Performa 450, troubleshooting, mac noob

1slickvdc

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Aug 25, 2014
28
0
Evening y'all,

A while back someone gave me an old Performa 450, a complete system, including all the original literature, disks, a SCSI CD-ROM drive, a game pad, modem, (lost track of the printer), and a few extra bits of software and such.

I decided to go try it out today and it doesn't want to boot. I fired it up, but I see nothing in the display, and no status sounds or beeps, just the HDD spinning up. Floppy doesn't try to read or anything either.

Where's the first place to look in trying to get this thing firing up and booting?

Also, if I can find (or build) an adapter to get that to work on a VGA monitor, I could actually bring it home and try to get it working here instead of an hour away.

Aside from newer OS X systems, I'm pretty much a mac noob.

Any ideas?
 

havokalien

macrumors 6502a
Apr 27, 2006
646
46
Kelso, Wa
Should have done a search

Ok first capacitors, capacitors capacitors. In the peer supply and on the motherboard.

Have to remove them, clean the motherboard and check for rotten traces due to goo and put on new capacitors. That will cure 99 percent of issues.

second go to any auction site and look for a DB15 to Vga adapter (not for G3 only) and you can use VGA. Just make sure the monitor support 640 X 480.
 

bobnugget

macrumors 6502
Nov 15, 2006
256
42
England
Evening y'all,

A while back someone gave me an old Performa 450, a complete system, including all the original literature, disks, a SCSI CD-ROM drive, a game pad, modem, (lost track of the printer), and a few extra bits of software and such.

I decided to go try it out today and it doesn't want to boot. I fired it up, but I see nothing in the display, and no status sounds or beeps, just the HDD spinning up. Floppy doesn't try to read or anything either.

Where's the first place to look in trying to get this thing firing up and booting?

Also, if I can find (or build) an adapter to get that to work on a VGA monitor, I could actually bring it home and try to get it working here instead of an hour away.

Aside from newer OS X systems, I'm pretty much a mac noob.

Any ideas?
Hey, it could be the PRAM battery too - if this has run out of power the system will appear dead (as yours is) until it is replaced.
 

havokalien

macrumors 6502a
Apr 27, 2006
646
46
Kelso, Wa
pram

Pram will usually be bypassed with a double power on sequence.

But due to age and what I have seen while repairing and collecting is the performs and LC's need new capacitors. They are just aging. The cardboard at the bottom is not holding back the gel inside them and they are leaking and rotting traces.

Give the board a good wash (many opinions on this) and replace the caps. Also caps in the power supply are suspect.
 

1slickvdc

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Aug 25, 2014
28
0
I'll try the battery first, since I've heard from a couple places that can cause it to not finish powering on. Then I'll hit caps if that didn't work. DigiKey to the rescue...
 

mcdermd

macrumors regular
Mar 17, 2004
180
3
Capacitors, for sure. The longer you wait, the more damage the leaked electrolyte will do.
 

1slickvdc

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Aug 25, 2014
28
0
Yeah, I'll get there when I get back to the system. Anyone have a list of the values of the caps on the board? The PSU caps won't be as critical of value (in making it larger if that's what I've got), just DCV ratings.

I can order direct replacements and just desolder/resolder and repair any traces that run up.
 

PowerMac G4 MDD

macrumors 68000
Evening y'all,

A while back someone gave me an old Performa 450, a complete system, including all the original literature, disks, a SCSI CD-ROM drive, a game pad, modem, (lost track of the printer), and a few extra bits of software and such.

I decided to go try it out today and it doesn't want to boot. I fired it up, but I see nothing in the display, and no status sounds or beeps, just the HDD spinning up. Floppy doesn't try to read or anything either.

Where's the first place to look in trying to get this thing firing up and booting?

Also, if I can find (or build) an adapter to get that to work on a VGA monitor, I could actually bring it home and try to get it working here instead of an hour away.

Aside from newer OS X systems, I'm pretty much a mac noob.

Any ideas?

As another said, check the capacitors or PRAM battery and such. I got a Macintosh Classic II once and it turned out that it wouldn't boot because leaky-capacitor juice was all over the motherboard. No joke, you can stick the motherboards themselves (with RAM and batteries removed) in the dishwasher to free them of the gunk and fix them. The fix will be long term but obviously won't be permanent unless the caps are replaced. I washed mine in the sink with dish soap and scrubbed it with a tooth brush. That works fine too if you don't want to use a dishwasher. There could be another issue with your computer that is holding it back, but the only things I can think of are the caps and PRAM battery. Check those first. If it turns out that you have leaky caps, wash the motherboard and, if you like, replace the caps as well. The sink/dishwasher method fixed my Classic II right up! I have a video on the process. (EDIT: If it turns out that there are leaky caps within the power supply, I don't know whether or not this method would be okay for it. I only know that it works on the motherboard).
 

mcdermd

macrumors regular
Mar 17, 2004
180
3
I never like using the dishwasher as it will usually leave a nasty white residue all over every pin. Even when you don't use soap. I like to scrub under hot water with a toothbrush, then blast everything completely dry with an air compressor.
 

PowerMac G4 MDD

macrumors 68000
I never like using the dishwasher as it will usually leave a nasty white residue all over every pin. Even when you don't use soap. I like to scrub under hot water with a toothbrush, then blast everything completely dry with an air compressor.
Yeah, that is exactly what I did with my Classic II's motherboard. I washed it under the faucet, scrubbed it with a toothbrush and soap, and then dried it off with an air compressor. I wouldn't want a motherboard with lead and other materials being washed in the same dishwasher I use to clean the silverware and plates I eat with. I am sure it's alright, but it seems like it's not the best thing to be doing.
 

1slickvdc

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Aug 25, 2014
28
0
Okay guys, had a busy last few weeks, what with the break up and move out and all. Anyway, now that she's gone, I have some room so I brought the Mac down to my apartment. The power supply checks out within voltage tolerances. I'm going to order new caps, since it's $3.48 worth of parts. I'm ordering the same aluminum types they used in manufacture just because when I repair anything I try to get as close to OEM parts as possible. I'm also trained (not yet certified though :() to IPC 610 standards, so even though my equipment sucks, I'll try to get pictures of a proper removal and reinstall procedure for these caps. One link I saw showed someone cutting them apart and peeling them off. That can absolutely TRASH the traces or lift a land (pad) if you clip wrong.
 

1slickvdc

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Aug 25, 2014
28
0
I talked all that **** about lifting pads and what did I do? Lose three. Any tips on pad repair? They've not just lifted, they've gone.
 

havokalien

macrumors 6502a
Apr 27, 2006
646
46
Kelso, Wa
edge of trace

you can scrape off the edge of the trace, clean it, and solder a small dot on it that should be ok as a repair.
 

1slickvdc

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Aug 25, 2014
28
0
I've been having a tough time trying to get solder to stick to the trace. I picked up one of those conductive pens, I'll see if I can use that in some way to my advantage.
 

1slickvdc

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Aug 25, 2014
28
0
Got it going! Thanks for the help guys. I might end up in another thread trying to figure out System 7.5, but hey, we'll see.
 

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