Retime (Slow-down) 60 fps clip in FCPX

[diamond3]

I've got some footage that was shot at 1280x720 at 60 fps. My fcpx project file is set to 1280x720 at 30 fps. If I add the clip, retime it to 50%, it has a still frame every other frame that is exactly like the previous frame. Does Final Cut Pro X not recognize that it has 60 frames to work from and use all of the frames instead?

What is the best way to slow it down, using all 60 frames per 2 seconds? Theoretically I shouldn't even have to use optical flow or frame blending because 60fps at half speed should play smooth in a 30fps project.

Also, my rant for the night: I hate not being able to copy and paste individual effects!

 

[mBox]

Strange I just did a GoPro test with 120fps and got decent results.
I did shoot some 720p at 60fps last week-end trail biking, I wont have time to process that till tonight to check.
Your project set to 720p 29.97 right?

 

[heyimandy]

Do you have an example of the clip? Regardless 60fps footage bringing it as far down as 50% is not going to be smooth. It's too slow for a 60fps clip unless you use an effect like twixtor or optical flow in Motion.

 

[diamond3]

I'm trying one more thing in a new project. My process hasn't been a typical one which could attribute to the problems. It was cut in FCP, 7toX to bring it into FCPX which created a sequence (compound clip) that I placed in my timeline. I'm pulling out all the clips from the compound clip and placing them in a new project set at 1280x720 @29.97 fps. It's rendering right now so I'll let you know if it was the compound clip affecting it. At first glance it looks like that may be the problem.

I'm using FCPX to take advantage of Magic Bullet Looks to color correct and do some adjustments since there were different cameras being used (GoPro HD Hero 1 and 2, Canon 60d, 550d) in some harsh lighting situations.

The reason for my rant earlier is because MB Looks is added as an effect, but if the clip is retimed to 50% and I copy, paste effects on another clip, it will retime the clip to 50% even if it was at 100% previously. The problem is the event has been cut to music so it just creates more possibilities for errors I have to watch out for. Why it has taken past 10.0.5 to add this ability is beyond me. This and working with key frames are my two biggest complaints about FCPX right now.

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Do you have an example of the clip? Regardless 60fps footage bringing it as far down as 50% is not going to be smooth. It's too slow for a 60fps clip unless you use an effect like twixtor or optical flow in Motion.

Theoretically it should be pretty smooth because it's not having to skip or create any frames since 50% of 60fps is 30fps. So during playback, all 30fps are there without any manipulation needed. I think i'm correct in this assumption, anyone can chime in if I'm not.

 

[heyimandy]

Is all the footage from the different camera sources 60fps timebase?

 

[handsome pete]

Theoretically it should be pretty smooth because it's not having to skip or create any frames since 50% of 60fps is 30fps. So during playback, all 30fps are there without any manipulation needed. I think i'm correct in this assumption, anyone can chime in if I'm not.

That's correct.

 

[heyimandy]

Found this source. It should fix your issues.

http://provideocoalition.com/index.php/mspencer/video/conforming_frame_rates_in_fcp_x/

 

[diamond3]

Hey sorry all, I went out of town yesterday and today and didn't get a chance to look into it more. Here is what I found out.

When I used 7toX and imported the xml file into FCPX, it added a compound clip (sequence 1) into my event. I created a project at 1280x720 @ 29.97fps and drug the sequence into the timeline. I opened up the sequence and started going through the project and color correcting when I noticed the issue for the clips that were slowed down.

What I did was copy all the clips out of the "sequence 1" compound clip and pasted them into a new project at the same res/fps. Then everything worked as it expected and the slow motion sections played back as I had hoped. I never would have thought the compound clip would have been an issue because I thought it was mostly for organizing things. So basically all the editing inside that compound clip was edited and played back at 60fps, so when the clip was slowed down in FCP7, it played back with a skipped frame. But when I exited the compound clip and just viewed the whole project with the compound clip inside, it played back in 30fps and I noticed the skipped frames during the slow-motion portion.

Thanks for the link heyimandy. I never noticed the conform option before. I just used 50% which worked, but it's nice to know if the project was in 24fps that would be the ideal route to go.

Anyway, I'm going to finish it up today and i'll post the link to the final video when it's uploaded and public tomorrow on YouTube. It was a pretty amazing food fight.

 

[mBox]

Did you try taking the suspect clips in the new Project into a Compound again?
Just to see if it occurs on the said clips.
If it doesnt then the culprit is either FCP7 or the 7toX option.

 

[FrankieTDouglas]

I use FCP7, but in FCPX, can't you just open it up in Cinema Tools and conform it to 30 FPS, which would then allow it to play smooth slow motion?

 

[LethalWolfe]

I use FCP7, but in FCPX, can't you just open it up in Cinema Tools and conform it to 30 FPS, which would then allow it to play smooth slow motion?

I don't think Cinema Tools exists anymore.

 

[Artful Dodger]

I don't think Cinema Tools exists anymore.

You are correct, though I did just watch something with Larry Jordan or another gentlemen and I thought that if you placed the higher footage into a project that was 30p it would automatically convert the frame rate clip down to the 30p and from there you can slow it down more as needed with a few clicks and it will retain a nice smooth look.

I don't have FCPX on my MBP yet so I can't give any screen shots

 

[heyimandy]

You are correct, though I did just watch something with Larry Jordan or another gentlemen and I thought that if you placed the higher footage into a project that was 30p it would automatically convert the frame rate clip down to the 30p and from there you can slow it down more as needed with a few clicks and it will retain a nice smooth look.

I don't have FCPX on my MBP yet so I can't give any screen shots

You are right to a degree. Yes it will convert it for you but by eliminating frames to meet 30P. By conforming you maintain all your frames and then when you slow it down it will be smooth as oppose to if you didn't conform it will be rough.

 

[Artful Dodger]

You are right to a degree. Yes it will convert it for you but by eliminating frames to meet 30P. By conforming you maintain all your frames and then when you slow it down it will be smooth as oppose to if you didn't conform it will be rough.

Many thanks, just learning FCPX myself and all these questions here are great learning material as are all the videos on YouTube. I haven't had the chance to play around with slow motion yet as I'm planing on trying it in the next week

 

[heyimandy]

No worries! Were all always learning. To be honest I haven't even dipped into FCPX yet... still on FCP7 and not sure if I'm ready for the switch yet.

 

[FrankieTDouglas]

You are right to a degree. Yes it will convert it for you but by eliminating frames to meet 30P. By conforming you maintain all your frames and then when you slow it down it will be smooth as oppose to if you didn't conform it will be rough.

Okay, so wait... with Cinema Tools, it was EAAAAASSSSSYYY to do slow motion. Just conform footage, done. Has this been thrown away in FCPX for some more complicated process?

 

[diamond3]

You are right to a degree. Yes it will convert it for you but by eliminating frames to meet 30P. By conforming you maintain all your frames and then when you slow it down it will be smooth as oppose to if you didn't conform it will be rough.

I think in the case of the project being at 29.97fps and the source clip being 59.94fps, 50% and conform did the same thing, which is good. I had set it at 50% using the retime editor and then went back and selected the conform option and it didn't require any rendering. I'll be using conform from now on, but it's good to see that FCPX isn't doing any unnecessary rendering if I choose 50%.

FrankieTDouglas: basically you add your 60fps clip into a 30fps project. If you do nothing, it will play back at regular speed (by eliminating every other frame) without you noticing the difference. Now if you want to slow it down and play each frame, you just click the retime button and then conform speed and it will make the 60fps clip 2x as long (slowed down) and play each frame. Here is a screenshot of what it looks like.

 

[heyimandy]

They basically made our lives easier.

 

[diamond3]

Thanks for the help and here is the video as promised that just got uploaded a few minutes ago.

Food Fight: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VCk5uONZbOA

And another we worked on earlier in the summer.
Slip N Slide: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H32m7SI18Ks

 

[Artful Dodger]

Here is the clip I was watching the other week:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4V2F5xjnG24

I was thinking you were in FCPX, then the previous comment will be wrong since FCP 7 had Cinema Tools, sorry for the confusion about that.