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RAM Issue: Paging Out (rMBP - 8GB of RAM)
- Thread starter locoboi187
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I thought 8GB of RAM would be way more than sufficient for college, and I'm not even an engineering student who runs CAD or stuff. I simply have 4 windows of Safari, iTunes, Mail, and 1 document running in Microsoft Office 2011. I heard 4gb on even the old Macbooks flew through multitasking. What gives? I know that Mountain Lion is x64, but thats no excuse. I'm paging out and experience lag time to time. I know a restart would clear the RAM and give a smoother experience, but within a few hours in the same boat again. I have the Retina Macbook Pro, base model. Can anyone help me?
What I'm doing is not even considered heavy multi-tasking and I'm not even on a site using Flash.
I usually dont truly exit programs because I don't run many and this isn't a problem on older Macs from what I've seen. This is my first time having a Mac, irrelevant but yeah.
http://i50.tinypic.com/2nkrnv8.png
http://i49.tinypic.com/9i6ww6.png
(I only opened Google Chrome to post this, too lazy to move around Safaribut this browser was NOT open when I took that screenshot from Activity Monitor)
Sorry the attachments failed loading here and this was the only way to post the images. I removed the [ I M G] tag so images won't look huge on a post.
There is nothing abnormal in your screenshots. More RAM will not eliminate your (very few) page outs. This is the way OSX works.
Absolutely. There will be kids surviving on less than what you just purchased. You'll be fine. Just don't take it to parties.
Yes, but that is a small percentage of total LG screen owners, so the probability you will face retention is low. There are also threads on here about light bleed (much more important than IR IMO) that seems to affect Samsung displays more, and that the colour reproduction is better on the LG. So this is trading off a set of possible risks against each other, and the certainty that whatever screen you get still looks a damn sight better than any other laptop screen on the market
Glad to know that this is just how the system works. Very new to Macs. Thanks!
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Yes, but that is a small percentage of total LG screen owners, so the probability you will face retention is low. There are also threads on here about light bleed (much more important than IR IMO) that seems to affect Samsung displays more, and that the colour reproduction is better on the LG. So this is trading off a set of possible risks against each other, and the certainty that whatever screen you get still looks a damn sight better than any other laptop screen on the market
Oh nice. Just wondering, can you link me to the light bleed issue? And I've read that Samsung screens are better than LG on the retina in terms of saturation and color reproduction. Not true I guess?
Edit: Nvm, found the screen bleed thread. Happy to say I dont have that issue either.
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Depends how long you take to get through college doesn't it
4-5 years. Not gonna be cocky and say I can get pre-med done with fast. Haha
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Absolutely. There will be kids surviving on less than what you just purchased. You'll be fine. Just don't take it to parties.
Other kids don't have the issue to have hardware that supports our screen resolution! Although I hear that the Integrated Intel GPU is much more capable then what the software is letting it run. In other words, not to its full potential.
Yeah I love not restarting or turning off my Mac. One of the things I love about it. I just open the lid and bam, ready to go. I don't want to turn off my Mac and is this a bad thing? Would it make a difference getting 16gb of RAM? Others mentioned that this is not a lot of page outs. I think my machine didn't restart for 15hours with that screenshot
The question is: are you satisfied with the performance of your machine or not? If yes, than stop looking at all these usage statistics - they are meaningless. Their only purpose is to let you determine a problem in case your machine suffers from performance issues.
Besides, your page-outs are only 9% of overall memory access, this is nothing to worry about.
Besides, your page-outs are only 9% of overall memory access, this is nothing to worry about.
Go to terminal and type in 'top'
That will give you total runtime. That's quite a lot for 15 hours. I'd consider it. I went with 16gb and have not regretted it.
The thing is though, I don't need 16gb of RAM. I shouldn't for the tasks I do. Everything is running okay so far except when I run mission control when with a lot of desktops open but thats the integrated gpu being slow. I know I sound weird and indecisive but it is a hard decision for me.
Then your computer is ok. Again, stop looking at diagnostics stats when there is no problem - only thing you will gain though this is paranoia
Macs are not immune to malware, but no true viruses exist in the wild that can run on Mac OS X, and there never have been any since it was released over 10 years ago. The only malware in the wild that can affect Mac OS X is a handful of trojans, which can be easily avoided by practicing safe computing (see below). Also, Mac OS X 10.6 and later versions have anti-malware protection built in, further reducing the need for 3rd party antivirus apps.
- Make sure your built-in Mac firewall is enabled in System Preferences > Security > Firewall
- Uncheck "Open "safe" files after downloading" in Safari > Preferences > General
- Disable Java in your browser (Safari, Chrome, Firefox). This will protect you from malware that exploits Java in your browser, including the recent Flashback trojan. Leave Java disabled until you visit a trusted site that requires it, then re-enable only for the duration of your visit to that site. (This is not to be confused with JavaScript, which you should leave enabled.)
- Change your DNS servers to OpenDNS servers by reading this.
- Be careful to only install software from trusted, reputable sites. Never install pirated software. If you're not sure about an app, ask in this forum before installing.
- Never let someone else have access to install anything on your Mac.
- Don't open files that you receive from unknown or untrusted sources.
- For added security, make sure all network, email, financial and other important passwords are long and complex, including upper and lower case letters, numbers and special characters.
- Always keep your Mac and application software updated. Use Software Update for your Mac software. For other software, it's safer to get updates from the developer's site or from the menu item "Check for updates", rather than installing from any notification window that pops up while you're surfing the web.
If you still want to run antivirus for some reason, ClamXav (which is free) is one of the best choices, since it isn't a resource hog, detects both Mac and Windows malware and doesn't run with elevated privileges. You can run scans when you choose, rather than leaving it running all the time, slowing your system.
I posted a screenshot from Activity Monitor on the 1st post. Is that it?
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Thanks for the tips. Appreciate it.
No, that only shows "My Processes". Follow every step of the following instructions precisely. Do not skip any steps.
- Launch Activity Monitor
- Change "My Processes" at the top to "All Processes"
- Click on the "% CPU" column heading once or twice, so the arrow points downward (highest values on top).
(If that column isn't visible, right-click on the column headings and check it, NOT "CPU Time") - Click on the System Memory tab at the bottom.
- Take a screen shot of the entire Activity Monitor window, then scroll down to see the rest of the list, take another screen shot
- Post your screenshots.
And posted! But this isn't when I was paging out. However, these are my day to day apps in use. I still don't know if I should get 16GB of RAM. The concept of future-proofing is stupid though, as nothing is future proof. RAM is just one factor that'll help a machine's transition to the future. But I still don't know what I should do.
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No matter how much RAM you have you will always have a minimal amount of page outs.
When you completely close an app, it doesn't instantly get purged from RAM.
Inactive memory is still allocated but has been deemed inactive via reference counting. Before inactive memory gets reallocated, it is checked to see if it actually inactive.
If it is truly inactive, it is freed. If it is inactive but is still needed, then that inactive memory is prioritized to be written to the swap file before the other types of memory and is more likely to be associated with paging, including page outs.
The benefit of this is faster performance of apps that are commonly used but the negative side effect is a small amount of baseline paging regardless of the amount of RAM.
This makes sure that you are getting the most performance out of your RAM regardless of the number of apps that are in use. Unless very few apps are open, you will have roughly 2/3 active vs 1/3 inactive memory.
Issues can occur when an app in use has a memory leak. In these instances, leaked memory will be listed as inactive but won't be freed when checked to see if it is still needed. Once the leakage has produced a significant amount of inactive memory with very little of it being able to be freed, paging will increase.
But, this would cause more paging than what you are experiencing.
When you completely close an app, it doesn't instantly get purged from RAM.
Inactive memory is still allocated but has been deemed inactive via reference counting. Before inactive memory gets reallocated, it is checked to see if it actually inactive.
If it is truly inactive, it is freed. If it is inactive but is still needed, then that inactive memory is prioritized to be written to the swap file before the other types of memory and is more likely to be associated with paging, including page outs.
The benefit of this is faster performance of apps that are commonly used but the negative side effect is a small amount of baseline paging regardless of the amount of RAM.
This makes sure that you are getting the most performance out of your RAM regardless of the number of apps that are in use. Unless very few apps are open, you will have roughly 2/3 active vs 1/3 inactive memory.
Issues can occur when an app in use has a memory leak. In these instances, leaked memory will be listed as inactive but won't be freed when checked to see if it is still needed. Once the leakage has produced a significant amount of inactive memory with very little of it being able to be freed, paging will increase.
But, this would cause more paging than what you are experiencing.
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Hmm good points. So I guess I would have no benefit of getting 16GB of RAM at all. I play BF3 on Bootcamp and that doesn't even go to 3.75GB of RAM haha
Nope, you would see the exact same thing with 16GB of RAM after a sufficient period of multitasking.
Mac OS X actually makes sure that the RAM you installed is being used instead of the RAM just creating free memory to prevent a minimal amount of paging.
Once you get how it works, it is obvious that Mac OS X memory management is much better. It actually manages the memory to put it to use.
I maintain that your page out experience was unusual. On a system with 6 GB of RAM, using Chrome, Mail, Reeder, Preview, PowerPoint, and Word over the course of many days (not necessarily all at the same time, and probably with a few other light-weight programs run as well), my swap file rarely exceeded 128 MB, and it would take close to a week to get there. I'm now on a system with 16 GB and I've gone for a bit over a week with zero page outs (I usually reboot roughly once every week, so I don't know beyond that). That your page outs and swap file with 8 GB exceeded mine with 6 GB, despite doing pretty similar tasks, indicates a problem.
The problem seems to be that some software that you're using is leaking memory. My suspicion was the virus scanner, but it's not really important: the answer to your question is that 8 GB should be more than enough for your needs, even over the next few years, and doubling to 16 GB would probably only slightly alleviate your problems. The true fix would be to determine what's leaking and either stop using it, change it for something else, or change how you use it (such as quitting it when you're not using it).
The problem seems to be that some software that you're using is leaking memory. My suspicion was the virus scanner, but it's not really important: the answer to your question is that 8 GB should be more than enough for your needs, even over the next few years, and doubling to 16 GB would probably only slightly alleviate your problems. The true fix would be to determine what's leaking and either stop using it, change it for something else, or change how you use it (such as quitting it when you're not using it).
Where does a low ram "slow-down" manifest itself?
My page-outs are currently 2.8 GB and my page-ins are 3.4 GB. I simultaneously run math software in OSX and Win 7 under fusion 5 and I have only 4 GB of ram. Up until a few months ago I was a multi-decade long PC user so I fully understand what a computer "slow-down" is; I just haven't noticed any slow down with my Mac.
My page-outs are currently 2.8 GB and my page-ins are 3.4 GB. I simultaneously run math software in OSX and Win 7 under fusion 5 and I have only 4 GB of ram. Up until a few months ago I was a multi-decade long PC user so I fully understand what a computer "slow-down" is; I just haven't noticed any slow down with my Mac.
