Quad, dual core? Can't wait for Macintel

Monyx

macrumors regular
Original poster
Oct 24, 2005
100
1
Australia
IN SHORT: help me justify the Quad!! ;-)

AUD$4600 - lot of money for a chipset that will be replaced in ~1yrs time. I will not have $$$ left over to upgrade software so will I get the full benefit using: FCP4.1, DVDSP3, PShop CS1, Nikon Capture4? I don't change machines often, I want 4+ yrs out of this purchase if possible.

Quad was not on my shopping list but I see fully-loaded 2nd hand G5s with an LCD sell for prices approaching what I can buy a stock Quad for (Educ pricing). My dilemma is I just can't hold out until the next generation since I've made this old G4 last so long.
 

slipper

macrumors 68000
Nov 19, 2003
1,539
29
Come on guys, be nice.

But im just wondering, what the hell are you talking about?
 

Bear

macrumors G3
Jul 23, 2002
8,089
4
Sol III - Terra
Monyx said:
IN SHORT: help me justify the Quad!! ;-)
...
What will you be running on the machine?

Remember some of the "Pro" apps will take a while until there is an Intel native version available. And these apps will not run well if they run at all under Rosetta. Take Photoshop for an example - it will run under a G3 (which is what Rosetta emulates) but then it has no Altvec instructions, so it runs at G3 speeds, not G4 or G5 speeds (under Rosetta).

Also, the odds are that the last machine to go Intel will be the PowerMac.

And add to that, how long do you want your current machine to work for you. Remember PPC applications don't die the day Intel Macs are released. Nor do they stop being shipped - that will take until 2010 before PPC software support falls off.

You know you want the Quad.
 

bigandy

macrumors G3
Apr 30, 2004
8,855
0
Murka
agreed. the time it'll take for PPC support to die, it'd be better going for the quad, and it'll last until you're at the point where you can comfortably move over, knowing your machine's lasted a good while.
 

gekko513

macrumors 603
Oct 16, 2003
6,302
1
Monyx said:
IN SHORT: help me justify the Quad!! ;-)
I can do that.

Now is the perfect time to get a PowerMac. If you get a it now it will be time to upgrade in 4-5 years time. At that time, Intel PowerMacs will most likely have been available for 2 years. This means that most pro software will finally have Intel versions and will be reasonably free of bugs. Apple have had time to introduce the second revision Intel model, so any hardware problems have also likely been sorted out.

And since most Macs in use at that time will still be PowerPC based, there will be little Intel only software.

If you choose to wait, you will have to wait two years. In those two years you will lose a lot of productivity. Then, when you get the Intel based PowerMac, you will have to be part of the trial and error period with lots of bugs. This will likely also reduce your productivity.

So, there you have it. If you want to maximise your productivity, get the Quad now. Did that help?
 

Monyx

macrumors regular
Original poster
Oct 24, 2005
100
1
Australia
gekko513 said:
Now is the perfect time to get a PowerMac. If you get a it now it will be time to upgrade in 4-5 years time.
So, there you have it. If you want to maximise your productivity, get the Quad now. Did that help?
Your predictions on Intel switch crystalises it... I'm definitely committed to PPC, has to work from right now with today's PPC Apps.

The only problem is the $AUD1600 jump from BTO 2Ghz (2GB,250GB,Nv6600,wireless) to Qaud (2Gb/250Gb/wireless).
Most demanding areas are: Compressor encoding, FCP rendering and RAW processing in PShop CS1 & Nikon Capture - perhaps not enough of a power user for a Qaud?!
 

Bear

macrumors G3
Jul 23, 2002
8,089
4
Sol III - Terra
Monyx said:
...
Most demanding areas are: Compressor encoding, FCP rendering and RAW processing in PShop CS1 & Nikon Capture - perhaps not enough of a power user for a Qaud?!
Compressor Encoding and FCP rendering will run faster on a QUAD.

As for NEF processing. Nikon Capture is very definitely processor aware. As is Photoshop. Also, if you run both at the same time like I do, having the Quad processors will be very nice. Also, if you have the encoding or rendering running while you are working with Photos, the QUAD bcomes even nicer to have.

Just remember to get enough RAM to cover your needs. 4GB is probably a good starting number for what you are using the machine for.
 

Dont Hurt Me

macrumors 603
Dec 21, 2002
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Yahooville S.C.
PPC is on the way out and the only way Apple can get decent speeds is with refrigeration. Plus a Intel Mac should allow everything to run on it in theory:D my 2 cents max out you G4 and wait, 2006 is around the corner.
 

Monyx

macrumors regular
Original poster
Oct 24, 2005
100
1
Australia
Bear said:
Also, if you have the encoding or rendering running while you are working with Photos, the QUAD bcomes even nicer to have.
I'm going to have restructure my whole workflow...coming from G4DP you learn to leave it alone on encodes/burns to ensure success. I'll have to be glued to the workstation just to keep 'em 4 cores busy!
 

allroy

macrumors member
Mar 10, 2004
61
0
Why a Quad...

Do you need it or just want it, buy a Dual 2 for $1800 w/ edu. discount save the extra $1199 for say more RAM, software or keep it if you decide to upgrade when the intel macs come out. You mentioned a used G5 AND lcd come close to the Quad G5 price... ummm so your going to use the Quad with no monitor?
 

Chundles

macrumors G4
Jul 4, 2005
11,981
364
Do it. You'll be the coolest kid on the block.

Hmm, going from two 1.42GHz G4's to two dualcore 2.5GHz G5's is going to be like night and day. Absolutely amazing....
 

Monyx

macrumors regular
Original poster
Oct 24, 2005
100
1
Australia
allroy said:
Do you need it or just want it, buy a Dual 2 for $1800 w/ edu. discount save the extra $1199 for say more RAM, software or keep it if you decide to upgrade when the intel macs come out. You mentioned a used G5 AND lcd come close to the Quad G5 price... ummm so your going to use the Quad with no monitor?
Yes it's 'want' not need...justified I guess if it lasts 4+ yrs. Whereas I wonder whether DualCore 2 will see me looking to intel sooner?
I'd put BT and 2GB ram in and run my old Studio display 17" until i saved a bit more cash for bigger HDs.
It is 'semi-pro' use - I edit weddings now with 280gb so 250gb will get me by - I shoot Sony DVCam, no need or market for HDV - most clients still want ask VHS w/ DVDs...so not concerned about moving beyond SD DVD for some years.
 

dmw007

macrumors G4
May 26, 2005
10,635
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Working for MI-6
Chundles said:
Do it. You'll be the coolest kid on the block.

Hmm, going from two 1.42GHz G4's to two dualcore 2.5GHz G5's is going to be like night and day. Absolutely amazing....
Heck, one of the coolest in the world.

Q-U-A-D G5's *drool* :)
 

andiwm2003

macrumors 601
Mar 29, 2004
4,326
379
Boston, MA
if buying the quad means you don't have money left to upgrade your software then you can't afford it. it's as simple as that.

new software will have more impact on your work than more power.

and you may need money down the road for some other things (screen?, printer?, camera?).


why don't you go for a old dual 2.0? if you could do with a G4 for so long you should be able to go with a dual g5 2.0 for two more years.

seems you want the quad but you don't absolutely need it.

edit: wrote that before your 8:37 post.
 

dmw007

macrumors G4
May 26, 2005
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Working for MI-6
Monyx said:
Yes it's 'want' not need...justified I guess if it lasts 4+ yrs. Whereas I wonder whether DualCore 2 will see me looking to intel sooner?
I'd put BT and 2GB ram in and run my old Studio display 17" until i saved a bit more cash for bigger HDs.
It is 'semi-pro' use - I edit weddings now with 280gb so 250gb will get me by - I shoot Sony DVCam, no need or market for HDV - most clients still want ask VHS w/ DVDs...so not concerned about moving beyond SD DVD for some years.

Monyx, if you are planning on using it for 4+years, then go for the Quad Power Mac G5. You will appreciate all the extra speed in the long run.
Plus, just the thought of owning one of these supercomputers is something that to me would be irresistible if I had not just plunked down $2,800 for my current G5. Go for the Quad, you will be sorry if you don't. :)
 

Monyx

macrumors regular
Original poster
Oct 24, 2005
100
1
Australia
andiwm2003 said:
seems you want the quad but you don't absolutely need it.
Yes, Quad is long way from old dual. Here's how I end up at Quad: I was seriously looking at loaded old dual 2.5 + 20" @ US$3080 on ebay - I stopped @ $2400:

http://tinyurl.com/e26jo

Applestore Edu Quad + 2Gb ram = US$3800 & will make do with my Studio 17" for few months. I already have some gadgets i.e. DVCam, TRV18E MiniDV, D70 + lenses, Harman Kardon & Technics spkrs just the computer draggin its heels.
 

Makosuke

macrumors 603
Aug 15, 2001
6,153
341
The Cool Part of CA, USA
In your situation, I'd probably get the quad, and not worry too much about Intel--it'll be a while yet before the PMs ship (I expect laptops first, and they'll have more advantages), and longer before everything is running smoothly. In fact, this is what I intend to do sometime next year--get a maxxed out Quad watever-is-good, and an Intel PB, so I have a stable desktop and a get-used-to-it laptop to carry me through the transition years.

Advantage of a dualcore 2.0 or 2.3: You will have enough money *now* for a better monitor, and/or a better graphics card, and/or some software upgrades (which WILL make a difference), and/or a heap of RAM. Disadvantage: You've got what youv'e got for the next couple years at least.

Advantage of a quad: Maxed out on speed, which should comfortably carry you through the four years you're wanting without issue. Disadvantage is you have to put up with older software and monitor for a while until you can afford upgrades.

Question: You said 17" studio... that's ADC, right? Aren't you going to need an ADC adapter to use that with your new machine? That's pretty pricey with what new LCDs are going for these days...
 

ipacmm

macrumors 65816
Jun 17, 2003
1,304
0
Cincinnati, OH
Monyx said:
Applestore Edu Quad + 2Gb ram = US$3800 & will make do with my Studio 17" for few months. I already have some gadgets i.e. DVCam, TRV18E MiniDV, D70 + lenses, Harman Kardon & Technics spkrs just the computer draggin its heels.
You could also save some money by ordering you 2GB of ram from crucial.
 

egrissom

macrumors newbie
Oct 19, 2005
17
0
Red Bank, NJ
I noticed you mentioned- FCP4.1

THEN DO NOT GET A NEW MAC, quad dual core whatever.

I just got my new 2.3 dual core today and after installing FCP 4 found out the horror of it all. the new macs do not work with FCP 4.5 or earlier. you have to run fcp 5, or you don't run anything. it totally sucks. hope you haven't ordered yet. the older g5s will work (new ones use PCI Express which FCP 4.5 and earlier do not support)
 

~Shard~

macrumors P6
Jun 4, 2003
18,388
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1123.6536.5321
If you're going to be doing Pro stuff, and if you want it to last 4+ years, get the quad - the sheer longevity of that machine will be fine for you. Keep in mind though that over the next 4 years Apple will be introducing new technologies which may not integrate into that box - certain video cards perhaps, faster RAM, Blu Ray... but hey, that's technology for ya!

As for the Intel machines, the Intel PowerMacs will not even be out until 2007, over a year from now, and will be sporting Conroe/Woodcrest chipsets. Personally, I'd want to wait at least a year into the transition to let the dust settle and make sure the Macs being pumped out are solid. If you still had your quad at that time, you definitely wouldn't be hurting with it, and could easily weather the storm. :cool:

Let us know what you decide! (And if you BTO it, with 1 TB storage, 16 GB of RAM, etc.! :eek: ;))
 

Monyx

macrumors regular
Original poster
Oct 24, 2005
100
1
Australia
egrissom said:
I just got my new 2.3 dual core today and after installing FCP 4 found out the horror of it all. the new macs do not work with FCP 4.5 or earlier. you have to run fcp 5, or you don't run anything.
Yep, checked this out already - apparently there is an easy fix, same as running it on G3, detailed on the Apple discussions FCP board:

http://discussions.info.apple.com/webx?14@1007.FqbiatcoSBf.3@.68bc8dcd

Chundles said:
Hmm, going from two 1.42GHz G4's to two dualcore 2.5GHz G5's is going to be like night and day. Absolutely amazing....
Night & Day alright, check this....I'm upgrading from Dual G4 500 Mzh NOT 1.42Ghz!!!