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PowerBook G4 17" High Res Upgrade
- Thread starter benwild_33
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You have NO idea!
If you've got any insight into the DLSD thermal plan (or ways to control it) that'd be appreciated
in terms of monitoring thermals (as well as fan speed and cpu voltage) on a DLSD, you can use iStat menus to do so
in terms of controlling thermals, G4FanControl should work with a DLSD (however I have not tested it personally) since I have found the stock fan profile in OS X to be very good for keeping thermals and noise in check on my 15 and 17 inch DLSDs
I suspect one of the main reasons the DLSD does not have the normal power (saving) options is due to the fact if you look at the DLSD schematics it was very clear that they where very much going to do a 7448 build but for whatever reason this got pulled at the 11th hour and they only gave us a 7447B, the DLSD schematics reference the 7448 in a few places and contain information on what to stuff if your fitting a 7447B or a 7448 to the board, so it seems like they may of been planning to offer both CPUs.. granted wether or not they where going to offer both cpus is purely speculation.
The reason this would affect the Power options is, the 7448 supports divide by 4 DFS (dynamic frequency switching) you can see mention of this in the Apple dev PDF for the DLSD they mention the DLSD supports the divide by 4 DFS feature of the 7448, but the 7447B only supports divide by 2 which is the CPU used in the production DLSD and as such the DLSD only supports divide by 2. id not be surprised if the tweaks needed to support the divide by 4 of the 7448 are still part of the DLSD, hence why the power settings are different despite using the same 7447B that for example my Mac Mini G4 has.
(divide by 2 and 4 DFS means, taking the main frequency and dividing it by 2 or 4 on the fly, so for example 1.67Ghz you get 833Mhz and 416Mhz respectively. The 7447B can only divide by 2 so can only step down to 833Mhz, where as the 7448 can divide by 2 AND 4 so can step down to 833 and 416)
ill say it really seems like they pulled the 7448 option at the last moment (and hence why im quite interested to see what would happen if you swapped a 7448 into a DLSD, but thats easier said then done, plus I still need to do a 7410 clamshell I really gotta get off my behind and order some more "goot" wick)
I hope this helps demystify some of the stuff surrounding the DLSD
in terms of controlling thermals, G4FanControl should work with a DLSD (however I have not tested it personally) since I have found the stock fan profile in OS X to be very good for keeping thermals and noise in check on my 15 and 17 inch DLSDs
I suspect one of the main reasons the DLSD does not have the normal power (saving) options is due to the fact if you look at the DLSD schematics it was very clear that they where very much going to do a 7448 build but for whatever reason this got pulled at the 11th hour and they only gave us a 7447B, the DLSD schematics reference the 7448 in a few places and contain information on what to stuff if your fitting a 7447B or a 7448 to the board, so it seems like they may of been planning to offer both CPUs.. granted wether or not they where going to offer both cpus is purely speculation.
The reason this would affect the Power options is, the 7448 supports divide by 4 DFS (dynamic frequency switching) you can see mention of this in the Apple dev PDF for the DLSD they mention the DLSD supports the divide by 4 DFS feature of the 7448, but the 7447B only supports divide by 2 which is the CPU used in the production DLSD and as such the DLSD only supports divide by 2. id not be surprised if the tweaks needed to support the divide by 4 of the 7448 are still part of the DLSD, hence why the power settings are different despite using the same 7447B that for example my Mac Mini G4 has.
(divide by 2 and 4 DFS means, taking the main frequency and dividing it by 2 or 4 on the fly, so for example 1.67Ghz you get 833Mhz and 416Mhz respectively. The 7447B can only divide by 2 so can only step down to 833Mhz, where as the 7448 can divide by 2 AND 4 so can step down to 833 and 416)
ill say it really seems like they pulled the 7448 option at the last moment (and hence why im quite interested to see what would happen if you swapped a 7448 into a DLSD, but thats easier said then done, plus I still need to do a 7410 clamshell
I really gotta get off my behind and order some more "goot" wick)I hope this helps demystify some of the stuff surrounding the DLSD
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Sorry, by thermal plan I mean solely CPU speed - not worried about the cooling.
So, would I be able to deduce the speed by the CPU voltage in iStat menus? I don't use iStat simply because it uses a few CPU% itself and I'm OCD about that
The divide by 2 DFS makes logical sense - however it doesn't tally with my recent video clip test between books - the DLSD should have played that clip with less CPU than the 1.33 books.
It's not a biggy - but the DLSD remains a bit mysterious to me - it performs unlike any other Powerbook I've had, I think it's maybe just a perfect marriage of 7200RPM drive, great GPU and a Leopard install that '"fits"
you can indirectly use iStat menus to monitor CPU Speed, while you cant view Mhz directly you can view the Core voltage and watch it step between 0.93V (833Mhz) and 1.28V (1.67Ghz) so you can use that to tell what your DLSD is doing. I have noticed a bug with iStatmenus that results in SystemUIServer using up all of the CPU on boot up, killing the process and letting it relaunch solves this issue for that boot.
whats this video clip? are you saying playing the clip the DLSD was using more CPU then the iBook G4 playing the exact same clip?
whats this video clip? are you saying playing the clip the DLSD was using more CPU then the iBook G4 playing the exact same clip?
is everything between the iBook and DLSD identical software wise? (for example was the video window the same size? and also are you using a 45W or 65W charger with the DLSD?)
theres a number of things that could cause the DLSD to use more CPU...
theres a number of things that could cause the DLSD to use more CPU...
The clip was played in Coreplayer with identical settings, power (when used) was 65W, the only difference was Leopard on the DLSD - guess that could be it, which is disappointing for Leopard.
Sounds likely to be the "Leopard Overhead". Can you try the experiment with Tiger on the DLSD?
Not without reinstalling or dual boot. Nevermind, it's not an issue, the DLSD peforms real well - just wish I could know/control the processor speed.
I've a 1.5Ghz 12" Powerbook on the way....that'll keep me diverted
What kind of PRAM battery do these take? My one is completely dead and I think this may be what causes it to act oddly when the battery runs out (will not resume from sleep until I remove the battery to reset it). I've worked out my main battery may only have 64 cycles but being sat plugged in its whole life has meant it has become out of calibration. It cuts off around 60%!
Deep joy. More opening up of the tin can. The guide below actually links to listings on eBay from the PowerBook Medic. I have bought from him before and he has a website if you want to avoid the middleman. Alternative for PB parts would be PCHub.com based in Singapore. Good for really old PowerBooks.
Other sellers on eBay are available.
https://www.ifixit.com/Guide/PowerB...+GHz+PRAM+Battery+&+USB+Board+Replacement/249
I just came across a shell script called TP for outputting temp and voltage data (using ioreg).
http://hints.macworld.com/article.php?story=20051021115356696
The script disappeared from the links in the article / post, but I found it on archive.org
Here it is anyway;
Copy/Paste into a new text file, save as tp (or tp.sh if you prefer), then chmod a+x tp to make it executable.
Install at /usr/local/bin with sudo cp tp /usr/local/bin/ - you may need to create this path with mkdir -p /usr/local/bin first in Tiger.
Usage: tp -h for help
tp voltage (or tp power) shows just voltage/power output.
tp gpu shows GPU temp readings
The script states that it doesn't work on newer PowerBooks, so I guess that must be the DLSD(?). But otherwise, this is the poor man's iStat Menu
EDIT: I should have said; it states that it DOES work on the newer PowerBooks.
http://hints.macworld.com/article.php?story=20051021115356696
The script disappeared from the links in the article / post, but I found it on archive.org
Here it is anyway;
Code:
#!/bin/bash
#
# TP Probe v.0.2 alpha
# by 31d1 2005 djbidi@gmail.com
#
# displays (somewhat accurate) hardware sensor readouts on some current macs.
#
# seems to work on new Powerbooks, ibooks, and PowerMacs
# does NOT seems to work on G4 Powermacs, or G4 Titanium Powerbooks
# help
if [ "$1" == "-h" ]
then
basename=`echo $0 | sed 's/.*\///'`
echo "usage: $basename [option|regex]"
echo " regex - display only matching lines"
echo " -h - display this message"
exit
fi
# get data
sensors=`ioreg -n IOHWSensor | awk '/location/ || /current-value/ || /"type"/' | sed -e 's/[^"]*"//' -e 's/" =//' -e 's/location//' -e 's/type//' -e 's/"//g' | awk '{ if ((NR % 3) == 0) print $0; else printf $0 " " }'`
# temperatures require strange manipulation
temps=`echo "$sensors" | grep 'temperature' | awk '{ for(i=1;i<5;i++) if ($i=="current-value") $(i+1)=((( (($(i+1) / 2^13) - ($(i+1) / 2^13) % 1 ) / 2^3) - .5)" C\t"); print $0 }' | sed -e 's/current-value //' -e 's/temperature//'`
# the rest merely need to be divided by 2^16
therest=`echo "$sensors" | grep -v 'temperature' | awk '{ for(i=1;i<5;i++) if ($i=="current-value") $(i+1)=(substr((($(i+1)/2^16)"\t"),1,8)); print $0 }' | sed -e 's/current-value //'`
# optionally display Machine Name and Type
if [ "$1" == "-l" ]
then
system_profiler SPHardwareDataType | awk '/Machine Name/ || /Machine Model/ || /CPU Type/' | sed 's/[^:]*: //' | awk '{printf $0 " " }'
machine
echo -e "\n$temps\n$therest"
exit
fi
# grep for $1 or display all
if [ "$1" ]
then
echo -e "$temps\n$therest" | grep "$*"
else
echo -e "$temps\n$therest"
fiInstall at /usr/local/bin with sudo cp tp /usr/local/bin/ - you may need to create this path with mkdir -p /usr/local/bin first in Tiger.
Usage: tp -h for help
tp voltage (or tp power) shows just voltage/power output.
tp gpu shows GPU temp readings
The script states that it doesn't work on newer PowerBooks, so I guess that must be the DLSD(?). But otherwise, this is the poor man's iStat Menu
EDIT: I should have said; it states that it DOES work on the newer PowerBooks.
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Also, the script works well with Geektool. Set the refresh time to 5 seconds or so and you've got a near zero CPU-usage temp / voltage monitor displaying on your desktop.
Minor edit for Leopard to show the correct Hardware details when running tp -l
Change the line that reads:
To:
You can then use tp -l to also show the hardware details above the probe readings. (See attached screenshot).
Minor edit for Leopard to show the correct Hardware details when running tp -l
Change the line that reads:
Code:
system_profiler SPHardwareDataType | awk '/Machine Name/ || /Machine Model/ || /CPU Type/' | sed 's/[^:]*: //' | awk '{printf $0 " " }'
Code:
system_profiler SPHardwareDataType | awk '/Model Name/ || /Model Identifier/ || /Processor Name/ || /Processor Speed/' | sed 's/[^:]*: //' | awk '{printf $0 " " }'You can then use tp -l to also show the hardware details above the probe readings. (See attached screenshot).
Yep, definitly works on my DLSD - reports two voltage readings depending on load, so essentially similar to automatic setting on other PowerPC.
I added 2GB Ram today, it was only £5 for a matching pair of Kingston PC2700U. Ordered it on ebay from China hence why it has only just got here.
I did notice one of my Ram slots has a sticker that says "New CPU", do all Powerbooks have this? I'm wondering if my one has perhaps been repaired in the past.
Got an MSata adaptor on the way from China too, I've got a 256GB Samsung PM851 MSata SSD to go in, I'm thinking I'll run Leopard and the original Panther install in a dual boot configuration as theres a game I want to play that won't run in properly in Tiger.
I did notice one of my Ram slots has a sticker that says "New CPU", do all Powerbooks have this? I'm wondering if my one has perhaps been repaired in the past.
Got an MSata adaptor on the way from China too, I've got a 256GB Samsung PM851 MSata SSD to go in, I'm thinking I'll run Leopard and the original Panther install in a dual boot configuration as theres a game I want to play that won't run in properly in Tiger.
With 256GB, you might as well span all three of your supported OS choices; Panther (min 10.3.7), Tiger and Leopard.
My typical partitioning for this is something like:
6GB - Panther
10GB - Tiger
(The rest) - Leopard
This depends on your usage of course, but I feel these are good minimum partition sizes to fit all the system, developer and common apps. For example, it can be difficult to find enough old Panther supported apps to fill up a 20GB partition, unless you install Final Cut Studio HD!
I haven't benchmarked it or anything, but it feels like Classic runs better under Tiger than Panther. This might not apply across all games, etc. But it's just an observation and because of this, I tend to keep a lightweight 9.2.2 System Folder and Applications (Mac OS 9) folder on my Tiger partition only.
The new cpu sticker is actually on the ram slot, It is a very tight fot getting the ram sticks in but my old ones were a similar size.
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I may consider a triple boot as I do like tiger.
very cool!
its good to know that it works OOB
This is definitely a question I have on my mind this day, as I was tipped to a used A1139 showing up for sale locally with the caveat that the boot-up gives hard kernel panics. What I've seen of those panics indicate provisionally that someone attempted to run Panther by adding a drive with that build already on it.
I won't know until I see it whether I'll buy it, but if I do, the feasibility of a 1920x1200 upgrade is foremost on my mind.
I figure if anyone here knows, it's @LightBulbFun.
If anyone is interested: I made a similar thread: https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/looking-for-17-powerbook-g4-compatible-panels.2317428/
Long story short: Panel upgrades are definitely possible, a 1680x1050 panel from a Sony Vaio worked for example without problems in my 17" PowerBook G4 1.5 GHz (more details in my thread).
Today I ordered an LP171WU1(TL)(B2) because I found one cheap locally in good condition. This panel has a resolution of 1920x1200 and was used in some later MacBook Pro 17" models. The one I'll get in particular came from another laptop brand but that shouldn't matter. The display connection is LVDS 30pin and the backlight is CCFL so in theory it could work with a PowerBook G4 17". Once the panel has arrived, I'll test it with my 17" PowerBook G4 1.5 GHz and it would be nuts if it actually works since this would make the LCD considerably better than those of the last 17" DLSD PowerBook G4s. What do you guys think? I honestly think it would work and I'm already excited about testing it.
Long story short: Panel upgrades are definitely possible, a 1680x1050 panel from a Sony Vaio worked for example without problems in my 17" PowerBook G4 1.5 GHz (more details in my thread).
Today I ordered an LP171WU1(TL)(B2) because I found one cheap locally in good condition. This panel has a resolution of 1920x1200 and was used in some later MacBook Pro 17" models. The one I'll get in particular came from another laptop brand but that shouldn't matter. The display connection is LVDS 30pin and the backlight is CCFL so in theory it could work with a PowerBook G4 17". Once the panel has arrived, I'll test it with my 17" PowerBook G4 1.5 GHz and it would be nuts if it actually works since this would make the LCD considerably better than those of the last 17" DLSD PowerBook G4s. What do you guys think? I honestly think it would work and I'm already excited about testing it.
Go for it. A display’s resolution can’t ever be too high. I sincerely hope it'll work.
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