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question about education discount

shecky said:
even better case is, you saved some money AND pissed off some of the holier-than-thous on here.
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hardly holier-than-thou. i agree that if apple wanted to police the edu store better, they absolutely could. i also agree that for most purchases, it's not worth their added effort, so they choose not to. i also think, though, that if someone is dense enough to hoot and holler that they've robbed the bank, they're silly to think no one is going to say anything.

sorry, but use the edu discount even though you don't deserve it if you want, but don't come to a public forum and tell everyone that that's what you're planning to do, and then act surprised when it starts a debate and "oh oh no let's stop talking about this now" after you've been called out for it.

honestly, the common sense on some people... :rolleyes:
 
If you're dumb enough not to take advantage of the student discount (whether you're actually a student or not), then it's your own damn loss.

If you think it's so immoral and dishonest to do it, you'll just end up like the rest of the American population, in debt up to your eye balls.

You think people like Steve Jobs got to where they are by being honest, or by taking advantage of others to move to the top.... :rolleyes:

Please, there's no morality in capitalism.
 
barkins said:
If you think it's so immoral and dishonest to do it, you'll just end up like the rest of the American population, in debt up to your eye balls.
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Not hardly.

There are plenty of successful Americans who have integrity and strong moral values and are not up to their eye balls in debt.

Yes, Apple's system is very easy to cheat. Maybe Apple won't know you cheated, but you will. What is the value of your integrity? Everyone must decide on their own. For some, it is worth very little. For others, it is worth a lot. You must decide what is right for you.

Character counts! :)
 
Buy from Amazon, get the rebate and avoid the tax - then you'll save more money than the student discount. The Student discount isn't much these days. The best deal is on AppleCare.

Debate aside, it is kind of silly to come to a message board asking us if it's ok to get the student discount. If you're not sure, why not just call apple and ask? I'm guessing it's because you know the answer. :rolleyes:

I'm not taking sides, just questioning the logic of the post. It would have made sense if the OP had wanted to know if student discounts were the cheapest way to go.
 
yojitani said:
Buy from Amazon, get the rebate and avoid the tax - then you'll save more money than the student discount. The Student discount isn't much these days. The best deal is on AppleCare.
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I'm impressed, took 30 posts this time to suggest that tax evasion is ok legally/morally while abusing the student store program is not. Usually it's in the first 5 posts.

For future reference:
Tax evasion is illegal and immoral.
Abusing the student store is immoral.

Can we try to keep the classifications straight? Obviously, YMMV on the level of immorality since everyone's morals are different.
 
It amazes me sometimes the direction that threads take.

I hope all this discussion doesn't alert Apple to the number of people that either do or consider abuse the education discount program. I'm a faculty member at a University and I appreciate the discount that's available to me however small. And yes, the Apple Care program goes from good deal to smokin' deal with the education discount.
 
JAT said:
I'm impressed, took 30 posts this time to suggest that tax evasion is ok legally/morally while abusing the student store program is not. Usually it's in the first 5 posts.

For future reference:
Tax evasion is illegal and immoral.
Abusing the student store is immoral.

Can we try to keep the classifications straight? Obviously, YMMV on the level of immorality since everyone's morals are different.
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:confused: don't buy online then. This is not tax evasion. You don't pay tax on items purchased out of state for most states. Apple has a store in most states, therefore when you buy from apple you pay tax. However, for most states when you purchase from Amazon, there is no tax. Choosing to buy without incurring tax is not immoral or illegal - it's using your wits!

If you want to debate the moral question of avoiding tax, take it to the community forum. Although from the sounds of things, there is little room for debate for you.
 
Can anybody tell me how much discount you get on apple-care. Am I right in thinking you get 15% off the hardware?

I can't access the Higher Education Site at the moment as I'm at home, and I think I have to get one of the network administrators to access it for me and they can be hard to find, so I can't check.

My girlfriend can access her university network from home but she's at a different University. If I get her to do it will the laptop/applecare then have to be in her name?

She has also purchased another laptop recently. Is there a limit to the amount of stuff 1 person can get?
 
yojitani said:
:confused: don't buy online then. This is not tax evasion. You don't pay tax on items purchased out of state for most states. Apple has a store in most states, therefore when you buy from apple you pay tax. However, for most states when you purchase from Amazon, there is no tax. Choosing to buy without incurring tax is not immoral or illegal - it's using your wits!

If you want to debate the moral question of avoiding tax, take it to the community forum. Although from the sounds of things, there is little room for debate for you.
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If you as an individual purchase $700 worth of products without paying sales tax in a calendar year (in a state with a sales tax), you owe Use Tax on those purchases. Use tax is the same dollar amount as sales tax. You can look it up in your state's laws, the $700 limit may be slightly different. Not paying this is evasion.

I did not debate morals or law-breaking in this or my prior post, I simply stated facts. Try to read only what I type, not adding to my words for me. I can be quite profuse without your assistance.

My point is that whiny people here complain about the morality of misusing Apple, but not their state. Double standard? Fanboys gone wild? Lack of knowledge about tax law?

(sorry, that was a little rude, I'm not trying to be rude, edited)
 
camking said:
Can anybody tell me how much discount you get on apple-care. Am I right in thinking you get 15% off the hardware?
...

She has also purchased another laptop recently. Is there a limit to the amount of stuff 1 person can get?
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First, there is no hard rule about the % off. It is different for each product. iPods now have $0 off, the lowest MBP is $200 (10%) off. It is about $100 off Applecare for the laptops. This is for the HE student discount. Some campus stores may have better/worse deals.

Next, you can supposedly only get one laptop, one desktop per school year. I think 2 displays, 1 of each class of iPod except unlimited on the Shuffle. Or something like that. If you log into the Edu store from a new computer (so no cookies make you miss the authorization), the authorization page tells you the limits. I don't know if people can get more than this or how Apple purports to police the various "school years" that people have, and I am not commenting on the morality of it if Apple allows people to purchase more than one.

Uh, that's through edu discounts. Obviously, you can buy as many as you want full price. :)
 
JAT said:
If you as an individual purchase $700 worth of products without paying sales tax in a calendar year (in a state with a sales tax), you owe Use Tax on those purchases. Use tax is the same dollar amount as sales tax. You can look it up in your state's laws, the $700 limit may be slightly different. Not paying this is evasion.

I did not debate morals or law-breaking in this or my prior post, I simply stated facts. Try to read only what I type, not adding to my words for me. I can be quite profuse without your assistance.
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Umm.. you are the one who said

JAT said:
For future reference:
Tax evasion is illegal and immoral.
Abusing the student store is immoral.
Click to expand...

This is part fact, apparently, and part opinion. Thus, you did not just "state facts." I find my State to be immoral in numerous ways that would justify me not paying taxes, but I'm not Henry David Thoreau... but that is beside the point of this thread.

Yes, I had no idea about the dictates of state tax laws and out of state purchases. I'm not sure I want to thank you for that bit of information since ignorance was bliss.:p


yt
 
all students in this thread, just don bother ...

we always hav some old man using their jealous eye lookin at us

its good to be young, at least we dont feel guilty and even talk about it when downloading mp3s from p2p website... look at those old men, how many of them claims to be a IP fan and keep seeidng their porn at night?
 
yojitani said:
This is part fact, apparently, and part opinion. Thus, you did not just "state facts." I find my State to be immoral in numerous ways that would justify me not paying taxes, but I'm not Henry David Thoreau... but that is beside the point of this thread.

Yes, I had no idea about the dictates of state tax laws and out of state purchases. I'm not sure I want to thank you for that bit of information since ignorance was bliss.:p


yt
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You're welcome. ;)

No, the above was all fact. I was defining the terms illegal and immoral for purposes of this discussion. They are different and people confuse them. And people tend to think that just because they are happy to be immoral that an act is therefore not immoral. That is a misunderstanding that many people make.

Here's some more definition:

Legality is hard and fast, yes or no. Breaking Apple's rule is breach of contract, not a criminal act. Legality doesn't really apply. Not paying tax is illegal, the govt says so.

Immorality is more of a judgement call and depends on the society and the individual. I did state that the level of immorality varies for each person, but there is no doubt that breaking a company's rules or breaking a law is an immoral act. If you are at 100% belief that the issue is immoral, you would never do it, if you are at 1% you'd always do it. But there is no 0%.

Your opinion of your state may well be justified. Personally, I find all human rule/politics completely immoral. I never said whether I would buy from Amazon or using a student discount when I wasn't a student. I may agree with you completely or be even less moral than you, you may never know. :p

BTW, I'm probably at "old man". But I'm also a student. I can do whatever I want on this. At least until 12/21 when I get my last degree.
 
JAT said:
Here's some more definition:

Legality is hard and fast, yes or no. Breaking Apple's rule is breach of contract, not a criminal act. Legality doesn't really apply. Not paying tax is illegal, the govt says so.

Immorality is more of a judgement call and depends on the society and the individual. I did state that the level of immorality varies for each person, but there is no doubt that breaking a company's rules or breaking a law is an immoral act. If you are at 100% belief that the issue is immoral, you would never do it, if you are at 1% you'd always do it. But there is no 0%.
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hmm... I'm not sure I 100% follow your reasoning, but there is a hint of Kant in your definition that makes me suspicious. It depends on where you locate moral judgment. What you say seems possible only if one accepts a transcendental notion of morality - which is a little problematic from my pov. Please clarify. Also, haven't we gone past the time when we can say "there is no doubt" without drawing a wry grin?

In agreement re: govt./rule, though I wonder how from your definition of immoral you can say 'government is immoral.'

yt

edit: congrats in advance for 12/21. Or should I say good luck?
edit 2: are you at umn?
 
You can check the prices in the North American Apple Education stores from any machine on the 'net. You don't have to be on a college network, or browsing from a specific school. (I don't know if the UK HE programme is different, apple negotiated different terms in the UK) Choose your school, and enter your old student number when asked. Then you can browse the prices and make your decision.

The decision point is when you order, you must agree to the purchase contract which says in part "I am a full time student or teacher and eligable according to the terms of the Education store". If you want to lie here, that's up to you - you accept whatever the consequences are that follow. Don't really know what those consequences might be, but start from the assumption that if you have breached the contract by falsifying information, then Apple has no obligation to uphold their side of the contract.

Of course, you could also forge your school transcripts and give yourself an extra degree when applying for jobs, or fictionalize your writing assignments to national magazines, too. Don't worry, it's been done before and will be again. If you're good with it, then who am I to say.
 
yojitani said:
edit: congrats in advance for 12/21. Or should I say good luck?
edit 2: are you at umn?
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Thanks, can't wait to be done. I'm at Minnesota School of Business. Long-time 2-year business school, they added bachelor degrees at the turn of century. So I went back to tack 2 BSs onto my AAS from a decade ago. Makes the resume prettier. :)
 
JAT said:
Thanks, can't wait to be done. I'm at Minnesota School of Business. Long-time 2-year business school, they added bachelor degrees at the turn of century. So I went back to tack 2 BSs onto my AAS from a decade ago. Makes the resume prettier. :)
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Umm ok, random
 
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