Our unheard voices as consumers. - Updated 10/30/09

monoxera

macrumors member
Original poster
Apr 20, 2009
69
0
Hi all. I've noticed more and more threads about the nvidia 8600m GT GPU's failing ever since mine failed and it is currently in the apple store.

Here are the following topics ALL about mbp's screen not turning on; black screen and solid sleep light and these topics were all from page 1 - page 5

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=806956
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=806724
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=737962
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=764665http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost.php?p=8660328&postcount=8
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=805039
http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost.php?p=8666615&postcount=5
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=803735
Edit* Brand new cases below
http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost.php?p=8685073&postcount=17
http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost.php?p=8693278&postcount=18
http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost.php?p=8691459&postcount=7
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=807317
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=807039
http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost.php?p=8684407&postcount=7
http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost.php?p=8703743&postcount=1 Added 10/25/09
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=808913 Added 10/26/09
http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost.php?p=8715593&postcount=4 Added 10/30/09
http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost.php?p=8634406&postcount=1 Added 10/30/09
http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost.php?p=8729810&postcount=1 Added 10/30/09

This is ALL really very suspicious. My MBP is in the "store" right now here in South Korea and I was told to wait 2-3 days until they call me back.

Ultimately, it came to this
So when Apple replaces the faulty GPU/Logic board, are they fitting a fault free one, or just another one with the same inherent fault?
And the answer was

no man...we have to bring it to court regardless...
it's clear nvidia's fault...
replacing a faulty chip with a new faulty chip won't solve the problem...
at the end all 8600 mbp users are f'ed...
wt can we do after the warranty ends?! NOTHING!!
so I say we should run the GPU as much as possible, get repaired more than 3times and get a new MBP for replacement!!
...

So in the end, what's going to happen?

Should I call Apple America, to tell Apple Korea and complain about this?

Btw, I've had EXACTLY the scenario with a customer that has had his ipod nano (1st generation) here in South Korea and it exploded in his office.
Link to story- http://asia.cnet.com/blogs/digihunter/post.htm?id=63008022

So tell me, what are our options?

Stay quiet and expect 8600m GT to fail again but see 3 year warranty end? (http://support.apple.com/kb/TS2377)
Or fight back to question Apple about this?

Now Apple are charging users with faulty 8600M GT to fix out of our own pockets?
http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost.php?p=8715593&postcount=4
 

nerd

macrumors member
May 15, 2004
92
0
My MBP is currently being repaired (for free) because of the faulty nvidia chip. I'm under the impression that the new revision of the logic board fixes the problem.

I don't see what the possible conspiracy is. Apple voluntarily extended the warranty first to two years I think and now to three years. It doesn't seem to me like they are trying to "run out the clock" on anyone. I'm happy with their response to this issue. (I'll be happier when I have my computer back and working!)

I am curious to know if Snow Leopard is more taxing on the GPU somehow and is causing the recent wave of failures. I noticed my first symptoms about a week after upgrading.
 

fluffyx

macrumors 6502
Oct 25, 2007
313
1
The new logic boards include an NVidia chip without the defective packaging.

In fact, the MacBook Pro logic boards were in short supply immediately after they realized that they were defective. One assumes that they recalled all of those service parts in the supply chain and refitted them with longer-lived GPUs.

As long as your MacBook Pro is less than three years old, if its 8600M has failed, Apple will repair it for free. Read more at http://support.apple.com/kb/TS2377 .
 

iLog.Genius

macrumors 601
Feb 24, 2009
4,828
354
Toronto, Ontario
The new logic boards include an NVidia chip without the defective packaging.
How accurate is that? From what I've read from the long post of failing 8600M GT's, Apple replaces the logic board with the another logic board with the same defective (pictures and profiler data was taken and posted). 8600M GT owners have to deal with defective chips until they either give up on it or Apple gives them a new MacBook Pro.
 

monoxera

macrumors member
Original poster
Apr 20, 2009
69
0
How accurate is that? From what I've read from the long post of failing 8600M GT's, Apple replaces the logic board with the another logic board with the same defective (pictures and profiler data was taken and posted). 8600M GT owners have to deal with defective chips until they either give up on it or Apple gives them a new MacBook Pro.
Yes, you are correct. I heard that as well.

Apple is replacing broken graphics card with same graphics card, until the 3 years period is gone, then you're SOL.

Ugh, can't we consumers do ANYTHING?
 

Sace

macrumors member
Mar 30, 2008
74
0
How accurate is that? From what I've read from the long post of failing 8600M GT's, Apple replaces the logic board with the another logic board with the same defective (pictures and profiler data was taken and posted). 8600M GT owners have to deal with defective chips until they either give up on it or Apple gives them a new MacBook Pro.
Actually i think the 8600 chips were discontinued, before Apple extended the waranty - So every existing chip is defective.

If you take a look at the new iMac line - Apart from the base model, Nvidia GPU's are GONE! Wonder why :rolleyes:
 

bov

macrumors 6502
Aug 21, 2007
385
0
San Francisco
prior to sending in my MBP for repair, i asked the genius if they replaced the logic board with the same known defect, and they said it is replaced with a different model, but same logic board

dunno how much i believe that statement though...

on a happier note, got the call from apple saying my baby is repaired, so im picking it up tomorrow and hopefully it's alll goood from now on :D
 

J&JPolangin

macrumors 68030
Jul 5, 2008
2,564
5
Thule GL @ the TOW
Actually i think the 8600 chips were discontinued, before Apple extended the waranty - So every existing chip is defective.

If you take a look at the new iMac line - Apart from the base model, Nvidia GPU's are GONE! Wonder why :rolleyes:
...execpt for the fact that the machines they hold the most market share (and growing) laptops all have nVidia 9400M's in the most popularly sold models... by the time the total 3 year period runs out, most people move on to new hardware anyway...
 

Eddyisgreat

macrumors 601
Oct 24, 2007
4,847
1
by the time the total 3 year period runs out, most people move on to new hardware anyway...
Yes but for home users three years usage out of a machine is a bit unreasonable don't you think? These aren't corporate users with buckets of cash who end-of-life their $80,000 rack servers because they are 1 Mhz slower than the newer model; 12 inch powerbook are still being bought and sold on the market.

Apple says "your stuff will die don't ask us when" not like a hard drive manufacturer with a stated MTF (mean time between failure) that we can look at when buying the drive, or any other statement saying "you machine will last no longer than 3 years".
 

GoCubsGo

macrumors Nehalem
Feb 19, 2005
35,743
141
My MBP is currently being repaired (for free) because of the faulty nvidia chip. I'm under the impression that the new revision of the logic board fixes the problem.

I don't see what the possible conspiracy is. Apple voluntarily extended the warranty first to two years I think and now to three years. It doesn't seem to me like they are trying to "run out the clock" on anyone. I'm happy with their response to this issue. (I'll be happier when I have my computer back and working!)
I have to agree with this guy for the most part.
OP: Your news is old and outdated. There is no conspiracy here because, as stated above, Apple acknowledged the problem and will fix the issue should it arise. Now go outside and breathe. :)
 

monoxera

macrumors member
Original poster
Apr 20, 2009
69
0
I have to agree with this guy for the most part.
OP: Your news is old and outdated. There is no conspiracy here because, as stated above, Apple acknowledged the problem and will fix the issue should it arise. Now go outside and breathe. :)
This is old news sure. But the rate of registered users posting about their failed GPU this month is quite a shock to me.
Conspiracy that apple replaces GPU with same defective GPU and in turn, 3 years will pass by and we will all have to fork out $1100 for a new logic board? Yes

Jessica, I'm guessing you haven't had a defective GPU?
I know I didn't have one until this week, and I saw that "nvidia 8600m GT ALL DEFECTIVE thread" and I really didn't give a rat's ass about all the users experiencing broken GPUs. But now that I get to feel first hand how awful this situation is, I am very upset and disappointed because I bought this laptop with my own monies, and it took me quite a while to afford this.

////////////////////////////////////////
Bottom line:

  • Apple replaces defective GPU with defective GPU that will break in 1 year.
  • Consumers cannot do a thing about it since they have extended warranty for 3 years
  • After 3 years our GPU breaks, who will cover us then? A $3000 laptop for me does not last 3 years, but should last 10 years at least for me.
 

chill.

macrumors 6502
Sep 1, 2008
385
0
the bottom line is, what do you expect them to do?

1. give you a whole new laptop as a replacement?

2. continue replacing the video card and doing free repairs for 10 years?

these really aren't financially feasible solutions. like.. a 3 year warranty is a 3 year warranty, not a 10-year warranty and not a lifetime warranty. yes, it's horrible that the 8600's are defective, but there's always a risk of purchasing a shoddy product.

are dell/hp/acer/apple etc. all going to give you a free new laptop? while it would be nice, the answer is no. they've already fulfilled their obligation by supporting the warranty. they really don't owe you anything
 

fluffyx

macrumors 6502
Oct 25, 2007
313
1
I would expect the chip to look the same to the naked eye, and for it to report the same info to System Profiler. It may not be possible to prove beyond a doubt that the new chips have changed at all.

But has anyone actually had to send their MBP in for this issue TWICE after Apple announced the Quality Program? The program was announced quite a while ago, and I've never seen it be a repeat issue.
 

monoxera

macrumors member
Original poster
Apr 20, 2009
69
0
I would expect the chip to look the same to the naked eye, and for it to report the same info to System Profiler. It may not be possible to prove beyond a doubt that the new chips have changed at all.

But has anyone actually had to send their MBP in for this issue TWICE after Apple announced the Quality Program? The program was announced quite a while ago, and I've never seen it be a repeat issue.
Yes, I've seen people getting it fixed 3 times before they raged
 

bov

macrumors 6502
Aug 21, 2007
385
0
San Francisco
im happy because i sent my 2.2Ghz MBP in for repair, and now have a 2.4 Ghz MBP. Also i have a 256MB 8600M GT instead of a 128MB one. :) Free upgrades are always nice.

hopefully this new logic board doesnt poop out on me though....
 

monoxera

macrumors member
Original poster
Apr 20, 2009
69
0
im happy because i sent my 2.2Ghz MBP in for repair, and now have a 2.4 Ghz MBP. Also i have a 256MB 8600M GT instead of a 128MB one. :) Free upgrades are always nice.

hopefully this new logic board doesnt poop out on me though....
Unibod?
 

Rampant.A.I.

macrumors 6502a
Sep 25, 2009
579
9
Yes, you are correct. I heard that as well.

Apple is replacing broken graphics card with same graphics card, until the 3 years period is gone, then you're SOL.

Ugh, can't we consumers do ANYTHING?
This unfortunately seems to be their new strategy for dealing with defective products. Deny that there's anything wrong with them, pretend like all the similar defective products are just wild coincidences, and stall the consumer until they're out of warranty.

It's a good strategy for the short term, because they're not losing any revenue. But in the long run... It's gonna backfire.
 

Stiss

macrumors 6502a
Apr 18, 2009
844
494
England
You can do something after the warranty has expired. Here in the UK you can anyway.

Sales of Goods Act says products should be free of inherent faults and should last a reasonable amount of time. For electronics such as TV's the law says 6 years, not sure for laptops.

If your in the UK and having a tough time with any one just ring Consumer Direct. They give you a case number, the retailer then rings them quoting your number and Consumer Direct puts them right.
 

rodo

macrumors newbie
Oct 24, 2009
26
0
i have the old santa rosa... my nvidia chip died 2 times, and I got 2 logic boards for free, out of warranty. Of course Apple replaced with the same logic board, I warned them it will burn again (and did xD) .... They said... well... ring us again and will change it.

Since my second burnout, I power off the computer more frequently. Also it would be fine to avoid any plastic covers as probably it would worsen the problem.

BTW-Are you refering to unibodies?? Do they have the same problem???? Why no other computers with embedded nVidia chips (most of them!) die?
 

comptr

macrumors 68000
Oct 25, 2007
1,793
404
Arizona
well for me it was the end of september and october. One logic board died, one screen died. Next ram died.Then another screen died. Then another logic board died. Finally the battery died. Its been the month of repairs for me. :(
 

thejadedmonkey

macrumors 604
May 28, 2005
7,978
531
Pennsylvania
the bottom line is, what do you expect them to do?

1. give you a whole new laptop as a replacement?

2. continue replacing the video card and doing free repairs for 10 years?

these really aren't financially feasible solutions. like.. a 3 year warranty is a 3 year warranty, not a 10-year warranty and not a lifetime warranty. yes, it's horrible that the 8600's are defective, but there's always a risk of purchasing a shoddy product.

are dell/hp/acer/apple etc. all going to give you a free new laptop? while it would be nice, the answer is no. they've already fulfilled their obligation by supporting the warranty. they really don't owe you anything
Actually, if they're supplying a known defective product, then they should be either giving you a new, non-defective laptop, or repairing the laptop not for 10 years, but for the life of the machine. I think the issue is that this graphics chip was in 2 generations of MBP's, so it would be too many to do a mass recall like they should...
 

chill.

macrumors 6502
Sep 1, 2008
385
0
Actually, if they're supplying a known defective product, then they should be either giving you a new, non-defective laptop, or repairing the laptop not for 10 years, but for the life of the machine. I think the issue is that this graphics chip was in 2 generations of MBP's, so it would be too many to do a mass recall like they should...
there's defective and then there's defective. it's not like you're getting a brick out of the box. the laptop is functional, what is in question is the "life of the machine". do you expect the auto industry to give you a new car every time your brakes wear down?