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Due to their lower speed, I guess they'll be rulled out of the running for iMacs. But if they're cool enough for the miini enclosure and the ram they want isn't too expensive, then maybe a super mini could evolve with them next year after their price goes down.

Bring on the Mac Pro 8 Cores Apple!
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50W TDP is right around where an iMac can handle. Even so it's hot in there with 31-35W mobile chips.

I don't see a reason that clock speed numbers and the consumer's perception would prevent it from being in the iMac. The price per chip might for now. Then again I doubt Apple wants to redesign the internals of the iMac. It's devolving into a Conroe Vs. Merom discussion again.

Once a prosumer machine ($1,000-1,500) has a quad core standard the iMac will too. I don't count workstations from Dell either.

This is starting to look like a hiccup in Moore's law or is that officially dead?
That would be transistor count which is still going up.
 
Computers don't run just one program. They run an OS that manages many of them. Updating the screen, reading data from the Internet and flushing data to disks, streaming data to the new Apple TV. All this goes on at once. The OS manages it well.

Also, applications that follows Apple's guidlines call a set of core services for do things with audio, video or to do a search or just about anyhting. These core services are written to take advantage of the hardware. Software not taking advantage of multiple processors is a myth. You can see for yourself just by watching Activity Monitor

There have been computers with multiple core now for what? 35 years? Maybe longer. They have been common for maybe 20 years and just now becoming common on consumer desktop systems. The software and theory on how to use mutliple processers is quite mature, Mac OS is really just BSD UNIX and BSD has been handling multiple processors for decades.

I remember using a BSD derived system that have two CPUs and right next to my big 20" CRT was my little "512K Mac" The Mac didn't even have a hard drive, just a floppy and a half megabyte of RAM. So I hade one system that was very much like Mac OS X for "real work" and the Mac for word processing and diagrams. I though even then that some one should mix these two systems together. Finally someonme at Next Inc. did. Point is that the software to use these multi-cores is quite mature.

You're right. However, many programs and even the core services can make better use of multiple cores. I'll admit, I'm no expert on how well software works, so forgive me if this is a stupid question: why are there single and multi-threaded apps? If core services can do use all the cores efficiently, why the difference?

Just remember, the average consumer doesn't use BSD but rather Windows and Macintosh. Most consumer computers that run those OSes haven't had multiple cores for years. Maybe 3-4 at most. While multiple cores do help speed up when you use multiple apps, when using a single app that's single-threaded, I don't see core services breaking it into different parts for each core.
 
You're right. However, many programs and even the core services can make better use of multiple cores. I'll admit, I'm no expert on how well software works, so forgive me if this is a stupid question: why are there single and multi-threaded apps? If core services can do use all the cores efficiently, why the difference?
A single threaded application will benefit from multiple cores when multitasking. That is it'll only benefit from one core leaving the others free for other applications. It'll hit 100% on that core and stay there.

A multi-thread application will have multiple threads of its parent process that are distributed across multiple cores. Effectively giving you more then the 100% CPU time that you had with the single threaded application. Now one thing that arises from that is the thread queue so that your distributed job data is outputted properly.
 
A single threaded application will benefit from multiple cores when multitasking. That is it'll only benefit from one core leaving the others free for other applications. It'll hit 100% on that core and stay there.

A multi-thread application will have multiple threads of its parent process that are distributed across multiple cores. Effectively giving you more then the 100% CPU time that you had with the single threaded application. Now one thing that arises from that is the thread queue so that your distributed job data is outputted properly.

That's what I meant.
 
With all these new anouncements of upcoming hardware, I don't know when I'll be getting a new computer.:confused:

I hope these processors go in the iMac line. It would be great to see some real power go back into those machines.
 
Phooey! Give us some real horsepower. I don't give a rats behind about power consumption in a desktop. I want speed.;)

I have owend a Quad core Powermac for over a year and while it kicks butt, most applications don't use more than 1 core. True, you can multitask like there is no tomorrow but there are many times I wish I had just plain more megahertz speed!
Most of Photoshop utilizes all cores, Aperture sorta does, but hammers on your graphics card, Final cut and Compressor are good at spreading the load.
I do think that most people think there is a greater day to day speed increase with a Quad than their actually is .
 
With all these new anouncements of upcoming hardware, I don't know when I'll be getting a new computer.:confused:

I hope these processors go in the iMac line. It would be great to see some real power go back into those machines.

you took the words out of my head...
:confused: :confused:
 
I have a G5 quad 2.5 and as I always thought and said... it is so... slow specially when I was playing the other week with one of the new 15" Mac Book Pro. It was faster than my G5.

I hope intel realease chips twice a year only, they are coming with a new chip every other week and is frustrating as a costumer to feel that my so expensive Mac Book is already discontinued.

We don't need to know about the costumes you wear. ;)

Intel releasing new chips all the time is nothing new, they have done this for ages. Would you rather have IBM or Freescale providing the chips? Then you will be lucky is you see an update every year!

I think this new processor from Intel was designed to compete with this from Sun:: http://www.sun.com/processors/UltraSPARC-T1/ But even with Intel's new chip Sun is still winning the the low power race

Sorry, but the Niagara series of processors from Sun are aimed at a different market. These are designed for high threads count situations and not per thread performance. An example would be web servers. Intel has nothing that can compete with the Niagara. It has encryption built-in so SSL can be done with virtually no penalty. No need for an offload card, this is done on the CPU. FP performance though is horrible, as the Niagara comes in 4, 6 and 8 cores, but only has one FP unit for all of the cores. Niagara2 will fix that issue and will have one FP unit for each core, more encryption schemes, more threads per core (from 4 to 8), higher clock speed and built-in 10-Gig-E x 2 and two-way support. It will still have four built-in memory controllers as does the current chip. Expect to see it in the next few months.

These processors are quite slow such that the performance per watt isn't really there for most things. If you benchmark it for databases and other apps that can exercise all 32 threads/8 cores you will find that a conventional 2x2 Intel or AMD rig will run rings around it such that it is not obvious why you would want to use it. Even when running 100 threads the Intel and AMD cores are capable of getting a lot more work done faster with no hardware thread support.

It's slow in some aspects and in other aspects it makes the Intel and AMD offerings look slow.
http://blogs.zdnet.com/Murphy/?p=524
“So if we blandly assume that the Xeon results would scale linearly, this suggests that it would take somewhat more than eight 3.2Ghz Intel Xeons to match one UltraSPARC T1 at 1.2Ghz. Similarly, it would take roughly four IBM Power5+ dual core machines.

So why is this interesting? For two reasons: first because that 2:1 ratio for Xeon to PPC crops up a lot in other benchmark results, and secondly because this illustrates the utter dominance of the "slow" CMT approach over higher megahertz on multi-threaded tasks.”

This is not the only benchmark (real world or otherwise) that shows this.
http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=2657&p=4

Yep, these processors are quite slow. If you look at open databases, then this chip shows poor performance as the database is not tuned for the chip. Use another database and this chip does much better, and if the database is licensed per socket, this is a great chip.

http://www.opensparc.net/blogs/2006-03/colm-maccarthaigh-niagara-vs-ftp.heanet.ie-showdown.html

They're ruled out because there is no such thing as a single socket Xeon solution anymore.

Really, look here:
http://h10010.www1.hp.com/wwpc/us/en/ss/WF06a/15351-15351-3328412-241644-241475-3201178.html

Just because the chip support it, doesn't mean it has to be used.

As for the power the current Xeon's in the Mac Pro, here you go:
http://www.intel.com/cd/channel/res...ucts/server/processors/5100/feature/index.htm
 
a rose by whatever name Intel wants to use...

The 3000 series is the Core 2 series with ecc support.

ECC support is in the chipset - a Core 2 Duo (Conroe) in a 975 motherboard supports ECC.

The truth is, a "Xeon" is any chip that Intel wants to call a "Xeon".

There are far more similarities among the Merom/Conroe/Woodcrest chips than differences.

If Intel wants to put qualify and test a Conroe for server applications, put it in a server mobo, and call it a "Xeon" - then that's a single socket Xeon in my book.

This has been going on for years. The first Pentium 4 Extreme chips were Xeons in a Pentium 4 carrier.
 
There is very little overall difference between mobile/desktop/server when it comes to Core 2. It's the SAME chip but it has been rated for different environments and pin configurations.
 
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