Oppo Digital to cease production

Discussion in 'Apple TV and Home Theater' started by Macalicious2011, Apr 3, 2018.

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  1. Macalicious2011 macrumors 6502a

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    #1
    https://www.whathifi.com/news/oppo-closes-its-doors-ditches-blu-ray-player-business

    It's an unfortunate fate for manufacturer of high-end products that are sometimes used as a reference for image quality.

    Other manufacturers will likely stop producing 4K bluray players too. I blame the movie studios and Sony who have made little effort in making UHD bluray movies more affordable.

    How do you convince an average consumer to spend £299-800 on a player and then an additional £20-35 per disc?
     
  2. BODYBUILDERPAUL, Apr 3, 2018
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 6, 2018

    BODYBUILDERPAUL macrumors 65816

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    #2
    I'm really not surprised. Times change, my gosh, the world has changed and the disc buying market is tiny.
    I did say few days ago that, give it two years and 4K BluRay will be gone. It's so easy to see that the big manufacturers are truly uninterested in the format when you see the utter chip, plastic rubbish with no thought for design or components that they've brought to the market this year.

    Another reason is that the younger, educated, well travelled millennials do not use television. They consume everything or iPhones, iPads, Apple watches etc.

    I truly believe people have more opportunities/interests today and watching film on a stationary TV screen is less popular. Certainly, research in the UK suggests that the average age of a person that buys a TV is 65, whilst BBC1 viewers are 61+. I'm truly glad that we are seeing the dimise of the TV.

    I also find it offensive that people criticise streaming as of poor quality or simply 'convenient'. Remind 10-15 years and people were watching film on VHS video, in the UK watching it on 21" CRT TV or watching via grainy analogue satellite.
    In comparison, we have streaming were everything is expected to be in sparkling HD or 4K Dolby Vision thanks to Apple.

    I don't blame SONY or movie studios at all. We've all moved on. Apple released super sexy must have products. The boring black box was dead. I saw this in 2002 at my first year at university. The 18-21 year olds had ripped CDs/download music to their computers at the time. Then came the iPod which they embraced and then BOSE with their iPod speaker dock. The days of sticking/jumpy CDs were gone. It was clear the film would follow which I witnessed in 2007 in the big cities. If anything, it was my international non-western friends that were 100% downloading at the time. To them a disc was alien!

    People have 'lives' now and wouldn't dream of spending money on a 4K BluRay player when it's simply stuck in their lounge - they are spending more travelling, eating out with friends, healthy living - there's only so far that an income will stretch!

    I for one will not miss the era of the messy disc.
     
  3. kazmac macrumors 604

    kazmac

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    #3
    Unfortunate. Oppo produced my favorite all region DVD player 13 years ago (it sadly did not work with our now ancient tv), but I agree with the OP comments here as to why Oppo is shutting down. How can you expect a consumer to football that bill for the tech and dvds?

    I never got on the 4K train except for a couple of dvds -which given our antiquated tv- will not be watched. That said, I am not a fan of streaming movies or tv shows, so as long as Apple and others make digital content downloadable, I will go with that and the physical blu or dvd.
     
  4. Macalicious2011 thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    #4
    I hope prices for discs will come down to make them more affordable. What probably makes them epensive is that the distribution and no longer split between consumers, rental companies and mainstream retailers - many who no longer sell physical media.
     
  5. BODYBUILDERPAUL macrumors 65816

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    #5
    Not going to happen. Let me tell you, that in the world of media, decisions are made and implemented within 1 hour - it's the fastest moving industry that i've had the pleasure to be a part of. IF Hollywood etc wanted 4K BluRay, the entire back catalogue of films would have been released within 12 weeks of the format launch.

    Yet another format that'll end up in landfills polluting this beautiful earth caused by greedy, dumb humans!
     
  6. Macalicious2011 thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    #6
    Very good point. Meanwhile ATV has a growing catalogue of remastered old movies.
     
  7. George Dawes macrumors 6502a

    George Dawes

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    #7
    i haven't bought a physical movie , game or book in ages

    thx to itunes and appletv and the psn store

    all that space too
     
  8. Strelok macrumors 6502a

    Strelok

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    #8
    Didn’t these have built in audio equipment, which made them so expensive? The other problem is that you could get an Xbox one S or X and get pretty decent quality while costing less and giving you access to more than just a Blu-ray player.
     
  9. BODYBUILDERPAUL macrumors 65816

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    #9
    EXACTLY! And i'm hoping that the boys at Apple are discussing this Opportunity story today BUT remember they turned their back on disc many, many years ago, so they probably won't even move an eye lid.
    HOPEFULLY it'll mean that Apple can offer the ultimate sound and vision experience with ATV 4K in the future. Maybe they'll implement Dolby HD along with Atmos, who knows. Certainly with 5G on its way and new apartments that have just been built near to me that have a 1000mbps broadband connection in each apartment, the streaming future is incredibly exciting :)

    I'm sure the crowd at Apple are already exploring the advancement / replacement of streaming film!
    --- Post Merged, Apr 3, 2018 ---
    EXACTLY!!! I'm in Paris for a week or two at a friends apartment and last night, we wanted to watch one of my films - simple, I signed into my iTunes ID on her Apple TV and boom - all of my films appeared!!! Now that's incredible! Same thing when I'm at my apartment on a weekend!
    --- Post Merged, Apr 3, 2018 ---
    Just top quality built quality and better audio components, I believe. Plus the cost of making each one is huge hence the inflated price.
    But the armchairs enthusiasts will tell you that the X Box one is terrible at playing 4K BluRay. Oh wait...
    --- Post Merged, Apr 3, 2018 ---
    Ahhhh, I still buy physical books and magazines. Apple aren't taking that away from me :) :) :)
     
  10. Macalicious2011 thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    #10
    I hope so but worry that the monster that is the Walt Disney Company will launch their own streaming service and charge arm an leg for movies.
     
  11. BODYBUILDERPAUL macrumors 65816

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    #11
    Certainly, the more I read about Disney, the more I am truly horrified. True scum.

    However we as educated people have the say - vote with your wallet. If i don't like something, I stay well clear of it. There's too much good and great in the world to be sucked in by evil!
     
  12. Macalicious2011 thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    #12
    I'm surprised that regulators haven't stood in the way of their merger with 21st century fox.

    Now, the chances of big titles being streamable through Netflix within a reasonable time are nil. Thankfully many franchisees like Avengers are repetitive while original series on Netflix and Amazon get better and better.

    I'm finding myself watching more series than movies. Last week I finished Altered Carbon which was brilliant and gave me more entertainment and food for thought than watching Balderunner 1 and 2 on the trot.
     
  13. BODYBUILDERPAUL, Apr 3, 2018
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 6, 2018

    BODYBUILDERPAUL macrumors 65816

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    #13

    Being honest, I could not give a damn about these old corporations - Sky, Disney, Sinclair TV etc - they are last century dinosaurs - they are in the past. It's the new boys on the block now with different ideas!
     
  14. archer75, Apr 3, 2018
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2018

    archer75 macrumors 68020

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    #14
    I understand demand. It just sucks. I've never purchased a bluray player or a bluray disc. But I did buy the Oppo 203 and UHD discs where I want the best audio and video available. You can't get lossless audio with online streaming which is unfortunate. And while the quality can be close it's not the same as owning the disc. I'm fine with streaming most 4k movies but in some cases I really want to own the disc.

    Though this doesn't necessarily mean that discs are going away. Many companies make UHD players. Oppo was very niche, very high end and sold in very few places, mostly online. Most consumers have never heard of them.
     
  15. BODYBUILDERPAUL macrumors 65816

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    #15
    In a way, I believe that it's a real shame that someone like Eddy Cue / iTunes management can't be interviewed or aren't willing to be interviewed as to why Apple has not carried lossess audio for iTunes film. Or how they feel audio will evolve.

    It would be thoughtful / insightful from them to comment on this.

    It's clear that iTunes and Apple TV 4K want to be the very best market leader for film, they really need to include everything that was part of 4K BluRay on the audio front I guess.

    But the film studios are just as much to blame. I bought a new film from iTunes called 'Everything Everything' and the HD copy is very very poor. Picture is waxy and worse, the sound is terribly compressed - lack volume, dull, lifestyle. Probably, the worst that i've come across! (Now compare that to 'Cal Me By Your Name' whose audio sparkled!)
     
  16. George Dawes macrumors 6502a

    George Dawes

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    #16
    steve was always into top end audio , i recall his front room where had a michell gyrodec t/t , nice amp and magneplanar speakers - most def not a standard set up !! very audiophile

    looks like cook and co make do with their ipod headphones and therefore have much lower sonic standards

    why else won't they upgrade audio on itunes ??
     
  17. Rigby macrumors 601

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    #17
    I think you're jumping the gun a bit. While the physical disc market is obviously in decline, it's still significant. Oppo's problem wasn't so much that they made a UHD player, but that they made a $500+ UHD player. This is just a very small niche market. But other UHD players have been on sale for less than $100 recently.

    Personally I'm sorry to see Oppo go. I don't have their UHD player, but I do have an older Blu-ray player (BDP-93) which is still going strong and doesn't just play 2D and 3D movies, but also DVD Audio and SACD. The build quality is excellent and their service is second to none.


    I doubt that TV sets are going away anytime soon. As a data point, Netflix recently disclosed that 70% of Netflix's streams are consumed on TVs.

    I would never watch a movie on a phone. Actually, even TVs are too small; a projector with a 120+ inch screen is where it's at. :D
     
  18. BODYBUILDERPAUL macrumors 65816

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    #18
    Apple are genius and certainly knows what sells and what doesn't. It's possible that the amount of people that own AV/Home Cinema gear is just too small a market for them.
    Who knows?
    Certainly, I can see why they did not offer lossless on iTunes downloads music now - getting people to pay even more for a download would be impossible and now that the majority have Bluetooth speakers/earphones, any 'extra' sound quality would be lost.

    MAYBE Apple will surprise us in September with a Atmos & lossless audio experience for the ATV 4K. Certainly with these stream only 4K DV files, they could I guess implement any form of new audio approach, I guess.
     
  19. archer75 macrumors 68020

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    #19
    Panasonic was selling their's for $800!!! But yeah, prices have come down and oppos should have too.

    Watching a movie on a phone is worthless. Even my 65" is too small. But it is 4k and dolby vision so it does look great. I have a projector and 149" screen but the projector is just 1080p and can only be watched at night when it's darker. I'm still waiting on a 4k Dolby Vision projector that uses LED bulbs available at the consumer level. Below $2k. I feel like I will be waiting quite a while.
     
  20. BODYBUILDERPAUL, Apr 3, 2018
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2018

    BODYBUILDERPAUL macrumors 65816

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    #20
    Outside of the USA, i'm not so sure that the physical disc market is significant Rigby. We don't even have shops in the high street that sell them. the USA seems addicted to TV in comparison to the rest of the world. My experience shows that it's the traditional person who seems to buy them - it's possible that they are Windows computers users and have never had the pleasure to use a Mac or any of Apple's products.

    I bought my best friend a SONY 360 BluRay player as a wedding gift in Feb 2010 and the little horror has never used it - not even once! ANNOYED!

    I'm not convinced these £100 disc players are going to be a pleasant experience - remember how cheap CD players with their poor error correction systems jumped & skipped at the slightest knock or scratch or fingerprint on the disc?

    Ha to your projector and there's me totally upset that my 40" TV screen is far too large and unsightly!

    I find the future of film & streaming to be incredibly exciting and my gosh, I'm thankful that I went the Apple way. It was the iPhone that changed my music & video habits way back in the day!
    --- Post Merged, Apr 3, 2018 ---
    Maybe watching a film on a phone is worthless to you but to me it's damn fantastic! To me a 65" TV is pure vulgar - crass and there's no way i'd have such a monstrosity in my home! I travel a lot & a journey home on a 3 hour train journey is far nicer with my AirPods on and a favourite film/surf video/Vlog to watch. I enjoy that far more than watching it on a big screen as i'd be more likely to leave the room after a few minutes to do something else instead!
     
  21. Rigby macrumors 601

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    #21
    If anything, I think it is more important outside the US.
    The Netflix numbers are global, not just for the US. If you follow the link I posted you'll see that they even break out some individual countries. Only a small minority of streams are being watched on phones in each case. From what I see around me, "Netflix and chill" on the couch in front of a TV is very popular with Millenials too. :p
     
  22. ActionableMango macrumors G3

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    #22
    My friend and his 13 year old daughter came over for a visit. She sat down on the couch in front of my 60" professionally calibrated 9th gen Pioneer KURO plasma connected to 5.1 surround sound. She then proceeded to watch movies on her Chromebook with cheap earbuds. ("As the director intended", I joke to myself.)

    At that moment I died a little bit inside.

    I do think there are currently too many players in a shrinking market for this to be sustained.

    Just to give an indicator of how small the UHD disc market is, if you look at Amazon's sales rankings for a new release movie that has both 3D discs and 4K discs competing, the 3D discs actually outsell the 4K discs. How bad is it when 4K is being outsold by a widely disliked, niche format that won't even work on any current model TV?

    On the other hand, at the same time that Oppo is winding down, there are several new models coming out from the major players. I think Oppo's problem is somewhat unique. They are significantly more expensive compared to the competition, and have little to no retail presence. On top of that, with everything being digital, pretty much every player is just a mechanism to read discs and they all send the same 1's and 0's to the TV. Oppo's differentiation is the nice DACs, SACD support, and some rare features like subtitle repositioning, but very few people need that sort of stuff (or are even aware of it).
     
  23. BODYBUILDERPAUL macrumors 65816

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    #23
    Don't forget though, in the UK and Europe, people who watch DVD (just like VHS and film on TV) are experiencing the film speeded up by 4%!!! Try listening to music at 4%. I have several older films on DVD and HD versions on iTunes and when played together & compared, you wouldn't think that it is the same actors when you hear their voices!!!
    Certainly NOT as the director intended!!!
     
  24. mattopotamus macrumors G5

    mattopotamus

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    #24
    Pretty sad to hear. I currently have an Oppo-203 which I absolutely love. As others said, this is more a sign of a niche product coming to an end vs. physical media ending. There are still tons of people that care about quality and purchase physical media, especially when you can often get the disc+digital code for nearly the same price as just digital.

    I am no dummy though, and it is only a matter of time before physical media, like CDs, bite the dust. I just think that day is still years away. If you walk into a best buy, I think you would be shocked at the 4K sales. I usually have to preorder 4K disc if I want them on launch day because they sell out at my local Best Buy.

    Somewhat related. Do we all really want physical media to come to an end. That just means your ISP are going to start to really crush you with prices when they know that is the only option.
     
  25. HobeSoundDarryl macrumors 604

    HobeSoundDarryl

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    #25
    All this iTunes worship and near gloating serves no purpose. As consumers, the group here is basically celebrating the end of access to a much higher quality source of video entertainment than you get in your preferred streaming channel. Celebrating reductions in consumer options- especially when the loss is higher quality for lower quality- is precarious and in the realm of shooting oneself in the foot.

    There is no victory here. There is no win. Oppo existing doesn't stand in the way of favored alternatives working, thriving, growing. It just provided ANOTHER option for those that would rather spend what- in my experience- is about the same money or less for BETTER QUALITY PICTURE & SOUND than I can get from any of the streaming services.

    Buy the disc: if it has a digital download, get that for the very same convenience. If not, jump through a few hoops and make your own copy at your own quality level (choices) for the convenience.

    Instead, we are nearly celebrating the demise of a standout player fundamental to being able to provide access to a much better quality medium. For what? Nothing for us at all. A favored corporation may see a few more sales but that doesn't mean we get a lift in quality for our own purposes.

    All this vision of the demise of discs is fine too. But once you knock better quality out of the way, what's driving the alternative to provide better quality? Think. Think different. And be care what you wish for.
     

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