Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.

Capeto

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Jul 9, 2015
505
1,164
Hey all,

My parents have a home theater with a Yamaha 5.1 receiver (RX-V477) and a 1080p Mitsubishi projector (VLT-HC3800LP). They currently have a Roku box hooked up to it that's starting to show its age so I got them the current-gen Apple TV 4K. However, no audio comes out at all from the Apple TV, whether it's steaming, sound effects (e.g., the clicking sound), or AirPlaying music to the Apple TV. To add to the mystery, for some reason when I select the S-Video input on the projector instead of the HDMI input, audio does come through the surround sound system– although with no video, since there's nothing plugged in on the S-Video input. Here's a simple diagram of how it's hooked up, pretty straightforward.

Apple TV <---(HDMI)---> Receiver <---(HDMI)---> Projector

I tried with my previous-gen Apple TV to troubleshoot, and I'm getting the same issue– video only, no sound. Plugging the Roku back in gives me both audio and video with no issues, all using the same HDMI cable. Here are some other things I've tried to troubleshoot, to no avail:

* Changing audio format from Automatic to 16-bit on the Apple TV
* Changing audio mode from Automatic to either 5.1 or Stereo on the Apple TV
* Changing video from RGB High to RGB Low (who knows, throwing a Hail Mary)
* Factory resetting the Apple TV, receiver, and projector

The Apple TV and HDMI cable are sending out audio, as evidenced by the fact that changing the input on the projector from HDMI to S-Video results in audio coming through. So what's going on?
 

ColdCase

macrumors 68040
Feb 10, 2008
3,364
276
NH
Perhaps DRM... I'm having a similar problem, no digital audio. The AppleTV doesn't trust your receiver or projector.... I think. When you switch the projector to s video, the AppleTV sees analog audio and sends the audio.

Dunno how to solve it.
 
Last edited:

Capeto

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Jul 9, 2015
505
1,164
That might be it– the receiver is a little aged (8 years or so) and it might not have whatever DRM verification the Apple TV is looking for. Yet another reason to curse DRM.

Any potential solution at all?
 

Slartibart

macrumors 68040
Aug 19, 2020
3,140
2,815
Which version of tvOS? What does Settings > Video and Audio > Audio Output show? What is under Audio Return Channel selected? Did you check another HDMI cable?
 

ColdCase

macrumors 68040
Feb 10, 2008
3,364
276
NH
Do you use the receiver to switch between video sources? Does your projector have audio outputs? Does your receiver have digital inputs?

There is quite a bit of discussion related to audio extractor devices and splitters, the bottom line is that DRM makes a mess of it. For example, I have an Insignia audio extractor that works flawlessly except for requiring a reset once a month or so. But the newer DVDO doesn't extract digital audio. Probably because the DVDO doesn't make the AppleTV happy and it doesn't trust it so it refuses to send HD audio. I hear its basicaly a fluke when it works as you would expect.

The older gen AppleTV has an optical digital output. You could try connecting that to your receiver.

Otherwise you may have to replace all your components. Easier but not cheap. Or look for ways to defeat DRM.
 

HobeSoundDarryl

macrumors G5
Receiver is relatively old. Replace it with a modern one and all such problems will probably be resolved.

I agree with others, it is probably some DRM issue. Or it could be an unfortunate lightning strike surge has fried something within the receiver. A few things you could try that are not referenced:
  • Have you tried unplugging the receiver, giving it maybe 5 or 10 minutes with no power and then plugging it back in? Some bit of computing inside the receiver may have crashed and a hard restart may bring it back to life.
  • Only because it is cheap and easy, try ANOTHER HDMI cable. It's probably NOT this but this is so easy to try. Yes, I know both the Roku and the S-VHS input having audio seems to imply all is fine, but this is just easy to try. So try. And Apple being Apple, try a premium (aka expensive) one instead of the cheapest one most people buy for cables.
  • Have you tried all HDMI inputs on the receiver? Maybe the input you are using- while working fine with Roku- has some issue in interacting with both AppleTVs? Try the others and see if ANY of them work.
  • You might try injecting an intermediary box between AppleTV and Receiver. This could be relatively cheap, overcome whatever AppleTV interaction issue with Receiver and then the intermediary box flows the signal on to the Receiver. Perhaps that intermediary can better link with the old Receiver. This intermediary box could be as cheap & simple as a HDMI switcher or one of the HDMI passthrough or Audio extractor devices. Basically this idea puts more modern HDMI "brains" in before the Receiver connection and then you hope that its output to Receiver will be like the Roku instead of the AppleTV.
  • Have you tried rewiring through a perhaps newer (standards) TV and then eArc'ing back to the Receiver? This somewhat undermines the point of a Receiver as central hub (and will undermine audio-only uses of Receiver with TV off) but it could possibly make it all work with "as is" hardware by basically shifting the receiver into a TV audio (out) device only. If eArc doesn't work/isn't available, this approach might let you analog out back to receiver S-video analog in for audio (but that will remove the Dolby Digital, leaving it stereo-only). Or you might be able to Optical Out (from TV) back to Receiver and possibly preserve Dolby Digital (though many TVs won't do this- stereo only through optical).
In short: it appears you need to seek out a way to make an old receiver work well with new tech or- like old Macs- retire/repurpose it and buy a new one. No receiver can keep up forever- just like Apple devices. For much less than any Apple (computing) hardware, your parents can buy a modern standards Receiver and for about the price of a mid-tier iPad, they can get a "loaded" Receiver (especially refurbished ones). It's time... or maybe (you as) Santa could get them one this Christmas? That would be a great gift they could enjoy for the next 8+ years or so.

The existing one could be sold or perhaps moved to another room to power some good speakers somewhere else in the home. Again like aging Apple technology, old stuff can still contribute. For example, I have a Snow Leopard Mac on my network mostly to keep delivering 2 things that didn't make the jump to Intel-native hardware. It's 11 years old but still doing those select jobs just fine.

When my own Receiver gets too old, I'll be doing exactly that: moving it to another room to add what it can do to that room.
 
Last edited:

ColdCase

macrumors 68040
Feb 10, 2008
3,364
276
NH
From what I've read, replacing a receiver does not always work when the display/projector is older generation. Replacing the display/projector with one that supports newer HDMI protocol versions usually works. The newer TV should send an EDID that the AppleTV likes, otherwise you are depending on the receiver to generate and send a compatible EDID.

The RX-V477 seems to be a modern enough receiver, but it seems to pass through HDMI from the TV. I dunno if the apple TV needs ARC to provide audio. When the projector is set to SVideo, the receiver may generate the HDMI EDID (and the EDID generated is compatible with the AppleTV audio but not video), dunno. When a device sends a EDID to the AppleTV that is not compatible, you generally get no video, no audio or nothing.

Sometimes the connection negotiatioin is not instantaneous, I've seen 45 seconds sometimes. Just saying there are lots of things that can go wrong. There are receivers(boxes) that regenerate the HDMI protocol overhead (including EDID), I think, and they work better with legacy displays. Scanning through the receiver's owners manual I notice settings that may get in the way. Did your ROKU have a digital audio connection?

If you are thinking just to replace, some smart TVs and Projectors have all the streaming apps built in, no need for an external device. They all have a digital audio output fror an external amp. So all your video sources are connected to the smart TV/projector, where the input is controlled, and your existing receiver becomes the amplifier that drives your speakers.
 
Last edited:

ColdCase

macrumors 68040
Feb 10, 2008
3,364
276
NH
This is a two year old Apple forum post I ran across yesterday that may be relevant. He had been using a vintage projector for years. In his case the TVOS15 update broke audio, but I've also read it broke in 14.7. I don't know what I don't know but it seems that you need to use a HDCP 2.2 compatible extractors that converts the vintage HDMI interface to 2.2 or higher. Roku may not care. What OS is on that old ATV that you tried.

"Solved!

I got a new HDMI switch + audio extractor and everything works the way I want it to again.

I wasn’t aware of HDCP 2.2 and it not being backwards compatible. Never gave it much thought as I don’t use a 4K screen. Turns out with tvOS 15 your gear needs to be HDCP 2.2 compatible, 4K or not.

Finding an HDCP 2.2 compatible switch with audio extractor at a reasonable price was a bit tricky but I took my chances with the cheapest one I could find (still €80, many others costing five times of that).

Let’s hope this works for a good while. And that others are helped by this as well.

That’ll be all!"
.
 
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.