RealPC Delayed

MacRumors

macrumors bot
Original poster
Apr 12, 2001
49,579
10,893
Spymac reports that FWB's reincarnated RealPC will be delayed "a few weeks" due to ongoing OS X updates.

A demo version was reportedly slated for June 1st... but will also be delayed.

Talk of the return of RealPC emerged in early April after Microsoft acquired Virtual PC from Connectix. < a href="https://www.macrumors.com/pages/2003/04/20030416204315.shtml"]A subsequent interview[/url] hinted at significant performance anticipated for the revived product.
 

MrMacMan

macrumors 604
Jul 4, 2001
7,002
11
1 Block away from NYC.
Yes, please speed, we need speed.

VPC makes windows run horrible, dual 1.42's equal to like a 500 MHZ Pentium.

Lets hope the competition will make both products kick.
 

mkaake

macrumors 65816
Apr 10, 2003
1,153
0
mi
how is this supposed to compare in speed again? i don't remember too much of the original discussion when this came up before...

matt
 

JohnHummel

macrumors member
May 22, 2003
69
0
Direct access to hardware

Originally posted by mkaake
how is this supposed to compare in speed again? i don't remember too much of the original discussion when this came up before...

matt
The big upgrade that RealPC is offering is direct hardware access. Instead of having a "virtual" video card that the PC interacts with, RealPC is suppose to be able to let this other operating system talk directly to the video card. In theory, you should be able to do things like play games on it. You probably won't get the same speed rating, but if I can play, say, Ultima IX, or some other DOS/Windows based game on my 867 Powermac and have it work as well as a Pentium 500 in a virtual Windows 98, I'd be happy.

Heck, if I could run Half-Life this way I'd be happy (especially as I don't sniff a chance of Half-Life 2 coming to the Mac anytime soon. Time to upgrade the Game PC.)
 

Mudbug

Administrator emeritus
Jun 28, 2002
3,846
1
North Central Colorado
Ok - I'll be the rumormonger

Maybe the delay is making sure it is compatible with the 970, allowing it to take full advantage of 64 bit processing. Delaying release of even the demo could mean that they've been working on this for a while, and have decided that at WWDC or thereabouts would be good timing to release their product.

My 2¢.
I doubt it, but my 2¢ anyway.
 

RIP

macrumors member
Jul 23, 2002
75
0
Phoenix, AZ
What!

Originally posted by MrMacman
Yes, please speed, we need speed.

VPC makes windows run horrible, dual 1.42's equal to like a 500 MHZ Pentium.

Lets hope the competition will make both products kick.
A 500Mhz Pentium would be very respectable. I suspect you meant a 25Mhz 486SX with 2Mb of ram and 16K external cache ram you had to install yourself in those DIP sockets.

I would take 500Mhz any day if it could reproduce. My 233Mhz real PC runs very fast cirlces around my emulated PC.
 

brandon6684

Guest
Dec 30, 2002
538
0
I hope this helps games out. With virtual PC 6 and Windows XP on a 600 MHZ iMac with 256Mb RAM, the best I can do is Command and Conquer Red Alert(the first one). The video upgrades in VPC 6(not mention it actually being able to run a acceptable speeds in OS X) have helped a bit, but real hardware access would help a lot.
 

Sol

macrumors 68000
Jan 14, 2003
1,564
6
Australia
Optimised for 970?!! I doubt it.

Originally posted by Mudbug
Maybe the delay is making sure it is compatible with the 970, allowing it to take full advantage of 64 bit processing.
Unless Apple themselves are behind this product I do not think it would be optimised for 970s allready. I do not think developers have the chips in their hands yet.

Anyway, considering that Virtual PC was updated just a few days ago I think most people can manage to wait a few more months for Real PC's re-launch. Let us hope that hardware acceleration will work as well as advertised.
 

macphisto

macrumors regular
Jun 29, 2002
233
13
At home
Re: Ok - I'll be the rumormonger

Originally posted by Mudbug
Maybe the delay is making sure it is compatible with the 970, allowing it to take full advantage of 64 bit processing. Delaying release of even the demo could mean that they've been working on this for a while, and have decided that at WWDC or thereabouts would be good timing to release their product.

My 2¢.
I doubt it, but my 2¢ anyway.
My thoughts exactly. Why release a product that would be outdated in a month. Push back the deadline, and release a demo of the program with all the bells and whistles.
 

shadowfax

macrumors 603
Sep 6, 2002
5,849
0
Houston, TX
Re: Ok - I'll be the rumormonger

Originally posted by Mudbug
Maybe the delay is making sure it is compatible with the 970, allowing it to take full advantage of 64 bit processing. Delaying release of even the demo could mean that they've been working on this for a while, and have decided that at WWDC or thereabouts would be good timing to release their product.

My 2¢.
I doubt it, but my 2¢ anyway.
this is my thought, or at least that they want to wait for panther, whatever it brings. i hope it brings enhancements for both 32 bit and 64 bit computing.
 

Freg3000

macrumors 68000
Sep 22, 2002
1,914
0
New York
Re: Optimised for 970?!! I doubt it.

Originally posted by Sol
Unless Apple themselves are behind this product I do not think it would be optimised for 970s allready. I do not think developers have the chips in their hands yet.

Anyway, considering that Virtual PC was updated just a few days ago I think most people can manage to wait a few more months for Real PC's re-launch. Let us hope that hardware acceleration will work as well as advertised.
I agree. They are just having a normal delay-they are not waiting for the 970. I think companies like Adobe and Macromedia would be more important to be let in on the coming 970 than the company that makes Real PC (although all companies optimizing for 64 bit processing would be GREAT).
 

stompy

macrumors regular
Jul 22, 2002
201
1
Don't have long to wait to see if this rumor pans out or not. But wouldn't be too upsetting, since I figured the original reports of RealPC shipping real, real soon were probably optimistic.
 

stompy

macrumors regular
Jul 22, 2002
201
1
Re: What!

Originally posted by RIP
A 500Mhz Pentium would be very respectable. I suspect you meant a 25Mhz 486SX with 2Mb of ram and 16K external cache ram you had to install yourself in those DIP sockets.

I would take 500Mhz any day if it could reproduce. My 233Mhz real PC runs very fast cirlces around my emulated PC.
Anybody here ever run SoftPC ? Now that was slow. (RealPC doesn't share any ancestery with SoftPC, does it?)
 

apemn88

macrumors newbie
May 5, 2003
6
0
PPC 970 & Panther

This sounds like the most convincing evidence that *something* is happening with apple hardware/software. The release alludes to 10.3 issues, but if that does not ship for a few months why the mention of a delay of "a few weeks"?

Not to stoke any flames, but I believe that select deveopers have already received their PPC 970 boxes. Remember the IBM specs...sampling Q2, shipping 2H '03. That falls squarely inline with this announcement, these rumors, and WWDC.

My unsubstantiated beliefs is that Apple is going to ship the 970 in July/August, and release details at WWDC..

We'll see...
apeman
 

kcmac

macrumors 6502
May 22, 2002
462
1
I'll be surprised just to see it. They claim they made an agreement with Connectix not to produce it the past. If it really is faster, why would anyone do this? I would have jumped ship in a New York minute if it worked better than VPC.
 

yumpin yiminy

macrumors member
Feb 20, 2003
35
0
for the softpc to realpc question:


soft windows was discontinued when Insignia decided to pump up realPC.

basically, soft windows ran a modified version of Windows while realPC ran a full version through software hooks to the mac OS.
For example, video was played thru quicktime instead of running straight Windows video or DirectX components. I *think* this was similar to the approach VirtualPC uses/d.

one caveat is that realPC did run DOS games really well, it was the DirectX stuff that made it really chug.

on half-life for the Mac, I'm probably one of the few who actually saw a copy of it running on a B/W G3. faster framerate than the pc version running on hardware at the time, from what i was told.
It definitely looked and played as well as the PC version, despite the hockey puck mouse.
 

bullitB

macrumors newbie
May 29, 2003
3
0
Chicago, IL, USA
Lies, Damn Lies, and Product Announcements

I think this whole new RealPC is a bunch of vaporware and crap.

We haven't seen this product in this century, and we know for a fact that towards the end of the old RealPC releases, VPC was already faster. VPC has gotten considerably faster since then. So, how are they magically going to make an emulator that is faster than VPC is now if the code hasn't been touch for years?

If it sounds too good to be true, it is.

All that said, if this new RealPC ever does get released and it's even as fast as VPC, that will probably be a good thing, having some competition and all. But I can't help thinking that we're being setup for yet another huge disappointment.
 

dongmin

macrumors 68000
Jan 3, 2002
1,708
0
Re: Optimised for 970?!! I doubt it.

Originally posted by Sol
Unless Apple themselves are behind this product I do not think it would be optimised for 970s allready. I do not think developers have the chips in their hands yet.

Anyway, considering that Virtual PC was updated just a few days ago I think most people can manage to wait a few more months for Real PC's re-launch. Let us hope that hardware acceleration will work as well as advertised.
personally I'm a bit skeptical of the speed promises the RealPC folks are making. Having used VPC for a while now, I can't imagine the RealPC having some secret to the universe that let's them make a dramatic improvement over VPC.

Of course, it's nice to imagine that maybe the speed gains ARE indeed dramatic. And after seeing how promising this new version of RealPC is, Steve Jobs decided to let FWB in on some insider info on Panther, 64-bitness, and PPC970. So FWB is now busy optimizing RealPC X for the 970 and Panther. In the greatest of Mac fantasies, the 970-64bit-RealPC combination is SO fast, that it beats out real Wintel systems in Windows tasks. Dare to dream.
 

DeusOmnis

macrumors 6502
Jul 22, 2002
258
0
Ann Arbor, MI
I fully expect to get screwed on price, however. Remember, when you guy vpc, you have to pay for a legal copy of windows as well (at discount i guess). I could see m$ overcharging them or something - it's in thier black books, we seen them do crap like that before.

Dont forget, if you buy a pc with linux on it from Dell, Dell still has to pay microsoft for a full copy of windows anyway. (or at least it use to be like this)
 

bullitB

macrumors newbie
May 29, 2003
3
0
Chicago, IL, USA
Originally posted by DeadlyBreakfast
Ok ..I know its off topic but could you please explain the above statement to me please. It makes no sense at all....
No, it doesn't, that's the point. Microsoft's OEM deal is something like this:

Pay us a fee for every computer you ship, and then every computer you ship may have Windows on it.

So when Dell ships you a Linux-running computer, Dell still (effectively) pays for Windows. This is all part of Microsoft's all-or-nothing mentallity, and it's why they're a monopoly.
 

AidenShaw

macrumors P6
Feb 8, 2003
18,640
4,643
The Peninsula
Optimised for 970?!! I doubt it too.

Originally posted by dongmin
In the greatest of Mac fantasies, the 970-64bit-RealPC combination is SO fast, that it beats out real Wintel systems in Windows tasks.

I've been trying really hard to think of why one would need 64-bit integers or >4GB of RAM (the only real advantages to 64-bits) in order to emulate a 32-bit x86 CPU.

The emulated machine isn't going to ask for 64-bit operations (outside of double precision floating point which is already supported on the 32-bit PPC, and maybe some SSE2 ops), it isn't going to need >4GB....

I think that calling it a "fantasy" is probably right on.
 

sparkleytone

macrumors 68020
Oct 28, 2001
2,307
0
Greensboro, NC
i think its a smart business decision being made here. how many software companies last year put out some new software just before jaguar, only to have to update it majorly in order to be compatible? this way they can iron out the details and make sure that any major changes in the OS are accounted for.
 
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