No good deed goes unpunished...

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iGary

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May 26, 2004
19,583
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Randy's House
So an old colleague of mine a really fun girl I used to work with at a publishing house) called me and said her sister was openign a spa...could I shoot the opening. That sounded like fun, and I did it in barter for some spa services...

So last week I go and do a couple of panoramas, because this is probably the perfect place for a virtual tour, totally on spec at my own expense, so they could see the process etc.

So I really want a "centerpiece" for my Web site and I figure an eight-room interactive panorama of a commercial spa would be great, so I offer to do it at my eight-room real-estate rate (about half).

The owner is all excited, she talks about it with her "investor" (her pop-in-law) and he said that he had already lined up some possible places to do it.

So she e-mails this morning and says "Yeah, he doesn't know whether he wants to go with you..."

"That's totally fine, I'd suggest you go with one of the vendors he has chosen."

"Oh, no, Gary I really want to use you."

"I'm sorry, it really doesn't sound like it will be a worthwhile venture for either of us - besides it's only a few hundred dollars."

"Well can I show him the demo you did?"

"Sure, just let him know that I did not shoot this as a "final" - only as a demo so you could see how the lobby would look in 360."

So I post it and he comes back with "Yeah, not impressed with the quality."

"I told "____" to let you know that it was a spec shoot."

"Well the image is not really as clear as I would like."

"Me neither, it was just a spec."

"Why didn't you do it right the first time?"

"OK, I really don't think this is going to work, no offense."

"Huh?"

"I haven't even asked for money yet and you are complaining. In my experience, situations like this go downhill really quickly. I'd recommend you utilize one ofthe otehr vendors."

"Their expensive as hell."

"You get what you pay for, "___." Hope everything works out with the spa."

Asshat™

Advice - never cheap out. Always bites you in the ass. :rolleyes:
 

kretzy

macrumors 604
Sep 11, 2004
7,923
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Canberra, Australia
I would have done exactly the same thing. If people are too moronic to understand what you are telling them, the last thing you want to do is go into business with them. :rolleyes:
 

devilot

Moderator emeritus
May 1, 2005
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1
Man, from your thread title, I thought this would be a happier thread. :p It's okay, Gary, we understand! :D I don't get what there is to not understand... a simple demo to see the overall gist of the work, you like the direction it's headed, like the other finished work of the photographer you've hopefully seen, then you hire. Right?
 

iGary

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May 26, 2004
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Randy's House
devilot said:
Man, from your thread title, I thought this would be a happier thread. :p It's okay, Gary, we understand! :D I don't get what there is to not understand... a simple demo to see the overall gist of the work, you like the direction it's headed, like the other finished work of the photographer you've hopefully seen, then you hire. Right?
I just needed to bitch.

The sad thing about this business is you really, in most cases, have to be an ass to make sure you get paid/taken care of/etc. All I imagined was doing this huge virtual tour for cheapm and then he goes "well I don't like it."

Yeah, pity the fool...that does business with this asshat on the cheap.

And people wonder why some photographers charge what they do.
 

devilot

Moderator emeritus
May 1, 2005
15,588
1
iGary said:
I just needed to bitch.
Aww, *squeeeze* you can bitch, any time! :D Not that you've ever waited for an invite or anything. :p ;)
 

dornoforpyros

macrumors 68040
Oct 19, 2004
3,070
3
Calgary, AB
ahh yes I've had the same thing happen with the c**p company I used to work for. "This is just a design comp, it's not final, we haven't finalized the design with the client yet, we can't build from this" turn into "why isn't it done yet?"

That is the double edged sword off creative work be it photography, video or graphics. People with an un-trained eye don't see the potential in the initial stages so they panic and back off.
 

Sayer

macrumors 6502a
Jan 4, 2002
981
0
Austin, TX
Simple fix:

Write a proposal, itemizing the steps you will take i.e. initial consulting, present initial design, review/revise with client, rework design, finalize, deliver.

And use finished, high quality samples of your work to show to clients. Don't ever show partially finished work, especially digital assets, to a client. You get exactly the response you describe if you do e.g. "that looks terrible!" And they may take the unfinished work and skip out on the bill.
 

iGary

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Original poster
May 26, 2004
19,583
1
Randy's House
Sayer said:
Simple fix:

Write a proposal, itemizing the steps you will take i.e. initial consulting, present initial design, review/revise with client, rework design, finalize, deliver.

And use finished, high quality samples of your work to show to clients. Don't ever show partially finished work, especially digital assets, to a client. You get exactly the response you describe if you do e.g. "that looks terrible!" And they may take the unfinished work and skip out on the bill.
Oh, no, we won't be doing business together.

Let them take the unfinished work - its crap. You evidently have a higher tolerance level for jackasses than I do. :)
 

ipacmm

macrumors 65816
Jun 17, 2003
1,304
0
Cincinnati, OH
I would have done the same thing, it isn't worth my time to deal with people that can't make the decision on whether to use you or not, yet they see what you can do and complain about it and when you try to tell them it isn't a final they end up going with some one for more money and get a less then par job for something you could have done a lot better...just my personal experience.
 

dvdh

macrumors 6502
Apr 6, 2004
429
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dornoforpyros said:
That is the double edged sword off creative work be it photography, video or graphics. People with an un-trained eye don't see the potential the initial stages so they panic and back off.
You can add architecture to that list. The complexity of the design problem and incredible duration of the process means that you may be stuck presenting 'initial stages' for months. It takes good management, a trusting client relationship (and maybe some faith that things are indeed going the right direction . . .)
 

Frank (Atlanta)

macrumors regular
Oct 29, 2004
145
0
Think you did the only thing possible.

Would have been horrible to work in that situation - nothing good would have come from it.

Better to move on, just as you did.

Frank
 

mad jew

Moderator emeritus
Apr 3, 2004
32,199
5
Adelaide, Australia
Well that sucks. :(

Since this is in the Digital Photography forum though, we should probably have some sort of picture to accompany all these words and stuff. Maybe a facial expression shot of your reaction to this whole event?...
 

octoberdeath

macrumors regular
Feb 22, 2005
117
0
how much would you have gotten if you didn't know those people? $66 an hour sounds good to me...though i'm not in the know of whats good and whats not. you wouldn't mind enlightening me though would you?
 
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