That's not why. Who would want the fans to blow full blast even when browsing Safari? And maybe it doesn't bother a lot of people. (I know my friend who had an old Sony VAIO, which to my ears had an unbearable fan noise) But I am comparing to a MacBook Pro from a year and a half ago, after two upgrades later.
Engadget had a post today somewhat related to this post:
http://www.engadget.com/2010/05/08/macbook-pros-with-nvidia-geforce-gt-330m-graphics-get-discrete-s/
I have yet to test out whether integrated Intel HD Graphics could run Cinema Display, and I'll post a result after testing this out soon.
The Intel GMA 950 chip (found in early MacBooks) could run a full 1080p monitor (thats 1920x1080).
I'm sure the much newer Intel HD chip can handle the 24" ACD running at 1920x1200.
So its not possible to utilise the Integrated chip when an external display is connected, due to the way in which the mini-display port is wired?
No problem here
After two weeks of using my 15" i7 MacBook Pro in clamshell mode with external display I see no problem. The computer is extremely quiet (much quieter than my previous black CD MacBook).
After two weeks of using my 15" i7 MacBook Pro in clamshell mode with external display I see no problem. The computer is extremely quiet (much quieter than my previous black CD MacBook).
After testing out gfxCardStatus, I confirm that Intel HD Graphics cannot activate an external monitor, in this case, LED Cinema Display. (It was in different posts anyway)
Still with the same concern. Even with a potential firmware upgrade, I believe it is not possible to activate external display with the integrated GPU. Discrete GPU does run faster with better performance, however, the heat and fan issue I had mentioned still exists.
Don't get confused though, I have not had an overheating issue with the new MacBook Pro itself, when it runs by itself. It performs great and is much faster than previous models. i5 processor really does make a difference. This thread was to give an idea to a potential buyer who was considering the MacBook Pro and LED Cinema Display combination.
I'll continue to update if any other issues arise.
Still with the same concern. Even with a potential firmware upgrade, I believe it is not possible to activate external display with the integrated GPU. Discrete GPU does run faster with better performance, however, the heat and fan issue I had mentioned still exists.
Don't get confused though, I have not had an overheating issue with the new MacBook Pro itself, when it runs by itself. It performs great and is much faster than previous models. i5 processor really does make a difference. This thread was to give an idea to a potential buyer who was considering the MacBook Pro and LED Cinema Display combination.
I'll continue to update if any other issues arise.
Hi all,
I guess my question is, if you are plugged in and not concerned about battery power, why would you not want the best graphics chip pushing everything at that point? Are you saying the fans are running constant and loud when the discrete graphics card is being used? Are you also saying that by running the discrete graphics constantly you can possibly damage the chip/hardware inside due to heat/overuse? That is definitely a concern...
It seems that this would be problematic even without the ACD monitor, as looking at the list of programs that activate the switch to the discrete graphics card (including iPhoto) the discrete card will most likely be running quite a bit anyway...
I guess my question is, if you are plugged in and not concerned about battery power, why would you not want the best graphics chip pushing everything at that point? Are you saying the fans are running constant and loud when the discrete graphics card is being used? Are you also saying that by running the discrete graphics constantly you can possibly damage the chip/hardware inside due to heat/overuse? That is definitely a concern...
It seems that this would be problematic even without the ACD monitor, as looking at the list of programs that activate the switch to the discrete graphics card (including iPhoto) the discrete card will most likely be running quite a bit anyway...
This is why, I'm not all that happy with apple's automatic gpu switching.
I want to have a say in what GPU I want to use. Too apple didn't provide a mechanism to opt for the integrated gpu, regardless of the demand being placed on the system.
I want to have a say in what GPU I want to use. Too apple didn't provide a mechanism to opt for the integrated gpu, regardless of the demand being placed on the system.
What you guys discussing about? Don't you have any serious problems?
I mean if you use an external monitor (I assume you are not running your external monitor with battery) then you have there a power adopter. So why not using the GPU?!? You wanna spare your GPU so you can still sell it after the rest of your macbook pro broke down? ;-)
I mean if you use an external monitor (I assume you are not running your external monitor with battery) then you have there a power adopter. So why not using the GPU?!? You wanna spare your GPU so you can still sell it after the rest of your macbook pro broke down? ;-)
hey, wise guy with serious problems.
you don't have to insult the people discussing about something new with the new machine. this is actually an interesting thread, it can be an issue. whether to use the integrated or the discrete, that's one user's option. "why" for any reason, that's none of your business. you don't have to put question marks and exclamation marks after someone who favors one over the other. When this thread is discussing how the new automatic switching works, why are you being ignorant and have to be sarcastic? if you have serious problems that you like discussing, go discuss that somewhere else then. no one forced you into this thread and made you steve jobs jr.
you don't have to insult the people discussing about something new with the new machine. this is actually an interesting thread, it can be an issue. whether to use the integrated or the discrete, that's one user's option. "why" for any reason, that's none of your business. you don't have to put question marks and exclamation marks after someone who favors one over the other. When this thread is discussing how the new automatic switching works, why are you being ignorant and have to be sarcastic? if you have serious problems that you like discussing, go discuss that somewhere else then. no one forced you into this thread and made you steve jobs jr.
Relax Tiger.
Unfortunately its not "ones user's option". You can only choose the switching option and the discrete GPU option but there is no discrete GPU option. Apple might add that option so.
stop confusing people, man. you can only choose to use "automatic switching" or "discrete GPU only." There is no option to use "integrated GPU only." and we already know it's not an option. and "Apple might add that option so."? what does that mean and that's your answer to everything? Apple's gonna do something soon?
I just sent my i7 back to Apple
Hi all. I hope with threads like this Apple gets some more pressure. I had the 3.06 GHz Core 2 Duo MacBook Pro with 8GB RAM and it worked great with the 24" Cinema Display - at home and in the office. I switched to the i7 15" flagship MBP with high res glossy screen and had the same problems described by the thread starter here.
So how did I get rid of the fan noise? I just bought an older Core 2 Duo (2.8 GHz) MBP (refurbished one) for my friend I gave my 3.06 GHz, took my old 3.06 GHz MBP back to me and sent the i7 back to Apple. I do not agree with the thread starter, that i7 is a great machine - it's not, it's the product of a market-war concerning long battery lifes and ended up in a really bad product design (internally) with a too lousy integrated graphic card. Since Apple pushes the setup with external display and MBP, it's even more crap, since in this combination you really can't use it - at least not compared to my older one - you feel like flying in a transatlantic airplane.
I really hope that the community can make enough pressure so that Apple sees that this product is no success and changes it quickly. In this case, I will buy it again.
One last word to the speeds: According to published benchmarks online the i7 is 30% faster than my old one (3.06 GHz). Since I bought three i7 for my employees, I had all 4 MBP at home and could make some speedtests (all i7 with fastest CPU and 8GB RAM). And yes, with Cinebench and stuff like this, i7 is 20-30% faster. But using it in daily life, you won't notice any difference in speed at all. Opening Mail, browsing Safari, working in Windows with Parallels or working with Aperture, it's all the same speed.
So, the only difference that remains is the resolution, at least if you go for high-res, and the new trackpad, where you can let things scroll even while removing your fingers. First thing is still better than to think, you're 8 hours a day in an airplane (besides: I do fly airplanes, so I know what I'm talking about) and the second can be solved with a magic mouse.
Again, Apple should take these complaints very serious.
Hi all. I hope with threads like this Apple gets some more pressure. I had the 3.06 GHz Core 2 Duo MacBook Pro with 8GB RAM and it worked great with the 24" Cinema Display - at home and in the office. I switched to the i7 15" flagship MBP with high res glossy screen and had the same problems described by the thread starter here.
So how did I get rid of the fan noise? I just bought an older Core 2 Duo (2.8 GHz) MBP (refurbished one) for my friend I gave my 3.06 GHz, took my old 3.06 GHz MBP back to me and sent the i7 back to Apple. I do not agree with the thread starter, that i7 is a great machine - it's not, it's the product of a market-war concerning long battery lifes and ended up in a really bad product design (internally) with a too lousy integrated graphic card. Since Apple pushes the setup with external display and MBP, it's even more crap, since in this combination you really can't use it - at least not compared to my older one - you feel like flying in a transatlantic airplane.
I really hope that the community can make enough pressure so that Apple sees that this product is no success and changes it quickly. In this case, I will buy it again.
One last word to the speeds: According to published benchmarks online the i7 is 30% faster than my old one (3.06 GHz). Since I bought three i7 for my employees, I had all 4 MBP at home and could make some speedtests (all i7 with fastest CPU and 8GB RAM). And yes, with Cinebench and stuff like this, i7 is 20-30% faster. But using it in daily life, you won't notice any difference in speed at all. Opening Mail, browsing Safari, working in Windows with Parallels or working with Aperture, it's all the same speed.
So, the only difference that remains is the resolution, at least if you go for high-res, and the new trackpad, where you can let things scroll even while removing your fingers. First thing is still better than to think, you're 8 hours a day in an airplane (besides: I do fly airplanes, so I know what I'm talking about) and the second can be solved with a magic mouse.
Again, Apple should take these complaints very serious.
Thanks to everyone who posted above ... you've saved me some grief and money too.
Fan noise and heat is a big issue for me. We're running a few C2D '09 2.8 and 3.0 ghz machines and no problems with fan noise or heat.
It's very hard to reach a conclusion here ... it doesn't bother some people, maybe many who just received their i5/i7's want to defend their purchase, others have nothing to compare it to.
I think it is safe to determine that Apple using this 'auto graphics switching' is a bad idea. Why? Because it forces the machine to run in discrete mode more often which in turn creates more heat and the potential for the fan to run more and at a higher rpm = more fan noise.
A person started a thread about waiting for the "Rev B i5/i7 MBP's and he's getting slammed hard by many i5/i7 owners yet his advice may be good.
Not to mention with the machine running in discrete mode more often than it needs to the battery life is diminished...
So yes, Apple does have a few things to get straightened up ... call it a Rev B or whatever ... if you're not in desperate need of a new computer wait.
The mac forums are buzzing with 'issue's' as well.
Fan noise and heat is a big issue for me. We're running a few C2D '09 2.8 and 3.0 ghz machines and no problems with fan noise or heat.
It's very hard to reach a conclusion here ... it doesn't bother some people, maybe many who just received their i5/i7's want to defend their purchase, others have nothing to compare it to.
I think it is safe to determine that Apple using this 'auto graphics switching' is a bad idea. Why? Because it forces the machine to run in discrete mode more often which in turn creates more heat and the potential for the fan to run more and at a higher rpm = more fan noise.
A person started a thread about waiting for the "Rev B i5/i7 MBP's and he's getting slammed hard by many i5/i7 owners yet his advice may be good.
Not to mention with the machine running in discrete mode more often than it needs to the battery life is diminished...
So yes, Apple does have a few things to get straightened up ... call it a Rev B or whatever ... if you're not in desperate need of a new computer wait.
The mac forums are buzzing with 'issue's' as well.
My i5 runs cool/warm even when using the optical drive for hours...I rarely, if ever hear the fans kick in...
Just got a MBP 15´ and I love it.
First Mac for me. Better late than never... it is great!
I wanted to wait for the next generation Cinema Displays and hook my MBP to one. No rush for me, while playing with my MPB.
I am curious now if I should buy a display. The heat, fans and clicks that are being discussed here are all new to me. Not sure what to make of it yet.
First Mac for me. Better late than never... it is great!
I wanted to wait for the next generation Cinema Displays and hook my MBP to one. No rush for me, while playing with my MPB.
I am curious now if I should buy a display. The heat, fans and clicks that are being discussed here are all new to me. Not sure what to make of it yet.
I really hope this thread hasn't deterred anyone from buying a new Core i5/i7 machine. I've been running my i7 high-res for two weeks now, and it RARELY gets hot. I've owned a couple of G4 PowerBooks that would fry me on a daily basis. This computer gets warm... I'd never say hot.
And even though I don't own an external display, I can say this: I've been gaming pretty heavily (Star Trek Online, in native resolution with graphics settings... all of them... on Max) and while the fans kick on, they are quite unobtrusive (even with the sound muted). I'm sure gaming stresses the GPU more then an external display does. No way you can convince me this is an universal flaw. 5000 RPM? Really? I have just fired up SMC Fan Control and set the fans on 5000 RPM, and I can tell you in no way has this computer ever made this much noise. Even under gaming. This "issue" of yours can't effect all users...
And even though I don't own an external display, I can say this: I've been gaming pretty heavily (Star Trek Online, in native resolution with graphics settings... all of them... on Max) and while the fans kick on, they are quite unobtrusive (even with the sound muted). I'm sure gaming stresses the GPU more then an external display does. No way you can convince me this is an universal flaw. 5000 RPM? Really? I have just fired up SMC Fan Control and set the fans on 5000 RPM, and I can tell you in no way has this computer ever made this much noise. Even under gaming. This "issue" of yours can't effect all users...
This is a pretty informative thread. Especially if you're looking into buying that Cinema Display with MacBook Pro, which I was looking into do.
Some of the replies here from i5/i7 owners don't seem to understand the point of this thread. The OP continues to say that his i5 is great, no one's really criticizing the new MBP. Just this combination seems to be a problem or just something different than a previous generation.
"Mine runs great! I don't own an external display, but it's great! I run games, it doesn't get hot! Mine's great!" Those replies don't even fit with the original discussion. If you're not running the Cinema Display, why even say your computer runs cool, when the thread is discussing about discrete GPU and Cinema Display connection?
Some of the replies here from i5/i7 owners don't seem to understand the point of this thread. The OP continues to say that his i5 is great, no one's really criticizing the new MBP. Just this combination seems to be a problem or just something different than a previous generation.
"Mine runs great! I don't own an external display, but it's great! I run games, it doesn't get hot! Mine's great!" Those replies don't even fit with the original discussion. If you're not running the Cinema Display, why even say your computer runs cool, when the thread is discussing about discrete GPU and Cinema Display connection?
Did you even read the posts here? Your missing the point totally. He said that he returned the machine because the fan turned on and made too much noise. From running an extra display. Gaming is more GPU intensive. Doesn't take a genius to put together the fact that if the fans don't turn off from what I've been doing, it could be an isolated incident. My reply certainly does fit in. Maybe you should take time to read all the posts like I did?
The OP is making a big deal about the machine having to use discreet graphics.... but really, whats the big deal if your machine is going to be plugged in? The only answer would be heat/noise.