Now that 10.7.2 is out...

[iMikeT]

Now that 10.7.2 is out, what are the ongoing thoughts about fixes and enhancements that need to be done to Lion?

I have seen it mentioned a couple of times in the forum and I also share the sentiment that 10.7.2 is exactly what the initial release of 10.7 should have been. With that, here is what I think should be addressed in an upcoming release:

- Mission Control. Apple needs to bring back classic Spaces, well at least the option of having classic Spaces. The interface of moving across desktops/spaces horizontally works very well on portable devices with touch interfaces (iOS devices) but when you're on a Mac, navigating horizontally doesn't quite work.

- iCal and Address Book. Both are still ugly and seem out of place with the overall theme of OS X. iCal needs to get the sidebar back and a better way of creating new events, perhaps revert back to previous versions when it was working just fine?

- Autosave/Restore. A System Preferences option is needed to turn it off or pick and choose which apps can use it rather than it being system wide. Also, when shutting down a Mac, the checkmark of "Restore windows..." needs to be unchecked by default and remain unchecked once it is unchecked.

- Full Screen Apps. Along with Mission Control, if you choose to have your app run in full screen, the app should enter full screen mode in the current desktop/space that it is in rather than becoming a new desktop/space or at least have the option for this.

I will definitely be submitting these and anything else I can think of to Apple at apple.com/feedback.

What you do you think, add or subtract from the list?

 

[AlteMac]

I agree with each of the above.

 

[doug in albq]

Lion is Apple's Vista.

At first I did not want to think this was possible.

Now I know it is most probable.

Look at the nightmare with 2010 15/17 inch MBP's, among all the other issues/problems.

Apple has become a phone/tablet/appliance company.

If more people needed actual computers, apple's stock would be falling hard right now.

 

[baryon]

Agree 100%. I really hate most of the new features of Lion, and most of them can't be turned off.

I was extremely disappointed to realize that Spaces and All Windows Exposé are no longer in OS X, but never would I have thought that Resume and Auto Save were such annoying features too.

While Resume can be turned off, Auto Save can't. So you open a TextEdit document to paste something in temporarily, maybe to remove the formatting or something, and then copy it over to an email, after which you want to close the TextEdit document and never see it again. However, 2 weeks later, you open TextEdit and that document is there again, and you don't even know what the hell it is since you don't remember it anymore. Very annoying!

Mission Control is just horrible, I won't detail why since we all know the reasons, and Full Screen apps are annoying too. They take ages to animate in and out of full screen, end up on random desktops that you can't predict, and reduce your ability to multi task. Yes, I can simply "not use them", which is why it's not a real issue.

The reason I'm not going back to SL is because I like some new things like the new Mail, as well as the disappearing scroll bars and reverse scrolling. Some things got more polished and better, but many fundamental things just turned horrible...

 

[laudern]

My folks are looking to get a laptop just for the net and stuff. And I cant recommend a mac to them because Lion will come installed on it. Instead I had to suggest and ipad.

 

[Simplicated]

Here's my opinions:

- An option to ungroup the application piles in Mission Control to display windows in the old Exposé way.

- Bring back restoring individual photo albums in iPhoto.

- Bring back fine volume/brightness adjustments.

- An option to turn off automatic termination. This is one of the peskiest things of Lion, as it makes opening a file by dragging a file to the icon in the Dock impossible.

The removal of fine volume/brightness is unfathomable to me. This is an advanced user feature, novice/most users won't notice this anyway. This, combined with automatic termination, show me that Apple is giving a huge middle finger to advanced/pro/power users.

 

[marc11]

- Full Screen Apps. Along with Mission Control, if you choose to have your app run in full screen, the app should enter full screen mode in the current desktop/space that it is in rather than becoming a new desktop/space or at least have the option for this.

I will definitely be submitting these and anything else I can think of to Apple at apple.com/feedback.

What you do you think, add or subtract from the list?

I disagree with this one point. If you have an app go full screen into the current desktop and want to access your desktop or other apps not in full screen how would you easily do it? Now I can either swipe to the desktop, mission control to it or the running app or use a short cut to get to it. In your scenario even if you went to mission control and picked the non full screen app, it could not show because you have a full screen app already running, seems like a conflict to me.

I like being able to have several apps in full screen and go to a new dedicated space and then several apps running on my desktop that I do not need running full screen, then it is easy swipes to the apps I want. Just MHO.

 

[TheBigKing]

How about battery life ?

 

[Simplicated]

Oh let's see all the blind worshippers downrating every single post that talks about the negative things about Lion. That's very mature.

 

[iMikeT]

Lion is Apple's Vista.

At first I did not want to think this was possible.

Now I know it is most probable.

Look at the nightmare with 2010 15/17 inch MBP's, among all the other issues/problems.

Apple has become a phone/tablet/appliance company.

If more people needed actual computers, apple's stock would be falling hard right now.

If you have such a huge issue with the current release of Lion as well any other product, I suggest that you let Apple know by giving them feedback at apple.com/feedback. I think that the fine folks at Apple will equally value your colorful feedback about OS X as we have here at the MacRumors forum.

----------

Oh let's see all the blind worshippers downrating every single post that talks about the negative things about Lion. That's very mature.

Agreed.

 

[WSR]

Now that 10.7.2 is out, what are the ongoing thoughts about fixes and enhancements that need to be done to Lion?

I have seen it mentioned a couple of times in the forum and I also share the sentiment that 10.7.2 is exactly what the initial release of 10.7 should have been. With that, here is what I think should be addressed in an upcoming release:

- Mission Control. Apple needs to bring back classic Spaces, well at least the option of having classic Spaces. The interface of moving across desktops/spaces horizontally works very well on portable devices with touch interfaces (iOS devices) but when you're on a Mac, navigating horizontally doesn't quite work.

- iCal and Address Book. Both are still ugly and seem out of place with the overall theme of OS X. iCal needs to get the sidebar back and a better way of creating new events, perhaps revert back to previous versions when it was working just fine?

- Autosave/Restore. A System Preferences option is needed to turn it off or pick and choose which apps can use it rather than it being system wide. Also, when shutting down a Mac, the checkmark of "Restore windows..." needs to be unchecked by default and remain unchecked once it is unchecked.

- Full Screen Apps. Along with Mission Control, if you choose to have your app run in full screen, the app should enter full screen mode in the current desktop/space that it is in rather than becoming a new desktop/space or at least have the option for this.

I will definitely be submitting these and anything else I can think of to Apple at apple.com/feedback.

What you do you think, add or subtract from the list?

I would also add
- Bring back classic Expose. For me, either SL or L version I'm not picky.
- Bring back "Save As..."
- Bring back "Do you want to Save?"
- Options to turn off or control Resume and Versions.

 

[Hugh]

Here's my opinions:

- An option to ungroup the application piles in Mission Control to display windows in the old Exposé way.

- Bring back restoring individual photo albums in iPhoto.

- Bring back fine volume/brightness adjustments.

- An option to turn off automatic termination. This is one of the peskiest things of Lion, as it makes opening a file by dragging a file to the icon in the Dock impossible.

The removal of fine volume/brightness is unfathomable to me. This is an advanced user feature, novice/most users won't notice this anyway. This, combined with automatic termination, show me that Apple is giving a huge middle finger to advanced/pro/power users.

Bold mine.

I don't understand what you mean. I have Volume and Brightness controls on my keyboard and they work fine. Can you explain little more on this, so I understand.

 

[iMikeT]

Agree 100%. I really hate most of the new features of Lion, and most of them can't be turned off.

I was extremely disappointed to realize that Spaces and All Windows Exposé are no longer in OS X, but never would I have thought that Resume and Auto Save were such annoying features too.

While Resume can be turned off, Auto Save can't. So you open a TextEdit document to paste something in temporarily, maybe to remove the formatting or something, and then copy it over to an email, after which you want to close the TextEdit document and never see it again. However, 2 weeks later, you open TextEdit and that document is there again, and you don't even know what the hell it is since you don't remember it anymore. Very annoying!

Mission Control is just horrible, I won't detail why since we all know the reasons, and Full Screen apps are annoying too. They take ages to animate in and out of full screen, end up on random desktops that you can't predict, and reduce your ability to multi task. Yes, I can simply "not use them", which is why it's not a real issue.

The reason I'm not going back to SL is because I like some new things like the new Mail, as well as the disappearing scroll bars and reverse scrolling. Some things got more polished and better, but many fundamental things just turned horrible...

And I equally agree with your reply. What I highlighted in bold is exactly the reason. Many of the core features of OS X, well features that were added over time that have become core features, were changed dramatically that it is causing too much of a disruption in how established users have been using OS X.

What I really enjoyed the most in Lion were the smaller features. Features like doing away with the Aqua scroll bars, resizing from any edge, and having a unified iChat are awesome. But it was the drastic changes that made OS X a lot more foreign than familiar.

I disagree with this one point. If you have an app go full screen into the current desktop and want to access your desktop or other apps not in full screen how would you easily do it? Now I can either swipe to the desktop, mission control to it or the running app or use a short cut to get to it. In your scenario even if you went to mission control and picked the non full screen app, it could not show because you have a full screen app already running, seems like a conflict to me.

I like being able to have several apps in full screen and go to a new dedicated space and then several apps running on my desktop that I do not need running full screen, then it is easy swipes to the apps I want. Just MHO.

What happens when a user like myself uses many desktops/spaces and has a dedicated desktop/space for a single app? What happens when a user has 15 desktops/spaces for example, can a user really be expected to swipe their way to space 16 when an app goes into full screen mode?

Keep in mind that some people do not run multiple apps on a single desktop/space. This is the reason why I am calling for the option to have apps enter full screen in the space they currently occupy rather than become an entirely new space at the end of the chain. Adding the extra desktop/space at the end can become confusing to users who organize their work a certain way.

I'm not asking to do away with a feature that you enjoy entirely but to give users the option to use it in a way that makes sense to the individual user.

 

[ceej]

Lion is Apple's Vista.
.

and yet just as many people that didn't have problems with Vista don't with Lion - more, in fact.

 

[baryon]

I disagree with this one point. If you have an app go full screen into the current desktop and want to access your desktop or other apps not in full screen how would you easily do it? Now I can either swipe to the desktop, mission control to it or the running app or use a short cut to get to it. In your scenario even if you went to mission control and picked the non full screen app, it could not show because you have a full screen app already running, seems like a conflict to me.

I like being able to have several apps in full screen and go to a new dedicated space and then several apps running on my desktop that I do not need running full screen, then it is easy swipes to the apps I want. Just MHO.

Well, with Exposé! Enter Exposé and the full screen app becomes smaller and the windows behind it become revealed. Why not? That's how it worked with Snow Leopard and QuickTime in full screen, it was fine. I have one app per desktop anyway, there is no point in the app going into a new desktop, leaving an empty desktop behind. Basically what it does is the app creates a new desktop and leaves the current one, for no reason, since there is nothing else on that desktop anyway. Maybe it could be intelligent and use the current desktop as its own full screen desktop if no other windows are present on it.

 

[Gemütlichkeit]

Lion is Apple's Vista.

I strongly disagree. Get used to the changes, everyone else is. Time to move on.

Nay sayers are the one's who are still running 98SE can't please everyone.

 

[boilingpoint]

Lion is Apple's Vista.

I totally agree.

I think apple want to apply its iPad experiences to MacOS and plan to make a professional iPad running the new OSX. I admit it is a good trial. If the compromise between OSX and iOS might be well done, all users will be happy.

However, this awkward OSX and iOS mixture of Lion is making professional MacOS users disappointed.

I think the mode differentiation between OSX and iOS (like in Windows 8) would be better than the current awkward mode mixture.

In desktop mode, Lion works as classic MacOSX. And in portable mode, Lion works as it is without supporting multimonitor. That is what I really want.

 

[handel30]

If you don't like Lion, go get a windows pc. Stop taking up so much space with your endless whining. All your complaining is just a waste of space and time. Windows 8 is the same tablet and app oriented os -- a lot worse, if you ask me. I wouldn't trade Lion for W8 for anything. But if you like Windows 8 so much, skedaddle. Git! People who call Lion Apple's Vista have never used Vista, or have forgotten what Vista is like. Lion is a wonder in comparison.

 

[Roy G Biv]

If you don't like Lion, go get a windows pc. Stop taking up so much space with your endless whining.

Thank you! Finally, someone who can intelligently counter criticisms with a love or leave it approach. Moderators, please make this the new golden rule for the forum. And make this man a moderator--nay, an executive administrator.

 

[vitzr]

Lion is Apple's Vista.

At first I did not want to think this was possible.

Now I know it is most probable.

Look at the nightmare with 2010 15/17 inch MBP's, among all the other issues/problems.

Apple has become a phone/tablet/appliance company.

If more people needed actual computers, apple's stock would be falling hard right now.

I have so many years, along with tens of thousands of dollars of Apple computers, I too didn't want to accept the direction Apples computer OS is headed.

Making it worse was Steve Jobs official declaration of the "Post PC Era". Between that, and all the other supporting reports I've read made it quite clear that the platform I've enjoyed so much for two decades, will never be the same again.

You said it best, Apple is now nothing more than a mass market appliance company dressed to "be cool". The main objective being world domination, not technical prowess. By dumbing down the products, Apple suits the largest number of average Joe's & Jane's.

 

[MartiNZ]

I would also add
- Bring back classic Expose. For me, either SL or L version I'm not picky.
- Bring back "Save As..."
- Bring back "Do you want to Save?"
- Options to turn off or control Resume and Versions.

You read my mind. Bring back customisation! Bring back user control!

My only other issue is the broken nested sorting in dock stacks, broken by SL.

 

[maflynn]

Lion is Apple's Vista.

Its funny you say that, because that exact criticism was leveled against 10.6. Plus unlike Vista, Lion has been apple's most popular OS ever. People have embraced 10.7 like no other OS upgrade from apple. I'm not to say that's no problems, but its far from being apple's Vista

Apple has become a phone/tablet/appliance company.

So? They're making hand over fist because that change and there's nothing wrong with making money

 

[Steve's Barber]

You guys can whine all you want but we're 3 versions into Lion now and nothing has changed. Nothing every will. I'm not happy with this direction either but...

Those that can't adapt will need to learn how or just move on.

 

[Martyimac]

I have to agree with the posters that don't like where took Lion. While it may or may not be Apple's "Vista", it is the first time I have ever considered rolling back to the previous OS. While change is always hard to deal with, I think Apple's choice to merge OSX with IOS is a mistake, at least in it's current iteration.
Since others have mentioned the items we are all aware of, I will throw a new one into the mix, Office for Mac.

Now that I am on Lion, Outlook no longer will sync with address book on my Mac Pro. This was never an issue under Snow Leopard. In fact, I was anxiously awaiting iCloud because I could finally sync between all my computers, a PC and my Mac, my iPhone and my iPad and it would all just work, without having to pay for mobilme. But I am no further along now than before. I gained icloud but lost sync between my Outlook programs on my mac and pc. So one step forward, one back and effectively, I am no further along than I was a year and a half ago.

Apple misstepped with Lion IMHO.

 

[hinkamp]

I don't understand why a lot of people are saying the Lion is making everything like an iPad. Because of launchpad? Then don't use it. I never do. Because of gestures? I think gestures are great. If you don't like the way is scrolls with a mouse, you can change that. You don't have to use the additional gesture features if you don't want to.

I can see why people don't like the autosave, I know I don't. It takes a little getting use to.

But... to say that Lion is Apple's Vista seems a bit dramatic, in my opinion.