Premiere Pro CC on nMP 8 Core/D700 - not great

Discussion in 'Mac Pro' started by anticipate, Jan 22, 2014.

  1. anticipate macrumors regular

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    Dec 22, 2013
    #1
    So.... my very preliminary testing with our new Mac Pro using the plugin I use most (filmconvert -FC) anyway, shows that Premiere CC needs more optimization for the dual GPUs. In fact, I'd say the CPU utilization is not up to snuff either.

    I know FC only uses one GPU presently from the developer. That will change. In the meantime, using a couple of typical projects with that plugin as an example, I'm only seeing 25-45% speed up in exports over our maxed out late 2012 27" iMac exporting the same project. That's significant of course but not the 100%+ one would think we would be seeing at the least given the MacPro config of 8 cores and dual D700s. Premiere Pro CC seems in fact to never maximize CPU (never mind GPUs). I have yet, in my very limited testing, see it "pin the meters" like I did on the iMac.

    Of course that's just testing now two short (under 5 min) projects, and it depends on what one is doing. Some stuff is much, much faster like Red Giant's Denoiser II or Warp Stabilizer VFX. The improvement there can be 3-4x faster anecdotally. I used to avoid them for speed reasons unless absolutely needed a lot of the time but now they are fast enough to rely on quickly. Other stuff unrelated top PPro CC like DxO PRIME noise removal on RAW stills is much faster too, as is Photoshop CC. Some effects like blur, sharpening, resize there are nearly instant now even on giga pixel files in Photoshop CC.

    And of course FCPX is much faster on it but I hate the whole editing paradigm. The timeline is just horrid on it; simple things like replacing a word in someone's dialogue is a multi click, multistep process that is nearly instant in Premiere and most every other NLE. Just to try to see your whole timeline is a chore, to see what your edits and sound are in detail are problematic, trying to keep things in sync is a chore, and you can't even zoom your timeline window to full screen! It's just not for me until the fundamentals of the program change. The amount of time gained by using it for exports would be lost in counteracting some of Apple's "magnetic" timeline issues.

    I'm sure Adobe will improve over time. They have to to stay competitive. In the meantime I'll take the 45%... but I wish I saw much more improvement given the cost and hardware differential.

    Unfortunately, for now, the mainstream reviews I have seen regarding PPro performance on this machine were right. More to come as I continue to test.
     
  2. linuxcooldude, Jan 22, 2014
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2014

    linuxcooldude macrumors 68020

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    Mar 1, 2010
    #2
    Adobe Preimere Pro CC currently only uses dual GPU's for export only for the nMP. Playback uses one GPU. Yes, it needs to be updated to fully support dual GPU's and OpenCL.

    A 25-45% speed up in exports on a maxed out late 2012 27" iMac is on par for that system considering it is only using a single mobile GPU. Verses dual workstation graphic cards.
     
  3. prowlmedia macrumors 68000

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    Jan 26, 2010
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    London
    #3
    Sure as you say, all adobe software needs to be adapted to the new GPU's. This is generally always the case. The 680GTX for example did not make it to OSX for a little while.

    I would guess that this is a priority at adobe. I do understand the reluctant to FCPx - It's a completely different schema - but when you get used to it, it flies. I love it now - but still use Premiere for the After effects integration... Now that's an application that needs a complete rebuild. It's a 20 year old mess :)

    Anything else is down to intels roadmap really.

    Thanks for the info. Don't suppose you can do download http://www.maxon.net/products/cinebench/overview.html

    and run the CPU and GPU test s Only takes a few minutes. Can't find any conclusive information about those.
     
  4. sirio76, Jan 22, 2014
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2014

    sirio76 macrumors regular

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    Mar 28, 2013
    #4
    Cinebench15 score GPU(single) score between ~90 in OSX and ~110 in Windows, CPU score should be around ~1300.
     
  5. prowlmedia macrumors 68000

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    London
    #5
    Sweet. Thanks. Sounds great. I hope that Maxxon will be supporting dual GPUs soon.

    I have a new 680gtx on a 2008 and that's only getting 33 - which seems very slow to me. Need to research why.
     
  6. anticipate thread starter macrumors regular

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    Dec 22, 2013
    #6
    Yeah, this is as I figured (They have been very good at updating CC), so I am sure in due time. My issue isn't that the dual GPUs aren't used during playback (I found using the plugins I rely on FCPX is actually more choppy when comparing "full" in PPro to "best quality" in FCPX whilst running 1080). It's that the CPUs aren't being close to fully used, and the dual GPU, while working (I see it in the OpenGL Driver Monitor), is barely used. Depends on the plugin, really. Some stuff flies.

    As the other poster said, the 25-45% delta is about what would be expected switching to dual workstation GPUs for general export. But you'd think double the CPU cores would matter more than it does. One or the other isn't being utilized properly, so the boost is relatively low for now. That said, I'll take an hour saved every 4 for export right now. That's really not that bad. And the machine remains fully responsive for other work as it's still got plenty of CPU and GPU to spare.

    ....

    As for Premiere, thanks for the response. Most responses I see are very emotional on the issue, yours was not :) I don't care who makes the software, only that it works well. I am sure FCPX will continue to improve, but when I can't do things like simple one click audio crossfades it drives me batty.

    As for cinebench:

    I got 86.22 fps and 1216 cb scores.
     
  7. Crapking120, Jan 22, 2014
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2014

    Crapking120 macrumors newbie

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    Jan 22, 2014
    #7
    Cinebench scores for 8C /3.0 Ghz D700

    8C/30T @ 3.0 Hz with dual 700
    Open GL 86.43
    CPU 1220

    Same test with my late 2012 rMBP i7

    4C/8T @ 2.7 Ghz with NVIDIA 650M
    Open GL 51.03
    CPU 558

    Concur with modest PrPro CC export / rendering improvements and just downloaded FCP to see if any noticeable / relevant enhancements with routine workflows.
     
  8. chfilm macrumors 65816

    chfilm

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2012
    Location:
    Germany
    #8
    Thanks a lot for that info, I'm going from late 2012 maxed iMac to your nMP config as well, and relying heavily on CC..
    Though more after effects and I was pretty happy with the speed of premiere before, since it always spiked all CPUs.

    Did you use media encoder for your tests btw? Sometimes I'm under the weird impression in makes better use of the resources. You had open cl accel on I suppose? I today did a test on the iMac with and without and it made a 3x speed difference.

    I'm absolutely convinced that Adobe works on support for the nMP, regarding some of their recent posts on the blog and in the forums. Question is how long it will take, but I just tool a leap of faith and subscribed to CC because of their frequent updates. So let's really hope they optimize CPU support at least.

    What about red playback in premiere? I got a Pegasus r6 which should be fine transfer speed wise. But on the iMac I could never edit flawlessly on native red files in premiere..

    Could you do some afx report as well? How's CPU utilization there during export?
     
  9. anticipate thread starter macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2013
    #9
    Yeah I tried exporting both direct from PPro and AME. OpenCL on in both cases. AME was always slower by about 10%. I seem to remember the same on my iMac. That was exporting both ProRes HQ and H264 multi pass. Single pass h264 will always be faster on the iMac due to QuickSync not being on the Xeon.

    Afx is mostly (all?) CPU dependent so there's noticeable improvement there. I'm not an expert or anything with it though, I use it mostly for warp VFX on top of re timed footage. It certainly seems to play back full res HD a lot faster without rendering than the iMac.

    PPro does use both GPU when exporting but just a little. I checked with OpenGL driver monitor and the compute/2nd GPU does get lightly used. Nothing extra during playback - just one GPU.

    I haven't played too much with 4k footage yet. What little I saw (redraw) needed to be played back at 1/4 for fluidity. FCPX was similar: it had to be on "best performance" which has a similar outcome. I'll have to test more (especially with filters) but all indications are 4k works well, it's just that no one should be expecting "full" real time playback. Beat performance/ 1/4 for that. But it can be done, with a bunch of effects added.

    I can't see you post as I type this but I think I addressed all your questions... :)
     
  10. chfilm macrumors 65816

    chfilm

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    Nov 15, 2012
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    Germany
    #10
    Yup, thanks again!
    I'm surprised only about 4k in fcp x.
    It's supposed to run a lot better than this I thought? Did you have the footage on your internal ssd?
    I can playback and edit 4k in fcp x in best performance more right now on my iMac!
     
  11. bcuzawd macrumors member

    bcuzawd

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    Dec 25, 2013
    #11
    Is the "30T" correct? :confused:
     
  12. Crapking120 macrumors newbie

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    Jan 22, 2014
    #12
    Typo - sorry 8C/16T and this AM got 87.35 on a retest with all browsers / apps closed. :)
     
  13. anticipate thread starter macrumors regular

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    Dec 22, 2013
    #13
    I really have to do more testing with 4k, that was only one quick test so no, not sure. And I never use the internal SSD for editing. It's bad on the SSD; I use a promise thunderbolt RAID.
     
  14. chfilm macrumors 65816

    chfilm

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    Germany
  15. goMac macrumors 603

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    Apr 15, 2004
    #15
    I wonder if that's part of the issue. Depending on the RAID size, that could be significantly slower than the internal SSD (assuming it's a RAID of traditional HDs.)
     
  16. anticipate thread starter macrumors regular

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    Dec 22, 2013
    #16
    That has nothing to do with it. The drive is pulling a tiny fraction of it's bandwidth (which is around 700MB/sec, SSD speeds).

    The issue is Adobe hasn't updated CC to take full advantage of the Mac Pro during editing -and- encoding. FCPX is significantly faster.
     

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