Police Can't Force You to Unlock an iPhone Using Face ID or Touch ID, California Judge Rules

[bradl]

I don’t care. Give them 3 fake passwords until the phone got deleted automatically. No proof no crime dude because the right of the people 2 b secure in their papers and effects against unreasonable searches and seizures shall not be violated and no warrants shall issue you know what i mean? Ill b free in 5 minutes just like that

This wouldn't be a 4A problem. That is the problem with your post.

This would be a 5A issue, not 4A. They can easily get a warrant to search your phone. That would be easy to do.

The issue with this case is that forcing you to provide your fingerprint for TouchID, facial scan for FaceID, or your password is a violation of your 5A right to not incriminate yourself for the crime you are accused of committing.

You may want to bone up on this subject relative to the Constitution, because from the post above, you'd still be in jail after those 5 minutes.

BL.

 

[stylinexpat]

I wonder how much ground that will hold at airports in California.. Best to use passwords instead

 

[Ebok]

About time! I totally agree with this. It's an invasion of privacy.

police don't give a **** about regular citizens.

 

[bradl]

I wonder how much ground that will hold at airports in California.. Best to use passwords instead

If the flight is domestic, it will carry a lot of ground. If international, not so much, until they clear customs. However, the gray line starts to come in with various other factors (US citizen on a US-based carrier traveling internationally, non-US citizen on a US carrier, US citizen on a foreign carrier, etc. etc.).

BL.

 

[drumcat]

"funs afoul" [sic]

That typo made me think of a laughing chicken.
[doublepost=1547540288][/doublepost]Also, if they make it thick enough for USB-C, someone is all out of excuses for removing the 3.5mm audio port.

 

[dilbert99]

TouchID and passcodes I get, but in practical terms, how can you stop someone from holding your phone in front of you?

How do you force the eyes open but get the fingers opening them out of the way?

 

[Solomani]

It'll still happen.

This ruling is simply from a California court. It will not apply or be enforced to nationwide laws until the Federal courts or the Supreme Court has a say on it.

 

[Carnegie]

This ruling is simply from a California court. It will not apply or be enforced to nationwide laws until the Federal courts or the Supreme Court has a say on it.

This decision is from a federal district court in California. The way some people refer to federal district courts - e.g., as in the OP - can be misleading. We're talking about a California court in the sense that it's for a federal district that's in California (i.e. the Northern District of California), not in the sense that it's a state court.

That said, yes, a federal district court isn't binding on other courts - federal or state. This decision is binding on the parties involved only, though some argue that federal district court decisions establish precedent for the same federal district.
[doublepost=1547554602][/doublepost]

The basis of the denial was that the police wanted to unlock all the phones found at the residence, not just the phones belonging to two people in question ie: the request was too broad. Once the scope of the request was narrowed to the phones belonging to the people in question then the actual issue of whether biometric security is protected will be adjudicated.

This decision deals with both of those issues - whether the Fifth Amendment prevents the government from being able to compel people to use biometrics to decrypt a digital device, and whether the government had sufficient probable cause in this case to require anyone on the premises to decrypt the digital devices found there.

 

[31 Flavas]

TouchID and passcodes I get, but in practical terms, how can you stop someone from holding your phone in front of you?

You can’t. But evidence gathered by illegal means (i.e. illegal search and seizure) is inadmissble. “Fruit of a poisioned tree.”

 

[Number-Six]

"funs afoul" [sic]

That typo made me think of a laughing chicken.
[doublepost=1547540288][/doublepost]Also, if they make it thick enough for USB-C, someone is all out of excuses for removing the 3.5mm audio port.

I think you're beating a dead horse with this one. Correct me if i'm wrong, but Apple has never added back something they removed in the past.

 

[rotax]

For now, though, Apple has implemented a method to quickly and temporarily disable Touch ID and Face ID by pressing on the side button of recent iPhones five times in quick succession.

Happy to hear the news about this ruling. The faster way to lock touch and face ID is to press and hold the right button and a left button at the same time as if you would power off the device. At the power down screen with the Power Off Slider & Emergency SOS you can power down or just hit Cancel and biometrics will be disabled and you will have to enter the passcode to get back in.

 

[2010mini]

TouchID and passcodes I get, but in practical terms, how can you stop someone from holding your phone in front of you?

You can’t. But then all evidence gathered becomes inadmissible as it was obtained illegally.
[doublepost=1547559882][/doublepost]

According to the article, there were warrants for the data in your phone also.

DNA is not the same as passcodes. BTW they can get DNA from any number of things you discard every day.

 

[tridley68]

no matter what cop's will always still think they are above the law we have seen it time and time again.

 

[2010mini]

I don’t care. Give them 3 fake passwords until the phone got deleted automatically. No proof no crime dude because the right of the people 2 b secure in their papers and effects against unreasonable searches and seizures shall not be violated and no warrants shall issue you know what i mean? Ill b free in 5 minutes just like that

Unless you have iCloud backup turned on. That data will be handed over if a warrant is issued. Any communications data made from said device will also be handed over. Location data? Yup. Internet browsing data? That too.

There are lots of info that can be legally obtained without your phone being unlocked. What law enforcement really wants is back door to your encrypted data.

 

[Shivetya]

plus why do with a warrant or tech with what a hammer can do it seconds?

 

[cfurlin]

California did something that makes sense for a change.

Is today “anything can happen” day?

 

[C DM]

I think you're beating a dead horse with this one. Correct me if i'm wrong, but Apple has never added back something they removed in the past.

Not sure when it comes to hardware, but they have done it with software.

 

[C DM]

California did something that makes sense for a change.

Is today “anything can happen” day?

Just like many other days.

 

[fathergll]

iOS should have an option for a device wipe password. Give them a special 6 character wipe code and 'OOPS!'

 

[0924487]

TouchID and passcodes I get, but in practical terms, how can you stop someone from holding your phone in front of you?

FaceID requires attention, don’t look at the phone or close your eyes.

It will lock out after 8 hours without biometric unlock, or 5 unsuccessful biometric unlocks.

 

[Doomtomb]

This is protected under the Fifth Amendment

 

[Mousse]

Interesting ruling. This is on the fringe though and I expect it to be overturned.

Overturned? No way in hell should it be overturned. Hail, this should never had been taken to Court in the first place. Forcing someone to unlocked their phone is a violation of the 4th Amendment.

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

This is protected under the Fifth Amendment

Yeah, that one too. IF there is incriminating evidence on their phone.

 

[NachoGrande]

According to the article, there were warrants for the data in your phone also.

If there is a warrant that have the right to it? It's no different than going through your house.

 

[VictorTango777]

Face ID should have a "self destruct" mode where you can register a custom facial expression that causes a countdown timer to appear, and the phone to erase itself unless the password is entered before the timer expires.

 

[barmann]

Here is what I don't understand - if there is a proper search warrant, approved by a judge, why would the locking tech of a phone or computer make any difference ?