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ppc advantages and comparison

I had to do some work on editing videos of tornadoes i chased this past saturday, and i usually do it on my intel based compaq that is running ubuntu linux at the moment, it was so disturbing to actually be using a non ppc machine much less a non apple machine i was so happy when it was done. I am now using my g4 ti powerbook now and am much more comfortable using it. I just went to the local apple store and found out that they still had a copy of adobe photoshop for the ppc/intel machines and am going to install it on my g4 powerbook and g3 imac so i wont be using my compaq until i hackintosh it... hopefully snow leopard will impress me enough to forget its not really an apple product!

I really wish people could explain what the ppc apples cannot do that the intel apples can or is too many people in love with redmond and intel to see that the older ppc apples are far better
 
zen.state said:
Here is a screen capture of a Photoshop benchmark showing a dual 1.8GHz 7448 actually outperforming both a Core Duo and Core 2 Duo.
Click to expand...


How about other benchmark that showing PPC being totally outperformed by Core 2 Duo?

One benchmark statistic does not show the entire picture. Tunnel vision at best.
 
Stella said:
How about other benchmark that showing PPC being totally outperformed by Core 2 Duo?

One benchmark statistic does not show the entire picture. Tunnel vision at best.
Click to expand...

One could also say that most computer users have tunnel vision in that they think performance is EVERYTHING. Simple minded at best.
 
Some thoughts..

I really am in awe of all the people coming here and dogging PowerPC. We PowerPC lovers/users have but one little area on this gigantic forum. All the other areas are dedicated to current Apple products etc.

Maybe leave us be? We understand PowerPC is less powerful. We get it. We still choose to use it.

Any person that truly embraces technology knows it's always about using what you're comfortable with and in turn works the way you prefer. For me and the other regulars here it's PowerPC Macs.

End rant..
 
zen.state said:
One could also say that most computer users have tunnel vision in that they think performance is EVERYTHING. Simple minded at best.
Click to expand...

Performance isn't everything, but I was replying to the person who posted ONE benchmark to show evidence of PPC outperforming an Intel processor.
 
intel was the enemy, some people just can't let it go... performance wise they are pathetic compared to any dual+ core architecture
 
TheMythTheMan said:
intel was the enemy, some people just can't let it go... performance wise they are pathetic compared to any dual+ core architecture
Click to expand...

It has nothing to do with hatred of intel. I have owned a couple intel and amd systems in the past.

Once again like most you base everything on performance. Unenlightened single mindedness doesn't work for me.
 
wow....

wow nice. thanks too all of you these are some of the best responses i have heard in a while, must be all that ppc tech making you guys reach that zen state (sorry i hade to)
my main reson for using ppc is that its what i can afford. i would love an 8 core mac pro, but unfortunatly that (and my foray into video editing) will have to wait. i object to hackintoshes -- not because they have issues, or are "illigal" -- but because they feal 'cold' like the cold buisness world of microsft still inhabits thier soul. ppc machinces other than being cheep, have a build quality and a 'happy' atmosphere that far surpasses most pc's and many modern macs.

thers more but typing that would take to long :p

long live ppc

<edit>
relly intel guys relly. i think we know that it looks like intel wins, but its market stratagy is making fast procescors run inefficiant code, while every other platform runs hyper effciant code on somewhat slower procesors...
just leave the ppc guys alone thats not what this thread is for.
thank you
</edit>
 
zen.state said:
Some thoughts..

I really am in awe of all the people coming here and dogging PowerPC. We PowerPC lovers/users have but one little area on this gigantic forum. All the other areas are dedicated to current Apple products etc.

Maybe leave us be? We understand PowerPC is less powerful. We get it. We still choose to use it.

Any person that truly embraces technology knows it's always about using what you're comfortable with and in turn works the way you prefer. For me and the other regulars here it's PowerPC Macs.

End rant..
Click to expand...

I'm going to add on to zen.state's rant with a rant of my own that I'm reposting from another thread:

*Rant: I LOVE IT (tongue-pressed-firmly-in-cheek there) when I, or someone else, posts a PowerPC-specific question and the response is, "ZOMG... ur such a dork... get a MINI!!!" Dude... if I wanted to ask a question about the Mac Mini or some other Intel Mac, I'd ask about an Intel Mac! In addition to my Macbook, I have a G5 iMac that serves admirably as the family computer. It runs Leopard, it surfs the web, handles email and light photo editing, views Youtube and Hulu just fine, and does whatever my wife and I ask of it. Is it a speed machine for Bioshock or Command and Conquer? Of course not. I understand its limitations, but as long as it continues to run, I have no reason to upgrade.*

End of rant. Zen.State is arguing against a specific sub-species of internet troll who inhabit the PowerPC message boards. I had the good misfortune of being introduced to this form of troll last year, when I was having a problem with my iMac. I had thought I was having the dreaded bad logic board and/or bad caps issue (turns out it was a bad stick of 3rd party RAM which I, a 3rd party tech, and an Apple genius all mis-diagnosed). I had posted on a message board, and a lot of people gave great advice in helping me solve the problem. However, I also received a lot of responses that went like this: "Dude… ur such a loser… get a MINI!!!" Unhelpful at best, terminally annoying at worst. And completely unnecessary.

For me, what are the advantages of PPC? Well, my PPC machine works, it does everything we ask of it, and it is paid off. Will I eventually replace it with a Intel-based Mac? Yes, most likely when Leopard ceases to receive security updates and is EOL-ed. I also believe there was a design aesthetic in the PPC Macs that made them unique, and set them apart from the grey-box Wintel world.

Quick afterthought: When I purchased my Macbook last April, I gave my G4 iBook to my step-sister who needed a replacement laptop for college after her machine died. The first day she had it, she called me and could not stop singing its praises, especially about how fast it was compared to her old laptop: a Pentium II Winbook running Windows 98 SE. You could say PPC is slow, I suppose, but it depends who you are asking (I couldn't believe she was running Windows 98 in 2009, but that's a different story, I guess).
 
One of bigger PPC Macs advantages (at least for me) is: you cannot overclock Intel Mac with soldering iron :D :cool: :p
And seriously: there's something magical in PPC (especially G3 and G4) called "that thing" ;). Plus simplicity, best Apple design ever, reliability and longevity.
 
Nostalgia is a perfectly good reason to like something.
Familiarity with, comfort, cheapness of spare parts are all perfectly valid points too. Or maybe it's just cool.

I have just one PPC Mac, a 17" G5 iMac currently regulated to the ignoble task of digital picture frame for my 81-YO mother.

I rescued the poor thing from certain scrapdom and repaired its failed Power Supply, replaced its missing Hard Drive and dug up a copy of Tiger for it to play with.
This was all well after having bought my first Mac, an Intel Mac Pro.

My impressions?

It must have been really something.

While SUCKERS like me were hopelessly flailing around with Windows, squinting at cheap displays and trying to ignore the howling of half a dozen tiny fans while trying to get something done in between constant updates, crashes, incompatibilities and BSODS....
you were quietly getting things done with the help of Pumas, Panthers and Tigers on quick, quiet and stable PPC Macs with fantastic, stunningly clear and sharp displays.

I can understand the attachment. Back then, your PPC Macs were a world apart from the disheveled land of PCs.

In retrospect, I should have never listened to the "Computer Experts" that assured me that Apples were expensive playthings that couldn't do half of what the PC they were selling me could do. Darn. Wish I were there.

Have Fun,
Keri

PS> I saw a G4 iMac in daily service last week on vacation. In the middle of nowhere, Wisconsin. :)

PPS> Apple probably won't return to PPC. But they might move away from Intel towards their own ARM or whatever CPUs. Wouldn't that be cool?
 
KeriJane:

You make some good points and share some good thoughts.

For me it's not really at all about nostalgia or attachment. It's that I firmly believe PowerPC is better and would much rather spend my money on it.

People just don't understand the whole preferred architecture concept it seems.
 
Another PPC Geek..

I only have one PPC mac, but I absolutely love it! That G4 MDD was my first Mac ever, and it's still is my favorite computer. I just got the brand new MacBook Pro 17' i7, however I still catch myself sitting on the G4.

The G4 Project was just sooo much fun! Great upgrade possibilities and a very stable platform that never stops working. Great spare part supply for decades to come and the best customer support crew on the planet (-this Forum-)!!
Since 2005, this awesome machine is mine and I still love working with it. In my configuration, Quake 4 and Age of Empire 3 runs pretty well. Leopard is stable as it can be and all other programs are fast for every day's duties.
I also love the nice Quicksilver design with the chrome doors and the air intake.
I also have the original Apple 23' ADC Cinema Display, so it's really hard to part with it. I will absolutely keep it like an old 84' Porsche Carrera !!!
 
Hi Zen.State

I wholeheartedly agree that PPC was far superior to Intel's "Netburst" junk...
but you're saying PPC is superior to the Core and i series CPUs as well?

I'm in no serious position to argue on the merits of either. I do understand the "Intel runs inefficient code really fast while everyone else runs efficient code more slowly" argument, but that's about it.

Apple seemed to think Intel surpassed PPC when the Core CPUs came out. Or do you think they switched mostly to provide Windows support so as to increase sales? It worked, too. A lot of people bought Intel Macs because they are Windows-Capable.

I can't wait to see what kind of CPU Apple adopts in the next few years. It probably won't be Intel. I suspect it will be an Apple-specific CPU and Chipset, immune to Hackintoshing and any Intel-specific vulnerabilities.
Betcha it'll be running OSXI. ;)

Or maybe there'll be THE TRIUMPHANT RETURN OF PPC!

Have Fun,
Keri

Maybe I'll keep an eye out for a G4 Mini or PowerBook
 
One other big point I forgot..

The G4 is not dead at all since it is still manufactured. Freescale still makes 7447 and 7448 chips along with other PowerPC variant chips for other platforms. PowerPC is used for a lot more than Mac OS. There is also a whole PowerPC Unix/Linux world out there.

The G3 and G5 chips are technically dead but as I said the G4 is still made.
 
KeriJane said:
Hi Zen.State

I wholeheartedly agree that PPC was far superior to Intel's "Netburst" junk...
but you're saying PPC is superior to the Core and i series CPUs as well?

I'm in no serious position to argue on the merits of either. I do understand the "Intel runs inefficient code really fast while everyone else runs efficient code more slowly" argument, but that's about it.

Apple seemed to think Intel surpassed PPC when the Core CPUs came out. Or do you think they switched mostly to provide Windows support so as to increase sales? It worked, too. A lot of people bought Intel Macs because they are Windows-Capable.

I can't wait to see what kind of CPU Apple adopts in the next few years. It probably won't be Intel. I suspect it will be an Apple-specific CPU and Chipset, immune to Hackintoshing and any Intel-specific vulnerabilities.
Betcha it'll be running OSXI. ;)

Or maybe there'll be THE TRIUMPHANT RETURN OF PPC!

Have Fun,
Keri

Maybe I'll keep an eye out for a G4 Mini or PowerBook
Click to expand...

You're basing everything on raw performance. Like everyone. What I like about PowerPC is how it computes and gets things done. The hardware it does it with. Slower or not to me it's better. How is that so hard for people to understand?

To most people a computer is just a device to get a few things done and all they care about is doing it as fast as possible and nothing in between. I love PowerPC hardware and code. How incredibly efficient it is.

People just don't get it..
 
zen.state said:
One other big point I forgot..

The G4 is not dead at all since it is still manufactured. Freescale still makes 7447 and 7448 chips along with other PowerPC variant chips for other platforms. PowerPC is used for a lot more than Mac OS. There is also a whole PowerPC Unix/Linux world out there.

The G3 and G5 chips are technically dead but as I said the G4 is still made.
Click to expand...

Aren't G-series CPUs widely used in the Satellite and Space Exploration business? Like the Mars Rovers?

Question: When the first Mars Rover was being rebooted frequently, did it go:"Bong!" with the Apple Startup Sound? I think that would've been very cool.

Have Fun,
Keri

PS. No, I wasn't basing everything on raw performance. I was merely asking what you meant by "better". I'm not disagreeing with you either, as I don't feel qualified to do so.
 
KeriJane said:
Aren't G-series CPUs widely used in the Satellite and Space Exploration business? Like the Mars Rovers?

Question: When the first Mars Rover was being rebooted frequently, did it go:"Bong!" with the Apple Startup Sound?

Have Fun,
Keri
Click to expand...

Not sure about that but it could very well be true. Other than Macs and Amigas the PowerPC (RISC) architecture has been used in many heavy duty application settings.

I know for a fact that a couple of the space shuttles in the 90's had 603e CPU's in them. Those were in Macs around 95.
 
zen.state said:
One other big point I forgot..

The G4 is not dead at all since it is still manufactured. Freescale still makes 7447 and 7448 chips along with other PowerPC variant chips for other platforms. PowerPC is used for a lot more than Mac OS. There is also a whole PowerPC Unix/Linux world out there.

The G3 and G5 chips are technically dead but as I said the G4 is still made.
Click to expand...

I'd like to have Dual 1.8 7448 from Newertech, but its price kills my enthusiasm :( I got one nice Quicksilver, it would fit perfectly together...
 
666sheep said:
I'd like to have Dual 1.8 7448 from Newertech, but its price kills my enthusiasm :( I got one nice Quicksilver, it would fit perfectly together...
Click to expand...

As you saw from the benchmark you linked in the other thread even the single is a beast. It still sells for the 350 US I paid about a year ago. Less than half the dual price.

OWC told me they may very well be selling G4 upgrades for another 2-3 years or more as they keep selling. They had to give up on the 7455 upgrades with L3 though because Freescale stopped making them. So now it's just the 744x chips.
 
so i was looking at my local craigs list serching "powermac"
wow
lots of g5s all dual core most 2ghz
thats insane
then agian, i do live within an hour of toronto (you know in canada? :p)
 
@OP: We aren't "intel" guys, we are "mac" guys, and most of us appreciate both halves of the spectrum and have invested heavily in both. But truth be told, there are no "advantages" to a PPC platform in the desktop environment (or in the server market really). They are heavy on power and aren't cheap to manufacture. Just not cost effective for Apple to continue that path if they want to keep making the massive profit they are.

The "unix" big iron boxes are IBMs POWER platform, not to be confused with PowerPC. Very similar in architecture, but the most recent power platform (7) is miles ahead of PPC. The G5s are closer to the Power 4 platform which is years old and obsolete (there is a 5 and 6 after that, and I think even IBM is either dropping or dropped AIX support for 4).

Now, if this thread was "Advantages to the Power7 platform", I would be writing 12 pages of posts of how I would LOVE to spend 40k on an entry level power7 server. But that isn't in the budget, not yet anyways. :D

Edit: A little correction on this, AIX's minimum supported is now power4. My bad. :)
 
zmttoxics said:
@OP: We aren't "intel" guys, we are "mac" guys, and most of us appreciate both halves of the spectrum and have invested heavily in both. But truth be told, there are no "advantages" to a PPC platform in the desktop environment (or in the server market really). They are heavy on power and aren't cheap to manufacture. Just not cost effective for Apple to continue that path if they want to keep making the massive profit they are.

The "unix" big iron boxes are IBMs POWER platform, not to be confused with PowerPC. Very similar in architecture, but the most recent power platform (7) is miles ahead of PPC. The G5s are closer to the Power 4 platform which is years old and obsolete (there is a 5 and 6 after that, and I think even IBM is either dropping or dropped AIX support for 4).

Now, if this thread was "Advantages to the Power7 platform", I would be writing 12 pages of posts of how I would LOVE to spend 40k on an entry level power7 server. But that isn't in the budget, not yet anyways. :D
Click to expand...

That would be a dream – expensive, but a dream. But doesn't the Power7 hit 100°C+ very easily? If they built a slightly less... volatile processor, I see no reason why it couldn't replace the Intel processor in the 400+ day old Mac Pros. That won't happen, but a man can dream.

How feasible does everyone think it would it be for Apple to take the A4 processor and get it on a more powerful level?
 
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