NVIDIA 8800GT for Older Mac Pros Now Available

[headfuzz]

Phew! Now hopefully people will be happy.

Now, time to price up whether a refurb Mac Pro + 8800GT is cost effective vs new Mac Pro...*

* and then realise I can afford neither. :'(

 

[MacsAttack]

Now do I buy this or do I wait and upgrade my whole machine...

Interesting question... Future graphic cards are going to use a different connector to drive the next generation of displays (duel link DVI just doesn't cut it for the proposed higher res/colour depth specs that are being suggested). Problem is that there were some three or four different proposed new connector schemas out there. DisplayPort has shown up on a few monitors and cards - so it may win out. UDI has some features to recommend it though - and an extended HDMI format is lurking in the wings.

While a decent mid-life upgrade, things are "about to happen" out there. Would not be surprised to see the revamped ACDs sporting DisplayPort for example. Though perhaps using this as an upgrade would tide you over until all the dust settles - and you'll be replacing the whole machine anyway to get that 64 core Mac Pro replacement that is the size of a Mac mini.

 

[MacFly123]

That's interesting that Apple is so tight-lipped on product releases and upgrades in the official channels (the press, etc), yet Steve himself (or his aides) are often willing to provide hints on upcoming releases or fixes by personal email. This at least the second or third example in recent months -- this, the iPhone calendar adding events, the Leopard Time Machine network drive issue, etc.

It is because all those things are not very significant in the scope of all of their products and to announce them through the press would be admitting a fault but by just replying quick and then releasing they avoid that and make the whiners happy.

 

[anthonyjr]

The real question is whether AppleCare covers this card when it is placed in your Mac Pro...

Once I find out the answer I'll make my purchase. I just want to know what I'm getting into beforehand.

 

[Spades]

Whether or not you get this or upgrade the entire computer will probably depend on other factors. As far as I'm aware there's no replacement for PCI Express on the horizon. There's a few versions of PCI Express, but 2.0 cards are compatible with 1.1 slots, and nothing really pushes the interface so hard that there's a noticeable difference between 2.0 and 1.1 yet. Nvidia's 9000 series has so far not changed that. I doubt the next generation is going to suffer terribly from being stuck in a 1.1 slot either. So as far as graphics cards go, as long as this mistake doesn't happen again, upgrades should work with old Mac Pros for the foreseeable future.

 

[iFizz]

...Why support a platform that has only 5% marketshare?

More like 8%

Also, it might be a bit of a chicken & the egg problem: ATI/NVidia don't want to support Macs b/c lack of software for it; software developers don't want to design for Mac b/c lack of hardware. All this is bs.

True. However, this will hopefully begin to change when the iPhone starts officially supporting third-party apps. Not to get too far OT, but....

All "official" iPhone apps must be sold at the App Store. This gives the iPhone app developers marketing and visibility of their apps to 100% of iPhone users. Call it a marketing utopia. Anyone who's got a good app, PC or Mac, will want to get a piece of this pie and make some extra money by selling an iPhone version of it. In order to code the iPhone app, you have to have a Mac (coding in Cocoa). So that sells more macs, especially to PC software development companies that never had Macs before. Their software engineers get to learn Cocoa, instead of dorking around with Cider. They build the app for the iPhone, sell it on the App store, and then everyone rolls in the dough! So now, big-time PC developers have Macs and their software engineers have wicked awesome Cocoa coding skills. Well, they might as well develop Mac versions of their games and applications! This will drive up supply of Mac games and apps, in turn driving up demand for bigger selection, better quality, and more frequently updated GPUs from Apple. Apple will have to $h*# or get off the pot. Apple won't be stupid about this, seeing a great opportunity to increase their market share as more games and apps are developed natively for Mac.
At least that's how many "experts" are speculating this will work.

 

[xbjllb]

Who SAYS competition isn't a good thing?

Wow. The VERY same day that PsyStar debuts their Open Pro line, with a GeForce 8600GT out of the box and a GeForce 8800GT option and probably, any video card you'd want to have them put in there, they would be only too happy to, and charge standard industry prices to boot.

And my favorite, the gleamin' chrome monolith...

Hmmm... I would expect this just might return Apple MacPros to the cutting edge their high prices warrant them to be. Soon.

Or lower the prices as befitting a "flagship" that lags behind Windoze PC's as far as video card and blu-ray drive/burner support goes.

 

[MrCrowbar]

hahaha. Well done sir, well done.

back on topic - really nice to see apple following through on something they said they'd do. Seems to me you'd have to be a pretty hardcore gamer to shell out for this if you already have an x1900, but if you are, or if you have a 7300, this is pretty great.

Would a hardcore gamer get a Mac Pro in the first place? I mean what game could make good use of 8 cores? It's all in the graphics card for gamers. Just get a Dell and put the 8800GT or better in there. Costs just a fraction of the Mac Pro, you get Windows with it and the Dell Ultrasharp Displays are awesome for gaming. I'd go for the 20" Widescreen, not bigger as you usually need to have the whole picture in your direct sight.

If you still need the Mac Pro for creative/professional stuff, just keep the ATI card in there and get the Dell for gaming. A KVM switch will let you share the display among both machines... or, again, get a Dell display, they all have 1 VGA and one DVI at least. With a good cable (not the stock ones), VGA can look pretty good.

PS: Yea, I'm still an Apple fanboy, but you gotta admit that they're just not made for gamers... except maybe the Macbook Pro.

 

[Laslo Panaflex]

1900xt still goes for $399 on the apple store, but this card is better yes? So I could order myself an 8800, and sell my 1900 on ebay and maybe break even?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ATI-Radeon-X190...ryZ25449QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

EDIT:

Just found this barefeats benchmark, looks like ATI cards are far better at rendering core image effects used in pro apps, even the r2600xt is better than the 8800. Looks like I'll stick to the 1900 for now, at least until the drivers fix the poor core performance for the 8800.

http://www.barefeats.com/harper10.html

 

[Tallest Skil]

Or lower the prices as befitting a "flagship" that lags behind Windoze PC's as far as video card and blu-ray drive/burner support goes.

Blu-ray amounts to 5% of the computer crowd; Apple doesn't care.

Video card-wise, I agree with you more than 100%; this is made possible by a grant from the National Science Foundation.

 

[Spades]

Would a hardcore gamer get a Mac Pro in the first place? I mean what game could make good use of 8 cores? It's all in the graphics card for gamers. Just get a Dell and put the 8800GT or better in there. Costs just a fraction of the Mac Pro, you get Windows with it and the Dell Ultrasharp Displays are awesome for gaming. I'd go for the 20" Widescreen, not bigger as you usually need to have the whole picture in your direct sight.

The Mac Pro is a waste for gaming, but two computers is even more of a waste. If a Mac Pro can work as well for a gaming machine as a Dell just by upgrading the video card, why not?

 

[xbjllb]

Blu-ray amounts to 5% of the computer crowd; Apple doesn't care.

Video card-wise, I agree with you more than 100%; this is made possible by a grant from the National Science Foundation.

Well they ain't getting a damn PENNY of my $9,000 until they DO care.

Either a flagship is a flagship on the cutting edge, or it's an expensive box with the most expensive thing on it being the logo.

 

[Clive At Five]

More expensive than the most expensive 512MB 8800 GT's... and no SLI. Oh well, it'll probably make enough MacPro users happy enough.

So when NVidia and ATI start using EFI, will we start seeing more Mac-compatible cards?

-Clive

 

[nick9191]

Apart from games the 1900XT is better for many applications anyway. Unless your a gamer its not worth it.

 

[diamond.g]

Interesting question... Future graphic cards are going to use a different connector to drive the next generation of displays (duel link DVI just doesn't cut it for the proposed higher res/colour depth specs that are being suggested). Problem is that there were some three or four different proposed new connector schemas out there. DisplayPort has shown up on a few monitors and cards - so it may win out. UDI has some features to recommend it though - and an extended HDMI format is lurking in the wings.

While a decent mid-life upgrade, things are "about to happen" out there. Would not be surprised to see the revamped ACDs sporting DisplayPort for example. Though perhaps using this as an upgrade would tide you over until all the dust settles - and you'll be replacing the whole machine anyway to get that 64 core Mac Pro replacement that is the size of a Mac mini.

Display Port is the equivalent of Dual Link DVI in a HDMI sized package. HDMI is only Single Link which is probably why Apple doesn't use it.

Well they ain't getting a damn PENNY of my $9,000 until they DO care.

Either a flagship is a flagship on the cutting edge, or it's an expensive box with the most expensive thing on it being the logo.

Sadly the 8800GT isn't flagship anymore meet the 9800GX2 and the 9800GTX

Blu-ray amounts to 5% of the computer crowd; Apple doesn't care.

Video card-wise, I agree with you more than 100%; this is made possible by a grant from the National Science Foundation.

I thought people here claimed that gaming (and thus the need for a more powerful video card) is also around 5% of the computer crowd (read:niche)? Apple doesn't care about gaming so why did folks here get worked up over the 8800GT?

 

[mdriftmeyer]

Why is it that Firmware on video cards has to be so complicated for the Macs and cause us to not have a wide selection???

It's a UEFI based card. When Vista SP1 is released and the entire nVidia and AMD/ATi cards are offered with UEFI equivalent cards you will see a much easier time for Apple to offer variety.

Apple doesn't get the resources from nVidia and ATi to work through their OEM cards like Microsoft because until this SP1 UEFI aware cards are specifically made for Apple.

 

[aygie]

hahaha. Well done sir, well done.

back on topic - really nice to see apple following through on something they said they'd do. Seems to me you'd have to be a pretty hardcore gamer to shell out for this if you already have an x1900, but if you are, or if you have a 7300, this is pretty great.

Hi guys, does anyone have a list of compatible graphics cards for the 1st Gen Mac Pro? FCP user with no Graphic Card knowledge.

 

[SolidShadow]

ORDERED!
*waits*

 

[MacsRgr8]

I have a newer Mac Pro with the 8800GT, and I agree, while it isn't for some, those of us who do a little gaming on the side should be more than pleased with it for the time being.

Now.. if only I could get Colin McRae DiRT to work on it..!!!

All other Windows (Vista 64 bits and XP 32 bits) games work perfectly well...

 

[Tallest Skil]

Well they ain't getting a damn PENNY of my $9,000 until they DO care.

Either a flagship is a flagship on the cutting edge, or it's an expensive box with the most expensive thing on it being the logo.

If all flagship computers were on the cutting edge, they'd all have the same specs and be no different from one another.

The Mac Pro is their flagship because it has technology that isn't niche.

Why are you wasting $9,000 on Apple RAM/HDDs anyway?!

 

[RKnight]

I don't know if anyone else mentioned this.... but... Last week I ordered a brand new Mac Pro, I picked the Nvidia 8800GT as an upgrade.

Today I received an email from Apple saying that the price on the upgrade as dropped and they were going to discount my bill. Very cool, kudos to Apple. From what I can tell it dropped $50.00. Now not a lot, but hey, I ordered it last week and they didn't need to give me the discount, but they did.

 

[JimNoble]

Probably the usual US$1 = GB£1…

Not far off - looks like it's £220.

Taking into account VAT and import duty, that's a 50 quid premium...

Jim

 

[pprior]

Apart from games the 1900XT is better for many applications anyway. Unless your a gamer its not worth it.

How can this possibly be - this card has WAY more horsepower than the x1900. I use my computer primarily for Aperture but also do some gaming and want a QUIETER and faster card. I have assumed this update would do the trick.

Are the drivers really that bad for this card that it can throttle all that extra hardware umphhh? If so, I would think apple would have to update them - aren't the new mac pros coming with this same card???

 

[patmcfar8]

Out of curiosity... which is the best card for the Adobe CS3 suite?

I've been waiting for the 8800GT... but it really the best card available?

 

[HyperZboy]

Why is it that Firmware on video cards has to be so complicated for the Macs and cause us to not have a wide selection???

RE: " E F I "................... WRONG!


CORRECT ANSWER: MONEY! (also acceptable: Apple's business model)

It's only about money and monopoly, although you could argue that Apple's controlled business model guarantees none of the compatibility issues of PCs. That is sort of debatable though. EFI is Apple's copyright that allows ONLY Apple or companies Apple chooses to license for the production of Mac video cards. Technically, many off the shelf PC video cards will work in Mac Pros within Windows or with minimal system updates but Apple deliberately chooses for off the shelf video cards to not work with Mac OS X. Whether EFI offers any advantages to PC BIOS, I doubt, but somebody correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't see any advantages other than deliberate incompatibility.

The good news though is that Apple priced this reasonably at $279 unlike previous video card upgrades through Apple (which were virtually highway robbery). That price point might virtually kill the Mac Pro PCI Express video card grey market on Ebay for all the companies that are currently selling upgrades for Macs. Seriously, why would anyone in their right mind buy a Mac video card from, well, like a Linux consulting company like Applemacanix for their Mac Pro when they could buy it from Apple for almost the same price?! DUH!

So, WOW, thank you Apple for the bargain!