PowerMac Liquid Cooling

Discussion in 'PowerPC Macs' started by PowerMac G5, Jun 3, 2016.

  1. PowerMac G5 macrumors newbie

    PowerMac G5

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    #1
    Looking to buy a PowerMac G5 used, looking at the insides of the machine it looks like it might be a liquid cooled one, and I don't really want to deal with what that might hold in the future. Looking at the pics attached do you guys think this is a liquid cooled ?
    $_20 (2).JPG $_20 (1).JPG $_20.JPG one?
     
  2. oi!, Jun 3, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2016

    oi! Suspended

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    #2
    Can't tell, need to take off the CPU shield/cover. All I can tell from this is that it's a dual processor model.
    (there's some plastic press in rivet like things, remove them carefully and patiently or the cover may get bent, it bends quite easily and is surprisingly difficult to get back into shape)

    Do you know what spec it is?
    AGP + PCI
    AGP + PCIX
    PCIe
    Dual 1.8
    Dual 2.0
    Dual 2.3
    Dual 2.5
    Dual 2.7
    Quad 2.5

    I don't think there was a dual 1.6Ghz processor model, but I could be wrong.
     
  3. Dronecatcher macrumors 68000

    Dronecatcher

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    #3
    If you can get a close up photo of the ID strip along the bottom you will get your answer.
     
  4. PowerMac G5 thread starter macrumors newbie

    PowerMac G5

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    #4
    Trying to get the serial number but I don't think he really knows what he is talking about, the only info he has given me is "A1047 emc 1969c"
     
  5. MacCubed macrumors 68000

    MacCubed

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    #5
    Ok, so far you can knock off the Quad and Dual 2.7. The Quad has a different "G5" panel, and the Dual 2.7GHz uses a Radeon 9650 graphics card, which uses Dual DVI, whereas the one in the photo you posted uses a card with DVI+ADC. Thus leaving the Dual 2.5GHz as the only water-cooled G5 that this can be.
     
  6. oi! Suspended

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    #6
    I suspect the clue is in the "Looking to buy a PowerMac G5 used". Is hes looking at an online sale, eBay, Craiglist, what ever?
    I had a very quick look round the Australian eBay, didn't spot it, but then it was only a very quick look.


    True, but people sometimes change cards (and other bits) for a variety of reasons.
    I still think the only way to be 100% sure beyond doubt, is to physically take a look.
    Even the spec is not 100% absolutely guaranteed, it is possible to swap a leaky LCU for air cooling (not advisable, but since when did that ever stop some people) also, it's not impossible to fit an LCU to a machine that didn't come with one originally (if you lived in the hotter parts of Australia, you might well consider it on, say, a dual 2.3Ghz. Less likely to on a single processor 1.6Ghz, but it's not impossible!)
     
  7. parendox macrumors newbie

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    #7
    It's either a 1.8DP, a 2.0DP, or a 2.5DP with liquid cooling. There are two ways you can tell (one isn't foolproof). Find out what the graphics card is; if it's a Radeon 9600 XT it's the liquid cooled 2.5DP, if it's a GeForce 5200 FX Ultra then it's one of the other two. But the card might have been updated or changed as oi! states, hence why this isn't foolproof, though on the other hand the Radeon was a better card than the GeForce and I'd say it's highly unlikely someone would downgrade their card - so if the machine has a GeForce in it then you can probably bet it isn't the 2.5DP liquid cooled model because that came with the Radeon in it.

    The only other way at this point that is foolproof is to get the guy to tell you what the serial number is (located on the base, along with the model and emc numbers I believe). Put that into one of the websites on the net that deal with Mac serial numbers and you can get exact model information.
     
  8. oi! Suspended

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  9. parendox macrumors newbie

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    #9
    Perhaps also read and understand mine before you get your nose bent out of shape.
     
  10. bunnspecial, Jun 4, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2016

    bunnspecial macrumors 603

    bunnspecial

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    #10
    Just get the specs on it.

    With the "bent" cover, it is a PCIx model and not PCIe.

    If it's 2.5 or 2.7ghz, it's liquid cooled. If it's not one of those two, it's not liquid cooled.

    No need to complicate things...

    BTW, I wouldn't put too much reliance on the GPU ports. The 2.7 was available BTO with an ADC card.
     
  11. oi! Suspended

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    #11
    [Calm And Relaxed Voice]
    Don't worry, my nose isn't bent out of shape, and I hope not to get you your nose bent out of shape, but what you have stated only works if the mac hasn't been modified at some point in it's life.
    This thing may be only months from it's tenth birthday, a decade's a long time to no have any mods at all.
    None of us know if it is the same as the day it shipped, or not. It might be, but for all we know, this may be the case of a single core 1.6Ghz with the motherboard, CPU's and PSU from a quad core (with a badly damaged case and fried GPU) and a random processor cover and graphics that were just sat on a shelf by the work bench. We do not know, because we cannot know.
    The serial number would likely be from the case, but internals could be changed.
    I've never done this to a G5, but if I had a reason to, I wouldn't hesitate.

    So I say again, the only way you can actually be 100% sure beyond any doubt, is to take a look at what is physically under that cover.
    [/Calm And Relaxed Voice]
     
  12. parendox macrumors newbie

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    #12
    Bunnspecial is right, this is needlessly complicating the issue with frivolous assumptions. It's best to stay with the facts here rather than go off on a wild tangent about the possibilities that the Mac is a modified mishmash of different parts because you have about as much evidence of that as any of us do, ie none. What we do have though is a model and emc number and unfortunately as much as you may want to cloud the issue with that corrupt logic of yours, you can only go with what you have.
     
  13. bunnspecial macrumors 603

    bunnspecial

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    #13
    Drastic modifications to a G5 are easier said than done, and few people do them because it's easier and cheaper to just find a box that has the processor specs you are chasing. In addition, you can't really swap G5 processors around willy-nilly like a lot of us do with G4s-if the processors have been changed, once again it's most likely they were changed to ones of identical specs.

    I'd say there's a better than 99% chance that if the sticker says 2.5 or 2.7, it's liquid cooled. If it's not one of these two, I'd put the chances at 99% or better that it's not liquid.

    That's the bottom line.
     
  14. Dronecatcher macrumors 68000

    Dronecatcher

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    #14
    I wouldn't worry so much whether it's a LCS or not - given the age, there's equal chance of anything failing now and it's not like the price will be high enough to warrant it as a long term proposition. Worst case scenario is it's a Dual 1.8 - which is still a very worthy and capable Mac.
     
  15. oi!, Jun 5, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2016

    oi! Suspended

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    #15
    No, I have precisely as much evidence as any of you do, i.e. none. Which was precisely my point.



    What we have, is a model and emc number and, unfortunately, an assumption. Without looking, we can only say that it probably does or probably doesn't have LCS.
    99% point something percent probability is not a 100% absolute certainty. For that, you do need to look.
    Sorry if you don't like my evidence based approach.
     
  16. bunnspecial macrumors 603

    bunnspecial

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    #16
    There's no need to make this a bigger deal than it is...

    I didn't put together a collection of over 100 PPC Macs by making absolutely, factually sure of what I was seeing. I took a lot of chances based on my knowledge of the products(most of them a lot older than the G5 being discussed) and what information I know about the product.

    I have been wrong very, very few times when going by sticker information.

    You can get a long way by realizing that a. Most Mac owners don't know or care enough to change parts, especially if they're not ones specifically advised as being interchangeable and b. High end systems are rarely converted to low end configurations.

    On a PCI/PCIx G5, the ONLY user authorized service parts are the RAM, expansion cards(including GPU), airport card, and hard drives. Most everything else is enough of a pain in the butt to change that few folks bother. As I said, unless switching to an identical processor, processor swaps are not possible without a logic board change.

    I have never personally encountered a G5 where the case sticker is wrong about the CPUs in the box, and finding one where that's the case would be the exception rather than the rule.
     
  17. Hrududu macrumors 68020

    Hrududu

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    #17
    Agreed. Logic board, CPU, or PSU are just as likely to fail as anything on a machine that's 10-12 years old. I've still got 2 liquid cooled G5s buzzing away and I don't think twice about them springing a leak. The quad is my go-to machine too. Just go for it and enjoy it while it lasts.
     
  18. oi! Suspended

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    #18
    Err, look, before I got the Mac Pro that I did, I noticed that a lot of cheap Mac Pro's have case damage, particularly the handles.
    I have a dead G5 with a case that's too good to throw out, so I had planned on getting a damaged Mac Pro cheap, pulling the whole thing to bits and swapping part of the case over, before rebuilding it in nice condition, kinda a bit Franken Mac, but hey.
    Then the bottom kinda fell out of the 1.1's market and I spotted a nice cheap one not that far from me, "Collection Only" perfect. Well, perfectish.

    Maybe I see more modded stuff (not just computers) because I hang with the kind of people who like modding stuff.
     
  19. gavinstubbs09 macrumors 65816

    gavinstubbs09

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    #19
    Remove the fan covering the RAM and look at the G5 side. If it has a radiator (like a car) it's a LCS model.
     
  20. bunnspecial macrumors 603

    bunnspecial

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    #20
    Look, the poor guy who started this thread is just trying to figure out if a G5 he's looking at is liquid cooled or not.

    All these what if scenarios are asinine, especially since the computer he shows looks more or less unmolested. I get tired of wading through all the crap here sometimes when the question COULD have been answered(and actually was) pretty quickly. There's no need to get caught up in minutia that have a .0001% chance of happening.

    BTW, good luck getting an MP board in a G5 case without taking a Sawzall to it and having the end result look like a piece of crap. There's way too much internal difference in them. If you've looked at enough Macs, modded ones become pretty easy to spot too.
     
  21. oi!, Jun 6, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2016

    oi! Suspended

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    #21
    Umm, do I understand correctly that you are unaware that both cases are held together with screws and bolts?
    I expect some (possibly all) will be in slightly different places, do you really think that needs a Sawzall to fix?
    Yes I know the back plate has threaded component mounting points (captive nuts) that are in different places and quantities, but I have something called epoxy resin and a good deal of patience. Do you not think that might be neater than major surgery with heavy duty cutting gear?
    Would I be correct to believe that you are not massively into modding?


    Thank god, some sense finally!
    Thank you Gavin for an answer that PowerMac G5 (the thread starter) might find actually helpful and informative.
     
  22. Command macrumors regular

    Command

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    #22
    The Power Macintosh G5/2.5 DP (PCI-X) (June 2004), Power Macintosh G5/2.7 DP (PCI-X) (Early 2005), and Power Macintosh G5 "Quad Core" (2.5) (Late 2005) all have a liquid cooling system.
     
  23. bunnspecial macrumors 603

    bunnspecial

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    #23
    I don't know why we keep dragging this out, but are you aware of the fact that one of the major structural elements-the "shelf" that separates the ODD and HDD from the LoBo in a G5, and that holds the HDDs, ODDs, and PSUs in a Mac Pro is cast as part of the case? I'm not seeing how that can moved without major surgery.

    As for modding-you're welcome to see my dual 1.8ghz Digital Audio G4 that's in a steel 4U rackmount case...

    I have enough other G4s lying around that would make modder's head spin-including what is likely one of the fastest ones in existences for single core processes. I have a Powermac 8600 capable of running OS X Leopard.

    Like I said, do we really need to complicate this with all of these what-ifs that you keep dreaming up? If the OP goes by the processor speed, he is most likely going to find the correct answer.
     
  24. oi! Suspended

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    #24
    The "shelf" is held in with screws.

    I nearly put my flashing PC in a microwave case, but that's old, people have done it too many times already.

    That 8600 sounds pretty sweet.

    Wish I could afford a processor upgrade card.
     

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