nVIDIA GeForce GT 750m is great!

Discussion in 'iMac' started by MartinAppleGuy, Apr 4, 2014.

  1. MartinAppleGuy macrumors 68020

    MartinAppleGuy

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2013
    #1
    I just want to say that the nVIDIA GeForce GT 750m with 1Gb of GDDR5 VRAM is absolutely great! Buying a Mac, I never expected it to be able to game all that well (from what people say), but this card is amazing for me! Plays all of my favorite games in OSX maxed out with great fps :) It is amazing for someone who has come from PS3 :D

    I must say, that I am very happy I never bought the Macbook Pro 13" at the similar price (£50 difference), as I heard that the Iris graphics aren't great for gaming (although Iris Pro can hold it's weight).

    Am I right in thinking that the myth that Mac's can't game comes from the fact the older Mac's used PowerPC CPU's that were not compatible with Windows based games (and Windows itself)? From looking at all of the games on the Mac App Store, there is a lot of quality games (no where near the amount of PC games mind you but still a good amount for someone that wants to play a game once and a while).

    And I am also very pleased with the performance of the GPU in other aspects too, heavy video editing and photo editing, as well as more simple things like buttery smooth scrolling/animations across the whole OS and when browsing.
     
  2. businezguy macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2003
    #2
    At this point I think the argument PC advocates make for PC gaming is that you can get a more powerful PC for the money. This is somewhat true if you buy a lower quality display. But if you factor in the display, you'd probably only save $200 or so on a PC.

    The second part of that is the argument that signicantly more games are compatible with the PC then Mac OS X. There's no arguing this, it's true. But most of the major games worth playing are Mac compatible and there's always the option of running Windows (at an additional cost) if you want.

    I think the stablilty and speed of Mac OS X is an argument on its side though. I saw it when gaming in Mac OS X in the past and I have a feeling I'll see it again when my new iMac arrives.
     
  3. MartinAppleGuy thread starter macrumors 68020

    MartinAppleGuy

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2013
    #3
    Thanks or the reply. One thing I wish to add though and it's about pricing. Bellow is something I studied a while back, and to be honest, Windows PC's are much more expensive when you consider things like electricity cost (gaming PC's are around 500-7000 watts, and iMac is around 90 watts when playing a game), anti-virus, then a bunch of other things like Office (Pages is not bad for the average user, numbers is Ok, but Keynote destroys Powerpoint, and it's all for free rather than £79 a year for upgrades), movie and photo editing software...

    Here it is -

    I have heard and read a lot about people saying iMac's are more expensive over Windows PC's and wanted to make a thread here to show the real colours of this argument; making it more clear for buyers. I have below several price and spec comparisons between the iMac and a Windows PC in several different terms (like All In Ones, Desktops, Build Your Own, Light Users and Heavy Users). For each comparison I have added the price of both the compared iMac and PC's price after 1,3 and 5 years. So I hope you enjoy the read, and hope that it allows for people to see the real difference in price between an iMac and a Windows based PC. Enjoy.


    First Comparison - iMac Vs. All In One Windows PC

    For this comparison, I have chosen to compare the entry level iMac to the best (similarly priced) Windows 8 All In One I could find; the HP Envy.


    iMac @ £1,149/$1,299/€1,299

    Processor - Intel Core i5-4570S | 4th Gen Haswell | Turboboost's from 2.7GHz > 3.2GHz | 4Mb L3 Cache
    Cores - 4 Cores | 4 Threads
    RAM - 8Gb DDR3 1600Mhz
    GPU - Intel Iris Pro 5200 | 128Mb eDRAM
    Storage - 1Tb 5400 RPM Hard Drive
    Display - 21.5 Inch IPS Fully Calibrated | 1920 x 1080
    I/O - 4 USB 3.0 | 2 Thunderbolt | SD Card Reader | Gigabit Ethernet | Bluetooth 4.0 | Headphone Jack | No Optical Drive
    Wi-Fi - 802.11ac
    Camera - HD
    In the Box - iMac | Wireless Keyboard | Magic Mouse/Trackpad
    Operating System - Mountain Lion (with free upgrade to Mavericks)


    HP ENVY Recline @ £1,049.99/$1,199/€1,199

    Processor - Intel Core i5-4570T | 4th Gen Haswell | Turboboost's from 2.9Ghz > 3.6Ghz | 4Mb L3 Cache
    Cores - 4 Cores | 4 Threads
    RAM - 8Gb DDR3 1600Mhz
    GPU - NVIDIA GeForce GT 730A | 1Gb
    Storage - 1Tb 5400RPM Hard Drive
    Display - 23 Inch | Multi-point Touchscreen | 1920 x 1080
    I/O - 2 USB 3.0 | 2 USB 2.0 | SD Card Reader | Gigabit Ethernet | Bluetooth 4.0 | Headphone Jack | No Optical Drive
    Wi-Fi - 802.11 b/g/n
    Camera - HD
    In the Box - HP Envy | Wireless Keyboard | Wireless Mouse
    Operating System - Windows 8

    The higher end 21" iMac has spec's more similar to the HP Envy but I chose to compare the entry level iMac with it to keep the prices similar. The iMac costs £100 ($100/€100) more than the Envy and at an initial look (at least in terms of the processor and screen); the HP Envy seems like the better deal. The Envy features a processor more similar to the high-end 21" iMac (with an initial clock of 2.9Ghz, that Turboboost's to 3.6Ghz as well as a dedicated graphics card with 1Gb of video memory.) compared to the above iMac that only features a 2.7Ghz i5 with Turboboost to 3.2Ghz. Both All In Ones feature 4th Gen Quad-Core i5 processors with 4 threads (i.e no hyperthreading). Both All In Ones also feature a 1Tb 5400 RPM Hard Drive, which may not be the fastest, but offers great storage at cheep prices.

    But that is about it for the similarities as from here on, both computers are configured differently. The Envy features a discrete graphics card with 1Gb of video memory compared to the iMac's integrated GPU that comes with 128Mb of eDRAM. This is a big plus for the Envy as more graphically demanding tasks should perform better with a dedicated GPU. It should be noted that the Intel Iris Pro GPU featured in the iMac is no slouch, as tests have shown it can hold it's own weight. The iMac features better I/O and Wi-Fi connectivity than the Envy. The iMac has 4 USB 3.0 slots (fast data transfer speeds), where as the Envy only features 2 USB 3.0, then 2 USB 2.0 (slower data transfer speeds). What does this mean, transferring data (be it photographs, video, music...) from a USB to the computer will take longer on the Envy if the 2 USB 3.0 slots are taken up. The iMac also features 2 Thunderbolt ports allowing for 2 external Thunderbolt monitors to be connected. Another difference with the connectivity is the Wi-Fi. The iMac features the new 802.11ac, where as the Envy features the older 802.11 b/g/n. This means that with a 802.11ac router, the iMac will perform much faster in wireless activity compared to the iMac. I have also noticed the 802.11ac helped when the computer was placed further away from the router, which could be a very important factor for a buyer.

    Up until now, all that has been stated is slight changes; the following is where these two computers differentiate more.

    The iMac features a 21.5 Inch IPS screen at the resolution of 1920 x 1080. The Envy features a larger 23" touchscreen with a resolution of 1920 x 1080. First off, the increase in screen size can be seen as a positive and a negative as it is (obviously) larger, but due to the Envy featuring the same resolution as the iMac, the iMac has a greater pixel destiny. This will make everything on screen appear sharper that the Envy. The Envy does however feature a touchscreen, something the iMac does not. This makes the Windows 8 experience much better as without touch it feels in-intuitive. Another thing to note is how well the screens are calibrated when taken out the box. Most users won't calibrate their computer monitors to perfection so it is important that the "Out the Box" quality is good. Both screens are IPS (allowing for wide viewing angles as well as high response times). The Envy features a well calibrated monitor, but it can't touch the perfection of the iMac's calibrated monitor. In all tests, the iMacs monitor is so close to perfection (in terms of saturation, colour accuracy, brightness, Gamut average and white point average). The screen is so well calibrated out of the box, professional should be happy to use this machine without even re-calibrating it. In the end, the Envy's screen is very good but the iMac is on top.

    Now onto Pricing. In the initial prices, the iMac comes out more expensive by £100 ($100/€100), now lets look beyond that.

    The iMac (along with all new Macs) come with the following software:
    iMovie
    iPhoto
    Pages
    Numbers
    Keynote
    App Store
    As well as others

    And the Envy comes with:
    Windows Store
    Beats Audio Console
    A few games

    Looking above, I have only noted a small amount of software that comes preinstalled on each computer. It should be noted that the Envy (look most Windows PC's) comes with Crapware. This is software that has been installed on the computer taking up lots of space as well as slowing the computer down and is made hard (if not almost impossible) to remove. This can be removed if the user is willing to reinstall the OS but this can take several hours and can be very troublesome if the user struggles to get drivers for the PC (a good example is the drivers are on the internet, but you can't connect to the internet because you don't have the ethernet or wireless drivers). The Envy doesn't appear to bad with the crap ware installed, most of it is games that should be easy to uninstall.

    Moving on, the iMac comes with Pages, Numbers and Keynote for free (also known collectively as iWork). These are a the Word, Exel and Powerpoint of the Apple world. I have used them extensively and have had no problems with them and never had something I can do on Microsoft Office that I can't do on iWork. For the Envy side of things, it does not come with Microsoft Office, that will set you back £79.99 ($99.99/€99.99) a year for Office 365 or a one off fee of £190 (£229, €229) for the 2013 edition (that will not be up to date when a new one comes out, where as iWork gets free updates).

    I have also taken into account electricity costs. The iMac uses only 15W at idle. The average cost to run an iMac for a year is £8.06 The Envy on the other hand uses around £20-30 to run per year. This is on average usage.

    There is also Anti Virus Software to be taken into account. It is still a fact that you are less likely to get a virus on a Mac with out Anti-Virus than you are on a PC with Anti-Virus. So I'm not saying it is impossible to get a virus on a Mac, I just saying that you are still less likely than if using a PC with. You can still get AntiVirus for Mac, and is usually free compared to being on average £19.99
    for a PC.

    So here are the figures:

    iMac
    Initial Price - £1,149
    iWork - £0
    iLife (for Movie Editing) - £0
    Running cost per year - £8.06
    Anti-Virus - £0


    HP Envy
    Initial Price - £1,049
    Office(per year) - £79.99
    Office (One Off) - £199
    Movie Edit Pro - £39.99 (was £59.99)
    Running cost per year - £25
    Anti-Virus - £19.99

    Now, instead of just adding that up, I am going to add up different values depending on the user.

    Basic User

    Wants to web browse, check emails, do social networking

    1 Year
    iMac : £1,157.06
    Hp Envy: £1,093.99
    3 Year's
    iMac : £1,173.18
    HP Envy: £1,183.97
    5 Year's
    iMac : £1,189.30
    HP Envy: £1,273.95

    Contains - Computer, running costs and Anti-Virus.

    As you can see, for the Basic User keeping it for 3+ years, the iMac is cheaper than the Windows All in One Alliterative. I would say though that if you come under the Basic user, a cheaper Mac (like a Mac Mini or Macbook Air) or a cheaper Windows PC/Laptop would suit you better.

    Average User

    Wants to do everything a Basic User does but also Work related things like documents...

    1 Year
    iMac : £1,157.06
    Hp Envy: £1,153.99
    3 Year's
    iMac : £1,173.18
    HP Envy: £1,314.00
    5 Year's
    iMac : £1,189.30
    HP Envy: £1,364.00

    Contains - Computer, running costs, Anti-Virus and iWork/Office(365 for the one year user, One Off payment for the 3 and 5 year user).

    For the Average User planning to keep the computer for one year, both computer are similarly priced. For the average user that want's to keep longer than that, the iMac is much cheaper (with a difference of around £200).

    Heavy User

    Wants to do everything an Average User does but also uses the system more and edits Video

    1 Year
    iMac : £1,161.00
    Hp Envy: £1,218.97
    3 Year's
    iMac : £1,185.00
    HP Envy: £1,479.66
    5 Year's
    iMac : £1,209.00
    HP Envy: £1,738.89

    Contains - Computer, running costs(£30 instead of £25 as user is on more, £12 for iMac instead of £8.06), Anti-Virus, iWork/Office(365 per year), iMovie/Movie Edit Pro.

    For the Heavy User, the iMac is considerable cheap than the Windows based All in One.

    iMac vs Custom Build


    For this comparison, I will compare the high end 27"(with upgrade to i7) iMac against a Custom Built Window's PC I configured at PC Specialist. I will also add the software from above as it is the Windows alliterative to the Mac's software.

    iMac @ £1,939.00/£2,199/€2,199

    Processor - Intel Core i7-4771 | 4th Gen Haswell | Turboboost's from 3.5GHz > 3.9GHz | 8Mb L3 Cache
    Cores - 4 Cores | 8 Threads
    RAM - 8Gb DDR3 1600Mhz
    GPU - NVIDIA GeForce GTX 775M | 2Gb Video Memory
    Storage - 1Tb 7200 RPM Hard Drive
    Display - 27 Inch IPS Fully Calibrated | 2560 x 1440
    I/O - 4 USB 3.0 | 2 Thunderbolt | SD Card Reader | Gigabit Ethernet | Bluetooth 4.0 | Headphone Jack | No Optical Drive
    Wi-Fi - 802.11ac
    Camera - HD
    In the Box - iMac | Wireless Keyboard | Magic Mouse/Trackpad
    Operating System - Mountain Lion (with free upgrade to Mavericks)

    Custom Built PC using PCSpecialist @ £2,058

    Processor - Intel Core i7-4771 | 4th Gen Haswell | Turboboost's from 3.5GHz > 3.9GHz | 8Mb L3 Cache
    Cores - 4 Cores | 8 Threads
    RAM - 8Gb DDR3 1600Mhz
    GPU - NVIDIA GeForce GTX 770M | 2Gb Video Memory
    Storage - 1Tb 7200 RPM Hard Drive
    Display - 27 Inch IPS Fully Calibrated | 2560 x 1440
    I/O - 2 USB 3.0 | 4 USB 2.0 | SD Card Reader | Headphone Jack | No Optical Drive
    Wi-Fi - 802.11n
    Camera - Microsoft WebCam 720p
    Contents - £80 tower, Microsoft Office Professional, Norton Anti-Virus 1 Year, Movie Edit Pro, Microsoft Touch Mouse, Arc Keyboard, HDMI, Asus 27" IPS Monitor
    Operating System - Windows 8.1 Professional
    Added better power supply and cooling which added around £130 to the price to make the computer quieter and cooler.

    And all of that would cost £1,729 with no software, no anti-virus...

    So in the end you get an uglier looking build PC for more money. The only way the Custom PC will be cheaper than the iMac is if you downgrade things or built it yourself.

    So here you have reached the end. And the question I now ask myself is "Are iMacs expensive?". Yes, they are. "Are iMac's expensive compared to similar PC's? No. Defianatly not. Remember that you don't just by the computer and sit it somewhere, you use it and using it costs money as well as the software you use. So now I better go; I don't want to find this year has cost me more than £8.06 for running my iMac
     
  4. yjchua95 macrumors 604

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2011
    Location:
    GVA, KUL, MEL (current), ZQN
    #4
    +1 for posting this. However, I think your point would be better made across if the name of the thread was changed, or posted as an entirely new thread titled along the lines of: Mythbusted - iMacs aren't pricier than PCs.
     
  5. quagmire macrumors 603

    quagmire

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2004
    #5
    Are we talking a PC from like Dell and HP or are we including custom built PC?

    Because a custom PC will beat the crap out of the iMac in terms of gaming. With a custom built you can get a 4670K/4770K and a 780ti. The best a Mac can offer is the 4771 and 780M.
     
  6. thejadedmonkey macrumors 604

    thejadedmonkey

    Joined:
    May 28, 2005
    Location:
    Pa
    #6
    That's the thing. If I'm looking for a high end PC with a dedicated GPU that sips power, the iMac is the best PC you can get.

    But if 1080p is good enough because I'm gaming, a mac isn't a good choice. If I want to just use Facebook, an iMac is overpowered. If I want to do a lot of GPU intensive work, the 750m isn't the best choice either.

    The iMac is a jack of all trades, but a master of none. Sure it's "good enough" for most uses, but if you're looking for a PC for a specific use, the iMac isn't the best choice.
     
  7. yjchua95 macrumors 604

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2011
    Location:
    GVA, KUL, MEL (current), ZQN
    #7
    That's why there's a 27" iMac with a 3.5GHz i7-4771 and 4GB of GTX780M. It's good for 1080p gaming (even 1440p as long as settings are high, but not ultra and with AA off).

    The GTX780M is pretty good for GPU-intensive work, although it may not be as good as a desktop 780.

    ----------

    Sure but in terms of power consumption, the custom PC will eat up one **** of a lot of power. And it's ugly in terms of design and doesn't run dead-silent like the iMac. Both my 21.5" and 27" iMacs run dead silent even under heavy loads.
     
  8. quagmire macrumors 603

    quagmire

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2004
    #8
    You don't have to argue with me over the merits of the iMac. I love my Late 2013 27" iMac with the 4670 and 780M. It runs X-Plane to a level I am satisfied at.

    But if I was a more hardcore gamer( not much of a PC gamer outside of X-Plane), I would seriously look into building a gaming rig with the 4770K and at least a 770.
     

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