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Only option is to send to apple for $799????????

C

cali shot doc

macrumors member
Original poster
Nov 11, 2011
72
14
So long story short about 1oz of juice was spilled on my mbp during my moms chemo appointment. Apple looked at it and told me the juice only affected part of my keyboard and that the hardware showed no signs of damage. About a week later it has begun to lag really bad. I have done a fresh install of lion and when that didn't help I took it to apple again. They ran diagnostics which showed nothing is wrong and that there is no problem with my hardware although they did recognize something is up. The genius believes liquid didnt cause the lag but because there is evidence of some liquid damage on the keyboard it doesnt matter, my apple care is still technically invalid. The guy recommended upgrading the ram but it didn't help.

The genius said my only option now is to buy a new Mac or send it to apple for $799 and have them do whatever they need to do. Even though the hardware shows no liquid damage I'm still being forced to pay $799 to have it fixed (I do have AppleCare).

Has anyone sent in there Mac, and what did they do? Would they just replace pretty much anything? My fear is I pay $799 and they do nothing cause the genius said once I pay and send it in they will deam what's necessary. I'm not sure what's the best option. It's a mid 2010 mbp.
 
Sell it and used that money to get a refurb.

Or if they do fix it, remember you get a year warrantee on the parts replacement.


$800 is the cost of a Mac mini.

$1200 for a new MacBook pro 13in or refurb 15in
 
mofunk said:
Sell it and used that money to get a refurb.

Or if they do fix it, remember you get a year warrantee on the parts replacement.


$800 is the cost of a Mac mini.

$1200 for a new MacBook pro 13in or refurb 15in
Click to expand...

How do you sell it? Sell it as parts? Ignore the lag and just sell it as if it's normal? How do you term/label it? How much would you sell it for.
 
cali shot doc said:
How do you sell it? Sell it as parts? Ignore the lag and just sell it as if it's normal? How do you term/label it? How much would you sell it for.
Click to expand...

If something is wrong with it, you should post it in the ad. If you know something is wrong and you say in that ad that its working perfectly, it would be wrong. You wouldnt want to be on the other end of the stick and buy something that is pretty expensive and to come home to find out its not as "advertised". Maybe in the ad, mention that you are selling it "as is".
 
cali shot doc said:
How do you sell it? Sell it as parts? Ignore the lag and just sell it as if it's normal? How do you term/label it? How much would you sell it for.
Click to expand...

800 likely gets you a new logic board and your system running back to normal. Problem is since your warranty is void, the replacement parts only carry a 90 day warranty, not worth the price. Put it up on eBay full disclosure what happened and let the market settle on a price. If you advertise as "normal" beyond the ethics, Apple documented the issue. If/when the new buyer sees the history you misled, you'll probably have a lawsuit on your hands.
 
So a bad logic board wont show up in diagnostic tests done by apple? Now to me because Im going to med school the logic board seems to me like the heart or brain of a body. You are going to notice and see that things are wrong in tests. I just don't get why apple can't tell me if it is or not.
 
So you said 1 oz of liquid. Did you wipe it up right away? Did you check inside at the time? Did you keep it running at this time? What is the lag like? Is it intermittent?

I don't understand "evidence of liquid damage on the keyboard".

You didn't clean it off? Give me something more to go on here, and check activity monitor during said lag. It's not a guarantee that this is just a bad logic board, but I feel like I'm responding without complete details.

One other thing, the guy you spoke to is a complete jackass.

Ram can help if you're maxing it out. It will not help if you start randomly experiencing lag.


Any other symptoms? Is the hard drive noisy? fan issues? anything going crazy in activity monitor? You need to be a bit more detailed, but most of those guys including the ones at the "genius bar" have the intelligence and product knowledge of a two by four.
 
thekev said:
So you said 1 oz of liquid. Did you wipe it up right away? Did you check inside at the time? Did you keep it running at this time? What is the lag like? Is it intermittent?

I don't understand "evidence of liquid damage on the keyboard".

You didn't clean it off? Give me something more to go on here, and check activity monitor during said lag. It's not a guarantee that this is just a bad logic board, but I feel like I'm responding without complete details.

One other thing, the guy you spoke to is a complete jackass.

Ram can help if you're maxing it out. It will not help if you start randomly experiencing lag.


Any other symptoms? Is the hard drive noisy? fan issues? anything going crazy in activity monitor? You need to be a bit more detailed, but most of those guys including the ones at the "genius bar" have the intelligence and product knowledge of a two by four.
Click to expand...
I had left the room and when I came back I saw the nurses were tippin it to the side to let it drain. They got me some can air and I blew it out. The computer stayed on but I turned it off thinking it would help save the computer. Things were fine the next few days except for the keyboard. A few keys were crunchy/sticky and some of the back light was dimmed considerably compared to the other side.

I took it in to apple and they said they'd look at it. I get a call at 8:45pm saying it will cost $185 to replace the keyboard. I said not to because I'm a med student and can't afford it till my next financial aid and small paycheck. She was nice and said she cleaned up the keys the best she could. She said all liqiud detectors were not tripped and that it didnt go past the keyboard. Once I got it back it became laggy. It seems that after a while when it gets warm it starts to lag or if i have more than 2 programs open. Today it happened, i hit restart and it was still laggy. Lag so bad that when typing a paper it's a word or two behind. Running the mouse over the dock is not fluid and crisp. Very laggy and slow.

Talked to AppleCare and they had me restart with command pr to reset memory, Didn't work. Had me fresh install lion, didn't work so they told me to see the genius bar. The guy said he ran a diagnostic + opened it to see liquid damage and he jus saw some evidence on the keys. Diagnostic was fine. He said I'd have to try a upgrade in ram or pay $799 to have apple figure out what's wrong and then fix it.
After getting home from apple Monday and after this so called genious opened my computer, now my keyboard is 100% dark. Before I still had backlight, now after his screwing around nothing.

No weird noises. I can't tell if it's any hotter than it has been. Only Noticeable problem is the lag.

My problem is if the liquid detectors aren't tripped then common sense tells me that it can't be a liquid caused problem. I've been told numerous times that the detectors are in a few spots, not all over. That to me isn't my problem. If they are all fine yet you are still going to blame it on liquid then why have the detectors in the first place? It doesn't make sense to me. It's like having a solid alibi for a crime yet still be charged for it. I understand liquid was spilled but since going to the genius bar things have gotten worse. Each time I try to talk to an apple employee they are just saying I need to buy another computer or pay the $799 yet they can't tell me what's wrong.
 
The two parts I find disturbing are the backlight dimming, and that they tipped it to drain it out (meaning it definitely had some liquid get in there).

The stuff you're saying is somewhat indicative of a dying part. Normally more things open and lag would mean I'd ask you what applications and how much ram / disk paging activity is going on in activity monitor. You can check that just for reference, but if something weird just starts suddenly, that's probably not the case.

I would argue with them on this. I would ask them to provide exact reasons for refusal to service this under applecare. If nothing tripped the liquid detectors and there is no sign of damage beyond the keyboard, you really should be fine. You don't have to yell at them, but make it clear you want to know any reason for denying service, and if they claim liquid damage, ask what they go by. If it's the sensors, then they should fix it. Arbitrary judgement based on dirty keys seems like a bit of a stretch for not repairing internal components.

You may also try a third party repair place that performs servicing under applecare and ask them what they think. Whoever you talked to there was clearly an idiot who gave you a completely generic answer which really annoys me.

I would definitely try to get this resolved. If you do end up giving up on this at some point, you can apparently cancel applecare and receive a refund on the unused portion.

http://www.apple.com/r/store/applecare/APPTermsConditions.pdf

There's the link. I looked for more stories on this stuff. I can recall when the sensor thing came out, people were reporting them tripped by humidity. I think they're in the wrong here. I'd want to hear a basis of determination on their determination of whether or not to provide service to a machine based on liquid damage outside of the sensors. They must have some method of determination, and a dirty keyboard doesn't cut it for a potential logic board issue.
 
Take it to an Apple Authorized Service Center ...

They can do things the Apple Store cannot do when there is evidence of " liquid damage ".

Example:

Apple 13" iBook had coffee spilled on it. It worked fine except the battery was not charging properly. Took it to Apple and they brought the iBook back out claiming 'liquid damage', and a voided warranty.

They could send it in for repair, for the Flate Rate Fee and the warranty would remain in force after that.

However one of the Apple people there whispered in my ear ... " if it were my iBook I would replace the cable that runs from the battery to the logic board ".

I asked if they could order the part for me, they said Apple does not sell parts.

I asked if they could replace that part, they said if they generated a report of the damage ( needed to order parts ) it would be force to enter the Flat Rate deal.

Then they whispered in my ear .... " an Apple Authorized Service Center " can do the work.

Took it to an AASC and paid them $169 to repair the new iBook.

Bill Breakdown:

Battery Cable $39
Labor $130

What they did for $130 was amazing, a complete and total teardown of the iBook, every affected part cleaned and all visible indications of liquid damage was removed.

Warranty?

Well 4 months later we had a problem, took it in to the Apple Store prepared for the worse.

The Apple Tech happily repaired and returned the iBook to us at NO CHARGE.

No mention was made of the past visit, as it was not recorded in their system.
 
If the liquid did not damage it/set off the trippers they are obliged to fix it. I would call trying PR or applecare by phone
 
What kind of "lag" are we talking about anyway? Do you use a SSD by chance?
 
Just because the immersion detectors were not tripped does not mean there wasn't any damage from liquid. It doesn't take a genius or a tech to figure out what might have caused a problem if he opened up the computer and found sticky crap all under the keyboard. Seriously, cmon - all of a sudden a defect popped up right after spilling stuff on the computer to the point where someone had to tip it to drain it out??

This isn't covered by AppleCare, nor should it be. Period.
 
A couple things. First, even if the immersion detectors didn't go off, if they can tell something was spilled and got inside the computer (i.e. sticky sugary juice residue) they don't have to fix it. From the Applecare documents:

The Plan does not cover:
b Damage due to accident, abuse, neglect, misuse (including faulty installation, repair, or maintenance by anyone other than Apple or an Apple Authorized Service Provider), unauthorized modification, improper environment (including lack of proper temperature or humidity), unusual physical or electrical stress or interference, failure or fluctuation of electrical power, lightning, static electricity, fire, or acts of God.

The reason they don't cover damage after liquid exposure is because pretty much anything that goes wrong after that can be caused by the liquid. It often takes time for problems to show up, because it takes time for corrosion to occur. I'm not sure why they haven't been able to diagnose the problem, but I'm thinking that when you used the canned air to blow the juice out of the keyboard, you may have done more harm than good. It could have pushed juice droplets inside, and it takes a very small amount of liquid, especially something acidic or sugary, to cause damage to electronics.

As others have said, you may have better luck with an Authorized Service Center. You still won't likely be able to get the work done under warranty, but they may be willing to look at it and try to find out what's wrong without the upfront cost. Good luck.
 
IllIllIll said:
Just because the immersion detectors were not tripped does not mean there wasn't any damage from liquid. It doesn't take a genius or a tech to figure out what might have caused a problem if he opened up the computer and found sticky crap all under the keyboard. Seriously, cmon - all of a sudden a defect popped up right after spilling stuff on the computer to the point where someone had to tip it to drain it out??

This isn't covered by AppleCare, nor should it be. Period.
Click to expand...

I agree but then what is the reason of the liquid detectors. Apple put them there for a reason to detect liquid, if you aren't going to go by that then why even have them there in the first place. And i have had 3 people tell me there is no evidence of liquid getting on the logic board or any other hardware. Technically i didn't have any issues till when i got it back. My keyboard was working fine and after this "genius" decided to open it up now i have no backlight. Thats not my fault, for all i know the first girl didn't clear herself of static electricity and she caused the problem since i didn't have any issues a week after the incident except for a sticky key.

In surgery mistakes happen, arteries get nicked, surgical towels have been left in. You can't tell me a computer tech has never screwed up and made things worse.

Point is, is i have been told 3 times that there is no liquid evidence on hardware which means warranty should cover it. Assumption rarely works.
 
mofunk said:
Sell it and used that money to get a refurb.

Or if they do fix it, remember you get a year warrantee on the parts replacement.


$800 is the cost of a Mac mini.

$1200 for a new MacBook pro 13in or refurb 15in
Click to expand...

Check open box item at Best Buy, got Macbook Pro 13 early 2011 for $750 after tax
 
cali shot doc said:
I agree but then what is the reason of the liquid detectors. Apple put them there for a reason to detect liquid, if you aren't going to go by that then why even have them there in the first place. And i have had 3 people tell me there is no evidence of liquid getting on the logic board or any other hardware. Technically i didn't have any issues till when i got it back. My keyboard was working fine and after this "genius" decided to open it up now i have no backlight. Thats not my fault, for all i know the first girl didn't clear herself of static electricity and she caused the problem since i didn't have any issues a week after the incident except for a sticky key.
Click to expand...
Liquid detectors aren't foolproof. Have you seen the ones in the MBP or any other device? It's not that difficult to understand that it's very feasible for a device to sustain water/liquid damage without tripping one of the detectors. Or maybe the liquid detectors in your machine are defective.

You describe a few possible scenarios that may explain why you're having problems now, sure. But they are no more or less plausible than the other scenarios that place the blame squarely on the liquid damage you sustained. In fact, if you examine the timeline you described, progressive damage from liquid exposure is the most plausible explanation. Trying to convince yourself that some new 'defect' suddenly popped up after spilling liquid on the machine is laughable. Plausible? Maybe, but highly unlikely and it makes you look like you are grabbing at straws to score a free repair or replacement.

In surgery mistakes happen, arteries get nicked, surgical towels have been left in. You can't tell me a computer tech has never screwed up and made things worse.
Click to expand...
No I can't, but neither can you PROVE that the problems you are having now were caused by a negligent tech. Conrad Murray tried to pull the same stunt in his defense in court by trying to say it was possible Michael Jackson killed himself, and he got slapped down for it because he couldn't prove it.

If you got into a minor car accident and your car checked out OK by the mechanic but started leaking coolant a week later, you're going to blame the mechanic for causing the coolant leak? And then demand a warranty repair? Seriously?

Point is, is i have been told 3 times that there is no liquid evidence on hardware which means warranty should cover it. Assumption rarely works.
Click to expand...
The flaw in your reasoning is that just because there isn't any evidence there's damage from liquid on your hardware currently, that doesn't mean the damage wasn't done by it. Ever hear of Occam's Razor? The simplest and most straightforward explanation is usually the correct one. You as a medical student should know and understand this better than other people, unless you haven't studied pathophysiology yet.

Right now you only sound like someone looking to take advantage of an AppleCare warranty repair when you clearly aren't entitled to one.
 
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There are a few ebay sellers with pretty good credibility (based on positive feedback quality/quantity) who repair the logic board for $200-$280, and if for any reason they can't repair your macbook, they issue a full refund
 
Again, my question is why you're on the hook for damage someone else did. Why aren't you making this person pay for the damages?
 
Sorry to say, that's your only option to get your laptop fixed by Apple. They take notes regarding your laptop by its unique identifier, serial number, so if you try going to try and talk to someone else over the phone, they will give you the same answer: No.

I'd look at local shops or online somewhere. It would be your best bet.
 
DO NOT SEND IT IN TO APPLE!

Do you have access to any spare 2.5" HDD's? I highly suggest popping in a blank drive, and installing OSX from scratch. It's very possible the lag is due to a dying HDD, which got wet. Typically when a motherboard gets wet, it either works, or it doesn't. You wouldn't notice a slow-down in speed.

My sister dropped her pre-unibody 15" MBP and it had serious lagging issues. Boot-up took forever, things of that nature. Apple quoted her $850 to replace the logic board, and it had to be sent out to Apple in CA, she'd be without it for 2 weeks, etc. She ended up buying a new unibody 15" MBP, since she was about to anyway.

I gladly took the old MBP off her hands. I opened it up and did some investigation. I then went to MicroCenter and picked up an OEM WD Black 2.5" 7200rpm 320GB HDD. (~$50 at the time) I took out the stock drive, popped in the new one, installed OSX, and the machine runs PERFECT.

To this day I occasionally use the machine for messing around with iOS development, and it continues to run perfect. I don't own a Mac myself, but you're seeing a post from me because I'm an avid iPad/iPhone user, and I'm planning to buy a new MBP for myself pretty soon.

Good luck.
 
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