MP 1,1-5,1 OCLP on a Mac Pro 5,1 with Sequoia

[skodises]

I must admit- I'm very much a Luddite, and I seriously do not like change. I bought my 5,1 at ruinous expense in 2010, and thanks to @tsialex and many of the posters here, I've been able to keep it working productively for me for all these years. I upgraded it to Catalina with the help of the Dosdude hackery quite some time back, upgraded to NVME blades on a 7101 that I reworked with better heatsinking, and so on and so on. It has evolved, sped up, and served me well for many years.

However, with the latest revisions of certain software that I need, Catalina support has finally been dropped, as I knew to be inevitable. And as a result, I faced a quandary: should I shoot Old Paint and build an equivalent Linux box (once again, at ruinous expense), or should I screw my courage to the sticking-place, and dive into Open Core?

When Apple decided to shove Tahoe down everyone's throats, I realized that this was in fact the last chance for the machine. If I was ever to try to make it live on, I needed to go to Sequoia, because it is finally now mature, entering end-of-life, and as a result Apple will no longer **** it up just for sport. And so, today, I ripped all the disks out except for one lonely SATA SSD in the optical bay, downloaded the Sequoia installer before they arbitrarily decide to pull it, installed OCLP 2.4.1, and pulled the trigger.

And damned if it didn't work.

I then stuck my 7101 back in, with my NVME blades and my *real* working environment, and did it again- and damned if it didn't work. Again.

That's right- It Just Worked. I followed the instructions, and did the install right over my familiar Catalina starting point, as if it were an everyday, pedestrian Apple upgrade. Boom. My entire environment, warts and all, running Sequoia, in maybe two hours of work. It was incredibly straightforward. No Time Machine silliness, none of that- I think I waited just long enough for the OCLP development to mature. The thing has always been a very competent machine, and astonishingly my work environment is completely intact: up and including Parallels running my Windows 10 VM, to please my employer.

So: my eternal thanks to @tsialex for his help, and to the OCLP developers for having made the rather inscrutable and opaque Open Core mechanism straightforward for even a gray-haired Luddite like me. Old Paint is happily grazing alfalfa here under my desk, and will continue to be with me for some time to come. It'll probably outlive me.

It reminds me of the hammer I inherited from my father when he passed, decades ago. I've replaced the handle 4 times, and the head twice, but it is still the best hammer ever.... Peace, and be safe out there!

 

[keksikuningas]

should I shoot Old Paint and build an equivalent Linux box

what about installing Linux on the Mac Pro though? It should be supported quite well, except maybe bluetooth

 

[mreg376]

That's today. Hopefully you won't come to regret it. I would not trust OCLP for any work that produces income.

 

[Cayenne1]

I have opted for a dual external boot approach after some photo s/w cannot update past Ventura on my 2017 5K iMac. Otherwise I needed to buy new H/W ($$$) to replace a beautiful 27" 5K screen.

So I kept Ventura on my internal system drive and used Open Core Legacy Provider (OCLP) to install Sequoia on an external Samsung T7 SSD attached to the iMac Thunderbolt 3 port. It works as well, if not better, than Ventura even though the T7 is only a USB 3.2 (not Thunderbolt 3) device.

At boot, OCLP gives the option to run one O/S or the other. It's a no-risk approach to trying it out. Of course your old Macs external port speed capability could be a performance issue.

So do you need to reinstall apps or update with Time Machine on the external Sequoia drive? Nope. You can, but I just used Finder to run applications from the internal Ventura system disk directly from the "Macintosh HD/Users/<username>/Applications" folder. The ones I clicked on ran fine. Probably because, unlike Windows, Mac apps are self contained packages. Try right clicking on an app and selecting "Show Package Contents" as an example.

Now I want to improve this setup by replacing the T7 with an actual Thunderbolt 3 enclosure and a fast SSD chip set. Online review shows many folks have done this, but those SSD prices! They gone through the roof as the A.I. folks are consuming all the supply.

So if you want to experiment try an external drive. Sequoia and OCLP are free.

 

[skodises]

I neglected to mention a couple of things in my original post. When all the drives are in, there are 13 in total, and probably 30 partitions; well over 30TB. I’ve carefully preserved one bootable partition for every OS version the machine has ever run, back to Snow Leopard, and this development is no different. I will always have my venerable Catalina drive, and my High Sierra drive, and so on to escape to if needed- with their contemporaneous app suites. If need be, I could have run Catalina until the machine converted back to aluminum oxide and coal: I would just have to suffer along with older, downrev applications.

The effort of sorting out all of the subtleties of OC always kept me from adopting it, to date. As a long time lurking participant on MacRumors, I have read every word of the horror stories from the many early adopters here, and elsewhere. I’m an EE, and a Mac user since the very beginning, so I have seen a few things myself along the way.

I never move to a new OS until it is at least a .3 major rev, and several times (like now) I have waited until the next-to-latest rev is actually going EOL. This is the machine’s last upgrade for many reasons: Intel support is officially dead now, just as the PowerPC and the 68k families before it. And it simply seems like time to bring it as far as it can go, one more time, because I’ll be retiring soon (I’m pushing 70). I’m glad once again that I’ve waited for all the early adopters to take the pain of bringing the previous revs to maturity. And it seems to me that the OCLP folks have accomplished that with 2.4.1, perhaps just in the nick of time.

I’ll post back with status updates, if anything worth reporting crops up. But so far, the single thing that has exhibited any difficulty had been ShareMouse- and that is no longer mission-critical for me. All my drives, my nice speedy 7101, my two Sonnet Tempo Pros, and my upgraded BT/WiFi have turned out to be just fine thus far. I’ll be making a donation to the OCLP folks, which is perhaps the highest compliment I can pay. I suppose that this means that I’ll need to update my sig…

We shall see if this current run of luck lasts. But please rest assured that I have taken this action with my eyes wide open.

 

[DBRK95B]

I have opted for a dual external boot approach after some photo s/w cannot update past Ventura on my 2017 5K iMac. Otherwise I needed to buy new H/W ($$$) to replace a beautiful 27" 5K screen.

So I kept Ventura on my internal system drive and used Open Core Legacy Provider (OCLP) to install Sequoia on an external Samsung T7 SSD attached to the iMac Thunderbolt 3 port. It works as well, if not better, than Ventura even though the T7 is only a USB 3.2 (not Thunderbolt 3) device.

At boot, OCLP gives the option to run one O/S or the other. It's a no-risk approach to trying it out. Of course your old Macs external port speed capability could be a performance issue.

So do you need to reinstall apps or update with Time Machine on the external Sequoia drive? Nope. You can, but I just used Finder to run applications from the internal Ventura system disk directly from the "Macintosh HD/Users/<username>/Applications" folder. The ones I clicked on ran fine. Probably because, unlike Windows, Mac apps are self contained packages. Try right clicking on an app and selecting "Show Package Contents" as an example.

Now I want to improve this setup by replacing the T7 with an actual Thunderbolt 3 enclosure and a fast SSD chip set. Online review shows many folks have done this, but those SSD prices! They gone through the roof as the A.I. folks are consuming all the supply.

So if you want to experiment try an external drive. Sequoia and OCLP are free.

Last month I did exactly the same thing on my 2017 27" iMac 5K. Mine is also running smoothly with Sequoia installed via OLCP on an external SSD. The external SSD is only installed in a standard USB 3.0 (or maybe 3.1) enclosure, but the speed of opening files and running applications seems entirely satisfactory to me.

I should mention, however, that I encountered nothing but problems when I attempted a clean install of Sequoia via OCLP on the same iMac's Internal drive and a subsequent Migration Assistant transfer of files from a backup disk. I'm not sure why this was unsuccessful. Perhaps the problems related to the fact that my iMac's internal drive is a Fusion Drive rather than a speedier SSD. Or perhaps they were due to the huge number of files that I tried transferring after the Sequoia OS install.

Interestingly, I was successful using OCLP to clean-install Sequoia on the internal SSD drive of my 2017 15" MacBook Pro and the subsequent Migration Assistant transfer of files onto it. Sequoia is now running smoothly on my MacBook Pro. The only problem I encountered was that all passwords that had been stored in my Keychain Access library disappeared during the Migration Assistant transfer, so make sure you have a copy of all your important passwords before attempting this.

Based on my experience, anyone planning to do an OCLP Sequoia install on their Mac's internal drive would be wise to make two backups first, a Time Machine backup on one external USB drive and, on a separate external drive, a full bootable backup created with a cloning app like Carbon Copy Cloner or SuperDuper.

 

[skodises]

Absolutely. Disks, while expensive, are still cheaper than experiencing the horror of wiping out the only copy of something critical. That situation (only one copy of anything) should never be allowed to occur.

To make this transition, I had done my nightly automatic SuperDuper clone of the Catalina installation (onto an SSD on one of the Sonnets) as usual- and then did another for good measure, onto a spinner. I then cloned it once more onto that lonely sacrificial SSD in the optical bay, pulled everything else out of the machine, and did the work there, just to prove to myself that the OCLP installation would work at all. Once that was done, I put only the 7101 back in, and redid the installation onto my preferred boot drive there. And only after I had exercised the heck out of that, did I put my other disks (including the two Catalina safeties) back in.

Caution is absolutely the order of the day. I've often described my backup technique as "belt, suspenders, duct tape, and superglue", because I also keep monthly disaster prevention backups offsite (spinners on sleds in my safe deposit box, at my old-school bank that still has such things). We had a house fire a few years ago, and though this machine somehow survived remarkably intact, I was never so grateful to have them...

Be safe out there, and that absolutely means backing up early and often.

BTW- for anyone who might be interested, I described my fanless 7101 mod here: https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/highpoint-7101a-vs-sonnet-m-2-4x4.2207732/post-30668973

 

[skodises]

Well, the first bit of feedback for those following along at home. My machine, and the OCLP 2.4.1/Sequoia software, run fine: I have no complaints so far.

However, apparently my procrastination-driven timing (in waiting for software packages to go EOL before adopting them) is impeccable. I installed OCLP on Saturday, March 21. Yesterday, I went to the OCLP site on OpenCollective to make my donation, now that I'm actually adopting the software. I definitely wanted to support their efforts, which have been unceasing, and very dedicated. And I discovered that they have discontinued accepting donations, because they are apparently dissolving the effort. It would appear that OCLP itself may be going EOL.

Needless to say, this is a very sad development. I waited a little too long to support the effort. I can still capitalize on it, of course, but this is one of the great shareware success stories of the past few years, and I am very sad indeed that I didn't contribute earlier. It would appear that the introduction of Tahoe has effectively killed this effort. I mourn.

My machine is currently running fine for my needs. And I suspect that it will continue to do so, as I will be declining all future Apple updates. I don't typically use any of the proprietary Apple apps that are being used to force users to purchase new hardware, by using new hardware features that the older hardware explicitly cannot provide (such as AVX2). My mail, calendar, browser, and all the CAD tools that I depend upon are third-party, and primarily come from the open-source world, where backwards compatibility is generally regarded as a feature and not a bug. So I'll remain perfectly fine for the next several years with exactly where I am, and then go Linux. After having done the forced march from 68k to PowerPC to Intel through the generations, I am abandoning Apple's forced march to their newest hardware.

I will not be adopting Tahoe on any hardware, even the MBP and Mini that can run it natively. Nor will I be installing iOs 26 on any of my iThings. At long last, time has now fully stopped for me in the Apple ecosystem, with the introduction of Tahoe and its bastard iOs stepchild. For those still reading, and who might be considering making this move, I'd recommend going and downloading all the necessary packages quite soon, and keeping them around offline for whenever you might eventually choose to utilize them.

Bold move, Apple. It's been fun while it lasted.

 

[pigeonguy]

Well, the first bit of feedback for those following along at home. My machine, and the OCLP 2.4.1/Sequoia software, run fine: I have no complaints so far.

However, apparently my procrastination-driven timing (in waiting for software packages to go EOL before adopting them) is impeccable. I installed OCLP on Saturday. Yesterday, I went to the OCLP site on OpenCollective to make my donation, now that I'm actually adopting the software. I definitely wanted to support their efforts, which have been unceasing, and very dedicated. And I discovered that they have discontinued accepting donations, because they are apparently dissolving the effort. It would appear that OCLP itself is going EOL.

View attachment 2616314

Needless to say, this is a very sad development. I waited a little too long to support the effort. I can still capitalize on it, of course, but this is one of the great shareware success stories of the past few years, and I am very sad indeed that I didn't contribute earlier. It would appear that the introduction of Tahoe has effectively killed this effort. I mourn.

My machine is currently running fine for my needs. And I suspect that it will continue to do so, as I will be declining all future Apple updates. I don't typically use any of the proprietary Apple apps that are being used to force users to purchase new hardware, by using new hardware features that the older hardware explicitly cannot provide (such as AVX2). My mail, calendar, browser, and all the CAD tools that I depend upon are third-party, and primarily come from the open-source world, where backwards compatibility is generally regarded as a feature and not a bug. So I'll remain perfectly fine for the next several years with exactly where I am, and then go Linux. After having done the forced march from 68k to PowerPC to Intel through the generations, I am abandoning Apple's forced march to their newest hardware.

I will not be adopting Tahoe on any hardware, even the MBP and Mini that can run it natively. Nor will I be installing iOs 26 on any of my iThings. At long last, time has now fully stopped for me in the Apple ecosystem, with the introduction of Tahoe and its bastard iOs stepchild. For those still reading, and who might be considering making this move, I'd recommend going and downloading all the necessary packages quite soon, and keeping them around offline for whenever you might eventually choose to utilize them.

Bold move, Apple. It's been fun while it lasted.

iOS 26 isn't that bad.

Tahoe is. Avoid it like the plague. But iOS 26 isn't bad.

 

[DBRK95B]

Well, the first bit of feedback for those following along at home. My machine, and the OCLP 2.4.1/Sequoia software, run fine: I have no complaints so far.

However, apparently my procrastination-driven timing (in waiting for software packages to go EOL before adopting them) is impeccable. I installed OCLP on Saturday, March 21. Yesterday, I went to the OCLP site on OpenCollective to make my donation, now that I'm actually adopting the software. I definitely wanted to support their efforts, which have been unceasing, and very dedicated. And I discovered that they have discontinued accepting donations, because they are apparently dissolving the effort. It would appear that OCLP itself is going EOL.

View attachment 2616314

Needless to say, this is a very sad development. I waited a little too long to support the effort. I can still capitalize on it, of course, but this is one of the great shareware success stories of the past few years, and I am very sad indeed that I didn't contribute earlier. It would appear that the introduction of Tahoe has effectively killed this effort. I mourn.

My machine is currently running fine for my needs. And I suspect that it will continue to do so, as I will be declining all future Apple updates. I don't typically use any of the proprietary Apple apps that are being used to force users to purchase new hardware, by using new hardware features that the older hardware explicitly cannot provide (such as AVX2). My mail, calendar, browser, and all the CAD tools that I depend upon are third-party, and primarily come from the open-source world, where backwards compatibility is generally regarded as a feature and not a bug. So I'll remain perfectly fine for the next several years with exactly where I am, and then go Linux. After having done the forced march from 68k to PowerPC to Intel through the generations, I am abandoning Apple's forced march to their newest hardware.

I will not be adopting Tahoe on any hardware, even the MBP and Mini that can run it natively. Nor will I be installing iOs 26 on any of my iThings. At long last, time has now fully stopped for me in the Apple ecosystem, with the introduction of Tahoe and its bastard iOs stepchild. For those still reading, and who might be considering making this move, I'd recommend going and downloading all the necessary packages quite soon, and keeping them around offline for whenever you might eventually choose to utilize them.

Bold move, Apple. It's been fun while it lasted.

 

[DBRK95B]

Thanks for sharing this news, even though it wasn't pleasing news. It's unfortunate that OCLP is soon coming to a close, although I can certainly understand the developers' reasons for doing this. The community of legacy Mac owners has benefited from the diligent efforts of a small, dedicated group of volunteers and I'm very grateful to them. It sounds like OCLP may never be available for Tahoe, but many users seem to hate the Tahoe OS anyway.

I'll probably buy a new MacBook Neo or Mac Mini at some time in the future, which are both reasonably priced. I like Apple products and I've made more than enough profits from Apple stock investments over the past 15 years to easily justify it. But I hate discarding old items when they are still functioning perfectly well (both my cars are over 20 years old and running well). It's bad for the environment and it's clear that Apple could keep supporting Mac computers with security updates beyond 8 years if they wished to. Especially since it's a company that claims to be committed to environmental responsibility.

 

[BillyJoeJimBob]

That's today. Hopefully you won't come to regret it. I would not trust OCLP for any work that produces income.

It'll be fine as long as {original poster} stays on Sequoia. Use ethernet instead of WiFi and don't install Adobe or any cleaner/optimizer [spyware/malware] products if you can help it.

fwiw: https://github.com/dortania/OpenCore-Legacy-Patcher/releases/tag/2.4.1

 

[skodises]

Yup. Agreed- that's good advice for the new folks watching this thread.

I'd done the WiFi/BT upgrade long ago, way back when I went to Catalina, so that should be a nonissue. Although, even if those features become broken again with OCLP/Sequoia, it will no longer affect me, as I will only be on hardwired Ethernet, and will continue to use my wired keyboard with my Logitech mouse receiver plugged into it (minimizing the opportunities for mischief). I've never used BT for anything other than amusement.

I'm also lucky in that my workflows require only a very simple PDF reader and no PDF authoring, so I was able to kick Adobe to the curb quite some time back- and I did so with great pleasure. And I can no more imagine using any third-party optimizer/cleaner product than I can imagine flapping my arms and flying to the moon. For folks like me, who need only a tiny subset of the code that has been developed over the years, and little else of all the stuff that has made the Mac Pro the Swiss army knife it became, this kind of stasis is a non-problem.

I only need one or two of the blades in that metaphorical knife; but I need them to be speedy, stable, and familiar. Let's face it: at this point in my life, I'm not about to try to turn Ol' Paint into the perfect gaming device or whatnot. I need to to run the VM hosting, simulation, and ECAD solutions that I need for my work, and run them well- and little else. For all other activities (such as the widely-rumored "having fun"), I have the MBP, the Mini, and my iThings...

 

[Cayenne1]

As I mentioned in an earlier thread, I have a dual boot 2017 iMac 27" with Ventura unchanged on the internal drive and Open Core Legacy Provider Sequoia on an external drive. The OCLP folks have been hinting at EOL since the development of a Tahoe version has not been successful.

The choice of spending a lot of money for a whole new setup just to run updated software is not a viable option for me. Perhaps the "its good enough" montra applies, at least for now. I still boot most often into Ventura unless I need a Sequoia version of one of my photo editor programs. This includes Windows XP software (Visio 2007 and Photoshop CS6) running just fine on a Ventura/Parallels VM. This requires running an older Parallels, as the Sequoia version won't support XP.

So I'm going to run 19 year old Windows software on a 9 year old Mac as long as the Mac doesn't die. MS Visio 2024 is ~$300 alone and runs only on Windows. And forget a new Adobe Photoshop.

Bottom line it's possible to extend the life of Intel Macs up to Sequoia. I don't see any S/W upgrades that are a must to have triggering a hardware overhaul.

errata: I had mentioned in my earlier post you could run apps on your internal drive without reinstalling on an external Sequoia drive. That's true for many apps, but if you're into running Homebrew apps from the Terminal (i.e. Exiftool, ffmpeg, etc.) best to reinstall on the Sequoia drive (PATH and version issues).