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PC world is beating the heck out of macs in portable computers
- Thread starter jefhatfield
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Actually if you order the right chips you can have over a gig in the iBook. Also the Dells I have been looking at will only hold 512MBs of RAM and they use integrated graphics.
Again what was the model of Compaq you picked up? I'm looking for my sister.
But its so nice when it can be for both at a cheep price.
I can throw any map on UT2003 at this computer and it plays them so smoothly, all while that boring history teacher lectures on about stuff I just read in the chapter I read the night before, lol
I do wish I had a choice of a 12 inch screen though. Don't know why compaq/hp doesn't offer this choice.
Presario 2100z I think, www.compaq.com or www.hpshopping.com choose the one with the amd inside
Don't get that dell then, esh, thats terrible, lol.
Dell offers it but they start at nearly $1500 after rebate. The reason that Compaq/HP don't offer it is because due to the size they can't offer the low price point that they want to. Again the reason one laptop costs more then another is because of how compact it is. The bigger they are the less development it requires and the closer they can make the price to a desktop. PC desktops for the most part are uninspired whipped together boxes and that's why they can offer such a low price point besides the low price of parts.
Originally posted by leet1
Presario 2100z I think, www.compaq.com or www.hpshopping.com choose the one with the amd inside
Don't get that dell then, esh, thats terrible, lol.
The 2100z doesn't offer integrated graphics thus a higher price point. I priced one out exactly as you spec'd and it came to $974. I was hoping to get what you got for my sister that's why I'm asking.
Since when did it become commonplace to go above 512MB with a PC laptop? Apple put that dedicated chip in so it could make its low end ibook a cut above the rest of those PC laptops. The 12 inch screen is its biggest hurdle, because people see 15 inchers for the same price.
Besides, any laptop worth investing more than 256MB of RAM in would more than likely have a dedicated graphics controller.
I challenge you:
Find me a new (that means NOT from Ebay or any other auction shop) PC laptop with better than a Mobility radeon 7000 and has to have at least 32MB of dedicated VRAM. Find me one for under 1150$ and I will concede my arguement.
Since when? I don't know. I might buy another 256 or 512 when I get some money together.
Sorry, not accepting this challenge, lol. I have no problems with an integrated card. It hasn't slowed down on any games I've thrown at it<gta3, ut, ut2003, a lot of games I've downloaded from kazaa and tried out, lol> so I don't think it matters weither or not a laptop has one<unless its upgradable like the one from vodoo.com>
Well they all currently have $100-$300 in rebates and I can't find a deal much better then that.
Well, even though there are laptops you can get for $800, I think Apple is hitting the sweet spot with Edu-priced iBooks starting at $949. At that price, if a kid wants an iBook, he/she is gonna pay an extra couple hundred bucks to get the iBook. Keep in mind Apple is a small player in the computer marketplace, so it has to follow a differentiation strategy. A Mac will never be the cheapest computer out there in any category (except maybe 2200 CPU massively parallel computers).
As an aside, that's why it's in Apple's best interest *not* to use an Intel processor and to differentiate its operating system clearly from Windows. When you're a small player struggling for market share, having a well-differentiated product (as long as its a quality product), will more or less guarantee you at least some small market share, because some people will *prefer* the things that make your product different.
In my case, for example, OS X is the only game in town. I'm a fan of Unix but I got sick of just trying to get the simplest things working on my Linux laptops and desktops. OS X is the only user-friendly Unix ever invented, so therefore it provides great value to me and I am willing to pay an extra couple hundred dollars for that preference. For other people there will be other things about the Mac that they will prefer. But the point is, the only hope Apple has of survival is in creating incentives for people to spend more on a Mac. The right approach will never be to try to make the cheapest computer in the market place. Let Dell duke it out with Taiwanese and Chinese companies for that part of the market.
As an aside, that's why it's in Apple's best interest *not* to use an Intel processor and to differentiate its operating system clearly from Windows. When you're a small player struggling for market share, having a well-differentiated product (as long as its a quality product), will more or less guarantee you at least some small market share, because some people will *prefer* the things that make your product different.
In my case, for example, OS X is the only game in town. I'm a fan of Unix but I got sick of just trying to get the simplest things working on my Linux laptops and desktops. OS X is the only user-friendly Unix ever invented, so therefore it provides great value to me and I am willing to pay an extra couple hundred dollars for that preference. For other people there will be other things about the Mac that they will prefer. But the point is, the only hope Apple has of survival is in creating incentives for people to spend more on a Mac. The right approach will never be to try to make the cheapest computer in the market place. Let Dell duke it out with Taiwanese and Chinese companies for that part of the market.
Actually the iBook is the cheapest in it's category. That of tough compact low weight laptops. As far as I can no one else even comes close.
Right, so it attracts customers that place some monetary value on:
- toughness
- compactness
- low weight
Different customers will place different values on these, though. For example, what dollar value would you place on "toughness". The point is, every computer buyer has their own set of preferences. For example, you can find compact low weight computers for the same price as the iBook. But the iBook is marketing compactness, low weight, *and* toughness - perfect for the kid that wants to toss their laptop in a backpack with their other books.
True you can find a laptop that is as light but I can't find any that are as cheap. I realize it's my opinion but the whole reason a laptop is even portable to start with is weight and for the most part the lighter the better. If a desktop computer and monitor weighed under 10 pounds you could consider it a portable as well. The point is no matter how you look at it weight is for nearly everyone that knows what they are looking at the most important deciding factor.
Dude, you're from Springfield? I grew up in Eugene. What the hell happened to the Ducks, man? Oh well, I shouldn't complain. When I lived there in the 80's the Ducks were the lovable losers with the goofy mascot, not the brash, showy "Miami of the West" team that they are now.
Yup, there was a time the ducks were cool now well you would have to live here to understand. They are so damn full of themselves and arrogant that if I said what I wanted to do to Autzen stadium I would be thrown in jail and called a terrorist.
PM me if you want to talk further off topic.
Well, here's what's going on in the PC world, here's a Buy.com best-seller:
http://www.buy.com/retail/computers/product.asp?sku=10357005&loc=101&adid=17070&dcaid=17070
It has basically the same specs as the iBook (12" Screen, 1.2" thick, built-in combo drive), and it comes in at an amazing 4.3 lbs., lighter even than the 12" AluBook. The price: $899. Granted, it's from a no-name brand and normal list price is $999 (it's on sale right now). But still, this is just one example. You can find other thin & lights for the same price as the iBook or less.
So it's back to differentiation from Apple. I would still buy the iBook instead of the above computer because of it's emphasis on toughness (and the reputation of Macs of being more durable anyways). And of course OS X and more attractive case design are also big differentiators.
Have you seen an Averatec??!! It's flimsy? My friend has either the same model, or the one after this. It feels very very easy to break. He's had it only for a couple of months, and already if you tilt it you can hear something rattling. If you tilt the system while you are playing a cd/dvd, you hear a huge whine from the drive.
Battery life is 3 hrs (vs 5+ for the ibook). No separate video card, the display is not as good as mine (mine's a powerbook though).
Overall, I don't think his laptop is going to last for long. I would strongly discourage people from buying an Averatec. I've personally seen people have problems with Sony Vaio's, and Dell's. HPaq's have been better. Toshiba is good. IBM of course is supposedly the best.
Fortunately, if you want mobility (light, long battery life), the Ibook/Powerbooks, are in exactly the same price range as the Intel laptops, i.e., IBM, Toshiba, the Compaq X1000.
The Compaq X1000 is awesome, 15.2" widescreen is pretty good. and you can get it for $500 less than the 15" Pbook.
Ive gone through 3 PC laptops in the last 5 years.
Compaq Presario 2120 1998-2001
Toshiba Satellite 2805-S402 2001-Present
Dell Latitude CPx 2003-Present.
The first was a Compaq Presario back in 97. OH MY GOD. What a colossal POS. I not kidding here folks. Biggest mistake of my life. That laptops ONLY good feature was its speakers. Fantastic sound. But the rest of the system. In the 3 year period I took that laptop in for repairs 8 times. (To the theme of 12 days of x-mas) 4 fried power sources, 2 bad mothers, 1 bad BIOS and a one BAD BAD vid card.
The final time the system went bad, which was just before the warrantee expired I said enough of this crap and made sure that there was no WAY IN HELL they could fix the problem. Somehow the CPU in my laptop mad direct contact with a car battery. I swear I have no clue how it happened. *whistles and looks at his feet.* I took it in and they said they couldnt repair it so theyd give me a choice. $1,000 towards a new laptop or a similar Compaq model for free. Fat chance with option two. I will NEVER touch a Compaq ever again. So I picked up my second laptop for 1/3 off the price of $3,000. This was in 2001. Its a Toshiba Satellite 15 800Mhz with the first gen GeForce 2Go GPU and CD-RW/DVD combo drive. In the time Ive had it Ive taken it in for repairs twice. Once for a dead battery from which I understand that is fairly common after a while, and the second time for a bad DVD drive. (Note to self-if your are going to RIP your own DVD collection do it on a drive other then your laptop.) Other then that its a fantastic system. Fast enough to handle games and a sound system to die for. The thing has a subwoofer on it. My biggest complaint was battery life. To say it sucks is an understatement. About 2 hours IF Im lucky.
This precipitated the acquisition of laptop 3. My company uses Dell. Ive always liked the Latitude series and the CSx series we use here, but are currently phasing them out, have a strong batt life. 3+ hours which is good. So I ended up getting a system off of e-bay for $300 that included a second battery and CD-RW/DVD drive. In addition that that I jacked the hard drive up to 40GB, jacked the RAM up to 384MB. All told it cost me about $500-$600 for this system. It has a 13.3 display and is only 1.14 thick and weights in a 4.3 pounds. The best thing about it is the silence. I know when an app is eating the CPU clocks on the thing because that is the ONLY time the fan switches on. (And that usually happens when an app is behaving badly. Thank god for W2Ks task manager. Whats even cooler, no pun intended is that its a variable rate fan. (High-Medium-Low) So even what the fan is on its relatively quiet. Right now Im in the market for a new laptop.
Doubtlessly some of you guys have seen my rants on the PowerBook. I love the design but every benchmark Ive seen a comparable Pentium M based system soundly kicks the snot out of even the high end 1.33Ghz CPU found in the 17 PowerBook. As Ive stated before I have no problems paying a premium for a PowerBook. After all its suppose to be the Porsche of the computer world right? But if Im going to pay that premium I expect it to thrash the competition or at least keep pace. This isnt about the size of my dick and needing the most powerful thing out there. Its about future proofing my devices as much as possible and getting the most bang for my buck. This is why Im in a holding pattern when it comes to getting a PowerBook. I want a G5 based PowerBook. I believe, hope?, that this will do to the PowerBooks what the G5 PowerMac did to the desktop line: Bring it in line with the competition. That and it will prepare the system for the day that Apple releases a 64-bit optimized version of OSX. It will happen. Its just a matter of time. Id rather be ready for that day then having to go out and plunk down more $$$$ on a new system. So for me its G5 or bust. Then and ONLY then will I consider switching. Or as I term it merging since I will continue to use my 13 Latitude in those situations where Im looking for something highly portable.
Compaq Presario 2120 1998-2001
Toshiba Satellite 2805-S402 2001-Present
Dell Latitude CPx 2003-Present.
The first was a Compaq Presario back in 97. OH MY GOD. What a colossal POS. I not kidding here folks. Biggest mistake of my life. That laptops ONLY good feature was its speakers. Fantastic sound. But the rest of the system. In the 3 year period I took that laptop in for repairs 8 times. (To the theme of 12 days of x-mas) 4 fried power sources, 2 bad mothers, 1 bad BIOS and a one BAD BAD vid card.
The final time the system went bad, which was just before the warrantee expired I said enough of this crap and made sure that there was no WAY IN HELL they could fix the problem. Somehow the CPU in my laptop mad direct contact with a car battery. I swear I have no clue how it happened. *whistles and looks at his feet.* I took it in and they said they couldnt repair it so theyd give me a choice. $1,000 towards a new laptop or a similar Compaq model for free. Fat chance with option two. I will NEVER touch a Compaq ever again. So I picked up my second laptop for 1/3 off the price of $3,000. This was in 2001. Its a Toshiba Satellite 15 800Mhz with the first gen GeForce 2Go GPU and CD-RW/DVD combo drive. In the time Ive had it Ive taken it in for repairs twice. Once for a dead battery from which I understand that is fairly common after a while, and the second time for a bad DVD drive. (Note to self-if your are going to RIP your own DVD collection do it on a drive other then your laptop.) Other then that its a fantastic system. Fast enough to handle games and a sound system to die for. The thing has a subwoofer on it.
My biggest complaint was battery life. To say it sucks is an understatement. About 2 hours IF Im lucky.This precipitated the acquisition of laptop 3. My company uses Dell. Ive always liked the Latitude series and the CSx series we use here, but are currently phasing them out, have a strong batt life. 3+ hours which is good. So I ended up getting a system off of e-bay for $300 that included a second battery and CD-RW/DVD drive. In addition that that I jacked the hard drive up to 40GB, jacked the RAM up to 384MB. All told it cost me about $500-$600 for this system. It has a 13.3 display and is only 1.14 thick and weights in a 4.3 pounds. The best thing about it is the silence. I know when an app is eating the CPU clocks on the thing because that is the ONLY time the fan switches on. (And that usually happens when an app is behaving badly. Thank god for W2Ks task manager. Whats even cooler, no pun intended is that its a variable rate fan. (High-Medium-Low) So even what the fan is on its relatively quiet. Right now Im in the market for a new laptop.
Doubtlessly some of you guys have seen my rants on the PowerBook. I love the design but every benchmark Ive seen a comparable Pentium M based system soundly kicks the snot out of even the high end 1.33Ghz CPU found in the 17 PowerBook. As Ive stated before I have no problems paying a premium for a PowerBook. After all its suppose to be the Porsche of the computer world right? But if Im going to pay that premium I expect it to thrash the competition or at least keep pace. This isnt about the size of my dick and needing the most powerful thing out there. Its about future proofing my devices as much as possible and getting the most bang for my buck. This is why Im in a holding pattern when it comes to getting a PowerBook. I want a G5 based PowerBook. I believe, hope?, that this will do to the PowerBooks what the G5 PowerMac did to the desktop line: Bring it in line with the competition. That and it will prepare the system for the day that Apple releases a 64-bit optimized version of OSX. It will happen. Its just a matter of time. Id rather be ready for that day then having to go out and plunk down more $$$$ on a new system. So for me its G5 or bust. Then and ONLY then will I consider switching. Or as I term it merging since I will continue to use my 13 Latitude in those situations where Im looking for something highly portable.
siliconaddict: If you can't wait for the G5 PB, get a T40 IBM. Fantastic machine, its only downside is its size, but its very light to make up for this. I love my powerbook, but the worst thing you can do is switch prematurely and be stuck with a foreign OS on a machine that doesn't meet your expectations.
My sister has a Toshiba laptop that my dad bought her for $1200. It has a 2.4 GHz P4, 512 megs RAM, a DVD/CD-RW combo drive, 60 gig HD, and I think an integrated Intel graphics card. Sure, it is cheaper than my PowerBook and has a faster processor, but it is also huge, heavy, sounds like a hair dryer, and gives off more heat than a space heater. Not to mention I personally think it is slow and she's had quite a few problems with Windows such as her video drivers becoming corrupt for no apparent reason, her sound sometimes stops working for no good reason, she's had 3 viruses since getting it in April, and as I mentioned, it sounds like a hair dryer.
I can run those games on my 675 p3 with a 5-year-old graphics card if i want. Try benchmarking the system on highest settings and see what happens. (I use 3dMark)
One of my friends purchased a Fujitsu P-5000 series laptop. Typical ultra-portable, its looks like computer wrapped arund an optical drive. Its way small 10.4" screen is too tiny, however, esp. at tis native 1280 x seomthing odd pixels. Needless tosay she has her fonts pumped up. Its also kinda fat - about 1.44" inches thick. Its mettalic plastic issomewhere between stylish and garish. I believe its a Centrino 1. something.
Its plenty snappy but but too anoying for a dedicated computer, i think. Also, being a bit of a style queen i think my PB 12" is has much cleaner lines and looks more sophisticated. I ahve to admit thought, the Centrino runs circles around my G4 867.
Its plenty snappy but but too anoying for a dedicated computer, i think. Also, being a bit of a style queen i think my PB 12" is has much cleaner lines and looks more sophisticated. I ahve to admit thought, the Centrino runs circles around my G4 867.