New Motherboard Details?

[whooleytoo]

Originally posted by deepkid
Don't be silly. Its common knowledge that no one outside of Steve's first layer knows anything about what's not available, with regard to new products.

Actually, quite a lot of people would know about the machines if their release was imminent. The only things that could be still kept secret would be the exact configurations, pricing, and especially, the finished look'n'feel.

He was probably looking at you, refraining from showing his stressful natural reply when confronted by overzealous fans. Some of store workers follow the sites just like you and me, and are not privy to some internal Apple product grapevine. This, from a couple of the store reps I've spoken to.

They barely know anything until the product hits their shelves.

Sales reps are usually the last to know and ( no offence to any sales reps present) for a very good reason. But a lot of people in manufacturing/assembly and in QA would know about the machines by now.

Mike.

 

[smada]

Originally posted by nichrome
Thus MacB's claim about the board having two FW800 ports and one FW400 strikes me as absurd. Now, if Sony camcorders, hard disks etc. widely supported FW800, this wouldn't be a problem, but that's just not the case. The current setup, with one FireWire 800 and two FireWire 400 ports in the tower Macs, makes a hell of a lot more sense.

But don't you remember how absurd everyone thought having only USB on the iMacs was? Then about year later there were 768.2 million USB accesories. If Apple doesn't implement FW800, then why should anybody use it?

 

[Cabrewolf]

Originally posted by Frobozz
This is only my own ignorance, but on the back of a receiver with 5.1 it has 6 connectors. One for each channel of audio. I am assuming that there is some pre or post-processing if you have only 3 connectors? Is there a custom speaker system to handle this?

For example: left, right, and center (3). The location of the audio (back and front) is done in software/hardware, and routed to the speaker it needs on a receiver or standalone system. The low frequencies are routed to a subwoofer, etc. Would this be right? I'm confused!

Post processed 5.1 requires six connections, but preprocessed 5.1 signals only need one digital line; either optical or RCA. Having only the one digital allows them to do not only 5.1 but also some of the higher quality suround encoding(6 and 7 channels).

Wolf

 

[backdraft]

"5 additional unidentified connectors"

hmm... modem port, ethernet port, display connection, power cord(though this probably doesn't count as a port), vga out, or usb 2.0?

 

[BurntCalc]

64 bit OS?

From my understanding, Apple is using a 64bit unix variant already for their OS. So is the OS going to be 64 bit??? Of course. It already basically is.

The question is whether we'll see the OS taking advantage of this in the new 970 powermacs. My guess is that we won't see anything like this.

TWO PROBLEMS: First, the chip. While I agree that the 970 is alive and well, I don't think we'll see it this summer. There are absolutely no concrete rumors or news on the subject.

Second, the OS. Again, everyone debates, but no one is sure. No reliable info here either.

In my opinion, two weak "maybe's" make a "probably not".

Folks, at this point in the game, there would be a lot more reliable info on the subject than just petty speculation on prototype boards. We'd see new case designs, chip manufacturing deals, leaked designs, etc... there is nothing like this. Usually a safe sign is when a major news site decides to break a story. Again, nothing. Just speculation.

Anyhoo... just my 2 cents.

 

[Frobozz]

Originally posted by reyesmac
... just ad cheap PC PCI surround sound cards and video in/out cards with mac drivers. Why waste money putting on the motherboard when they would just use a pci cards?

It's probably to cater to the professional audio crowd, which, has a majority of mac users. If it's on the motherbaord it's probably much lower latency. In fact, coupled with OS X, the Mac has the Digital Audio mac and newer (I believe) have the lowest audio latency of any personal computer.

 

[nuckinfutz]

Originally posted by reyesmac
Why doesnt Apple just make a mac with 6 pci and 1 agp slot and just ad cheap PC PCI surround sound cards and video in/out cards with mac drivers. Why waste money putting on the motherboard when they would just use a pci cards? That way, the people who needs extra slots can take the unwanted cards out and the ones that dont need that many slots still have 3 to work with. It will be dissapointing if they dont use industry standard connectors for audio and video.

What they need to ad to the motherboard is a hardware mpeg encoder/decoder with video in and out, that way making iDVD's and iMovies will be quicker.

1. Cost
2. Heat
3. Reliability
4. Size

To make things cheaper you must integrate as much as you can. Consolidation is key.

There really aren't any industry standards. Apple could use a myriad of the "standards"

toslink?
Coax?
DVI?
BNC?

Actually, you remind me of an interesting thought here. AAC can be transmitted over spdif, AAC is (one of) the audio specification for MPEG4. As receivers start to support MPEG4 solutions for digital video, its reasonable to expect AAC to be incorporated into future receivers,

I think you are right here. What does AAC and WM9 have over standard MP3. Multichannel capability. Now consumers have access to low cost 5.1 systems. Multichannel will become a desired capability. I can't wait.

 

[hvfsl]

Originally posted by Frobozz
Uh, you're a going just a tad overboard. Lots of people use Macs for Audio for good reason. I won't bother explaining it all. Just ask the thousands of professionals who do music for a living, on a Mac, including my brother.

I got a bit anyoyed because there were lots of people saying there was no point in having 5.1 sound because stereo is good enough. So I though I would start some flaming. I know Macs are better for audio in general, just not watching DVDs it seems.

 

[Dave_B]

Originally posted by macrealist
Originally posted by pyrotoaster
================
quote:

"If MacBidouille is actually posting real info here, all they'd need is one really good source in just the right place. "

================

From their articles, it sounds like their inside source is in manufactruring. All of the info is from a non-engineer point of view, and the info on the color of the MLB and the wrapped boxes are similar to aapl manufacturing practice.

The manufacturing plant in Ireland makes PowerPCs and servers, and has a European call support facility, and probably where the source is from.

As I recall, the stories about the 970's had them landed in Taiwan.

 

[andyduncan]

Somehow I doubt that "Unidentified mystery ports" would end up being USB, VGA, Modem, Ethernet, or any other easily recognizable port. Also, preproduction MOBOS often have extra ports for debugging/diagnostics. Though 5 sounds like a bit much.

With regards to 5.1 over 3 miniplugs, sure you can do it, but it sounds like sh*t. Digital out is the only way to go. Most of these boards don't have horse pucky in the way of D/A converters. Anecdotally my g4's miniplug sounds way better than my VIA's.

 

[illumin8]

Originally posted by nuckinfutz
Probably not going to happen. What Digital Out would you use? SPDIF is stereo only. There is no industry standard multichannel Digital I/O.

I call bullsh*t. SPDIF supports many digital formats, including:

* PCM - Pulse Code Modulation or stereo
* DTS - 5.1 or 7.1
* Dolby AC3 - 5.1 or 7.1

I'm sure there are more formats available. It would be awesome if Apple had both an optical and an SPDIF output for sound.

 

[LionMage]

Originally posted by Frobozz
This is only my own ignorance, but on the back of a receiver with 5.1 it has 6 connectors. One for each channel of audio. I am assuming that there is some pre or post-processing if you have only 3 connectors? Is there a custom speaker system to handle this?

If these three ports are in fact for 5.1 surround sound, then they are probably using stereo mini-jacks for each of the three connectors. That way, each connector provides output for two separate signals. No software multiplexing or other weirdness is required. Stereo mini-jacks are the same kind of plugs that are used for headphones and ear-buds, not to mention most computer speakers in the Wintel world.

While it's not as nice as having six discrete RCA jacks, one for each channel, the use of three stereo mini-jacks has the virtue of keeping the footprint of the connectors relatively small. Most Wintel motherboards that have built-in 5.1 channel surround sound support (such as the MSI KT3 Ultra ARU motherboard that I have in my one Athlon PC at home) use this very same method for doing surround sound. It's a cheap way to add value, and of course, if you don't want surround support then the ports get reassigned -- one port becomes stereo output, another becomes microphone input, and so forth.

 

[nuckinfutz]

Originally posted by illumin8
I call bullsh*t. SPDIF supports many digital formats, including:

* PCM - Pulse Code Modulation or stereo
* DTS - 5.1 or 7.1
* Dolby AC3 - 5.1 or 7.1

I'm sure there are more formats available. It would be awesome if Apple had both an optical and an SPDIF output for sound.

I know it's semantics but if we're talking about Compressed Multichannel music then we have plenty of choices. However in the case of SACD and DVD-Audio which support multichannel uncompressed audio there is no "standard" connector.

My bad for not putting in the "Uncompressed" that's an important differentiation.

 

[whoami]

it's really funny how this topic has turned into a audio discussion!
it's too bad recievers and most home audio gear don't have MLAN or similar capabilities. then they wouldn't even have to add any jacks! multi channel audio over firewire!

 

[Mosco]

Originally posted by SuzanneA
Btw, still on the audio theme, IF the 970s are going to use HyperTransport in any way, and Apple decided to go with nVidia for the chipset (since they have HT experience from the nForce 3) it wouldn't be unreasonable to expect the nForce's 'realtime dolby digital encoding' on multi-channel audio.

The nforce 3 doesn't have the nvidea APU. IT also lacks firewire support. it also lacks a southbrdge so i not exactly sure how easy it is to add these things.

Originally posted by Sayer
You know most PeeCee mobo's don't have optical output for 5.1 surround sound, so why should a Mac?

Just about all PeeCees get audio support via a PCI card, and it has tons of features built in and lots of software support.

The nforce 2 chipset with MCP-T southbridge has a realtime DD encoder built in and most boards atleast have a built in optical out and some have in. The nforce APU is amazing, only thing better would be an high end creative stuff.

I think the new intel chipsets have something like also but i am not sure.

 

[SuzanneA]

Originally posted by Mosco
The nforce 3 doesn't have the nvidea APU. IT also lacks firewire support. it also lacks a southbrdge so i not exactly sure how easy it is to add these things.

Only because right now the nForce 3 is for servers, you can bet when the release of the consumer AMD64 nears, the nForce 3 will magically gain more consumer-PC features, such as the APU and Firewire.

Anyway, I was really more speculating on the idea of nVidia designing a new chipset based on their existing experience with HT and other features that apple MAY want. I personally doubt it would happen - Apple would want the chipset to remain proprietary IP to themselves, I imagine. Though with nVidia a touch mad at MS about the xbox2, who knows what might happen 😀

 

[Raiwong]

5.1 is good, but I'd trade the connectors for something else. The whole 5.1 thing is having 6 speakers that can reproduce 3D sound. Many people are happy with 2 SPEAKERS on their godamn computer.

The 5.1 system is designed for home cinemas on plasma tv,s with a big sofa. Not some mac geek that has to be a audio phile as well, which is pretty rare to sit in a smallass screen 22inch is small for cinema standards and watch movies like that.

If you want to watch DVDs get a home cinema, nearly all of the Pc users don't use their 5.1 system. Ok now some say 5.1 for games? what games on the mac?! we will even have trouble trying to get 5.1 apps now.

5.1 is still a very nich market, i'm not saying its expensive or something, but people just don't feel the need to clamp 6 speakers in their room.

Honestly the computer 5.1 market isn't lifted off because noone is interested right now. Card manufacturers only include the connectors because they are cheap and will add value to their product.

I also agree with the whole integrated motherboard thing, why not just have other manufacturers, BUT NO APPLE has style they like to design everything, and looks innovative. I can see a innovative motherboard coming up our asses. and the innovation sure costs alot too

sorry i'm a bit high today...I apologize

 

[P-Worm]

I think the most interest is the fact that there is only one FW400 port there and two FW800. Is it just me or is there almost nothing right now that supports FW800? Maybe Apple has something else up their sleeve that none of us are aware of.

As a side not, I don't really buy all of this audio talk. It just doesn't seem like what these mystery ports are.

Another good point is where the ethernet port went. This whole article doesn't make a lot of sense.

P-Worm

 

[Fukui]

Originally posted by SuzanneA
Though with nVidia a touch mad at MS about the xbox2, who knows what might happen 😀

What happened with MS/Nvidia?

 

[SuzanneA]

Originally posted by Fukui
What happened with MS/Nvidia?

MS told intel and nvidia it doesn't need their chips for the xbox 2, it will design the CPU and GPU itself.

Really, you can stop laughing now....

 

[DharvaBinky]

dual GBCU ehternet?

Originally posted by Frobozz
Good point... what's up with that? Seems like a basic thing to report. Suspicious...

It said the ports were grouped in to 3 and 2. That could be the audio grouping (3) and dual Gigabit Ethernet...

That'd make the pro mac a little more pro. Especially since Apple could assuredly write network load-balancing drivers for their own motherboards giving them a 2gb on copper solution...

😎

Dharvabinky

 

[AidenShaw]

Not 64 bit OS, not today

Originally posted by BurntCalc
From my understanding, Apple is using a 64bit unix variant already for their OS. So is the OS going to be 64 bit??? Of course. It already basically is.

Can you offer any proof of this from Apple? A random website with OS X listed in the 64-bit column isn't proof - that mistake has been made before.

Just because some members of BSD are 64-bit, doesn't mean that the Mach kernel, the BSD layers, Carbon, Cocoa and everything else is 64-bit.

Mac OS X is a 32-bit operating system, period. The presence of 64-bit cousins should mean that the UNIX parts should be fairly easy to port, but all the Apple stuff added on top has a legacy of 32-bit code.

 

[stompy]

Originally posted by SuzanneA
MS told intel and nvidia it doesn't need their chips for the xbox 2, it will design the CPU and GPU itself.

Really, you can stop laughing now....

You're wrong about one thing, I can't stop laughing 😛

 

[Eniregnat]

It seems that most everybody is 970 centered. Think outside the box, perhaps this new motherboard is for the consumer line digital hub[b/] that was on top of the rumor charts way back when the Cube was about to appear. Actually the digital hub (combo entertainment center/email/phone/ and all around Jetson’s like appliance) rumor surfaces every couple of months. This is just my take.

 

[soggywulf]

Originally posted by andyduncan
With regards to 5.1 over 3 miniplugs, sure you can do it, but it sounds like sh*t. Digital out is the only way to go. Most of these boards don't have horse pucky in the way of D/A converters. Anecdotally my g4's miniplug sounds way better than my VIA's.

Have you tested this double-blind? I find it unlikely that you hear differences in DACs, outside the psychoacoustic effect.