PUBG Maker Sues Apple and Google for Not Removing Clone Apps

[shadowmatt]

As an IP attorney, they're on solid ground here if the games are substantially similar in look and feel.

Bethesda won a nice settlement against Warner Brothers for "stealing" Fallout Shelter for their Westworld game.

If Apple/Google are knowingly profiting from an infringing product, they are liable vicariously.

The original PUBG game was based on a free mod for another game Arma 3 which in turn copied mods for DayZ going back many years now.

Those mods were in turn based on the film Battle Royal, which given the many games which operate in the same space, the game style is called "Battle Royal"

Wouldn't those free mods constitute prior artwork or whatever it's called?

 

[ShrimpScampi]

Well, as I said, it's a hard line to draw but there's a lot of app-spam in the AppStore. I'd argue ripping off someone elses app and selling it as your own with an ever so slightly modified name ranks high among dubious business practices, so we're probably trying to avoid much of the same garbage.

Yeah trying to trick someone into installing your app by riding on the coattails of an established app is textbook dubious business practice to me. It’s like making a car and branding it BMVV or making a sound bar named Bang & Olafsen or even opening a burger joint named Shake Shaak. Just seems shady and speaks volumes about the company to me.

 

[madrigal77]

Player Unknowns Battlegrounds Battlegrounds.

 

[ChrisGerber87]

Cry cry cry, Apple stop regulating your App Store and telling us what we can and can not do. Wait some time…. Cry cry cry. Apple please regulate the App Store because we want you to stop people from copying us. You can’t have it both ways. Also, if I sell stuff in a store why am I going to care who makes what? I just sell the stuff. If you want to blame the store then can we get all the counterfeit stuff of Amazon please?

 

[ilikewhey]

35%? Seems kinda low

yeah don't quote me on it, i only took one class cause i thought I would practice IP, it may also differ from state to state. but there is a certain percentage of threshold one would have to breach in order to count as a direct infringement.

 

[needsomecoffee]

Jason Cross has an excellent, recent article about this and other significant issues re: App Store. Myself, I am eagerly awaiting the outcome of this lawsuit and especially the Eleftheriou suit which was filed a while ago. Not sure why Apple is so opposed to cleaning up the App Store. Fake reviews and scam apps have been going on for a long time. It is not millions, but billions into Apple's pocket over the years (not sure when it started the C-Level execs thought it would get this big). So we have to ask, "Why does Apple ignore this?". I think Jason is on the right track. Hard for Apple to take measures now after they have left consumers exposed for so long at so much profit. Likely "Legal" (not Marketing) has advised it is better to do nothing (admit no guilt) versus clean up the horribly excess scams and fake reviews (admit some guilt). As Jason notes, though, it could well be Marketing ("protect the brand halo") or a combo of Marketing+Legal. Advise this insightful article highly. I really hope Eleftheriou and his lawyers push all the way past discovery and go to court. Pretty sure Apple will offer ALOT of cash to avoid this, but Eleftheriou seems to be motivated by more than just cashing in. Link:

Wordle may be fixed, but the App Store is still a total mess

Scams, knockoffs, ripoffs, and fake reviews abound, but it doesn't have to be this way.

www.macworld.com

PS: If you like Wordle, follow the link and install it as a PWA. Apple hates PWAs because for an app like Wordle, there is a TON OF GOOD in being a PWA and few if any reasons to code it in Swift and release via App Store.

 

[TracesOfArsenic]

JEEZ LawJolla, you need to be more thorough when making unpaid comments on a message board. I expect to see you discuss all points of legal address, even if it's not relevant to the conversation. You can add non-significant references to appendix B. For example, what does maritime law say about this specific situation? For each statement explain why it is or isn't relevant. Only citations made using the 19th edition of Bluebook will be accepted.

I'm particularly interested in what bird law has to say about the clone and liability for damages.

 

[Art Mark]

Interesting case. Not sure what the courts will say. It seems that the original publisher will have to win a court case saying they (their game) was actually infringed on. Then Apple could take action. I’d think if Apple takes action just on the word of any publisher they’d be in a bigger mess, no?

 

[Art Mark]

Jason Cross has an excellent, recent article about this and other significant issues re: App Store. Myself, I am eagerly awaiting the outcome of this lawsuit and especially the Eleftheriou suit which was filed a while ago. Not sure why Apple is so opposed to cleaning up the App Store. Fake reviews and scam apps have been going on for a long time. It is not millions, but billions into Apple's pocket over the years (not sure when it started the C-Level execs thought it would get this big). So we have to ask, "Why does Apple ignore this?". I think Jason is on the right track. Hard for Apple to take measures now after they have left consumers exposed for so long at so much profit. Likely "Legal" (not Marketing) has advised it is better to do nothing (admit no guilt) versus clean up the horribly excess scams and fake reviews (admit some guilt). As Jason notes, though, it could well be Marketing ("protect the brand halo") or a combo of Marketing+Legal. Advise this insightful article highly. I really hope Eleftheriou and his lawyers push all the way past discovery and go to court. Pretty sure Apple will offer ALOT of cash to avoid this, but Eleftheriou seems to be motivated by more than just cashing in. Link:

Wordle may be fixed, but the App Store is still a total mess

Scams, knockoffs, ripoffs, and fake reviews abound, but it doesn't have to be this way.

www.macworld.com

PS: If you like Wordle, follow the link and install it as a PWA. Apple hates PWAs because for an app like Wordle, there is a TON OF GOOD in being a PWA and few if any reasons to code it in Swift and release via App Store.

I don’t Apple cares if it’s a PWA or not. And I’m a little confused, is Apple deciding what an infringement is or should a court? If the original games creator didn’t care since he’s not competing in the App Store why should Apple?

 

[Wildkraut]

Jason Cross has an excellent, recent article about this and other significant issues re: App Store. Myself, I am eagerly awaiting the outcome of this lawsuit and especially the Eleftheriou suit which was filed a while ago. Not sure why Apple is so opposed to cleaning up the App Store. Fake reviews and scam apps have been going on for a long time. It is not millions, but billions into Apple's pocket over the years (not sure when it started the C-Level execs thought it would get this big). So we have to ask, "Why does Apple ignore this?". I think Jason is on the right track. Hard for Apple to take measures now after they have left consumers exposed for so long at so much profit. Likely "Legal" (not Marketing) has advised it is better to do nothing (admit no guilt) versus clean up the horribly excess scams and fake reviews (admit some guilt). As Jason notes, though, it could well be Marketing ("protect the brand halo") or a combo of Marketing+Legal. Advise this insightful article highly. I really hope Eleftheriou and his lawyers push all the way past discovery and go to court. Pretty sure Apple will offer ALOT of cash to avoid this, but Eleftheriou seems to be motivated by more than just cashing in. Link:

Wordle may be fixed, but the App Store is still a total mess

Scams, knockoffs, ripoffs, and fake reviews abound, but it doesn't have to be this way.

www.macworld.com

PS: If you like Wordle, follow the link and install it as a PWA. Apple hates PWAs because for an app like Wordle, there is a TON OF GOOD in being a PWA and few if any reasons to code it in Swift and release via App Store.

Me too, but i find very strange that the last lawsuits always landed on judge Yvonne Gonzalez Rogers table.
I hope i‘m wrong, but smells like $ changed sides under the table…
I think there is more to this, maybe economic interests and enforcing international market power.
Or just a nice way to spy on users, just like USA forced UK to block Huawei, which recently came to light.

Anyway, all very shady, at least there are more nations involved into this.

 

[macduke]

I thought they changed the name to PUBG: BATTLEGROUNDS, or PUBGBG for short as I will refer to it from here on out. Stupid, right? But also hilarious. As someone who has really loved PUBGBG over the years and stackin up those those chicky chicky din dins, I think PUBGBG is dying and trying to make a desperate attempt at a cash grab before they become completely irrelevant. It was kinda sad when PUBGBG tried to sue Fortnite. They're really quite different games.

Here's the way I understand the history of it all, having lived it and played a lot of it, though my memory may be foggy: PUBGBG didn't come up with the concept of battle royale. It was actually a book/movie called Battle Royale. Then that concept kinda got copied by The Hunger Games. Then that turned into a Minecraft mod on servers, and then a mod for the game Arma 3 that included a lot of the mechanics of PUBGBG before PUBGBG was even an idea. There is even an actual game called H1Z1 that predated PUBGBG. Then PUBGBG came out around the time of Fortnite. But Fortnite was more of a crafting game mixed with an objective game. I was actually really interested in it before it came out and followed it's development. In the OG Fortnite it was more like a mix between Minecraft and Halo? Not sure if that's a perfect analogy but yeah. You could craft things beyond just slapped together towers like treehouses and forts and collect resources and build bases and have objective gametypes like holding zones and capture the flag, the sort of stuff that I play a lot in Halo. But then when PUBGBG became really popular and little known Twitch streamer Ninja made his big debut playing PUBG. It was the height of that popularity. So Epic Games pivoted to copy some of those gameplay mechanics into a free to play version of Fortnite, called Fortnite Battle Royale. Ninja ended up going over to playing that and the rest is history with the crazy popularity of that game.

PUBGBG has been salty ever since, even though I don't think they really deserve it. The game is horribly buggy and prone to crashes and disconnects and it took years to get into a halfway decent condition. But even on my Xbox Series X the graphics still look like warmed over dog crap and the FPS isn't great considering how terrible the graphics are vs. how powerful this console is compared to the original Xbox One it came out on. The menu UI/UX is also terrible and they're always changing the way weapons work so it's impossible to know what to use when I play duos with my buddy every couple weeks. They'll also just randomly completely reset all of my settings so I have to configure my controls again, but I won't realize it until I'm in a game.

 

[labyrinth153]

One of my biggest frustrations with the app store are obviously false apps. "bubbles for snapchat" or "Guide to PUBG $2.99". Or the junk that advertises with footage of AOE2 that has been going around. I imagine it is worse on the other side of the table for Android, but it's still a sore spot for me.

 

[Wollombi]

Why hasn't Epic Games been sued by PUBG?

They were, but PUBG eventually dropped the suit. Did you read the article?

 

[softtree]

Reading through the complaint, I think the challenge is going to be convincing the court that any of the things Garena copied are copyrightable. PUBG obviously didn't invent helmets with visors or frying pans in a shooter game, for example. Even if the game at issue is a much more blatant clone than, say, Fortnite, that doesn't necessarily change the legal answer on whether the parts copied are protected by copyright. A lot of music lawsuits recently, such as Gray v. Perry, have run into similar issues. Most likely this will be settled before the court has to meaningfully weigh in on any of it, though.

 

[Wollombi]

Apple wanted to keep control of the sole method of payment in the App Store, so now they get to keep the liability that goes with it when they sell an infringing product on their app store. If they are receiving a commission, then they are, in effect, selling the product in tandem with the developer.

Pretty sure Apple didn't see this coming, but they really should have. If they did, they either didn't prepare or decided that any losses sustained would be acceptable. Note that approach isn't about right or wrong, or a creator's right to their IP, just whether they can afford the penalty or not, indicating that, despite their best arguments/pleas lately, they really don't GAF about developers beyond what they can charge (some might say extort from) them for access. And they don't GAF about end users in the same way.

 

[boss.king]

Cry cry cry, Apple stop regulating your App Store and telling us what we can and can not do. Wait some time…. Cry cry cry. Apple please regulate the App Store because we want you to stop people from copying us. You can’t have it both ways. Also, if I sell stuff in a store why am I going to care who makes what? I just sell the stuff. If you want to blame the store then can we get all the counterfeit stuff of Amazon please?

You realize that these are different parties, right? They’re allowed to have different objections to the things Apple does.

 

[I7guy]

App Store review process doing what it does best: Giving the green light to apps that will make Apple more money.

How does apple know an app will be able to earn revenue?

 

[I7guy]

Apple wanted to keep control of the sole method of payment in the App Store, so now they get to keep the liability that goes with it when they sell an infringing product on their app store. If they are receiving a commission, then they are, in effect, selling the product in tandem with the developer.

Pretty sure Apple didn't see this coming, but they really should have. If they did, they either didn't prepare or decided that any losses sustained would be acceptable. Note that approach isn't about right or wrong, or a creator's right to their IP, just whether they can afford the penalty or not, indicating that, despite their best arguments/pleas lately, they really don't GAF about developers beyond what they can charge them for access. And they don't GAF about end users in the same way.

I’m pretty sure apple has this covered and possibly may even have thought about it. It’s easy to file a lawsuit, harder to win it.

 

[Michael Scrip]

If you want to blame the store then can we get all the counterfeit stuff off Amazon please?

Amazon makes money on all sales... both real and counterfeit.

So you can see why they aren't in a hurry to eliminate all the fake products.

I'd imagine Apple is quite happy with all the money they make from fake or scam apps too... as crappy as that is.

 

[4jasontv]

It was kinda sad when PUBGBG tried to sue Fortnite. They're really quite different games.

Here's the way I understand the history of it all, having lived it and played a lot of it, though my memory may be foggy: PUBGBG didn't come up with the concept of battle royale. It was actually a book/movie called Battle Royale. Then that concept kinda got copied by The Hunger Games. Then that turned into a Minecraft mod on servers, and then a mod for the game Arma 3 that included a lot of the mechanics of PUBGBG before PUBGBG was even an idea. There is even an actual game called H1Z1 that predated PUBGBG. Then PUBGBG came out around the time of Fortnite. But Fortnite was more of a crafting game mixed with an objective game. I was actually really interested in it before it came out and followed it's development. In the OG Fortnite it was more like a mix between Minecraft and Halo? Not sure if that's a perfect analogy but yeah. You could craft things beyond just slapped together towers like treehouses and forts and collect resources and build bases and have objective gametypes like holding zones and capture the flag, the sort of stuff that I play a lot in Halo. But then when PUBGBG became really popular and little known Twitch streamer Ninja made his big debut playing PUBG. It was the height of that popularity. So Epic Games pivoted to copy some of those gameplay mechanics into a free to play version of Fortnite, called Fortnite Battle Royale. Ninja ended up going over to playing that and the rest is history with the crazy popularity of that game.

The game H1Z1 does predate PUBGBG, but it was made by the same guy, Brendan Greene. The difference between PUBGBG and previous games was that PUBGBG was a dedicated battle royale game as opposed to a mod.

The issue with Fortnite was that Epic allegedly used their Unreal Engine support team to review unreleased games. Epic had access to the PUBGBG game prior to either game being released. After Epic got access to PUBGBG they changed Fortnite from being a sandbox survival game to a battle royale game. The differences between Fortnite and PUBGBG were a result of not having time to change the code. No question about it, Fortnite is a clone of PUBGBG. The only issue is, was it ok for the Fortnite team to review PUBGBG via the Unreal support team?

 

[Macbookprodude]

Good ! Its a stupid game anyway !

 

[Nuvi]

This is funny… You guys know what Epic games (Fortnite), Bluehole (PUBG) and Garena (Free Fire) have in common? They are all Tencent Holdings Limited companies. Yep, so Chinese giant which is major Epic owner (Fortnite), has large ownership of PUBG and Garena Free Fire too. PUBG can’t really go after Garena because that would be like dog chasing after its own tail, they decide to sue Apple and Google.

 

[Runequester]

If they had removed the app, people would all be busy screaming that Apple censors the app store.

 

[jinnj]

Another reason why we need alternative AppStores. Funny is, that Apple started to intensively advert PUBG in the AppStore right after kicking Fortnite out.
Now Apple is being sued by them, too. ?

I❤️it!

PUBG purchased those ads as soon as Epic took its app off the store.

 

[joshavtech]

As an IP attorney, they're on solid ground here if the games are substantially similar in look and feel.

Bethesda won a nice settlement against Warner Brothers for "stealing" Fallout Shelter for their Westworld game.

If Apple/Google are knowingly profiting from an infringing product, they are liable vicariously.

I play PUBG

This is correct. I'm surprised the IP attorney in this thread hasn't commented on this aspect, but in the US (and most other jurisdictions), gameplay mechanics are covered under patent law, not copyright. Copyright only protects the expression of an idea, not the idea itself, and unless Krafton applied for and received a patent for the battle royale format (possible, but highly unlikely), they have no standing for an infringement claim on the gameplay aspect whatsoever.

The only other area where they could potentially have a claim is under trademark protection. There is a legal concept called trade dress which covers the "look and feel" of a product, and the legal standard generally applied is whether a competing product causes "confusion in the marketplace;" that is, if someone could plausibly mistake your clone for the real thing.

So they might have a case for trademark infringement, there's a small chance they could have a case for patent infringement if they actually secured a software patent on battle royale (then is Epic licensing it for Fortnite?), but unless they can prove the clones use specific media or code from PUBG, copyright doesn't enter into this case.

They definitely do. I play PUBG on console and mobile. One look at the App Store page for the “clone app”, and you can tell they copied everything. It’s WAY more than just the gameplay concept. It’s almost like they ported the game over, changed some of the text, then clicked “submit” to the App Store. All of the fonts/menus look exactly like the PUBG game.