Except some apps combine Export with Save As, and some don't. Now it's obvious which is for making a duplicate and which is for saving to a different format. Better, IMO.
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No more SaveAs?!?!?!
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Except some apps combine Export with Save As, and some don't. Now it's obvious which is for making a duplicate and which is for saving to a different format. Better, IMO.
What's wrong with "Duplicate" then ? Duplicate, modify, save and have all the clutter you want on your filesystem. Seems to me this is different, not gone.
I still don't get why the OP had to do everything all over again in automator 5 times... just go back to an earlier version, duplicate and start from there. No need to start from scratch.
But it's still there...
It's just named differently. And "Save" now doesn't just smash whatever is on your drive. IE : They added functionality, renamed some, and everything is still there. That's why I don't get the gripe.
I'ma let you finish but some of us want that. As an author, I want many versions of the same thing 'littering up my filesystem'.
You can still have it... that's what I don't get. What's the beef ? It's just different now.
Two things are for sure; Apple is transitioning to a system where apps hold their own data in specific containers like iPhoto, Aperture and iTunes. For really simple computing where each file only works with one app that's fine. For more powerful computing the file system works best and the flexibility of Save As is an integral part of it.
The second thing for sure is that KnightWRX will think that Save As and Duplicate are the same set of operations till the end of time.
The second thing for sure is that KnightWRX will think that Save As and Duplicate are the same set of operations till the end of time.
Gotta agree. He's dead right.
This is true but you also have to realize that that system is a lot more secure. Apps will still be able to see other sandboxed apps files it just needs permission from the system to do so (this is a very basic explanation). It's actually really smart what they're doing. There will be no lost functionality.
Exactly how do you use "Save As..." in a way that "Duplicate" will not work for you?
S-
How do they differ really ? Duplicate lets you have 2 sets of the same document that evolve differently. Basically "Save As" with Versions integrated.
What is it that I'm supposed to think ? Maybe someone could explain instead of just saying "it sucks, Apple is dumbing it down".
Having worked with block based snapshots under Netapp and Volume Shadow Copy, I think the versions thing is a good feature.
I'm the first to have turned off/on many things in Lion to make it more Snow Leopard like (scroll bars turned on, little lights on the dock, reverted the scrolling to the usual behavior instead of this "natural" crap that works on touch screen, disabled Resume), I don't use Launchpad at all and never will, despise the Mac App Store's philosophy, but seriously, I don't understand the flaw here. The functionality that is claimed "lost" by a few posters is still there.
What is it that these posters are missing ? If they renamed "Duplicate" to "Save As" would that make these guys happy ? Is it because "Duplicate" is now "Save As" but requires 2 operations (Duplicate, then save) ?
It's also completely optional in that 3rd party developers can choose to integrate it or not in their applications. If a workflow works better without versions and works fine with Save As, the developer can leave the option there.
Lion has duplicate because of the automatic saving. If you would be able to "save as" your last version, you are actually only duplicating it... so Apple called it "duplicate". "Save as" would only make sense in a system that does not automatically save your file. Now to each to determine which is the greater evil...
You can have both at the same time. I use Eazydraw which has Save As and Duplicate and also autosaves and supports Versions. Doing a SaveAs is the same as doing a Duplicate, followed by a save of the new document, then going to to the original document and closing it. So you only end up with the new document open which has no version history. If you wanted to create many different versions of the original you would have to reopen the original document after each Save As.
Exactly, it's different, not gone. Hence I don't get all the people saying "Save As" is gone!
And it's optional, it's up to the app developer to provide the functionality. They could very well offer "Save As" and "Duplicate" and Versions. Just make sure to submit feedback if you really want "Save As", but know that it is still there already.
Except that this auto-save doesn't work properly on mounted drives (e.g. SMB mounts of Linux file systems) - which get overwritten with temporary changes. Great way to destroy my company's documents.
Leave feedback on this. (I have!)
http://www.apple.com/feedback/macosx.html
It's not just network mounts but also USB flash drives. In most cases you don't get a warning about the problem until it is too late. Certainly autosave should be disabled on documents for which Versions can't work.
My "workaround" is to rely on file locking and making duplicates of docs I intend to modify. Frankly, important documents should be write protected anyway as even without auto-save it is too easy to overwrite them.
I'll never be able to get everyone else in the office to lock their files - normally it's not been a problem in the 10 years Ive worked for the company (we're linux based) - yeah we chmod quite a few of them, but really, who wants to do that for every file they create?
In any case, locking then means I can't easily rotate some pages (schematics) without the paperclip , erm I mean Duplicate dialog box, appearing. I want to look at an image, maybe rotate it and close it without saving or duplicating.
It's the biggest UI FUBAR since Springy the paperclip, but with the added fun-factor of potential data loss on non-HFS+ drives.
Feedback to Apple duly delivered. I've also sent a mail out to my colleagues - about 1/3 of my workplace use Macs and until this gets resolved I will recommend that they don't upgrade - unfortunately I really wanted a new MBA, I just never realised that OS X Lion would made such a fundamental change without allowing the user to turn off such a feature!
I *could* use Adobe Acrobat instead of Preview to read PDFs and get rid of TextEdit - but both are the nice OS X built in apps that I love(d) to use. Until now.
I also wonder *how* I'm going to explain the concept of Duplicate and versions to my mother. "This file is locked". Huh? Seriously, was the old concept of saving a file really that hard?
My apologies to all - it's late and I'm ranting.
If you aren't sure about saving the changes, then you should be duplicating them. Imagine if you were editing the original, unlocked document, wanted to select all, but hit command-S,W instead of command-A - boom, your changes are gone. It's not hard to imagine, a finger-slip could easily hit the S and then W when reaching for the A. Or what would happen if the network connection was dropped while saving a file on the server?
Even long before Lion, I never edit files off of the server or USB stick (it's slower to save anyway). I make a duplicate, edit and save to my heart's content, and then copy the file back when I'm finished. It's safer that way.
Even long before Lion, I never edit files off of the server or USB stick (it's slower to save anyway). I make a duplicate, edit and save to my heart's content, and then copy the file back when I'm finished. It's safer that way.
I don't know your mother, but I think a computer novice with no preconceived notions would have no trouble with the concept. If you have a document and wanted to alter it but keep the original, wouldn't you use a copy machine first ("duplicate")?
Have you ever opened an image file or PDF and wanted to do something to enhance the readability onscreen (by say rotating, zooming or changing the color profile) but didn't necessarily want to permanently overwrite the original? Well now you are SOL because of Lion: you either have to go back and fish out the original from the time machine-like screen or make a completely needless copy of the file just to be able to look at it. I really regret installing Lion because of this stupid 'do-it-our-way-or-you-are-screwed' autosave, which is a shame, because other things about Lion aren't bad.
I remember back when I was using Windows that I had to remember never to rotate an image in Windows Explorer because it altered the original file.
Even with Snow Leopard, when you rotate it makes a copy. You are just asked if you want to save it (and, of course, you say "no").
In Lion, if the file hasn't been changed in two weeks it gets locked. You can't accidentally modify a locked file. You get the choice to either alter the original or make a duplicate. No such protection for newer files, although you can lock them manually.
Even if you alter the original, you can do a "revert to saved" as long as you haven't closed the file. It's only if you have closed the file that you have to go back with Versions. Even if you do a revert to save it will save a version in the edited state.
This means you are protected against accidental edits and accidental quits without saving (as long as the file has a name). Snow Leopard protected against neither accident.
As previously noted, this doesn't work right with network shares, so if you have your files on a share leave feedback on apple.com/feedback.