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The Exposure Notification gives them absolutely no information about who you stood next to. Your entire paranoid scenario breaks down after that. Go read the damn spec. Stop spreading paranoia. And stop watching Fox News, it’s like the eating lead paint of the last 20 years.

The Apple-Google implementation is based on the DP-3T protocol developed by the Swiss Federal Institute of Technology of Lausanne. You can learn how it works from their documentation and source code.

The article below is itself informative, but I'm linking to a specific comment about the GAEN API.

Always be skeptical of anything Google says when it comes to privacy.
 
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from the link above from Proton mail, and as the poster mentions as well:

quote
SwissCovid uses the #DP3T protocol, which keeps all sensitive data stored locally on the users' device. Overall, the protocol is not too bad as we have explained
However, it doesn't mitigate the privacy issues inherent to Android and Google.
endquote

just to be clear: Proton mail is talking solely about the android platform. and does not make the same criticism against iOS.

The article below is itself informative, but I'm linking to a specific comment about the GAEN API.
Always be skeptical of anything Google says when it comes to privacy.
 
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The article below is itself informative, but I'm linking to a specific comment about the GAEN API.

Always be skeptical of anything Google says when it comes to privacy.
The Twitter thread and ProtonMail blog article actually basically agree that the protocol is privacy-preserving.

The twitter thread mentioned doesn't raise issues with the protocol itself or its implementation, but specifically with Android's choice of requiring to grant location sharing permissions to the app since it uses Bluetooth. Apple doesn't require the app to be granted such a permission since they have implemented a specific entitlement tailored for exposure notification use.

The second link is a user comment on a ProtonMail article. The user comment raises doubts on the privacy of the GAEN API mainly due to its closed-source nature, but the ProtonMail article itself actually mentions GAEN in the section "Approaches that are private by design"...

It's true that Google/Apple could hide a location tracker in their API, but they don't need exposure notification do to such a thing: they can hide that in other apps just as easily, or in other parts of the OS or even in the device firmware if they manufacture the device itself.

Basically if you don't trust them and use their products you are screwed already, long before you eventually decide to install an exposure notification app.
 
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Because it shouldn't be. There are no regulations that would require a health app to be approved by the states - the activities of the CDC and the NIH are already authorized by the commerce clause (the Federal government is responsible for interstate activities that can affect interstate commerce, which includes pandemic disease) - and have been challenged and upheld in the courts many times.

The real issue is that the current administration took office without any help from anyone experienced - the former Bush administration officials who would have served in say a Romney administration shied away from working with this president because he was seen as fundamentally flawed from the standpoint of the long-term survival of the Republican Party (that's what Lindsey Graham meant when he said that electing Trump would be the end of the party, though he's since accommodated Trump like the good little Vichy soldier he is).

Anyway, extremists and griefers filled the vacuum. In particular, Steve Bannon, who argued for "the deconstruction of the administrative state," set the ideological tone for the administration - cut everything in the executive branch that regulated commerce, or projected diplomatic power, or provided equal services to all citizens regardless of their state.

It plays on anti-government sentiment built up by Federal intervention against segregation, the Vietnam draft (which has been over since the 1970s), the drug war, the big-industry anti regulation propaganda of the Bush years, and decades of conspiracy theories; and also on paranoia and xenophobia resulting from the kind of national PTSD the US has suffered from since 9/11/2001.

So no, it's not a real thing - any time between 1932 and 2016, if this kind of pandemic had hit, there would have been a coordinated Federal response. But the current faction in charge is ideologically opposed to simple competence.
Thanks for such an elaborate response.

I’m actually a big fan of the US even with all its flaws and impossible quirks (and receive a lot of flak for it over here for saying that mind you) and I find it sad that were it to happen under different circumstances it would have probably set the example at an extreme high bar (I believe) like it usually happens over many many other domains.
 
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Slippery slope if you are ever deemed an "enemy of the state"....for whatever reason.
You stood next to so and so and now you have to be tested.
But I wasn't even at that location on that date..
Doesn't matter, our records are infallible. you WILL be escorted to the testing facility.
Surprise!!! You have it!!!
Now you have to be quarantined in a FEMA camp.
And eventually you will have to be injected with the vaccine.
Oh did you just volunteer to be a test subject?
No!!!
Take him away!!!
He's not wrong that this is a possibility.

I have a feeling you don't understand how this contact tracing works. There is no GPS involved. Your contacts are tracked by your phone sending out a code via bluetooth. that code is picked up by other phones within a small radius of you and stored there. Your phone is also picking up codes from other phones at the same time and storing those codes. All the codes are anonymous. No user data is attached and all codes are stored locally on the phones. Once someone who has the app tests positive, only then does that person inform the app and the codes it has stored from the last two weeks are then uploaded to a server. Meanwhile all the apps on the other phones check that server regularly for the codes it has been transmitting. If it finds one of it's codes it informs the user. It is completely anonymous. Also completely voluntary.
That's funny. Even when my company says "this survey is completely anonymous", they still make you enter a code to take the survey. "It's so people can't take the survey multiple times", or "to follow up if somebody issues a threat in the comments", they insist.

Okay, fine. But the only way to guarantee that your tracking is accurate is to .. um.. track each person.
Seriously insane paranoid uninformed post. If it is satire, well done. If not, get help.
His or her concern is valid. Please stop trying to shut down discussion by accusing the commenter(s) of mental illness. Yeah, that's how I see it. Rather than disagree, you accused. So I am left to wonder, are you trying to change hearts and minds, or do you really have something else in mind?
The whole thing should have been national, but our executive branch is incompetent and wants to divorce itself from responsibility. So they left it to the states to handle. Now we have a mish mash of different guidelines and reporting. It's been a mess from day one.
Everybody wants a national solution for everything. But what if they screw it up at the national level? Then EVERYBODY gets an equal dose of mediocrity. Well, at least it's consistent, right? /sarc

I prefer to let the well-run states have a chance to excel. States can collaborate. Maybe then some states will create a better system, and (OH MY GOD) enter into an agreement to sell or barter with other states to share the solution.

Why must we always wait for mommy and daddy (the Federal Government) before we attempt to tackle a problem?

Give entrepreneurials a chance!
Oh, we are perfectly clear that you are someone who supports health tracking and government-issues apps to do so. You even seem to think Apple should force this system on everyone, default opt-in.



I'm not reading a damn thing from Google. They've proven to be an absolutely invasive and creepy company with data collection. They get no free pass on this, nor any respect or trust in asking to please let them monitor your movements in regards to your health. The very fact that you would even consider trusting them in this instance, is bewildering.
I agree with you. Nobody should force it, and haha, I don't believe Google much either.
Once again, if the government wants to spy on you, or, track you, they don't need one more app. They can do it now....
You're right, they can do it now.

But at least in part, my resistance here is out of concern that this would be just ONE MORE THING that the government can (and WILL) enthusiastically use to justify the removal of even more of our freedoms and liberties.

Yes, they can track me now, and I'm sure they already do because I have at least one bank account, I have a 401k, and some IRAs, I vote, I am in the 45% who actually pay taxes each year by writing a check, I'm registered as a voter but I'm a big sinner because I'm not a member of the bureaucratically-favored (Democrat) party, I write to my politicians about the 2nd amendment, our Bill of Rights, and my concern about the national debt, and I use a VPN.

I don't consent to forced-contact tracing in any form. I don't trust the Feds to use such power with care, and I certainly won't be fooled into thinking that they'll preserve my rights in their mad grab for more power.
 
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He's not wrong that this is a possibility.

That's funny. Even when my company says "this survey is completely anonymous", they still make you enter a code to take the survey. "It's so people can't take the survey multiple times", or "to follow up if somebody issues a threat in the comments", they insist.

Okay, fine. But the only way to guarantee that your tracking is accurate is to .. um.. track each person.
His or her concern is valid. Please stop trying to shut down discussion by accusing the commenter(s) of mental illness. Yeah, that's how I see it. Rather than disagree, you accused. So I am left to wonder, are you trying to change hearts and minds, or do you really have something else in mind?
Everybody wants a national solution for everything. But what if they screw it up at the national level? Then EVERYBODY gets an equal dose of mediocrity. Well, at least it's consistent, right? /sarc

I prefer to let the well-run states have a chance to excel. States can collaborate. Maybe then some states will create a better system, and (OH MY GOD) enter into an agreement to sell or barter with other states to share the solution.

Why must we always wait for mommy and daddy (the Federal Government) before we attempt to tackle a problem?

Give entrepreneurials a chance!
I agree with you. Nobody should force it, and haha, I don't believe Google much either.
You're right, they can do it now.

But at least in part, my resistance here is out of concern that this would be just ONE MORE THING that the government can (and WILL) enthusiastically use to justify the removal of even more of our freedoms and liberties.

Yes, they can track me now, and I'm sure they already do because I have at least one bank account, I have a 401k, and some IRAs, I vote, I am in the 45% who actually pay taxes each year by writing a check, I'm registered as a voter but I'm a big sinner because I'm not a member of the bureaucratically-favored (Democrat) party, I write to my politicians about the 2nd amendment, our Bill of Rights, and my concern about the national debt, and I use a VPN.

I don't consent to forced-contact tracing in any form. I don't trust the Feds to use such power with care, and I certainly won't be fooled into thinking that they'll preserve my rights in their mad grab for more power.
Again, you don't seem to understand how this system works. Read the specs.

Second there is no letting the states that excel and letting the ones that don't, fall behind. This is a pandemic, if one state is doing bad, we are all doing bad. That's why a national approach is best, since there is no segregation between states. Clear concise guidelines and leadership is necessary. For example, clear guidelines on where and when to wear a mask and consistent messaging about it would have saved thousands of lives. Unfortunately we don't have that kind of leadership hence 1,000-1,500 Americans dying every day, while other countries are almost completely rid of the disease.

Finally there is no forced anything. You can always opt out of the tracing. Which is anonymous, and has been designed from the ground up to be so. FYI, I use a VPN, an alternate DNS, never use google products and services, and tend to be pretty careful about what I transmit to other parties and what I don't. This is a non-threat. But you always have the option to not participate.
 
That's funny. Even when my company says "this survey is completely anonymous", they still make you enter a code to take the survey. "It's so people can't take the survey multiple times", or "to follow up if somebody issues a threat in the comments", they insist.

Okay, fine. But the only way to guarantee that your tracking is accurate is to .. um.. track each person.
Well, realistically it can still be anonymous in the sense of it being individualized but without a way to actually connect it to a specific person/name.
 
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why dont you have ONE US app? crossing borders would then work.

we need the Australian government to use the Apple/Google APIs. Our crap app does not work as well ;(
 
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