Powerbook G5 Power consumption

[Sun Baked]

Why bother... the sock puppet should be burned. Long live the muppets.

What's the point of comparing the two next generation chips? When people want to compare a chip that'll be introduced in August/September with one that'll be a generation older/hotter/more expensive.

Because it makes better press, and it's easier for them to prove their point.

Imagine the screams of bloody murder if Apple's SPEC test tested a September 2003 computer with a January 2003 PC.

Why bother using the 7457 as the comparison for a September 2003 G5? When the sock puppet wants to use the January's 7455.

Hey if you use the first generation 7457 as your benchmark, it'll use as much power as the 7455 Rev. 3.3

If you compare the latest 7457 vs. the 970 -- one is going to be cooler, one will cost less, and one requires little engineering dollars.

And of couse people aren't complaining about the heat of the current machines.

Use the 2GHz G5 and we probably wouldn't need a lighter to torch the sock puppet.

Yay muppets...

 

[Pete_Hoover]

I'm thinking they won't be out for atleast 8 months.

 

[dongmin]

Current G4:

7455-L (rev 3.3): 15.0 watts at 1.0 ghz
7457-N: 7.5 watts at 1.0 ghz
7457-L: 16.6 watts at 1.3 ghz

from a Moto document


IBM 970:

970 (1.1v): 19 watts at 1.2 ghz
970 (1.3v): 43 watts at 1.8 ghz

from an IBM document


I wish I had some sort of script written so that I don't have to type this up everytime someone rants about how the 970 runs cooler than a G4 and how there is this Apple conspiracy to withold fast computers from a wanting public. What rubbish! Oh, by the way, I think IBM's original estimates are lower than the current shipping G5s. I can't find the link but I think it's something like 20W for 1 ghz 970.

 

[shadowfax]

Originally posted by dongmin
Current G4:

7455-L (rev 3.3): 15.0 watts at 1.0 ghz
7457-N: 7.5 watts at 1.0 ghz
7457-L: 16.6 watts at 1.3 ghz

from a Moto document


IBM 970:

970 (1.1v): 19 watts at 1.2 ghz
970 (1.3v): 43 watts at 1.8 ghz

from an IBM document


I wish I had some sort of script written so that I don't have to type this up everytime someone rants about how the 970 runs cooler than a G4 and how there is this Apple conspiracy to withold fast computers from a wanting public. What rubbish! Oh, by the way, I think IBM's original estimates are lower than the current shipping G5s. I can't find the link but I think it's something like 20W for 1 ghz 970.

what's your point? that the G5 is not going into laptops soon, or that 20 W is low enough for a laptop. i really think 20 W at 1 GHz is outrageous, personally. i would like to see apple and IBM make a joint effort at a Centrino-esque processor. something small, with superfly altivec and power management features on the core.

 

[praetorian_x]

Originally posted by dongmin
Current G4:

7455-L (rev 3.3): 15.0 watts at 1.0 ghz
7457-N: 7.5 watts at 1.0 ghz
7457-L: 16.6 watts at 1.3 ghz

from a Moto document


IBM 970:

970 (1.1v): 19 watts at 1.2 ghz
970 (1.3v): 43 watts at 1.8 ghz

from an IBM document


I wish I had some sort of script written so that I don't have to type this up everytime someone rants about how the 970 runs cooler than a G4 and how there is this Apple conspiracy to withold fast computers from a wanting public. What rubbish! Oh, by the way, I think IBM's original estimates are lower than the current shipping G5s. I can't find the link but I think it's something like 20W for 1 ghz 970.

Fair enough. Finally, some documentation. Were rev 3.3 chips released last year when the powerbook went 1 ghz? That would tell us if the current form factor could handle that sort of heat output. The 7457 numbers are meaningless, since they aren't out right now.

I'd be interested in any information that current 970s are running hotter than originally planned.

I should note, my claim is not that apple is intentionally witholding products, my claim is merely that, given what I had previously seen published, *heat* was not the reason. Could be chip-set issues. Could be case redesign. I don't think apple will hold back better laptops a second longer than is necessary.

Cheers,
prat

 

[dongmin]

Originally posted by Shadowfax
what's your point? that the G5 is not going into laptops soon, or that 20 W is low enough for a laptop. i really think 20 W at 1 GHz is outrageous, personally. i would like to see apple and IBM make a joint effort at a Centrino-esque processor. something small, with superfly altivec and power management features on the core.

My point is actually quite modest: simply that the current G4 runs cooler than a 970. Whether such and such processor at such and such power levels can go into a laptop is a whole another question that I'm not qualified to answer. I would assume, however, that if current PowerBooks only do 4-4.5 hours of battery life on current power levels, Apple will not put in a more power-hungry processor UNLESS they found other ways to compensate for it, like a bigger-capacity battery or better power management.

As far as a Centrino-type processor, the G4 7457 should do quite well in balancing performance and power consumption. And the rumored .09-process 970s should also do quite well. Assuming that the G4 is more or less at the end of its development path, it's safe to say that Apple and IBM are working on a power-efficient chip whether this be a G5 derivative or G3 derivative. Apple NEEDS these lite chips to go into their small-form-factor machines, i.e. the iMacs, laptops, and Cubes.

 

[shadowfax]

Originally posted by dongmin
My point is actually quite modest: simply that the current G4 runs cooler than a 970. Whether such and such processor at such and such power levels can go into a laptop is a whole another question that I'm not qualified to answer. I would assume, however, that if current PowerBooks only do 4-4.5 hours of battery life on current power levels, Apple will not put in a more power-hungry processor UNLESS they found other ways to compensate for it, like a bigger-capacity battery or better power management.

As far as a Centrino-type processor, the G4 7457 should do quite well in balancing performance and power consumption. And the rumored .09-process 970s should also do quite well. Assuming that the G4 is more or less at the end of its development path, it's safe to say that Apple and IBM are working on a power-efficient chip whether this be a G5 derivative or G3 derivative. Apple NEEDS these lite chips to go into their small-form-factor machines, i.e. the iMacs, laptops, and Cubes.

ah, gotcha. a .09 µ 970 would be good for a laptop, but would need to be clocked pretty high and have powersaving technology on the core to be competitive with the chip in those centrino laptops.

 

[primalman]

Originally posted by bwawn
People, the 970 is not going to be available in mass amounts until Q3 this year. That has been established for about a year now. Q3 is when the PowerMac G5 is shipping. This is no coincidence.

...PowerBook G5s at WWDC would have resulted in another two to three month wait on the new systems due to the lack of 970 chips until Q3, and the current systems are already selling well...

...it's just a matter of waiting until the 970 is in mass production and easy to acquire for both PowerMacs and PowerBooks.

It is Q3 buddy. If they are talking calendar year, Q3 started July 1. If they are, talking fiscal year, depending on their books, Q 3 may have started in May.

Either way, 970 is in mass production, and no doubt shipping to the major client.

 

[jbomber]

Originally posted by primalman
It is Q3 buddy. If they are talking calendar year, Q3 started July 1. If they are, talking fiscal year, depending on their books, Q 3 may have started in May.

Either way, 970 is in mass production, and no doubt shipping to the major client.

Correct me if i'm wrong, but won't all those chips be immediately earmarked for desktops? won't it be atleast another 6-12 months (from now) before those chips see the inside of a prosumer portable?

1- apple wouldn't want to steal the thunder of their brand new desktops by introducing a line of laptops sporting their new chip.

2- all the motorola chips have to go somewhere. might as well bump the laptop line up a bit and push those until the 970 is ready.

3- they gotta give us something to wait for.