Question on Photo Credit in a Licensing Agreement

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by DirtySocks85, May 24, 2014.

  1. DirtySocks85 macrumors 65816

    DirtySocks85

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2009
    Location:
    Wichita, KS
    #1
    I'm currently drafting up a licensing agreement for an organization to use some of my images in a slideshow/PowerPoint for a fundraising event. I will be licensing 53 images to them for this sole purpose, but I doubt they will be using ALL 53 images. The organization will also likely be using images from other sources as well in the slideshow.

    My question is, what is a reasonable method of photo credit to ask for in the licensing agreement? For the number of images that they are using, a specific byline underneath each image would be both tedious for them, as well as potentially aesthetically detrimental to the slideshow. I would be okay with a simple "Images provided by" type of credit on the final slide, but I am not (likely to be) the exclusive image provider for this slideshow, and I don't want it to appear as though I am taking credit for another photographer's work.

    Any suggestions on how to phrase my credit requirement in the license agreement?
     
  2. Designer Dale macrumors 68040

    Designer Dale

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    #2
    Perhaps make up a composite of some of your images that you are pretty sure will be included and ask that it be used as a closing slide credit?

    Dale
     
  3. Doylem macrumors 68040

    Doylem

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2006
    Location:
    Wherever I hang my hat...
    #3
    What is it you are really after? You don't mention money, so I'm assuming (?) that you are loaning a set of images, for free, to the charity, and they will be shown at a one-off fundraising event.

    If it was me I would either be charging a fee (to pay for the time it takes even just to put a set of pix together), because most people in the room on the day will be getting paid for their time, effort and skill. If I loaned the pix for free, for a presentation, I wouldn't insist on a credit at all. I wouldn't even be drafting a license, unless it was just to clarify the fact that the images were for one particular purpose only...
     
  4. phrehdd macrumors 68040

    phrehdd

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2008
    #4
    Not to be a damper but ....

    Just make up the agreement for the one time use and include all the usual about any other use would be an infringement etc. Forget about the reference to your name being up on the presentation. There are plenty of people who diagrams and graphics and they don't get their name put up in the presentation.

    However, if you believe that they may make printed matter from the presentation - that is where you can get your name added appropriately.
     
  5. Cheese&Apple macrumors 68000

    Cheese&Apple

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2012
    Location:
    Toronto
    #5
    Looking at your website, you're offering paid photography services. Assuming that you're offering to donate use of images for this event, I would simply ask for a credit at the end along with any other photographer. Something simple like: "Photographs courtesy of..."

    You haven't mentioned whether or not printed copies of the presentation will be distributed or if there will be a printed agenda for the event but an acknowledgement in print would be nice as well.

    A little credit for your efforts can't hurt you or the organizer and could help to promote your business.

    However, if they're using photos by a number of photographers, you'll all have to agree to the same means of credit.
     
  6. snberk103 macrumors 603

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2007
    Location:
    An Island in the Salish Sea
    #6
    I would ask for my business name to be included along with the other sponsors. Usually (in my experience at least) during a presentation the charity will thank a number of people/businesses who have helped make the event happen. That's where you want your name included.

    Most non-photographers probably aren't really looking at the photos - and potential clients aren't likely to associate a particular image with their own photo needs. However, people at these events do tend to be loyal. They are there because they believe in the cause - and they will support others who believe in the cause. So associating your name with the cause makes you part of the 'family'. (Consider making this cause someone you help regularly). The best place for your name is on any printed material that folks will take home - as a supporter of the group.

    The other thing to consider - and the cause will let you know if this works for them... is to charge for your services and then donate that fee back to them for a tax receipt. You end up paying a bit of tax since the tax write-off isn't 100%, but often a charity would rather see the donation - for instance they may be able to match your donation with money from another source. It also makes their books look better if they have more donations.

    Good for you for supporting them.
     
  7. DirtySocks85 thread starter macrumors 65816

    DirtySocks85

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2009
    Location:
    Wichita, KS
    #7
    Thanks for all of the feedback so far. Maybe to help get some more concrete answers I should clarify as to WHAT the event is, and WHY my photos are going to be in the presentation.

    I both work and volunteer (depending on what I'm doing) at a privately owned zoo. That's where almost all of my animal photography that you guys have seen here comes from. Every year we have a fundraiser that helps bring in funds to help feed the animals during our off season (we cannot be open year round due to climate issues). During this fundraising event every year, we show a short video placed to music with information and photos about our zoo and our animals.

    It is that video that my photos are being used for. As I strongly believe in the cause and have a close connection to the zoo, I am donating the use of my photos for the presentation, but at the same time, I would like to at least get some recognition/advertising out of it.

    Doylem, to address your post specifically: I actually know that most people in the room will NOT be being paid for their time at this event. We will be primarily staffing it with volunteers, and a few of our regular staff that make somewhere in the ballpark of $8/hour. Sure our Directors and Assistant Director will be there, but they own the place, and are salaried, so technically, not being paid to be there. I suppose I can ask to be placed on the sponsor list as there will be food/beverage vendors and other sponsors there as well, although I think they may also be making a monetary donation to be on that list. And yes, I am drafting the license to clarify that this is for only this particular use. I know my boss, and he's a nice guy, but if I don't specify, the next thing I know, my images will be being printed up in brochures and ads for the zoo without my permission, or without be being paid for their use. I don't mind loaning them for the fundraising event, but if they're going to be used for advertising, I expect to be paid a licensing fee (and will be happy to discuss one at that time).

    phrehdd - The only non-photo diagrams and whatnot in the presentation will be from the zoo's Assistant Director, Matt, who is putting together the entire presentation. There may be other photos of the zoo's animals by other photographers, but whether they receive credit for this or not is between them and the zoo's management; none of my business.

    I hope that additional information helps clear up how these will be used and what the most reasonable method of attribution to request would be.
     
  8. snberk103 macrumors 603

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2007
    Location:
    An Island in the Salish Sea
    #8
    That's good background thanks… and a good cause too.

    It seems to me that you are trying to leverage the use of your images into some increased traffic for your business. A worthwhile goal, in my opinion. It also seems to me that you don't need to target the staff and volunteers… they know who you are already.

    It further seems to me that the people you do want to target - are the same folks that the whole fundraising effort is aimed at… who are people with money - not the volunteers and staff, naturally.

    Are you going to be there working or as a guest? If you are working - it may be harder to use the event to drum up some business. As a guest, then you are free to network.

    Do you have a little logo you can use? Putting a little logo in the corner of each image - discretely - will identify those images in people's minds. Wearing a name tag with that logo on it will then connect you - personally - the images. If someone liked the photo and then sees you walking around with the logo, they will have a reason to talk to you. Which is when you hand them a business card with your logo on it. You've not cemented that branding in their mind. In a few weeks, months or whatever when that person needs a photographer they will remember that visual logo - even if they don't remember your name - and will go through their pile of papers looking for that logo on the card. Of course this applies to the electronic versions of a business card.

    Even if someone didn't notice the logo on the photos in the slideshow, walking around with a name tag with the logo on it gives them an excuse to talk to you… then you can explain that you provided a number of the images in the show.

    I think the biggest opportunity here is the chance to schmooze in a room full of people who have the money to donate to the zoo.

    Also… if the other sponsors need to pay to get on the list, then you should be there too. Either by charging for and then donating back your normal licensing fee - or by showing your boss what it would have cost them to buy the rights. But that is the place to be … on the sponsors page.

    I am both a photographer - and a member of several (serially) arts based charities. For any big projects I have charged for my services and donated it back. Mind you, I'm in Canada - but I don't think the rules are very different elsewhere. The little stuff I just give them… In exchange the Board Members know who I am. I've been hired by other Directors or had business referred by them.

    There is one area to watch out for… if you have signed a conflict of interest agreement, there may be some issues to talk over with your boss first.

    Good Luck

    Good Luck
     
  9. phrehdd macrumors 68040

    phrehdd

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2008
    #9
    Unless there is a location for credits stop worrying about it. I have done various graphics, full poster layout, and more photos than I can count without my name being attached. Then again, where it makes sense or there is location for such credits, I have had my name placed. Often, it is merely found in a "special thanks to...." section. Please understand, I do know how it feels to want credit for work done but I also have had to consider who is using my work and for why. Charities are just that and you might just consider being charitable but have a firm agreement (in writing) about the usage.

    Just so you know, I have had images used in printed media, bus stops rear light photos etc. with no reference to myself included because they were charities. You also might well know that some non-charities often don't want photographer names attached either (as in pamphlets, various promotional material and more). It is just part of the business.
     
  10. Cheese&Apple macrumors 68000

    Cheese&Apple

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2012
    Location:
    Toronto
    #10
    Another thought....

    Where I work I doesn't matter if you're a volunteer, part-time or full-time, pictures, taken while in the employ of the corporation, on their premises or off, belong exclusively to my employer.

    Under these circumstances, I would be happy with a simple acknowledgement.
     
  11. Doylem macrumors 68040

    Doylem

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2006
    Location:
    Wherever I hang my hat...
    #11
    Are you perhaps over-thinking this? You're loaning some pix for a one-off presentation. Good cause. Raising funds. No charge. Erm... that's it!

    I've often loaned or donated images to charities. It's nice to be thanked, of course. But I don't ask to be thanked, or make it a stipulation that I get 'credit'.

    Maybe just enjoy the occasion... once you've made it clear that your pix are for this one purpose only... and not for publication, etc.
     
  12. Designer Dale macrumors 68040

    Designer Dale

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    #12
    Keep it simple like Doylem says. Iv'e seen dozens on presentation videos in my years and can't remember ever reading the credits anyway.

    Dale
     
  13. DirtySocks85 thread starter macrumors 65816

    DirtySocks85

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2009
    Location:
    Wichita, KS
    #13
    Alright, you guys are probably right, I was likely overthinking it. A couple of things to wrap up in case anyone was wondering.

    I gave our Assistant Director copies of the images with and without my logo and asked that he either use the copies with the logo, or include a brief "Images courtesy of" credit at some point during the presentation if he used the ones without the logo. I haven't actually heard from him which he'd prefer, but he didn't seem to have any issues with those conditions.

    At a minimum I needed to draft something up to make it clear that the use of these images was limited to this one-off thing. I know the guy I'm handing these images off to, and I know that if you aren't super specific with him, he assumes he can use it for whatever. Nice guy, but doesn't really have an understanding/respect for IP.

    The idea behind asking for credit was that I'd like this to be a mutually beneficial type of situation. While it is a cause I believe in, I'm also trying to kickstart a business, and every little bit of exposure could help.

    phrehdd - to your most recent post: You're a better man than I for your truly charitable donations without any type of benefit beyond warm fuzzies and pure benevolence. Congrats. I don't typically ask for much, but in this case I'm willing to be a touch selfish. If it were paid work for someone, I wouldn't expect credit in the slightest. I'm being paid for it instead in that case.

    Cheese & Apple - None of these photos were taken on "company time". I mean, I suppose I get free admission into the zoo as a perk of my employment, but my photos are 100% mine. I do them on my own time, and they aren't commissioned in any way. They are all taken in areas of a zoo that the public has access to by paying for admission. I'm not employed as a photographer, I'm paid to aid in interactions between park guests and animals. The copyright (and ownership) of my photos is 100% mine.
     
  14. monokakata macrumors 68000

    monokakata

    Joined:
    May 8, 2008
    Location:
    Hilo, Hawai'i
    #14
    I do think you should insist on the one-time use thing. It's a simple agreement, and it protects you.

    When I was in a kind of event-management business, I would create mailing lists for my clients. All my clients agreed to pool their names -- you put in, you can take out. I learned to add a one-time use clause to my agreements when people would take the lists they got from me and turn them over to organizations who weren't my clients and therefore had no right to the names. At least one race director said, "But you included the names in your services that we paid for, so we thought they were ours."

    Nope. Some simple one-time use language kept that from happening again.

    Plus if your images get away from you, you end up looking like jerk when you complain about it. Of course you're not a jerk, but people are going to say, "He let the Zoo have them . . . why not us?"

    Simple language.
     
  15. DirtySocks85 thread starter macrumors 65816

    DirtySocks85

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2009
    Location:
    Wichita, KS
    #15
    Well, the event that the presentation will be shown at will be this Saturday, but I got to preview the video tonight at a staff party. He used my watermarked versions, and they look just fine in the video. Not too distracting, but I feel like I could get some brand recognition out of it. Overall the video looks great, and my work really shines in it. I think he may want to post that video online as well, and if so I'd be happy to extend permission to allow the video in the same format to go online. If that happens, I'll post a link here for all to see.
     

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