OS X the best operating system?

[UBS28]

With the 750m you'll get the 130% increased GPU performance by just running Windows. Quite interesting to see how OS X holds back the hardware that we have inside the Macbook Pro. So I think OS X is not that great as we paid alot of money for the hardware.

Apple should probably make OSX more open and allow companies like NVIDIA to release their own drivers for MAC. Because Apple is doing a horrible job at it.

 

[Samuelsan2001]

OS X is designed for a balance between battery life and performance and for me it makes the best of that. It's also very secure simple and easy to use beautiful to look at and fast and fluid in most circumstances it also has great scaling abilities.

Now drivers for graphics cards are a different matter that's really because Apple have to adapt the drivers themselves for OS X rather than use the stock latest updates from NVIDIA or AMD. You assume NVIDIA or AMD will want to develop drivers for macs. I agree they aren't doing the best job at it but that really has nothing to do with OS X itself.

 

[faxe]

OS X is designed for a balance between battery life and performance and for me it makes the best of that. It's also very secure simple and easy to use beautiful to look at and fast and fluid in most circumstances it also has great scaling abilities.

Now drivers for graphics cards are a different matter that's really because Apple have to adapt the drivers themselves for OS X rather than use the stock latest updates from NVIDIA or AMD. You assume NVIDIA or AMD will want to develop drivers for macs. I agree they aren't doing the best job at it but that really has nothing to do with OS X itself.

about security not really, apple is very slow in fixing security issues. the thing which saves us that os x has no 50% market share on computers, so windows is a better target and nowadays maybe even more secure.

 

[Samuelsan2001]

about security not really, apple is very slow in fixing security issues. the thing which saves us that os x has no 50% market share on computers, so windows is a better target and nowadays maybe even more secure.

The underlying unix system I see inherently more secure, and Apple update any security fixes pretty fast now fast in my opinion. I don't disagree that Windows has got a hell of a lot better but restarting to install a million pieces of crap every time I turn something on is not my idea of a secure system.

 

[SoyCapitanSoyCapitan]

With the 750m you'll get the 130% increased GPU performance by just running Windows. Quite interesting to see how OS X holds back the hardware that we have inside the Macbook Pro. So I think OS X is not that great as we paid alot of money for the hardware.

Apple should probably make OSX more open and allow companies like NVIDIA to release their own drivers for MAC. Because Apple is doing a horrible job at it.

Nvidia does release drivers for macOS. It's officially called a Quadro driver but if you look at the attached notes it will mention other supported GPUs.

Makes no difference though. Apple has included Nvidia best possible driver for mobile GPUs with Sierra. But you're comparing it against Direct X performance which is usually ahead of OpenGL.

 

[npreq]

The underlying unix system I see inherently more secure, and Apple update any security fixes pretty fast now fast in my opinion. I don't disagree that Windows has got a hell of a lot better but restarting to install a million pieces of crap every time I turn something on is not my idea of a secure system.

There's not a lot left of what you're referring to. samba was replaced by apple's own in house smb server/client for example, and a lot of the old FreeBSD services have been replaced as well throughout the years. Also, it doesn't matter if it's configured laxed (which it is). And that's not even touching the firmware (Thundershock anyone?)

But you're comparing it against Direct X performance which is usually ahead of OpenGL.

It's not that OpenGL is inherently slower (in fact it can be faster, you just have to work for that), it's that Apple's shipped implementation is stuck on GL 4.2, which was released in 2011. You can't use more advanced techniques on Apple's GL. Why? Because Apple likes lock in, hence METAL (and no Vulkan)

Without 4.3, 4.4 and 4.5 - no compute shaders, no load/store, no texture views, no asynchronous buffers, no flush control, no memory security. And that's from memory here.

 

[lowendlinux]

Lets define best then we can answer the question, but for many especially here it's the best.

 

[SoyCapitanSoyCapitan]

not that OpenGL is inherently slower (in fact it can be faster, you just have to work for that), it's that Apple's shipped implementation is stuck on GL 4.2, which was released in 2011. You can't use more advanced techniques on Apple's GL. Why? Because Apple likes lock in, hence METAL (and no Vulkan)

Without 4.3, 4.4 and 4.5 - no compute shaders, no load/store, no texture views, no asynchronous buffers, no flush control, no memory security. And that's from memory here.

Right that's what I mean and though I would love Apple to update GL and CL, we know that they have been working with some ex AMD folk for a while to develop Metal. That's why the APIs are looking old, but Metal itself is still not there yet.

Frankly this isn't a priority for Apple anyway because if they did have APIs equivalent to Windows then forums and reviews would be full of comments like 'I was gaming on the new MBP and the battery sucks'.

Ditto for VR.

It's bad enough this forum speaks so little about pro usage and that a lot of newcomers don't have enough knowledge of macOS - so they get irrationally annoyed when a new OS still has a few driver bugs for a new GPU.

 

[playtech1]

The merits of one OS over another are pretty hard to pin down, but for me MacOS is still better than Windows 10 in terms of user interface and usability. Ultimately that - together with the top build quality and design - are why I stick with Mac.

But... in some ways I feel MacOS is falling behind and in other ways I feel it is becoming less user-friendly. Graphics driver updates and the opaque storage management, for example. Windows 10 has reached the point where I could actually see myself buying the next gen Surface Book for my next workhorse laptop.

There are also definitely some ares where Apple could really use a kick up the backside. DirectX is far better than OpenGL and a lot of the apps and utilities are either neglected or have been dumbed down (Airport Utility, Disk Utility, etc.). There are also lots of virtually abandoned features - the Dashboard, Launchpad and Quick Look.

Right now I'd give Sierra a B- and El Cap a B+.

 

[tevion]

The merits of one OS over another are pretty hard to pin down, but for me MacOS is still better than Windows 10 in terms of user interface and usability. Ultimately that - together with the top build quality and design - are why I stick with Mac.

But... in some ways I feel MacOS is falling behind and in other ways I feel it is becoming less user-friendly. Graphics driver updates and the opaque storage management, for example. Windows 10 has reached the point where I could actually see myself buying the next gen Surface Book for my next workhorse laptop.

There are also definitely some ares where Apple could really use a kick up the backside. DirectX is far better than OpenGL and a lot of the apps and utilities are either neglected or have been dumbed down (Airport Utility, Disk Utility, etc.). There are also lots of virtually abandoned features - the Dashboard, Launchpad and Quick Look.

Right now I'd give Sierra a B- and El Cap a B+.

Personally i see very little difference over Windows 10 and OSX, i love them both. I use Windows 10 for a desktop PC, mainly as i have quite a powerful rig and to run my HTC Vive / Games, i use a Macbook as it's simply the best Notebook money can buy (in my opinion of course). I used to have a 27" iMac but to be honest, i think Windows 10 is a far more suitable operating system for the desktop.

 

[agaskew]

"Best" is subjective - performance isn't everything. I spend nearly all day in Firefox, VirtualBox and Microsoft Office. For me, Windows 10 performs better and Office in particular is much better on Windows - no surprises there. But visually, Windows 10 is still a really ugly mish-mash - try the Windows 10 Settings versus Control Panel. There are still old blurry dialog boxes and fonts around, and the slow rise of UWP contributes to the confusion. If that stuff drives you bananas, OS X will soothe you a lot better.

 

[mkeeley]

Was going to comment on Win10 being a messy mishmash but aga's already done that. Some will see that more than others and it will annoy some more than others. But for me, who mainly uses it for graphics work, the big things are things like thumbnails in Finder for pretty much everything (tried getting .ai's thumbnailed in Win10, some would some wouldn't, extremely slow), quick preview, finder that doesn't sit there thinking about doing things like File Explorer often does etc which makes OSX so much nicer to work on. You don't realise how nice until they're gone. Not sure sure for how much longer though:

http://www.theverge.com/2016/12/21/14037686/apple-macbook-macos-focus-mobile-features-ios

Privacy is a big deal these days yet Win10 does an absolutely massive amount of spying which you can't disable even if you go through all the privacy settings. Then there's onedrive content, and no doubt onenote, which they scan through. For some reason much of the media isn't making a big deal of this. So, unless proven otherwise, OSX is far better in that regard.

 

[jasnw]

What is really sad is that the usual phrasing of OS X vrs. Windows comparisons these days is along the lines of "it's not as bad as Windows." This is damning with NO praise. I switched from a Linux+Windows mix in 2002 to Linux+OSX and gradually moved my Linux CL work to OSX. I loved it, and things (well, except printing) really did Just Work. I looked forward to OSX upgrades. Now, I dread upgrades and stay at least one version behind the Bleeding Edge (three back on my server) because of lost capabilities and worse performance. Mac and OSX design these days appears to be driven by "not a nickel more in resources than is needed to be marginally less bad than Microsoft/Windows."

 

[mkeeley]

What is really sad is that the usual phrasing of OS X vrs. Windows comparisons these days is along the lines of "it's not as bad as Windows." This is damning with NO praise. I switched from a Linux+Windows mix in 2002 to Linux+OSX and gradually moved my Linux CL work to OSX. I loved it, and things (well, except printing) really did Just Work. I looked forward to OSX upgrades. Now, I dread upgrades and stay at least one version behind the Bleeding Edge (three back on my server) because of lost capabilities and worse performance. Mac and OSX design these days appears to be driven by "not a nickel more in resources than is needed to be marginally less bad than Microsoft/Windows."

If the Verge article's to be believed, and no reason why it shouldn't be, they don't even have a dedicated OSX team any more, that says all you need to know about its future whilst Cook's around. They work on iOS and OSX's an after thought if they have any time left. With each release they're adding fewer and fewer features. Wouldn't surprise me if they stop doing yearly releases but spin it as though that's a good thing.

 

[ardchoille50]

Lets define best then we can answer the question, but for many especially here it's the best.

Exactly. And, that definition is going to be vary quite a bit from user to user as it involves more opinion than anything else. For me, macOS is the best desktop system available.

 

[BlueGoldAce]

It varies from user to user.

I prefer windows 10 for actual desktop work. I built a high end pc, and having first rate driver support from nvidia, etc is nice. I also just prefer how windows 10 works for my desktop productivity. I also game a lot, and windows 10 is the better choice for that.

But I prefer macOS for laptops. The battery life, touchpad, stability (windows 10 is stable, but third party manufactures mess things up, like laptop not sleeping, etc), ecosystem integration, etc. I just prefer the work flow of the MacBook Pro when I am using my laptop.

If I am at home I'll use my desktop for 95% of work and productivity needs.

I like both operating systems. I find they work together and coexist well.

 

[Pit bull puppy]

I have both, I have a Dell Latitude running windows ten pro and i have a white unibody MacBook running mac os sierra. for me both computers serve a purpose, i am a storm chaser....i chase tornadoes and the best radar program only runs on windows. I also have digital ham radios, the only way to program them is by computer and the programming software for the radios also does not run on mac. Mac os x is the ultimate operating system since it just works and works consistantly..... windows has gotten much better but still has far too much user required maintenance and disk cleaning and virus protection needs to be the best. mac os will always be #1 for me since it just works and works without constant nagging for maintenance tasks or updates every week.

 

[BlueGoldAce]

I have both, I have a Dell Latitude running windows ten pro and i have a white unibody MacBook running mac os sierra. for me both computers serve a purpose, i am a storm chaser....i chase tornadoes and the best radar program only runs on windows. I also have digital ham radios, the only way to program them is by computer and the programming software for the radios also does not run on mac. Mac os x is the ultimate operating system since it just works and works consistantly..... windows has gotten much better but still has far too much user required maintenance and disk cleaning and virus protection needs to be the best. mac os will always be #1 for me since it just works and works without constant nagging for maintenance tasks or updates every week.

Storm chasing, now that sounds like a neat profession. I'm a stem cell biologist; I always find it fascinating the diversity on forums like these.

I, personally, think that windows 10 is really close to be as user friendly as macOS. This is only the case, though, with a surface device, home-built desktop, or a Microsoft signature version or a laptop; in that order of better to worse for customer friendly.

The surface devices allow Microsoft to have Apple like control, and as such you can see the benefits. When I owned a surface book, it was a fantastic machine. I'd even say it was a tiny bit more dependable then my newer MBPtb.

I also find that home-built desktop, with quality parts, are extremely reliable. If you just stick to name brand hardware, compatibility and reliability becomes an after thought. Combine that with the benefits of unlimited power draw (meaning no concerns over battery life), and you get an amazing machine.

I see the problems with windows coming from
their party OEMs, like Dell, that add extra software, bios code, etc and don't properly test it.

Windows defender is plenty for the average user, and bsked into the operating system. SSDs, in a PC that has one, renders hard drive maintenance a thing of the past.

I love my win10 desktop, and I greatly enjoy my MBPtb.

I prefer the power, price, gaming ability, and customizability of windows 10 hardware/desktops.

I prefer the stability, along with a few niche software programs, that macOS offers in laptop form.

 

[GeekishlyGreek]

It varies from user to user.

I prefer windows 10 for actual desktop work. I built a high end pc, and having first rate driver support from nvidia, etc is nice. I also just prefer how windows 10 works for my desktop productivity. I also game a lot, and windows 10 is the better choice for that.

But I prefer macOS for laptops. The battery life, touchpad, stability (windows 10 is stable, but third party manufactures mess things up, like laptop not sleeping, etc), ecosystem integration, etc. I just prefer the work flow of the MacBook Pro when I am using my laptop.

If I am at home I'll use my desktop for 95% of work and productivity needs.

I like both operating systems. I find they work together and coexist well.

Yep. You can count me in this bracket aswell. I'm not so sure I'd go as far as describing them as "co-existing" well (at least, not in the sense of interoperability between the two systems, as I think they both have a long way to go in that sense). But bit by bit, even that they're getting better at this as time goes by. But yes, definitely in the sense that I think you were referring to here (where they co-exist in the sense of preferring to have both due to one being better at certain tasks than the other in different situations), I'm in 100% agreement. Most of my work stuff I'd not be able to do so many things on my mac that I rely upon being able to for my job, so my Windows machine is used for most of that stuff. But for all of my personal stuff, I do prefer using my Mac for that (though admittedly, I actually do alot more stuff on my iPhone than my Mac these days) I find it more convenient for most things (except for stuff that relies upon heavy keyboard use). So definitely alot to be said for each of them being merely tools. Of course which one is the best tool for the job will inevitably vary, depending on what you're trying to achieve at the time.

 

[Pit bull puppy]

windows has come a long way and i don't mind it as much as i used to..... i left windows pretty much completely after i got a vista machine, and dealt with a radar app that was just basic for years..... now i can at least not go completely nuts and get extremely flustered when i have to use windows but i still mainly prefer mac, especially since i have an iPhone, and 2 iPads. if windows starts making me rabid again, i found radarscope radar app to be decent and will get the laptop version of it and go back to being a mac user only again but i will give the new version of windows a chance.... i say that as i am using my unibody white MacBook.

 

[GeekishlyGreek]

windows has come a long way and i don't mind it as much as i used to..... i left windows pretty much completely after i got a vista machine, and dealt with a radar app that was just basic for years..... now i can at least not go completely nuts and get extremely flustered when i have to use windows but i still mainly prefer mac, especially since i have an iPhone, and 2 iPads. if windows starts making me rabid again, i found radarscope radar app to be decent and will get the laptop version of it and go back to being a mac user only again but i will give the new version of windows a chance.... i say that as i am using my unibody white MacBook.

Yeah, the mac does get alot more relevant once you have other Apple devices. Before I had ever used an iPhone, I used to only ever have windows computers, but a few iPhones later, and my Mac suddenly became alot more useful to me in terms of seamlessness. I do really love that about it! One thing I do find myself doing though since using both, is I have a tendency for falling in and out of love with them at different times. Last year for example, windows was getting so annoying with everything they destroyed from windows 8 onwards, that I was literally thinking of going only the mac route myself. There are a few things that I still relied upon however, and they've fixed some things on windows 10 that have made if feasible again, but I do still feel it has gone downhill compared to windows 7 (which is why I do currently prefer using my mac still for everything except the stuff that I can't).

What is the radar app btw? Am I right in assuming that it's some sort of virtual windows console that can be used on the mac? If so, might be interesting to look into.

 

[Pit bull puppy]

i do severe weather storm chasing and need to have live radar available, right now the best program/app is gr level x which is only made for windows, however i have an alternative on my iPhone and iPad called radar scope which seems to be pretty decent as well, have yet to try it on the MacBook as of yet.

 

[Tech198]

With the 750m you'll get the 130% increased GPU performance by just running Windows. Quite interesting to see how OS X holds back the hardware that we have inside the Macbook Pro. So I think OS X is not that great as we paid alot of money for the hardware.

Apple should probably make OSX more open and allow companies like NVIDIA to release their own drivers for MAC. Because Apple is doing a horrible job at it.

er.... no.. we don't wanna be like Windows users who must hunt for their drivers and version manufacture web site... Apple making sure third-party drivers will work.... What a nightmare.


I agree about being more open, but drivers is not the way.