PowerPC G4 - Fried Tiger OS on HD - trying to boot in DVD or USB - install Sorbet!

[oharag]

I posted on Reddit and Apple Forums - now I'm coming here. Here is what I posted. If you guys can help me find a bootable DVD/USB or anything else to repair my PB OS - and eventually get Sorbet installed it would be appreciated.

So I created an issue. I had a Powerbook G4 lying around and I thought it would be cool to resurrect it. After 5-6 years it booted up into Tiger 10.4.? I thought awesome - nostalgia. Will I then decided to see what the latest OS I can run on this laptop to improve compatibility with modern day internet. I found Sorbet - a combination of Leopard and unreleased Snow Leopard for PowerPC. I downloaded the image and tried following instructions.

• Well Disk Utility would not create a partition on my HD since it was where the OS resides - in the videos the people installing Sorbet just selected DU - created a new partition - used Carbon Copy to reimage Sorbet onto the new portion - reboot and boom. I couldn't even do this.
• I own my Tiger (I can't find the original DVD). So I went to Mac Garden archives to download a new Tiger Install DVD thinking to reinstall Tiger and create partitions during install. Tiger DVD mounted on desktop - I selected Install Tiger - said it had to reboot to do this - reboot - and it goes back to the original HD. So I try to boot into Tiger Install DVD holding Option - doesn't show up. So this was dead end.
• I then on my Mac M1 create a USB with the Sorbet OS imaged on it. Inserted into PB hold option - and it doesn't show up. Understand the Sorbet IMG files is a fully running HD image of Sorbet - should be bootable - no?
• So then I got frustrated - I said I'm going to get Sobet running so I used DU to try to image Sorbet over existing Tiger on HD. I knew this was going to end badly. Bot did it - my PB Tiger OS is fried - won't boot - just get jibberish.
• So I download Leopard Install DVD - still won't show up in boot options holding Option.

My question to everyone - is WTH why is it sooooooo hard to recover a bad old MacOS X install? Also - is THERE anything out there that will allow me to boot into a DVD or USB - repair the Mac HD with Tiger - or at least reinstall PowerPC capable MacOSX????? I mean this is a Mac it should be seamless? Am I missing a DVD from my Leopard retail box that had a bootable DVD to perform repairs - etc???

To say this has been frustrating is an understatement.



I came here after posting on Reddit because I hope this Apple Community would be able to help better. Any help would be appreciated.



Few thoughts:

• Before I fried my OS install on my PB - there was a way to boot up in target mode using Firewire - man I don't even have a HD using FireWire - and my new Macs are modern - using USB only. If bootie from Firewire HD is easier than DVD/USB please advise - again I'm sure Firewire HDs are rare and most likely expensive.
• There are command in Open Firmware on the PC that I suppose will force booting into a USB - but why is this soooooo hard - on a Mac!!!! Should be - hey man I don't see OS on HD so let's look around - oh hello USB - boot!

Thanks

 

[Amethyst1]

Well Disk Utility would not create a partition on my HD since it was where the OS resides - in the videos the people installing Sorbet just selected DU - created a new partition [...]

Leopard's Disk Utility can shrink existing partitions and create new ones in the resulting area non-destructively. Tiger's can't.

I own my Tiger (I can't find the original DVD). So I went to Mac Garden archives to download a new Tiger Install DVD thinking to reinstall Tiger and create partitions during install. Tiger DVD mounted on desktop - I selected Install Tiger - said it had to reboot to do this - reboot - and it goes back to the original HD. So I try to boot into Tiger Install DVD holding Option - doesn't show up.

You need to burn the Tiger install DVD image to an actual DVD or drive partition. You can't just mount the image and boot/install from that. If you can't boot from a DVD: Are you sure the image was burned correctly and the Mac's DVD drive still works properly?

I then on my Mac M1 create a USB with the Sorbet OS imaged on it. Inserted into PB hold option - and it doesn't show up. Understand the Sorbet IMG files is a fully running HD image of Sorbet - should be bootable - no?

The M1 Mac may have set up a GUID Partition Table (GPT) on the USB drive. Only the very latest PowerPC Macs can boot from that. Older ones require an Apple Partition Map (APM) setup. No idea if an M1 Mac can be told to create one so it's best to prepare (partition) the USB drive using a PowerPC or (early) Intel Mac using a version of OS X known to deal with APM.

There are command in Open Firmware on the PC that I suppose will force booting into a USB - but why is this soooooo hard - on a Mac!!!! Should be - hey man I don't see OS on HD so let's look around - oh hello USB - boot!

Some PowerPC Macs will boot from USB drives using the "Option menu" but most will not.

My question to everyone - is WTH why is it sooooooo hard to recover a bad old MacOS X install? Also - is THERE anything out there that will allow me to boot into a DVD or USB - repair the Mac HD with Tiger - or at least reinstall PowerPC capable MacOSX?????

It's not hard if you have a working install medium ( ), so my advice would be to get that sorted before looking into Sorbet. You can download a Tiger install DVD image from here or a Leopard install DVD image from here. Burn either of those to a DVD (Leopard needs a dual-layer disc) and try booting up from that.

 

[TheShortTimer]

I posted on Reddit and Apple Forums - now I'm coming here.

The advice that you received from the Apple Forum on this matter seems pretty good but you stopped replying to the person who was attempting to help you...

Good advice has been imparted here by @Amethyst1 and hopefully it gets you up and running.

 

[oharag]

Leopard's Disk Utility can shrink existing partitions and create new ones in the resulting area non-destructively. Tiger's can't.


You need to burn the Tiger install DVD image to an actual DVD or drive partition. You can't just mount the image and boot/install from that. If you can't boot from a DVD: Are you sure the image was burned correctly and the Mac's DVD drive still works properly?


The M1 Mac may have set up a GUID Partition Table (GPT) on the USB drive. Only the very latest PowerPC Macs can boot from that. Older ones require an Apple Partition Map (APM) setup. No idea if an M1 Mac can be told to create one so it's best to prepare (partition) the USB drive using a PowerPC or (early) Intel Mac using a version of OS X known to deal with APM.


Some PowerPC Macs will boot from USB drives using the "Option menu" but most will not.


It's not hard if you have a working install medium ( ), so my advice would be to get that sorted before looking into Sorbet. You can download a Tiger install DVD image from here or a Leopard install DVD image from here. Burn either of those to a DVD (Leopard needs a dual-layer disc) and try booting up from that.

Thanks for response.

Yes I burned the Tiger/Leopard DVDs Iso to DVD without issue - the Tiger was single layer DVD Leopard D/L. I believe I have what as called the Combo Drive on my PPC PB - I can read DVDs but write only CDRWs? I don't think this is a Superdrive on my PPC.

So when I burned Tiger DVD - and before I fried my Tiger OS - it mounted on desktop (as did my USB3.1 thumb drive). I clicked install tiger - it said I needed to reboot - I did - went right to HD again. Now I believe someone stated that I had a newer version of Tiger - thus the one I tried 10.4 would not work.

The Tiger/Leopard DVDs that I got on the nets would not boot holding C or show up as bootable using Option key. I tried OF commands - also wouldn't boot. I can hear the disk a whirring - but nothing. I've been trying bootable USBs as well.

What are your thoughts regarding using USB 3.1 TD on PPC PB? It mounted fine - but some stated it won't boot on old PB Usb (I guess 2.0). Should I buy a USB 2.0 if I want to mess around with PPC PB - if I can ever recover? I sear I used to have older USB TD - but maybe I tossed them. I only have USB 3 and 3.1

What are your thoughts on the Combo Drive vs Superdrive - ability to read double layer DVDs - especially Leopard since it's a 8+GB size. The Tiger I dled was 4.0 GB and it fit on a single sided DVD. I read Apple used to ship OSes on multiple CDs or DVDs maybe for this purpose.

I will download you links above and give it a try - I have a Pioneer BDR-XD05S optical drive. It's been very reliable - I actually have DVD+R D/L disks fresh in my home. Haven't burned to DVD media in a long time - funny how times advance - DVDs???? What's that says a young kid.

PS I believe my typing above is a mess - I have a flakey keyboard that I can't part ways with - but it's old. Some keys don't register during typing. I will try to correct before posting.

 

[oharag]

The advice that you received from the Apple Forum on this matter seems pretty good but you stopped replying to the person who was attempting to help you...

Good advice has been imparted here by @Amethyst1 and hopefully it gets you up and running.

I person with name
BDAqua
on Apple Forums replied - I'm in a back and forth on Apple Forums. I decided to make the rounds - I posted on Apple Forums - Reddit - Mac Forums and even Mac Garden forums - trying to find anyone with knowledge on old Macs. I will try to make the rounds and ask everyone their thoughts. I'm trying to narrow down the specifics and hopefully get my PPC PB back up and running. I think many of my problems are - downloading a bootable DVD - trying to get my fried OS PPC PB to read these DVDs - maybe it's the fact I'm using USB 3??? Maybe because I have a Combo Drive instead of Superdrive. Something is just not jiving here. I'm following multiple threads if I find a solution I will post it here so others can learn.

Thanks

 

[oharag]

Leopard's Disk Utility can shrink existing partitions and create new ones in the resulting area non-destructively. Tiger's can't.


You need to burn the Tiger install DVD image to an actual DVD or drive partition. You can't just mount the image and boot/install from that. If you can't boot from a DVD: Are you sure the image was burned correctly and the Mac's DVD drive still works properly?


The M1 Mac may have set up a GUID Partition Table (GPT) on the USB drive. Only the very latest PowerPC Macs can boot from that. Older ones require an Apple Partition Map (APM) setup. No idea if an M1 Mac can be told to create one so it's best to prepare (partition) the USB drive using a PowerPC or (early) Intel Mac using a version of OS X known to deal with APM.


Some PowerPC Macs will boot from USB drives using the "Option menu" but most will not.


It's not hard if you have a working install medium ( ), so my advice would be to get that sorted before looking into Sorbet. You can download a Tiger install DVD image from here or a Leopard install DVD image from here. Burn either of those to a DVD (Leopard needs a dual-layer disc) and try booting up from that.

So I downloaded your link for Leopard. It seems to be the same as all the others. When I mount Image I see -> Install Mac OS X app + Optional Installs folder + Instructions folder. In no way do I see that there is a file structure or that this is a bootable DVD once burned - again I still have question regarding whether I can even read D/L DVDs on a combo drive.

Searching nets:A combo drive is a type of optical drive that combines CD-R/CD-RW recording capability with an ability to read (but not write) DVD media; some manufacturers refer this as CD-RW/DVD-ROM drive. The term was used almost exclusively by Apple as a name for the low-end substitute for their high-end SuperDrive, as the latter was designed to both read and write CD and DVD recordable media. The device was created as a mid-range option between a CD burner and a DVD burner, which at the time the combo drive was introduced was generally an expensive option costing in excess of US$300 a unit.

I do have an external USB Superdirve I bought for my newer Mac mini - Intel will this work on PPC PB?

I will try the Tiger one - single layer DVD again - as stated these downloads look no different from the ones I downloaded from Mac Garden/Internet Archives. Unless the bootable file structure is hidden when just looking at them on my desktop

 

[for this]

It is very easy for me to reinstall OS on every PPC Mac I have because I still keep all their original CDs/DVDs. I also made a 10.5 DVD+R DL from a downloaded torrent file, OS 9 CDs with repair utilities of my choice, and quite a few other discs. They are all bootable and work perfectly. I don't know why so many people have problem making a bootable CD/DVD for old Macs. It may be because I burned all of them on a PPC Mac. I don't have experience burning OS related discs from other kinds of computer.

The Tiger I dled was 4.0 GB and it fit on a single sided DVD. I read Apple used to ship OSes on multiple CDs or DVDs maybe for this purpose.

A single layer 10.4 DVD can work if it's compatible with your Mac, I have one, originally pumped from the factory. You don't need other accompanied discs. But I don't know what model of your PB is. The last model needs at least 10.4.2 to boot.

 

[oharag]

It is very easy for me to reinstall OS on every PPC Mac I have because I still keep all their original CDs/DVDs. I also made a 10.5 DVD+R DL from a downloaded torrent file, OS 9 CDs with repair utilities of my choice, and quite a few other discs. They are all bootable and work perfectly. I don't know why so many people have problem making a bootable CD/DVD for old Macs. It may be because I burned all of them on a PPC Mac. I don't have experience burning OS related discs from other kinds of computer.



A single layer 10.4 DVD can work if it's compatible with your Mac, I have one, originally pumped from the factory. You don't need other accompanied discs. But I don't know what model of your PB is. The last model needs at least 10.4.2 to boot.

Hey just an update to this post:
- None of my DVDs (Leopard - D/L or Tiger DVD) would boot. Not from holding C or shown in boot options holding Option.
- I tried OF commands for CD - didn't work.
- I decided to try Boot USB. I found out USB 3.1 thumb drive would not show up in OF list. I had to buy a USB 2.0 thumb drive. Once this happened I managed to use OF commands to boot into Leopard Install on USB.

This whole experience has been a learning experience - and to say this took WAY TOO long and was convoluted. This should have been way easier.

BTW I thought since I have a ComboDrive not a Superdrive I couldn't mount D/L DVDs. This is not true. I mounted everything I burned - D/L single layer DVD. So why I couldn't boot is unknown to me. Also tested my old USB external Superdrive - it mount mount a DVD. This was surprising to me - I guess not enough power is supplied by USB on PPC PB.

Weird experience overall.

 

[TheShortTimer]

Hey just an update to this post:
- None of my DVDs (Leopard - D/L or Tiger DVD) would boot. Not from holding C or shown in boot options holding Option.
- I tried OF commands for CD - didn't work.

You were doing something wrong on that front because I've burned CDs and DVDs that were downloaded from the same places as yours and they've always worked on all my PPC Macs. Either that or the internal optical drive on the PowerBook is faulty - does it mount any DVDs or CDs?

- I decided to try Boot USB. I found out USB 3.1 thumb drive would not show up in OF list. I had to buy a USB 2.0 thumb drive.

It was pointed out to you here that USB 3 doesn't work well with OF and that you'd need to by a USB 2.0 device.

Once this happened I managed to use OF commands to boot into Leopard Install on USB.

Excellent news - congrats! Have fun with the PowerBook.