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Qualcomm Claims New X85 Modem Creates 'Huge Delta' in Performance Versus Apple

Even as a long-time Apple fan, I would opine that this was an entirely predictable -- and welcome -- press release from Qualcomm. Because this means that Qualcomm isn't just sitting comfortably on their monopoly anymore: now we have a horse race. And that's good for everyone.
 
I7guy said:
But people laud android because the ai on android devices can repair photos? There is a long, long way to go.
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This proves you have no clue whats possible with AI on Android. Laughable and typical 😂😂😂
 
HJM.NL said:
Apple will end up as Atari. The negt gen X elite 8 (for mobile) is already faster than the A18 pro. Qualcomm is specialized in making modem chips and I’ve little faith in Apple to surpass them.
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Apple doesn't need to have the best modem.

High speed transfer rates should be a pretty low priority since most Apple customers won't need it.

Where Apple should focus their attention is:
  1. Holding on to the signal in low signal areas
  2. Better performance in low signal areas
  3. Some improvements in latency
  4. Even lower power usage
 
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turbineseaplane said:
The replies are already hilarious

If this was reversed and it was Apple's modem, it would be a DUNK FEST

C'mon guys .. let's all slightly de-tint the Apple colored shades
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No, because Qualcomm has the wrong focus.

Everything should be made to use as little energy as possible and at the same time providing decent performance.

Where Apple has to improve the C1, is being better at handling low signal areas and maybe latency. Higher transfer rate should have an extremely low priority.
 
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turbineseaplane said:
While I agree with your point, we all know it would in fact be a "yay Apple!" .. "BOOM .. Apple wins again!" dunk fest if it were reversed, even if it were totally pointless, as it often is
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it would only be good if Apple also could achieve low power usage. Throughput is almost never a good thing if it costs power.
 
Wizec said:
What I would really like? A modem that gets 200Mb/s, and sips battery like there’s no tomorrow.
Or, give me a toggle switch to put it alone into low power mode.
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The expression "like there’s no tomorrow" means it would sip battery fast without any care about tomorrow.
But what you said after sounds like you want the opposite, something that consumes as little battery as possible.
 
I7guy said:
It’s laughable because there really isnt much. AI on android are some parlor tricks.

And while Qualcomm says the new chips use AI obviously not ChatGPT.
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Clueless and pointless again. AI on Qualcomm’s modems will make certain the user benefits from the best experience possible without having to deal with settings.

That’s an example of useful AI compared to a braindead Siri, Genmoji and censored image playgrounds.
 
hans1972 said:
Apple doesn't need to have the best modem.

High speed transfer rates should be a pretty low priority since most Apple customers won't need it.

Where Apple should focus their attention is:
  1. Holding on to the signal in low signal areas
  2. Better performance in low signal areas
  3. Some improvements in latency
  4. Even lower power usage
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Does Apple deliver on that compared to Qualcomm modems? You have a comparison sheet?
 
mazz0 said:
I expect that's true. It is Apple's first go after all.

Gotta say, I don't really see the use-cases for this. It's already more than fast enough for web browsing and streaming media, what else are you doing with a phone or tethered device?

Edit: like @Wizec says - power efficiency seems far more important.
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It's almost certainly NOT true.

Qualcomm know what's in their modem. They DON'T know what's in Apple's modem.
But plenty of Apple patents talk about the exact same thing, using "AI" to make decisions about the optimal combination of MIMO features, band combining, etc...

Will there be some particular set of circumstances under which QC does better with a weak signal than Apple? Probably.
Will there be some particular set of circumstances under which Apple does better with a weak signal than QC? Probably.
Will the difference be so obvious, so common, that anyone actually cares? Unlikely.
 
HJM.NL said:
Clueless and pointless again. AI on Qualcomm’s modems will make certain the user benefits from the best experience possible without having to deal with settings.
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How could know that from an announcement without seeing any implementation? Slinging around ad-Homs meant go far here.
HJM.NL said:
That’s an example of useful AI compared to a braindead Siri, Genmoji and censored image playgrounds.
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Useful (or useless) is completely subjective.
 
attila said:
What the heck is an "AI powered" modem?! This term is buzzed out of relevance by now.
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That mainly shows that you know nothing about the problem space.

At any given time a modem has a vast number of options it can configure. eg it has multiple antennas. Should it configure those for
- beam combining (create a stronger signal that can go a longer distance)
- alamouti coding (creating a signal that can handle fast fading, ie rapid changes in signal strength)
- independent data streams (maximum bandwidth)
?
You can of course combine the above features. Then what if you are going fast (eg on a high speed train and doppler shift is an issue)? What if the SNR/interference around you keeps changing rapidly? etc etc

The 5G spec provides a massive number of options. Which should you use on any particular packet transmission?
This is not a trivial problem; it's more akin to a self-driving car than to calculating an integral, that is it's more a pattern recognition problem (try many thing, see which work and which fail, figure out a way to represent the pattern of successes) than a single provably correct solution.
In other words it's a good match to AI...


The same, BTW, is true for modern video encoding. Same issue - massive number of options, not at all obvious what the optimal set of options is for any block, AI is a good solution; and people who don't understand the problem claiming that its use is just advertising hype.
 
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Like many posts here, I too could care less about the top end speed. Reliability to me is worth a lot more. Solid connections at a usable speed, all the time, no failures. These modem companies need to focus on the connection, and not the speed.
 
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name99 said:
That mainly shows that you know nothing about the problem space.

At any given time a modem has a vast number of options it can configure. eg it has multiple antennas. Should it configure those for
- beam combining (create a stronger signal that can go a longer distance)
- alamouti coding (creating a signal that can handle fast fading, ie rapid changes in signal strength)
- independent data streams (maximum bandwidth)
?
You can of course combine the above features. Then what if you are going fast (eg on a high speed train and doppler shift is an issue)? What if the SNR/interference around you keeps changing rapidly? etc etc

The 5G spec provides a massive number of options. Which should you use on any particular packet transmission?
This is not a trivial problem; it's more akin to a self-driving car than to calculating an integral, that is it's more a pattern recognition problem (try many thing, see which work and which fail, figure out a way to represent the pattern of successes) than a single provably correct solution.
In other words it's a good match to AI...


The same, BTW, is true for modern video encoding. Same issue - massive number of options, not at all obvious what the optimal set of options is for any block, AI is a good solution; and people who don't understand the problem claiming that its use is just advertising hype.
Click to expand...
finally someone explaining the common sense instead of being a “all things Timmy” cheerleader. Thanks 👍🏻
 
Narg said:
Like many posts here, I too could care less about the top end speed. Reliability to me is worth a lot more. Solid connections at a usable speed, all the time, no failures. These modem companies need to focus on the connection, and not the speed.
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They should focus on both and I would choose the best if they’re comparable in price.
 
JitteryJimmy said:
This reminds me of this headline: "Blackberry's powerful Storm will blow away Apple's iPhone"
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I think you must be referring to "BlackBerry’s Storm Aims to Blow the iPhone Away".

I was a Crackberry addict myself, back-in-the-day -- but clearly, RIM's aim was a little off the mark, at that late stage of the game... and while I do see how your comparison could be apt, it remains to be seen if Qualcomm's efforts will mirror RIM's failure.
 
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Maybe. But expecting Apple's modem to evolve and be better over time. For now Qualcomm may be leading.
 
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Narg said:
Like many posts here, I too could care less about the top end speed. Reliability to me is worth a lot more. Solid connections at a usable speed, all the time, no failures. These modem companies need to focus on the connection, and not the speed.
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Exactly. It’s about the user experience. I would choose slower and reliable with good battery life any day if the week against faster and less battery life.
 
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deathnite said:
The expression "like there’s no tomorrow" means it would sip battery fast without any care about tomorrow.
But what you said after sounds like you want the opposite, something that consumes as little battery as possible.
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True enough, but, where I’m from, “like there’s no tomorrow” is used more generically to simply emphasize the antecedent, e.g. “sip”. So, the intent was simply to emphasize that the modem should sip power, not guzzle.

I could have used a more widely understood idiom though 😊
 
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Qualcomm is losing its biggest customer and this is all they can talk about now. I mean Apple is still paying for some patents for their modems but as 6G comes around the corner that could actually end up with QC paying Apple, lol.

Hopefully the C2 will support 5.5G (5G Advanced) for the much higher upload speeds but aside from that as others have stated speeds are 'good enough'
 
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BootsWalking said:
AI in a cellular chip that improves connectivity for weak signals. What does it do - guess the data in the air?
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How about check other channels for signal strength with a switch to the better signal in milliseconds?
 
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