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Doesn't matter.
Even if Qualcom were to be prevailant, the US government would simply overturn this import-ban too.
 
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This was a predictable move from Qualcomm, it's the best leverage they have over Apple. But surely Apple must have known this would happen, and felt extremely confident they could block it or get around it, given that iPhone sales account for the majority of Apple's revenue.
 
"Qualcomm claims Apple "could not have built the incredible iPhone franchise" without relying on Qualcomm's "fundamental cellular technologies.""

i wonder what a "Standards-essential patent" is

I wonder what Google is.
 
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Plus if you looked at the earnings report carefully, Apple is putting all the unpaid money into an account, so they can pay everything at a moment's notice. With the money being right there in case Qualcomm wins a court case, it is extremely unlikely that Qualcomm would win an injunction.

Nice catch. I had hoped they were putting it a separate trust, but could find nothing about it. It's clearly in the Q2 report. I also agree Qualcomm will not win any injunction. This will end eventually with Apple using all Intel Modems in time. IMO, you will also see Apple look to Intel for ARM Fabrication in the coming years to offset TSMC. :apple:
 
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... If Apple charge $1 for an iPhone, Qualcomm gets, maybe $0.01? If they charge $1,000 why should Qualcomm get $10? ...

Can't have it both ways. When Apple sued Samsung for rounded corners, Apple got a percentage of the entire cost of Samsung's phones sold. Apple didnt just ask for the cost of the plastic phone shell.
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no one said it was.

This news story is saying Apple has stopped payments. That sounds like free to me.
 
Cook is notorious for low balling Western companies to the point of bankruptcy so he can transfer the intellectual property offshore to produce for less. Hope Qualcomm is smarter than to become another one of Cook's victims.
 
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Doesn't matter.
Even if Qualcom were to be prevailant, the US government would simply overturn this import-ban too.

No, this is totally up to POTUS and as I've said earlier, Trump is no Obama (and Qualcomm is no Samsung). To make matters worse for Apple, while Apple has many allies in high places, Qualcomm is an American company with considerable political/lobbying power in the US.
 
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What if America manufactures all iPhone from the bbeginning? I mean, if iPhone 7 is manufactured in America and export to other countries, what would Qualcomm do? Ban the sale? Or whatever?
 
The last time Apple tried to get out of paying for a FRAND patent because they claimed the price was too high, the ITC banned their devices from import:

ITC Rules Apple Infringed on Samsung Patents, Issues Cease and Desist Order for Older Apple Devices - MacRumors 2013

And that was with Samsung reportedly asking for "a licensing fee of 2.4% per device sold, which Apple found to be unreasonable." The ITC ruled 1) that royalties based on price were standard with cellular patents, and that 2) it was just an initial offer, which Apple was expected to negotiate down.

Fortunately for Apple, the Obama administration stepped in and vetoed the import ban, saying that a ban could not used for a FRAND situation... unless the licensee continued to avoid actual negotiating.

Not so sure Trump would do the same, if the ITC rules in a similar manner.
Would be quite the bargaining chip for Trump to get Apple to repatriate their hordes of cash though. "I'll lift this ban if you repatriate at a much higher tax rate and it will still cost less than it will cost you to have iPhones banned in the US."
 
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Qualcomm's entire market capitalization is less than a quarter of the cash Apple has on hand. Thats kinda like getting in a fender-bender accident with a guy who has more cash in his wallet than your entire net worth. While I don't necessarily agree with the concept, when you "follow the money" you can generally predict the outcome of almost any event.
 
Can't have it both ways. When Apple sued Samsung for rounded corners, Apple got a percentage of the entire cost of Samsung's phones sold. Apple didnt just ask for the cost of the plastic phone shell.
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This news story is saying Apple has stopped payments. That sounds like free to me.
It's not free, it's in the court system. Apple is being sued, doesn't sound like free to me. They still owe money (maybe), to be decided to by the courts. No different than not paying a contractor for shoddy work. You didn't get the work free, your payment to the contractor will be determined by what happens in the suit or the lien on your house.
 
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IANAL, but if Apple uses Qualcomm IP in a chip manufactured by someone else, shouldn't that third party manufacturer have paid the license to use the Qualcomm IP? If Apple is designing a chip that uses Qualcomm IP, and is just farming out its manufacture, then yes, Apple should be paying the license. However, why isn't the IP the thing that gets charged for, and not the entire price of the iPhone? If Apple charge $1 for an iPhone, Qualcomm gets, maybe $0.01? If they charge $1,000 why should Qualcomm get $10? The Qualcomm IP is in the chip using that IP, not the App Store, or the way icons wiggle when you hold them down, or what the multitasking screen looks like, or Touch ID, or Lightning etc. It seems to me that Qualcomm is being greedy.

Are smartphones the only industry where you can claim a percentage of the sale price (or profit) of a device because one of your chips is in it?

It's no different than Apple claiming 20% of an app purchase whether it cost $.99 or $9.99.
 
Good. Apple thinks they can run roughshod over everyone else in the industry. They've finally met their match.

(Don't expect Apple to ever use Qualcomm again though.)
 
Qualcomm's entire market capitalization is less than a quarter of the cash Apple has on hand. Thats kinda like getting in a fender-bender accident with a guy who has more cash in his wallet than your entire net worth. While I don't necessarily agree with the concept, when you "follow the money" you can generally predict the outcome of almost any event.

Just a note that 93% of Apple's cash is held by its shell companies outside the U.S.

Only about $16 billion is kept in the U.S. for operating expenses.

In fact, in the U.S., Apple is close to $100 billion in DEBT, since it's cheaper for them to borrow money than to pay taxes to repatriate their offshore cash.

What if America manufactures all iPhone from the bbeginning? I mean, if iPhone 7 is manufactured in America and export to other countries, what would Qualcomm do? Ban the sale? Or whatever?

Good question. The ITC can only ban foreign imports. Its purpose is to protect US companies from imports which infringe US patents.

So if Apple made and sold a subset of iPhones in the US (and not in a foreign exclusion zone) the ITC would have no jurisdiction over them.

However, since Apple buys chips outside the US to avoid US taxes, the ITC can ban their import.

The ITC has also previously ruled that their foreign purchase means Apple does not get the benefit of US common law patent exhaustion protection:

itc_patent_exhaustion.png
 
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Due to FRAND though it should be reasonable and Apple is arguing the royalties aren't reasonable.

If the royalties weren't reasonable for the quality of technology being licensed, the hundreds of licensed companies would've come up with alternative comm methods, instead of paying Qualcomm for decades.

Apple simply thinks that anything more than $1 per device for anyone else's patents, is unfair to Apple. They think they deserve special treatment, which is unfair to all the other licencees who have paid a larger fee for years.

I like that someone is standing up to Apple.

Qualcomm is no angel, but...

It is interesting to read all of Apple's contract complaints, especially if you know anything about the terms that Apple itself usually imposes on its suppliers. It's a case of Apple being faced with needing to "put on its big boy pants", as they put it to GTAT not long ago.

Qualcomm, for instance, refused to bow to Apple's usual contract requirements for huge penalties if enough chips couldn't be supplied in time, or to exclusivity. Some will remember how such clauses helped bring GTAT down.
 
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T
Good. Apple thinks they can run roughshod over everyone else in the industry. They've finally met their match.

(Don't expect Apple to ever use Qualcomm again though.)
They still use Samsung...
 
It should be based on a percentage cost of the chip surely?
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If the royalties weren't reasonable for the quality of technology being licensed, the hundreds of licensed companies would've come up with alternative comm methods, instead of paying Qualcomm for decades.

Apple simply thinks that anything more than $1 per device for anyone else's patents, is unfair to Apple. They think they deserve special treatment, which is unfair to all the other licencees who have paid a larger fee for years.



Qualcomm is no angel, but...

It is interesting to read all of Apple's contract complaints, especially if you know anything about the terms that Apple itself usually imposes on its suppliers. It's a case of Apple being faced with needing to "put on its big boy pants", as they put it to GTAT not long ago.

Qualcomm, for instance, refused to bow to Apple's usual contract requirements for huge penalties if enough chips couldn't be supplied in time, or to exclusivity. Some will remember how such clauses helped bring GTAT down.

I think you're missing the point, Apple does NOT have any agreement with them at all. They won't make a licensing deal with apple at all and won't even sit down at a table. If you have a patent you can't just declare a price it has to be fair across all phone makers and currently it's far from that. I hate apple as much as the next guy for dodgy business practices but this is where FRAND is indeed a necessity.
 
Can't have it both ways. When Apple sued Samsung for rounded corners, Apple got a percentage of the entire cost of Samsung's phones sold. Apple didnt just ask for the cost of the plastic phone shell.
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This news story is saying Apple has stopped payments. That sounds like free to me.

You're making a poor comparison. Samsung was sued because it copied Apple's design in an effort to sell its own product.

There was no licensing agreement for a technology, which is what the Qualcomm suit is about. Qualcomm is effectively trying to re-negotiate terms of an agreement because they know Apple is making and has tons of cash. And they also realize that they are going to lose a piece of business that has been generating revenue for them for years, so they're trying to delay the inevitable, in the hopes that the lawsuit itself will keep investors from dumping them.
 
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