Radeon 9800 Pro 128mb or 256mb?

[Lord Blackadder]

I say go with a PC XFX GeForce 6800GT 256MB for $220 and flash it...I did. (see link in sig for the story)

Between the 128 and 256MB models of the 9800 there is not a great enough difference to justify the price jump IMHO, though the different ports between the cards might be significant depending on what displays you are running.

The Radeon 9800 series is starting to get a bit long in the tooth but it was and still is a great video card that can handle most games very well.

 

[TDM21]

Yes, the card that you linked to at ebay is a PC card that was flashed with a Mac rom. The seller is known for this and depending on what kind of card he is selling, can be very ambiguous. Here are the details on the card

Most PC versions of the ATI 9800 Pro have a 64KB rom chip. The Mac version of the card (and almost all retail and OEM Mac cards) have a 128KB rom chip and therefore use a 128KB rom file. Video card hackers (such as those found at www.strangedogs.com) found a way to shrink some roms down to 64KB and be fit on the PC rom chip. This made PC cards work in Macs with almost no ill effects. The 9800 is a perfect example of this. The problem is when ATI comes out with a firmware update, it won't fit on the rom chip and can therefore leave the card dead.

What the hackers also discovered is you can de-solder the PC video card's 64KB rom chip and solder a new 128KB rom chip in its place. This will allow you to flash the full Mac rom onto the card and have practically no difference between it and a real Mac version. This is what the seller has done.

So basically you bought a refurbished/old stock/used PC 9800Pro that the seller soldered a new rom chip onto and flashed with a full Mac rom. While this isn't a bad thing, the seller has sold the card dishonestly to you.

If you go to the link above and head to the forums you can read reports of just how dishonest the seller is.

 

[macgeek2005]

Yes, the card that you linked to at ebay is a PC card that was flashed with a Mac rom. The seller is known for this and depending on what kind of card he is selling, can be very ambiguous. Here are the details on the card

Most PC versions of the ATI 9800 Pro have a 64KB rom chip. The Mac version of the card (and almost all retail and OEM Mac cards) have a 128KB rom chip and therefore use a 128KB rom file. Video card hackers (such as those found at www.strangedogs.com) found a way to shrink some roms down to 64KB and be fit on the PC rom chip. This made PC cards work in Macs with almost no ill effects. The 9800 is a perfect example of this. The problem is when ATI comes out with a firmware update, it won't fit on the rom chip and can therefore leave the card dead.

What the hackers also discovered is you can de-solder the PC video card's 64KB rom chip and solder a new 128KB rom chip in its place. This will allow you to flash the full Mac rom onto the card and have practically no difference between it and a real Mac version. This is what the seller has done.

So basically you bought a refurbished/old stock/used PC 9800Pro that the seller soldered a new rom chip onto and flashed with a full Mac rom. While this isn't a bad thing, the seller has sold the card dishonestly to you.

If you go to the link above and head to the forums you can read reports of just how dishonest the seller is.

Oh well. As long as it works, that's fine with me. It's not like it's not gonna work, right?

 

[Foxglove9]

The seller says it will work, so it should, but I would question his claims including one that says it is 2/4/8x compatible AND I especially can't see how he can guarantee that it will work on Leopard (does he work for apple or have a beta?). What's your return policy?

Plus with flash cards, while some work very well, there are a lot of incompatibility issues. Plus you will get no support from ATI if you ever have a problem with it.

I flashed a few cards as well and have been through a lot of bugs and fixes dealing with flashed cards. Eventually I just bought a retail ATI 9800 128 2/4x card for $170 brand new. This was over a year ago.

But his feedback is decent and like you said, as long as it works than who cares!

Oh well. As long as it works, that's fine with me. It's not like it's not gonna work, right?

 

[macgeek2005]

The seller says it will work, so it should, but I would question his claims including one that says it is 2/4/8x compatible AND I especially can't see how he can guarantee that it will work on Leopard (does he work for apple or have a beta?). What's your return policy?

Plus with flash cards, while some work very well, there are a lot of incompatibility issues. Plus you will get no support from ATI if you ever have a problem with it.

I flashed a few cards as well and have been through a lot of bugs and fixes dealing with flashed cards. Eventually I just bought a retail ATI 9800 128 2/4x card for $170 brand new. This was over a year ago.

But his feedback is decent and like you said, as long as it works than who cares!

It will work. I'm lucky with these sorts of things.

 

[TDM21]

Oh well. As long as it works, that's fine with me. It's not like it's not gonna work, right?

Mostlikely it will work in your system.

But his feedback is decent and like you said, as long as it works than who cares!

His rating is doctored. After reading about this guy I have discovered there are ways to make is so some feedback doesn't get posted on your account. If you look through the feedback you will see some were retracted. Those were negative feedback that he was able to get "resolved." He is still a shady and deceptive dealer.

 

[macgeek2005]

Mostlikely it will work in your system.



His rating is doctored. After reading about this guy I have discovered there are ways to make is so some feedback doesn't get posted on your account. If you look through the feedback you will see some were retracted. Those were negative feedback that he was able to get "resolved." He is still a shady and deceptive dealer.

Hmm well. We can only wait and see. I just hope he ships on time so it gets here around the same time the adapter and the games do.

 

[Lord Blackadder]

I wouldn't trust that ebay seller...but then again I am very skeptical of buying video cards off ebay - there are several very honest people out there and a lot of scumbags. They buy cheap, used PC 9800s then flash them to the Mac. Sometimes the mods are done quite sloppily.

Fortunately for you, the Radeon 9800 is pretty flash friendly so you have a decent chance of it working fine, even if the flasher didn't *really* know what he was doing.

One thing to watch - the stock fans on many Radeon 9800 series cards are somewhat unreliable. Make sure to visually confirm that the fan works when you get the card and check it from time to time. It would also be wise to run a temperature monitor app to keep an eye on temps; if the card is getting too hot you may need to modify the cooling system (or the card may be borked).

If you have any problems I suggest going over to the Strangedogs video card flashing forums. Several of their members even repair poorly modded cards for a reasonable fee.

Bottom line: I always flash my own. It's a pain in the butt sometimes but If I screw something up I only have myself to blame. But I'm not lecturing you. Hopefullly the card will be fine and you'll have hours of fragging enjoyment out of one of ATI's great video cards.

 

[Foxglove9]

I second this, at least bookmark the site for future use. Like he said, the 9800 is one of the more friendly cards to flash so chances are it'll be fine.

If you have any problems I suggest going over to the Strangedogs video card flashing forums. Several of their members even repair poorly modded cards for a reasonable fee.

 

[macgeek2005]

I wouldn't trust that ebay seller...but then again I am very skeptical of buying video cards off ebay - there are several very honest people out there and a lot of scumbags. They buy cheap, used PC 9800s then flash them to the Mac. Sometimes the mods are done quite sloppily.

Fortunately for you, the Radeon 9800 is pretty flash friendly so you have a decent chance of it working fine, even if the flasher didn't *really* know what he was doing.

One thing to watch - the stock fans on many Radeon 9800 series cards are somewhat unreliable. Make sure to visually confirm that the fan works when you get the card and check it from time to time. It would also be wise to run a temperature monitor app to keep an eye on temps; if the card is getting too hot you may need to modify the cooling system (or the card may be borked).

If you have any problems I suggest going over to the Strangedogs video card flashing forums. Several of their members even repair poorly modded cards for a reasonable fee.

Bottom line: I always flash my own. It's a pain in the butt sometimes but If I screw something up I only have myself to blame. But I'm not lecturing you. Hopefullly the card will be fine and you'll have hours of fragging enjoyment out of one of ATI's great video cards.

That's gonna be tough to visually see if the fan works, cause my computer is situated on the floor between a desk and a wall, i'll have to set it up somewhere else to run it with the door open and watch the fan.......... Do I really need to do that?

Could you suggest some temperature apps?

 

[Foxglove9]

I would say don't worry about it. Just check it initially when you first install the card and plug in the power cable to the card. Boot up with the case open and make sure the fan is spinning and looks normal. Close up and test your machine out a bit, running some hardware tests. Also check rebooting and make sure that works too. You can pop open the case again if you want to check the fan, usually you can hear it through the case since those PC fans can be noisy.

Most likely if the fan did die out, you would see artifacts on your screen, almost looking like a little snow or static (think of the photoshop noise filter if you have ever used that.). If that happens you might have a problem with heat or memory on the card. Another thing is your screen could lock up or go black. You can run the card fanless doing regular tasks for a little while anyway without risk of ruining it. So you would have time to react most likely. But you know anything is possible. I wouldn't worry really.

That's gonna be tough to visually see if the fan works, cause my computer is situated on the floor between a desk and a wall, i'll have to set it up somewhere else to run it with the door open and watch the fan.......... Do I really need to do that?

 

[macgeek2005]

I would say don't worry about it. Just check it initially when you first install the card and plug in the power cable to the card. Boot up with the case open and make sure the fan is spinning and looks normal. Close up and test your machine out a bit, running some hardware tests. Also check rebooting and make sure that works too. You can pop open the case again if you want to check the fan, usually you can hear it through the case since those PC fans can be noisy.

Most likely if the fan did die out, you would see artifacts on your screen, almost looking like a little snow or static (think of the photoshop noise filter if you have ever used that.). If that happens you might have a problem with heat or memory on the card. Another thing is your screen could lock up or go black. You can run the card fanless doing regular tasks for a little while anyway without risk of ruining it. So you would have time to react most likely. But you know anything is possible. I wouldn't worry really.

I think i'll sell the card, and sell the 9000 Pro that's in the machine, and with the money put together i'll buy the $259 Real Mac card from OWC...........

 

[macgeek2005]

I found this! And now I regret buying from that guy.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16814102623

It's $30 cheaper than on OWC and it's the exact same card, a real mac card with 256 vram and a box and everything.

I emailed the seller asking to cancel the purchase and see if we can come to an agreement of some sort, and if he refuses, i'm selling the card and buying this one.

edit: Yes, I have the patience to wait that long to play the games. I want the best, not some crappy flashed card.

 

[Foxglove9]

Be careful on NewEgg mac specific stuff. They tend to make a lot of errors in their descriptions and don't back up their stuff when you get it, open it and find out their info was wrong and won't take it back. It's happened to me.

Also they pick and choose what customer comments they want on their site. There are so many junky products that have rave reviews. I know they've rejected a lot of my comments so I don't even read or trust them anymore.

I found this! And now I regret buying from that guy.

 

[macgeek2005]

Be careful on NewEgg mac specific stuff. They tend to make a lot of errors in their descriptions and don't back up their stuff when you get it, open it and find out their info was wrong and won't take it back. It's happened to me.

Also they pick and choose what customer comments they want on their site. There are so many junky products that have rave reviews. I know they've rejected a lot of my comments so I don't even read or trust them anymore.

Um, my older brother buys from newegg all the time, and all his friends say it's by far the best place. They're PC users, but still, I don't see why it would be different.

 

[macgeek2005]

Alright **** it. I've made up my mind. I'm buying the 256mb card from OWC, RIGHT NOW, i'll deal with the rest later.

Thanks for the help guys.

Bye

 

[Foxglove9]

Yeah they do have great prices, I buy lots from them as well. I use primarily a mac but I also have 2 pc's here as well. I don't know why it's just they mislabel a lot of their mac only products. Just double check model numbers on the manufacture websites for any mac hardware you buy from them. I only brought it up because their return policy isn't the best.

Good luck with the new card!

Um, my older brother buys from newegg all the time, and all his friends say it's by far the best place. They're PC users, but still, I don't see why it would be different.

 

[macgeek2005]

Yeah they do have great prices, I buy lots from them as well. I use primarily a mac but I also have 2 pc's here as well. I don't know why it's just they mislabel a lot of their mac only products. Just double check model numbers on the manufacture websites for any mac hardware you buy from them. I only brought it up because their return policy isn't the best.

Good luck with the new card!

Oh, in that case I will buy from newegg, because the number is the same. I checked it. 100-435058. I should be okay right?

edit: These are the same right? At OWC they don't show that number....

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16814102623

http://eshop.macsales.com/item/ATI Technologies/100435058/

 

[Makosuke]

Newegg doesn't specialize in Macs, but I buy stuff from them all the time, and the item descriptions are rarely mistaken. Besides, if you look at the images associated with the product (which Newegg takes themselves, so they're accurate), there is a picture of the box that EXPLICITLY says Mac Edition, for G4/G5, AGP 2X/4X. That really doesn't leave any doubt about what it is, and that it's going to work. I'm 99% sure that it's the exact same thing OWC is selling--ATI doesn't make that many different cards.

By the way, in checking that part number, I did notice that Amazon has the same thing (their product image is wrong, but that's common at Amazon) for $235 with a $30 mail-in rebate if you buy it in the next 6 days:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000BJBCGG/103-8125419-7531008?v=glance&n=172282

(I hate mail-in rebates, but I thought I'd mention it.)

 

[macgeek2005]

Newegg doesn't specialize in Macs, but I buy stuff from them all the time, and the item descriptions are rarely mistaken. Besides, if you look at the images associated with the product (which Newegg takes themselves, so they're accurate), there is a picture of the box that EXPLICITLY says Mac Edition, for G4/G5, AGP 2X/4X. That really doesn't leave any doubt about what it is, and that it's going to work. I'm 99% sure that it's the exact same thing OWC is selling--ATI doesn't make that many different cards.

By the way, in checking that part number, I did notice that Amazon has the same thing (their product image is wrong, but that's common at Amazon) for $235 with a $30 mail-in rebate if you buy it in the next 6 days:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000BJBCGG/103-8125419-7531008?v=glance&n=172282

(I hate mail-in rebates, but I thought I'd mention it.)

I hate mail-in rebates too. Newegg is my best choice. I'm buying that card, and i'll deal with that nasty seller inbetween breaks of playing Call of Duty 2 and Quake 4.

 

[Makosuke]

I hate mail-in rebates too. Newegg is my best choice.

It's what I'd do. And actually, I just noticed that the Rebate form linked on Amazon's site says that it's valid for all online orders--nothing specfic to Amazon. Meaning that you could take a shot at squeeszing an extra $30 out of ATI if you want (they deserve it just for making the rebate exist).

Newegg is usually pretty good about linking to Manufacturer rebates, but maybe they missed this one--the part numbers seem to line up.

Worth a look, at least.

 

[macgeek2005]

It's what I'd do. And actually, I just noticed that the Rebate form linked on Amazon's site says that it's valid for all online orders--nothing specfic to Amazon. Meaning that you could take a shot at squeeszing an extra $30 out of ATI if you want (they deserve it just for making the rebate exist).

Newegg is usually pretty good about linking to Manufacturer rebates, but maybe they missed this one--the part numbers seem to line up.

Worth a look, at least.

Thanks. Newegg now says out of stock. I don't know if it said it before or not, but i'm pretty sure it said "In stock" just earlier today. Oh well. I'll be ordering from OWC. I'm sick of this crap. I don't care about the money. I'm buying the stupid $259 video card, UPS second day air.

Thanks for the help.

 

[Livestfastest]

His rating is doctored. After reading about this guy I have discovered there are ways to make is so some feedback doesn't get posted on your account. If you look through the feedback you will see some were retracted. Those were negative feedback that he was able to get "resolved." He is still a shady and deceptive dealer.

Wow, what terrible advice you all give here!

Advising someone to visit strangedogs.com for truth or honesty is like advising the hen to leave the safety of the henhouse and go visit the fox for protection!

Strangedogs.com Moderator Amacapart
Strangedogs.com Moderator Tewlboy
Strangedogs.com Moderator Honor_DJ
(Rubytuesday at strangedogs claims he's 2 of those people alone!)

Do the math. That's 45 negatives, about 15 neutrals, and 9 doctored withdrawn negative feedbacks for strangedogs.com !

Now here's the mac_geniuses feedback for comparison, including the negative engineered by the person who posted above who claimed it was "doctored". Looks alot better to me compared to the absolutely discustingly awful strangedogs.com feedback, wouldn't you agree?

How can some of you be so consciously dishonest to a new person to this website asking for honest advice? Can you even sleep at night?

Obviously, there are nothing but dishonest strangedogs members and their bad feedback infesting these places and giving out bad advice.

By the way, OWC is a great place to buy from.
Newegg should rename themselves RefurbishedEgg. Even when you buy something new at Newegg, it is often open box, refurbished, or used.
And avoid strangedogs.com unless you want to be lied to, ripped off or both!