New PowerBooks this Week?

[maxmag]

Whatever

Clearly you know absolutely nothing about chip design. Have you ever seen the size of the heat sink on a G5? What about on a 90nm G5? You have no idea what you are talking about as well because you aren't familiar with the large amount of power consumption involved. Moreover, no one is risking anything considering I am not revealing my neighbor's name. You probably are paranoid borderline-delusional and listen to the trash that Powerpage.org puts out (i.e. the new powerbooks are sitting on a dock somewhere in Taiwan...blahblahblah...)

Based on reported specs of the 90nm 970FX (i.e. that it runs cooler than most if not all high-end Intel/AMD chips used in laptops, and almost on a par with the G4 at comparable if not higher clock speeds), I find this a bit hard to swallow. Also, I doubt that your neighbor, if he is a Sr. Engineer at Apple, would risk his job telling you anything about the status of PB production.

Sorry, you'll have to try harder than that.

(Note, I'm not saying that I think a G5 PB will come out tomorrow or even next week. It may well be another six months before one comes out. But to say that they need 'quite a bit below' 90nm process is just BS.)

 

[konaforever]

Hey, those rumors are the funniest things I've heard in awhile. Don't knock em.

....listen to the trash that Powerpage.org puts out (i.e. the new powerbooks are sitting on a dock somewhere in Taiwan...blahblahblah...)

 

[macdong]

Clearly you know absolutely nothing about chip design. Have you ever seen the size of the heat sink on a G5? What about on a 90nm G5? You have no idea what you are talking about as well because you aren't familiar with the large amount of power consumption involved. Moreover, no one is risking anything considering I am not revealing my neighbor's name. You probably are paranoid borderline-delusional and listen to the trash that Powerpage.org puts out (i.e. the new powerbooks are sitting on a dock somewhere in Taiwan...blahblahblah...)

first of all, we are on a rumor website. everybody knows Apple's tight policy of not discussing their future products, not to mention a "senior engineer". so i would say his doubt about you having a neighbor in Apple is reasonable, and those attacks from your words are uncalled for.

besides, what makes you think you aren't risking anything? how many Apple PB divisions are in Apple, and how many "senior engineers" are in that division? if it can be narrowed down to below 10 people, your neighbor's department is gonna have some problem.

by the way, let's assume you do have a neighbor as senior engineer in Apple PB division. tell him they are doing a poor job. Apple has been working with IBM for quite some time now, and i still can't believe they didn't have a plan for PowerBook at the beginning. they should've forseen these problems whatever they are. a supposed pro laptop left hanging is unacceptable.

 

[Snowy_River]

Clearly you know absolutely nothing about chip design. Have you ever seen the size of the heat sink on a G5? What about on a 90nm G5? You have no idea what you are talking about as well because you aren't familiar with the large amount of power consumption involved.

If you're only basing your info on the size of the heat sink, I'd be inclined to question your knowledge of chip design. I will be honest and say that I've never designed a computer system. However, I am an physicist, so I know a little about heat dissipation, etc. I've based my information on the released specifications on the power consumption (i.e. directly related to necessary heat dissipation) of the 970FX at various clock speeds, vs. the power consumption of other chips used in mobile settings (P4-M, P-M, G4, etc.).

Now, I will freely acknowledge that the G5's system controller is another culprit of high heat output, and it's usually been where the finger has been pointed lately as to why we don't have a PB G5 yet. This makes the standing question one of when a low power system controller will be ready as the standing question. But that has little to do with the size of the process that the G5 is on. Thus, I question your information.

Moreover, no one is risking anything considering I am not revealing my neighbor's name.

As has been pointed out by MacDong, Apple is known for being very proactive in plugging leaks, even going beyond firing employees to suing them for damages. The information that you gave was easily enough to narrow the field to a mere handful of people. Further, Apple could try to subpoena your IP address from MacRumors, and thus find out where you live, and therefore who your neighbor is. ALL APPLE EMPLOYEES KNOW HOW SERIOUS LEAKING INFORMATION IS. They rarely, if ever, do it.

You probably are paranoid borderline-delusional and listen to the trash that Powerpage.org puts out (i.e. the new powerbooks are sitting on a dock somewhere in Taiwan...blahblahblah...)

Did you not read the last line in my post? Nothing I've said has warranted an attack such as this. Trying to tear down someone else's argument by attacking them personally is one of the weakest forms of attack, and usually is indicative of a weak position on the attacker's part.

first of all, we are on a rumor website. everybody knows Apple's tight policy of not discussing their future products, not to mention a "senior engineer". so i would say his doubt about you having a neighbor in Apple is reasonable, and those attacks from your words are uncalled for.

besides, what makes you think you aren't risking anything? how many Apple PB divisions are in Apple, and how many "senior engineers" are in that division? if it can be narrowed down to below 10 people, your neighbor's department is gonna have some problem.

by the way, let's assume you do have a neighbor as senior engineer in Apple PB division. tell him they are doing a poor job. Apple has been working with IBM for quite some time now, and i still can't believe they didn't have a plan for PowerBook at the beginning. they should've forseen these problems whatever they are. a supposed pro laptop left hanging is unacceptable.

Thank you MacDong.

 

[Naimfan]

Snowy--

"Apple could try to subpoena your IP address from MacRumors, and thus find out where you live, and therefore who your neighbor is."

Apple could try, but they would fail... ;-)

Best,

Bob

 

[macdong]

Snowy--

"Apple could try to subpoena your IP address from MacRumors, and thus find out where you live, and therefore who your neighbor is."

Apple could try, but they would fail... ;-)

Best,

Bob

hmm, i don't know about that.
if RIAA can do it over verizon for file swapping, Apple just might be able to
nah, just kidding

 

[Parikh1234]

Snowy--

"Apple could try to subpoena your IP address from MacRumors, and thus find out where you live, and therefore who your neighbor is."

Apple could try, but they would fail... ;-)

Best,

Bob

well we know hes in arizona. And if im correct, isnt apple in california? Thats one hell of a morning drive. Also, how many senior apple engineers are there in arizona? I think apple needs to know about this guy

 

[Naimfan]

Sorry gang--I meant from a legal perspective there is little to no chance a subpoena could be served. While the RIAA example seems to be analogous, it is not.

I don't mean to suggest an opinion on the veracity of the claim.

Best,

Bob

 

[macdong]

Sorry gang--I meant from a legal perspective there is little to no chance a subpoena could be served. While the RIAA example seems to be analogous, it is not.

I don't mean to suggest an opinion on the veracity of the claim.

Best,

Bob

you are right about subpoena.
i was only joking

 

[Snowy_River]

Sorry gang--I meant from a legal perspective there is little to no chance a subpoena could be served. While the RIAA example seems to be analogous, it is not.

I don't mean to suggest an opinion on the veracity of the claim.

Best,

Bob

Yeah, I realized that they might not be likely to succeed, but that hasn't always stopped companies from trying. That is why I used the word 'try'. My primary point was that he was revealing more information that he might have realized...

 

[billwest9999]

My primary point was that he was revealing more information that he might have realized...

Which is good for the rest of us. Who cares if he goes to jail if we get our rumors? Somebody has to be sacrifice for the benefits of the group. One for all, all for one!

 

[Anna]

bah, I could almost bet my life on that there is no PB this week. Why would apple release something so close to easter anyway. These PB rumors are beginning to be like "the boy who cried wolf".

 

[DreaminDirector]

These PB rumors are beginning to be like "the boy who cried wolf".

Sadly, I was thinking the same thing....

 

[aswitcher]

Sadly, I was thinking the same thing....

And it felt like this 2 months ago...

 

[Snowy_River]

And it felt like this 2 months ago...

But to what extent can that be blamed on the rumor sites as opposed to Apple. As I've already pointed out elsewhere, we're really only just now getting to the point that PB updates are due, not over due. The rumor sites have been screaming about impending updates, working the community up into a frenzy, only to be disappointed when nothing comes (earlier than history would indicate things should be expected).

 

[aswitcher]

But to what extent can that be blamed on the rumor sites as opposed to Apple. As I've already pointed out elsewhere, we're really only just now getting to the point that PB updates are due, not over due. The rumor sites have been screaming about impending updates, working the community up into a frenzy, only to be disappointed when nothing comes (earlier than history would indicate things should be expected).

The September bump was pretty minor so I tend to think they are overdue. Whilst the PBs are good almost everything about them can be improved now to be more in line with what is available in the pc market: screen resolution/refresh, hd speed, dvd speed, clock speed (of course), graphics card... a G4 update if that is indeed whats next will have to do at least these to not get serious criticism. Plus they may do what they did last time and release the G5s within a few months of a G4 upgrade...

 

[oingoboingo]

Clearly you know absolutely nothing about chip design. Have you ever seen the size of the heat sink on a G5?

The large heatsink and large, yet slow spinning fan are so the G5 can be cooled ***quietly***. Pentium 4 and Athlon chips producing higher heat outputs are cooled without issue by much smaller heatsinks and fans...but those fans spin at several thousand RPM, and generate much more noise. I have literally just returned from helping a PC-using friend set up an iPod on his overclocked AMD Athlon system. He has a heatsink/fan combo which is about 1/3rd the size of the G5s heatsink...and I can still hear the buzzing in my ear from the 6000 RPM cooling fan. In contrast, I can almost see the individual blades turning in my 1.6GHz G5's CPU fan, and only notice the fan noise when there's no other noise at all in the house.

Big heatsink + fan != large unquenchable furnace-like heat output.

 

[Unregistered.]

My standard attitude (that has been developed over many years) is to realize I'll be disappointed by Apple's releases. Most of the time I am underwhelmed. I have had a few "blown away" moments in the past few years; the iMac is a great piece of cool engineering, the introduction of the 12 and 17 PBs was cool, and although I never was a huge fan (pardon the pun) of the G5's boring cheese grater appearance, just the G5 being real and not a myth was exciting. I find that most updates don't do anything for me, since we're (no offense) way behind the PC world (spec-wise anyway). Apple's strength is in their design, not their power. I mean, PBs are MAYBE going to go up to 1.5Ghz. That's where PC laptops have been for 2 or 3 years now. You can get 1.5Ghz laptops for under $1000 on the PC side. That's their low end. My brothers Dell (which is actually a great laptop even though it's running Windows) is at 2 Ghz and he got it at least a year ago. The Dell Laptops are at 3.4 Ghz now.

But then I look at them

http://www1.ca.dell.com/content/topics/segtopic.aspx/brand/inspiron_xps?c=ca&l=en&s=gen

and I realize that Apple might take years to get to the same power place, but it's worth the wait. The Dells are monsters, while the Apples are cool. So because I'm more a fan of cool design than raw power, I guess I'll stick around. But I sure would like the G5's to come out soon, because Apple's bloody far behind. We're about to be labelled 'beleaguered' again....

ps. The one thing that's cool about Dells is this, their Quicksnap Colors: Skulls Rule.

http://www1.ca.dell.com/content/pro...ADHS1&l=en&s=dhs&~page=6&~tab=viewstab#tabtop

 

[klaus]

My standard attitude (that has been developed over many years) is to realize I'll be disappointed by Apple's releases. Most of the time I am underwhelmed. I have had a few "blown away" moments in the past few years; the iMac is a great piece of cool engineering, the introduction of the 12 and 17 PBs was cool, and although I never was a huge fan (pardon the pun) of the G5's boring cheese grater appearance, just the G5 being real and not a myth was exciting. I find that most updates don't do anything for me, since we're (no offense) way behind the PC world (spec-wise anyway). Apple's strength is in their design, not their power. I mean, PBs are MAYBE going to go up to 1.5Ghz. That's where PC laptops have been for 2 or 3 years now. You can get 1.5Ghz laptops for under $1000 on the PC side. That's their low end. My brothers Dell (which is actually a great laptop even though it's running Windows) is at 2 Ghz and he got it at least a year ago. The Dell Laptops are at 3.4 Ghz now.

But then I look at them

http://www1.ca.dell.com/content/topics/segtopic.aspx/brand/inspiron_xps?c=ca&l=en&s=gen

and I realize that Apple might take years to get to the same power place, but it's worth the wait. The Dells are monsters, while the Apples are cool. So because I'm more a fan of cool design than raw power, I guess I'll stick around. But I sure would like the G5's to come out soon, because Apple's bloody far behind. We're about to be labelled 'beleaguered' again....

ps. The one thing that's cool about Dells is this, their Quicksnap Colors: Skulls Rule.

http://www1.ca.dell.com/content/pro...ADHS1&l=en&s=dhs&~page=6&~tab=viewstab#tabtop

Maybe Apple Hardware isn't as innovating or powerfull like Dell's lineup, or an other manufacturer for that matter.
But in no way can you compare GHZ numbers from pc to mac.

So stop doing it.. it makes no sense

rev B G5 will be very much in line with what the pc has to offer right now, at least if they announce them in the next few weeks (max 4)

 

[Unregistered.]

That's true, Klaus. Once we get faster G5's and put them in PowerBooks we'll be pretty much as fast as the PC world. What I was saying is that PCs are faster, that's a fact, but I'll stick with Apple because they have style and coolness the PCs don't usually have, and I can be slow because I get paid by the hour anyway.

But there's no way that a 1.25Ghz G4 PowerBook is anywhere near as fast as that Dell monster I mentioned above. It's scientifically impossible -- just the slow RAM and System Bus, lack of cache, slow harddrive, etc. make the G4 PowerBook a turtle compared to other guys at the same price point.

But it's a cool turtle, so I'll buy it anyways and hope Apple catches up.

Like I said, I don't care about speed as much as the total package. I just don't want to pay full price for a computer that was released in August or September (and was using older parts even then). A G5 PowerBook would be nice, but I'd never buy a first revision of it. So I'm hoping for a faster G4 soon.

 

[klaus]

That's true, Klaus. Once we get faster G5's and put them in PowerBooks we'll be pretty much as fast as the PC world. What I was saying is that PCs are faster, that's a fact, but I'll stick with Apple because they have style and coolness the PCs don't usually have, and I can be slow because I get paid by the hour anyway.

But there's no way that a 1.25Ghz G4 PowerBook is anywhere near as fast as that Dell monster I mentioned above. It's scientifically impossible -- just the slow RAM and System Bus, lack of cache, slow harddrive, etc. make the G4 PowerBook a turtle compared to other guys at the same price point.

But it's a cool turtle, so I'll buy it anyways and hope Apple catches up.

Like I said, I don't care about speed as much as the total package. I just don't want to pay full price for a computer that was released in August or September (and was using older parts even then). A G5 PowerBook would be nice, but I'd never buy a first revision of it. So I'm hoping for a faster G4 soon.

Yes, I second your opinion about the prices of the current hardware. Those prices are fair when they are announced, maybe even 4 months later, but from that point, i'd like to see some price drops.. Almost every products degrades in price the longer it's available. So why doesn't Apple do that?

It would make more sense, cause personally I have been waiting for a rev B G5 for a long time (2 months or so, yes I think it's long ). And to be honest, I won't need the extra power that a 2.4 ghz throws at me compared to the 2.0 ghz. But I just don't want to pay the same price as it was in september.

If price drops were announced 2 months ago, i'd be sitting here with a dp 2.0 ghz on my desk.. truly. But as the situation is now, i'll wait for the rev B. And oh lord, please before june 26th, so I can use the display promo


EDIT : regarding that DELL monster as you refer it so elegantly . That's not a real laptop anymore, more like a mobile desktop, and you can't compare it to a "regular" laptop like the powerbook. I have an Acer inspire 3ghz, it's almost 8 cm's high , it's weight is 7 kg, screensize is 17", it has a normal hd, so you can swap it as much as you like. But the battery lasts for 45 minutes..

so it's a desktop replacement, for use at 2 locations for instance. Not recommended for people that want to do some surfing on the train

 

[stockscalper]

Have you seen how much power those 3.4 GHZ Dells consume? They consume over 100 watts compared with 12 for the 970 FX. You can fry an egg on them and battery life is miniscule. Intel is abandoning the megahertz myth and will no longer give Mhz ratings for their chips. The Centrino series is more in line with Macs and there isn't a power gap even with the existing G4's. As for cost, yes you can buy cheaper PC laptops, but the operative word is cheap as in cheaply made. The keyboards are flimsy and screens washed out. Take a Dell catalog and once you go throught the upgrades to the better screen, more memory, bigger hard drive and wireless card and firewire ports and soon you find that a comparably equipped Dell costs more than the Powerbook, and it's still a thick clumsy ugly brick.

 

[jade]

Have you seen how much power those 3.4 GHZ Dells consume? They consume over 100 watts compared with 12 for the 970 FX. You can fry an egg on them and battery life is miniscule. Intel is abandoning the megahertz myth and will no longer give Mhz ratings for their chips. The Centrino series is more in line with Macs and there isn't a power gap even with the existing G4's. As for cost, yes you can buy cheaper PC laptops, but the operative word is cheap as in cheaply made. The keyboards are flimsy and screens washed out. Take a Dell catalog and once you go throught the upgrades to the better screen, more memory, bigger hard drive and wireless card and firewire ports and soon you find that a comparably equipped Dell costs more than the Powerbook, and it's still a thick clumsy ugly brick.

Hey guys let's compare Apples to Apples at least. The 3.4 laptops are good laptops, but the use desktop processors to sacrafice battery life for speed. And that is why the laptops are super cheap, because Intel's desktop chips are much cheaper than the mobile ones.

The powerbooks are in badly need of an upgrade, but you do need to compare them to the true competition, the other notebooks that actually use mobile chips, and place a higher premium on battery life.

For the target market of these cheap laptops, battery life and size are of no consequence, and Apple doesn't compete in this market. Unfortunately for Apple the segment of the laptop market that is growing most is the cheap and fast market.

 

[Snowy_River]

... Those prices are fair when they are announced, maybe even 4 months later, but from that point, i'd like to see some price drops.. Almost every products degrades in price the longer it's available. So why doesn't Apple do that?...

Econ101. If Apple lowered their prices during their product cycle, only to spike them up when they made a new release, they'd suffer seriously in sales. It's a far better policy, economically speaking, for them to accept a gradual decrease in sales over the course of the product cycle, than to suffer the consequences of price drops. One way that Apple gets past this, frequently, is to offer rebates and special deals late in the product cycle. Another is that some new machines are shunted into the 'refirb' market.

 

[billwest9999]

Close the thread! There are no PB this week, next week, or the week after. Not until WWDC.