Office of Intellectual Property Enforcement

Discussion in 'Apple TV and Home Theater' started by mallbritton, May 8, 2008.

  1. mallbritton macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2006
    #1
    Since there is a lot of talk in this forum about creating digital copies of our video and audio entertainment for our personal use I thought this article from Macworld might be of interest to some here.

    I think this is especially relevant since a poster in the I Can't Wait Until... thread said just today that he doubts the DMCA is enforceable in court.

    Well, think again folks. This PRO-IP legislation is all about going after the private citizen for copyright infringement. This means ripping the video off the DVDs we purchased for viewing on our :apple:TVs. This legislation was crafted by and for the RIAA, movie studios, and other entertainment content providers specifically so they can prevent us from doing exactly what so many of us on this board are doing right now. There may come a time when we can't even talk about it amongst ourselves for fear of federal prosecution.

    Cuss & Discuss.

    Regards,
    Michael
     
  2. kolax macrumors G3

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2007
    #2
    Money money money.

    Corrupt world we're evolving in.
     
  3. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2004
    Location:
    Chicago, Illinois
    #3
    You're kidding! So now we won't even be able to store our DVDs on our ATVs? Wow- that's so like the Bush administration. :mad:
     
  4. sblasl macrumors 6502a

    sblasl

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2004
    Location:
    Heber Springs, AR
    #4
    I think the Dems are more sympathetic to the desires of the Hollywood studios sleaze balls than the Bush administration...

     
  5. RaceTripper macrumors 68030

    Joined:
    May 29, 2007
    #5
    I dislike Bush as much as the next guy, but I think we can blame the Dems for this type of unenlightened legislation.
     
  6. jaw04005 macrumors 601

    jaw04005

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2003
    Location:
    AR
    #6
    :rolleyes:

    I think you should look again at who "Hollywood" contributes the most to. The Bush Administration's Justice Department actually opposes the idea.

    http://www.news.com/8301-10784_3-9939265-7.html
     
  7. TheSpaz macrumors 604

    TheSpaz

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2005
    #7
    I'm the guy from the other thread. I've never heard of anyone getting in trouble for duplicating or making backup copies of their movies for their own personal private use. Are we also not allowed to record TV shows, remove the commercials and then put them on our Apple TVs?
     
  8. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    Dec 22, 2004
    Location:
    Chicago, Illinois
    #8
    True- but then why is this "czar" going to be in the White House? ;)
     
  9. mallbritton thread starter macrumors 6502

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    Nov 26, 2006
    #9
    The bill hasn't become law yet, it was just passed by the House. Next it has to pass the Senate, then it has to go to committee, then it goes to the Oval Office to be signed.

    But my point is that this is the kind of laws the entertainment industry wants to pass so they can try to force us to pay and pay and pay for the media we consume.

    Regards,
    Michael
     
  10. TheSpaz macrumors 604

    TheSpaz

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2005
    #10
    Should I worry now, or wait until the outcome before I stop ripping my DVDs.
     
  11. mallbritton thread starter macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2006
    #11
    I think we should find out what the Senate bill number will be for this legislation and work on our Senators to defeat the bill once it gets to the floor. It hasn't gone to the Senate yet.

    Regards,
    Michael
     
  12. MikieMikie macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2007
    Location:
    Newton, MA
    #12
    The real implication here is not that any law enforcement agency or their arm would go up against private individuals, but surely they would shut down the Handbrake org, or force it to be hosted in some politically immune environment.

    Their goal would be to keep us away from the tools that break the copy protection. So, MTR & Handbrake, as well as the Windows equivalents, would more likely be their true targets.

    I'm sure the studios aren't coming after me. After all, there's a precedent for this: when peer-to-peer Napster was sued, shutting them down was the goal, not suing or prosecuting all of the individual copyright violators (although some were prosecuted as examples).
     
  13. TheSpaz macrumors 604

    TheSpaz

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2005
    #13
    Even if they take Handbrake offline, won't thousands of people still have it and can re-distribute it on Rapidshare and stuff? It certainly won't stop the ripping... people will still find a way to get those tools.
     
  14. gwsat macrumors 68000

    gwsat

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2008
    Location:
    Tulsa
    #14
    I agree. Using Handbrake to rip files from personally owned DVDs and convert them to MP4 for private, personal use in iTunes and on Apple TVs is a non-issue, it seems to me. The fair use exception to copyright laws as it applies to personally owned copies of music and of videotapes is well established and has been often litigated. I see no significant difference between that and personally owned DVDs. Further, the fair use standard is a lose one, which is decided on a case by case basis. Thus, I am not going to worry about it for the moment.

    Obviously making copies of DVDs you don’t own is unlawful, but then so is making copies of copyrighted music you don’t own.
     
  15. desenso macrumors 6502a

    desenso

    Joined:
    May 25, 2005
    #15
    This applies to pretty much everyone here: don't be so ridiculous. Ripping your movies to your Apple TV is not going to get you in trouble unless you give the police some other reason to get a hold of your computer (P2P, child porn, etc).
     
  16. netdog macrumors 603

    netdog

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2006
    Location:
    London
    #16
    Time for John Perry Barlow to put down the bong, get his butt off the ranch, and get himself back to Washington. We need him now more than ever.
     
  17. mallbritton thread starter macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2006
    #17
    There seems to be some misunderstanding about what the DMCA is all about. It is not about fair use. The DMCA, basically, prohibits the development or use of software to intentionally break copy protection on DVDs, or CDs, or other such media. So, technically, when we rip the contents off a DVD, breaking the copy protection, we are breaking U.S. law. Now... do I care? No. Am I in fear of prosecution? No. I am doing this for my own personal use and in my opinion it is highly unlikely that I would ever be prosecuted for what I am doing. Like all the people in this discussion, I think, I don't view what I am doing as wrong.

    The movie studios, on the other, hate what we do. Hence this PRO-IP legislation. Right or wrong the studios see what we do as "theft" and "copyright infringement." This view is, of course, complete poppycock, but what the studios really want is to have complete control over what we do with the digital media and to protect their present revenue stream and they are attempting to do that by thinking up new ways for us to pay and pay and pay for the digital content we enjoy. I know some of you have read the recent stories about NBC Universal wanting Apple to build a "copyright cop" into iTunes and all iPods. This story is related to the story about the PRO-IP legislation.

    Having said all that I agree with you, gwsat, that what we do is no big deal. And I will continue to do it in spite of the DMCA and if this PRO-IP legislation becomes law. However, I strongly suggest we contact our representatives in the Senate and voice our displeasure over this upcoming bill. If it dies in the Senate it will be dead for the rest of the legislative session.

    Regards,
    Michael
     
  18. TexasAg macrumors member

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2008
    #18
    Welcome to US Government 101 - The legislative branch (Congress) passes laws, and the executive branch (President) enforces laws. Any copyright enforcement actions would be undertaken by the executive branch. But don't let facts get in the way of your Bush-bashing.:rolleyes:

    One court has said that distributing code to hack DVD encryption was a violation of the DMCA, even though people couldn't engage in fair use to backup DVDs without that software. This would seem to indicate that you can hack DVD encryption as long as you develop the code yourself, use it yourself, and don't distribute it (which most of us couldn't do). This is why many people believe the DMCA is overbroad - it prevents most people from engaging in fair use, which is specifically listed in US copyright law as being OK.
     
  19. Moof1904 macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    May 20, 2004
    #19
    Just what we need: more government. More money wasted. More trampling over our personal liberties.

    The DMCA is sh-t. It should have never passed. Everyone who voted in favor of that piece of garbage should have never been reelected.

    And now we get a whole new flock of jack-booted thugs to help enforce bad laws.

    Hollywood not only bites the hand that feeds them, they shove that hand into a shredder.

    I'd like to see the law abiding, entertainment-purchasing public start voting not only with their votes (which seem to be useless) but also with their wallets. A year or two of near zero revenue for the entertainment industry would show them that alienating their public and treating us all like criminals is not the way to protect their IP.
     
  20. TheSpaz macrumors 604

    TheSpaz

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2005
    #20
    On a side note: One thing that annoys me about buying video content as download only... is that once you download it... it's YOURS FOREVER. You cannot re-sell it... you cannot send it back, you can't even burn it to a watchable DVD... and unless you make backups, you risk the chance of losing it, or having it not be able to play in future technology. What happens when all of your movies have been digitally downloaded and then 10 years down the road you can't find anything that will play these files anymore. Also, what happens down the road when you lose your password or something and you have zero access to your movies?

    At least with DVDs, I can make a digital copy from it and still keep the original DVD as a backup that is always there if the digital copy goes missing or corrupt.

    Also, even if you make a burned archive of your digital movies... how long do those DVD-R discs last? How long will the iTunes Store last? I just don't think of it as a safe investment.
     
  21. mallbritton thread starter macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2006
    #21
    I'm glad to see I've provoked some lively and intelligent conversation. :)

    Honestly, I'm not expecting the digital content I buy to be good for the rest of my life. If I want that kind of longevity I'll shell out the bucks for the hard copy. I don't care about reselling it either so that's not a concern for me, but I do understand it is a concern for some others.

    There are two main reasons I'm buying more and more of my audio and video entertainment digitally:

    1. It's convenient.
    2. It's environmentally friendly

    As time passes I expect the video to get better and better as consumers demand better quality for their large screen Hi Def TVs. Apple is already making this happen with the new video content on the iTunes store.

    At any rate, that's my opinion.

    Regards,
    Michael
     

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