I think this is an insane conclusion. I've been using the Retina MBP for over 1 week and simply can't even look at anything non-Retina anymore. Sitting down at a desk in front of my computer working at x distance the clarity is yards beyond the non-Retina junkers.
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Retina MacBook Pro Pushes the Limits of its Graphics Capabilities
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I think this is an insane conclusion. I've been using the Retina MBP for over 1 week and simply can't even look at anything non-Retina anymore. Sitting down at a desk in front of my computer working at x distance the clarity is yards beyond the non-Retina junkers.
Went to the apple store in meadowhall today to check out the rMBP. I didn't notice any scroll lag at the default resolution, and when I bumped up to the highest I still didn't notice any drastic lag when scrolling or invoking Mission Control. I did, however, experience a LOT of lag when resizing windows - this isn't a problem for me because I usually set my window size and leave it at that.
Seems like it would have made more sense to bring "retina" to 13" models which would allow them to run a lower resolution and be less demanding of the GPU. Then next year when mobile GPU's and/or haswell becomes available, introduce Retina to the 15" models and a year later when mobile GPU's advance further, the 17" models.
This has nothing to do with insanity and in your rush to belittle based on your personal views you missed the critical issue. I can not see the pixels on the 1440x900 display. Likewise, anything finer is also invisible. Since I want the added I/O and internal optical drive the non-Retina version is best for me. "BEST FOR ME." Go back and note that I clearly said that this may be different for for those with hawk like vision, better eyes than eye, and wanting more transportability, and etc.
Stop being insulting and actually read the review. I wasn't suggesting what you should buy, merely what works for my eyes.
Criminy.
You can't see pixels easily at any setting. The screen is always 2880x1800 pixels. Pixels always remain the same size, obviously. It's the image mapping that changes according to setting. To say you can't see pixels at "1440x900" shows your lack of understanding of the basic properties of the screen.
WOW JUST WHAT I NEEDED! As a professional film and multimedia artist .... (snip)
Looks like you intend to add "professional forum troll" to your resume?!
Here's a hint: Buy the regular MacBook Pro. It's just like the old MacBook Pro, only faster. No retina display you'd have to get all upset about. And it has a CD drive. I know, it's hard to figure that one out before sitting down and writing angry posts, but there you go, the internet's here to help.
Great, concise explanation. It's a bit hard to wrap your head around I think because we've never seen one of these.
I thought that the higher resolutions would look crappy, kind of like your standard MBP looks at non-native resolution. But I didn't realize that because you can't see the pixels, it actually looks sharp, and just fine.
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I vote to shut down this thread until Mountain Lion ships, then re-open it.
I think I've read about performance problems and scrolling issues about 50 times by now even though it should be obvious that it's a software problem.
Lion is slow on rMBPs - we get it.
This completely blows my mind. I believe that you are telling me what is accurate for you, but it differs from my experience so completely (I've been beyond frustrated with displays being too low-res for the better part of two decades - even when the displays were "top of the line" and no such hidpi thing even existed) that I really cannot identify with your statement. Fortunately for me, others must share my opinion for a 'retina' macbook to now be in production. Fortunately for you, you have other choices.
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That's only the case for the rMBP. He stated that he could not see the pixels on "the 1440x900 screen," which I assume is the cMBP. (He also stated that he "could not see any difference between the two with them set at the same resolution.") I could understand someone not being very sensitive to the pixels on the higher res display (I can still see them plain as day, but it's certainly much finer) but not on the old screen. Especially at 15", 1440x900 resolution is just laughable.
ok I've had my new rMBP for a few dAYs now, so here's my opinion.
Firstly, it's an amazing machine, yes it's form is truly a marvel. It's elegently slim and it's a joy to carry around, it's very light for a laptop with this much power, it's just crazy.
secondly the display, wow, I mean the people on here saying you can't tell the difference need to go get glasses or laser eye. My friend is like that when it comes to comparing SD to HD movies, for some reason he can't tell the difference either.
best way to tell is go to apple trailers and watch the new Total recall, trailer 2 in full 1080p , wow, those city shots just pop off the screen. believe me you can tell the difference, you really can, so don't anyone listen to people who say they can't.
After all the talk on this forum about how bad the lag is and how slow the UI is, almost had me convinced, I actually was dreading it, I thought I was in for major disappointment and was thinking maybe I should just cancel, given what anandtech and others have said. let me be clear, the discussion on performance has been blown way way out of proportion. It is in no way shape or form as bad as people are making it out, I honestly didn't find it that bad at all, It's seriously not a big deal. there might be the odd nano second lag here and there but to me it's very smooth and a great experience. don't let anyone buying be put off by people saying it can't perform because it can, and very well at that.
if you really are bothered by it, just run a third party app to run your resolutions natively until your hearts content,although I recommend if you do that to stick to no higher a res than 1920x1200 as full 2880x1900 is so tiny it's really unusable. i'm using setresx, I tried a few and I liked that one the most because it's a very simple straightforward app. just run it, go to the menu bar and pick the res you want and it will change natively to that res, then to end it, just quit it, go to preferences and pick best for retina or whatever you like, I found this workaround is quite useful for using apps that are not yet retina supported.
I guess there's only a few areas i'm disappointed in, yes a lot of the web doesn't support the resolution, so quite a few webpages are pretty ugly to look at and very pixelated. I hope this get's sorted one day because it's a shame.
and then there's adobe, i'm a big user like a lot of folks on here of After Effects/photoshop and various other adobe programs, they do indeed look terrible on the retina screen, way to pixilated, text in particular looks very bad. so for graphic artists, this is a problem, however I found if I used setresx and kept it at 1920x1200, this really helps and it's a decent work around until adobe update things and don't forget you can always plug it into an external monitor which most do anyways. so it's not a dead end but would be nice to see adobe help out.
Heat, man this thing could burn a hole in my desk like alien blood. yes it's no different from any macbook pro in terms of heat, it's still a furnace when doing intensive work such as hd video streaming, rendering, gaming. so yeah it get's hot.
Overall am I pleased, yes, yes i am, after reading all the comments on here which did end up planting seeds of worry in my head, i'm glad i'm able to say I won't be returning it to the apple store, it is indeed a very good machine.
Firstly, it's an amazing machine, yes it's form is truly a marvel. It's elegently slim and it's a joy to carry around, it's very light for a laptop with this much power, it's just crazy.
secondly the display, wow, I mean the people on here saying you can't tell the difference need to go get glasses or laser eye. My friend is like that when it comes to comparing SD to HD movies, for some reason he can't tell the difference either.
best way to tell is go to apple trailers and watch the new Total recall, trailer 2 in full 1080p , wow, those city shots just pop off the screen. believe me you can tell the difference, you really can, so don't anyone listen to people who say they can't.
After all the talk on this forum about how bad the lag is and how slow the UI is, almost had me convinced, I actually was dreading it, I thought I was in for major disappointment and was thinking maybe I should just cancel, given what anandtech and others have said. let me be clear, the discussion on performance has been blown way way out of proportion. It is in no way shape or form as bad as people are making it out, I honestly didn't find it that bad at all, It's seriously not a big deal. there might be the odd nano second lag here and there but to me it's very smooth and a great experience. don't let anyone buying be put off by people saying it can't perform because it can, and very well at that.
if you really are bothered by it, just run a third party app to run your resolutions natively until your hearts content,although I recommend if you do that to stick to no higher a res than 1920x1200 as full 2880x1900 is so tiny it's really unusable. i'm using setresx, I tried a few and I liked that one the most because it's a very simple straightforward app. just run it, go to the menu bar and pick the res you want and it will change natively to that res, then to end it, just quit it, go to preferences and pick best for retina or whatever you like, I found this workaround is quite useful for using apps that are not yet retina supported.
I guess there's only a few areas i'm disappointed in, yes a lot of the web doesn't support the resolution, so quite a few webpages are pretty ugly to look at and very pixelated. I hope this get's sorted one day because it's a shame.
and then there's adobe, i'm a big user like a lot of folks on here of After Effects/photoshop and various other adobe programs, they do indeed look terrible on the retina screen, way to pixilated, text in particular looks very bad. so for graphic artists, this is a problem, however I found if I used setresx and kept it at 1920x1200, this really helps and it's a decent work around until adobe update things and don't forget you can always plug it into an external monitor which most do anyways. so it's not a dead end but would be nice to see adobe help out.
Heat, man this thing could burn a hole in my desk like alien blood. yes it's no different from any macbook pro in terms of heat, it's still a furnace when doing intensive work such as hd video streaming, rendering, gaming. so yeah it get's hot.
Overall am I pleased, yes, yes i am, after reading all the comments on here which did end up planting seeds of worry in my head, i'm glad i'm able to say I won't be returning it to the apple store, it is indeed a very good machine.
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Well said, I was thinking the same.
The stories are indeed a bit blown up, but there is a certain truth in it.
Not everything is smooth like we used to get on our Mac hardware, there is some minor lag.
And to be honest, browsing the web on my PC (Win7/i7/SSD) with Chrome does feel smoother which is new since in most cases the Mac is much smoother.
But this lagy feel is not with anything, just browsing the web or particular webpages.
For the premium price tag it should have been better, probably if Steve tried it he would't agree releasing.
I can't really blaim them since there is no better solution yet, currently there is no mobile GPU that is either capable of handeling the hugh resolution and still energy efficient so you don't need to carry an power generator with you.
I hope upcoming software and osx updates will solve this, turning off anti aliassing improved this already and since the pixel density is so good its not really useful anymore.
I have tried Retina optimal settings and the two higher res. for me i'm using the highest resolution I still have good eyes so can read small text very well, I like much space and this resolution also has the least side effects with non retina software.
Up until now the MBPr did not disappoint me.
The stories are indeed a bit blown up, but there is a certain truth in it.
Not everything is smooth like we used to get on our Mac hardware, there is some minor lag.
And to be honest, browsing the web on my PC (Win7/i7/SSD) with Chrome does feel smoother which is new since in most cases the Mac is much smoother.
But this lagy feel is not with anything, just browsing the web or particular webpages.
For the premium price tag it should have been better, probably if Steve tried it he would't agree releasing.
I can't really blaim them since there is no better solution yet, currently there is no mobile GPU that is either capable of handeling the hugh resolution and still energy efficient so you don't need to carry an power generator with you.
I hope upcoming software and osx updates will solve this, turning off anti aliassing improved this already and since the pixel density is so good its not really useful anymore.
I have tried Retina optimal settings and the two higher res. for me i'm using the highest resolution I still have good eyes so can read small text very well, I like much space and this resolution also has the least side effects with non retina software.
Up until now the MBPr did not disappoint me.
I've been to the Apple Store a few times to review these things. They are sick. Going to be ordering mine soon. I only experienced the FPS drop when using iTunes album view on the high resolution. I also experience drops on my 2008 MBP, as well as sub 40 FPS on Facebook. I'm not too worried about it.
How's video playback?
How's video playback?
well since i've been surfing the web, it's pretty obvious that it totally depends on the website, in terms of performance as is the case with FB. I'm a gamer, although I didn't buy the rMBP exclusivley for games I do like to visit sites such as IGN and Gamespot. when reading a games review it's very smooth but as soon as you read members comments below said review, the rMBP really struggles, it's extremely choppy. However, these two sites apart from FB are the only two i've experienced this type of lag.
a little annoying, but hasn't yet dampened my spirits.
a little annoying, but hasn't yet dampened my spirits.
How are the fonts displaying with and without anti aliasing? Do you have a couple of minutes to post a few pics, I 've not seen this posted anywhere on the web.
Sure, I will make some more pictures this morning.
I already have one right here: https://twitter.com/#!/Osirison/media/slideshow?url=pic.twitter.com/Yy7vmth7
The fonts are perfect, since the resolution is high and there are so many pixels you can't see the choppy edges anymore (where they use AA for in the first place)
It's not so much of a conclusion than it is merely his opinon about the product. Just because you find the same product more appealing/valueable/better doesn't mean everyone else must also.
He clearly explained his observations, his concerns about being a first generation model, his concerns over durability and stability and objectively described how he couldn't validate the value of a SSD over a HDD during his visit to the store.
All this means is that there's always a product for someone and it's good that there's different products to choose from. He found the normal MBP more of a value for his needs than the rMBP.
Oke here are some pictures as requested, if you want more just ask
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Macbook Pro retina by Osirison, on Flickr
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Cables by Osirison, on Flickr
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MBPr angle by Osirison, on Flickr
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MBPr and Eizo SX2762W by Osirison, on Flickr
![]()
Text zoomed by Osirison, on Flickr
![]()
Text zoomed by Osirison, on Flickr
There are some more in the photostream
Macbook Pro retina by Osirison, on Flickr
Cables by Osirison, on Flickr
MBPr angle by Osirison, on Flickr
MBPr and Eizo SX2762W by Osirison, on Flickr
Text zoomed by Osirison, on Flickr
Text zoomed by Osirison, on Flickr
There are some more in the photostream
Totally appreciate where you're coming from, but as somebody who apparently has 'hawk eyes' I assure you that it has made a hell of a difference for me!
I must admit I had a touch of 'buyer's remorse' for a while before the rMBP arrived, but then just 30 minutes of looking at the new screen, then going back to my old MacBook and the huge difference is instantly recognisable (and made me realise I had made the right decision!)
I also thought the new display was so bright and clear - my '07 MacBook seems yellowish in comparison. I'm sure there's an obvious technical explanation for this that I just don't know about
One thing I will echo is that some applications and websites seem a bit pixelated on the new screen - particularly logos for things.
Sure it has a larger battery, but that makes no difference to me without when that batterys extra power is used up feeding retina. The power of the battery matters not to me, it's the usage time I get that matters.
Unfortunately in this respect there is no real gain. I'd much prefer the extra use time without the retina.
Ok, I have been using the rmbp for a week now and here is my opinion.
I am using boot camp, parallel desktop, watching video, fb...and so far I haven't encountered any issues as described by other user. Battery life is good (when I said good, I am able to obtain a good 5 hours use when using parallel desktop or boot camp and be reminded that there is no automatic GPU switching under window so the navidia card is on all the time...and yes I am still a heavy window user since this is my first mac). May be I am lucky, I did not experience any issues as described by other users, eg lagging when browsing certain websites or ghost image on screen.
USB3: I have no trouble using my external HD with USB3 as stated by some other users which that machine wont read USB3 drive. I have tried all the 2 USB ports and no issues.
Disc drive: I agree with ppl saying that a disc drive is necessary, especially when you have to install another OS on the machine (note: creating ISO boot up disc or drive is not as easy as you may think despite numerous guidelines you can find on web. It is 100% easier to have a disc drive). Also I watch a lot of movie on my computer (since I dont play game...) and some movies are damn hard to find on the internet, especially HD ones. That said, I am very amazed with the slimness and portability of this machine, even when compared to my netbook. I support the ideas of removing the disc drive, provided that you have an external one.
SSD: i don't understand why some ppl would prefer a HDD over SSD. It is quiet and much fast than HDD. The only thing is the high price tag. From starting up to fully function os taking 10-15s. Under Window experience index, primary hard disk (disk data transfer rate) scores 7.9, which is indeed the max scores.
Retinal display: not much to say about this, it is simply amazing esp when watching all these HD videos. I now dont even bother to plug in to my 27" monitor. The only thing I found is that retina display is last well supported in window when compared to osx. I need to configure the resolution and DPI several times when using window before I can obtain a reasonable reading size. Also safari is the only browser that support retina display at this moment and I dont use safari at all. Using other browser requires frequent adjustment on the size of page/ word when surfing. This can be annoying if you do not know how to use keyboard shortcut. Some users complain about the apple native zoom function, and I agree...it SUCKS. Just stick with the default zoom function of the browser.
I am using boot camp, parallel desktop, watching video, fb...and so far I haven't encountered any issues as described by other user. Battery life is good (when I said good, I am able to obtain a good 5 hours use when using parallel desktop or boot camp and be reminded that there is no automatic GPU switching under window so the navidia card is on all the time...and yes I am still a heavy window user since this is my first mac). May be I am lucky, I did not experience any issues as described by other users, eg lagging when browsing certain websites or ghost image on screen.
USB3: I have no trouble using my external HD with USB3 as stated by some other users which that machine wont read USB3 drive. I have tried all the 2 USB ports and no issues.
Disc drive: I agree with ppl saying that a disc drive is necessary, especially when you have to install another OS on the machine (note: creating ISO boot up disc or drive is not as easy as you may think despite numerous guidelines you can find on web. It is 100% easier to have a disc drive). Also I watch a lot of movie on my computer (since I dont play game...) and some movies are damn hard to find on the internet, especially HD ones. That said, I am very amazed with the slimness and portability of this machine, even when compared to my netbook. I support the ideas of removing the disc drive, provided that you have an external one.
SSD: i don't understand why some ppl would prefer a HDD over SSD. It is quiet and much fast than HDD. The only thing is the high price tag. From starting up to fully function os taking 10-15s. Under Window experience index, primary hard disk (disk data transfer rate) scores 7.9, which is indeed the max scores.
Retinal display: not much to say about this, it is simply amazing esp when watching all these HD videos. I now dont even bother to plug in to my 27" monitor. The only thing I found is that retina display is last well supported in window when compared to osx. I need to configure the resolution and DPI several times when using window before I can obtain a reasonable reading size. Also safari is the only browser that support retina display at this moment and I dont use safari at all. Using other browser requires frequent adjustment on the size of page/ word when surfing. This can be annoying if you do not know how to use keyboard shortcut. Some users complain about the apple native zoom function, and I agree...it SUCKS. Just stick with the default zoom function of the browser.
No. You are making all these generalizations and vague statements. The point and reality is that he stated he couldn't really see a difference between the Retina display and the non-Retina display.
I can't believe anyone could reach that conclusion, unless their eyesight was really bad. And even then the screen is so much better. There are many people on here with the same perspective as me, as in:
"I must admit I had a touch of 'buyer's remorse' for a while before the rMBP arrived, but then just 30 minutes of looking at the new screen, then going back to my old MacBook and the huge difference is instantly recognisable (and made me realise I had made the right decision!)"
As a user, I'm pretty confused.
- problems with USB-Ports (incompatibility with hardware)
- kernel panics ( most likely drivers )
- Ghost images on the screen (most likely a start-up production problem)
- Short battery life in some cases ( the extreme 2,5 hours )
The apple support forum is full of problems with the new hardware . I think I will wait little bit. Could be, that the new OS X version brings also solutions. I need a new computer, but I don't like to be a Release Candidate tester.
- problems with USB-Ports (incompatibility with hardware)
- kernel panics ( most likely drivers )
- Ghost images on the screen (most likely a start-up production problem)
- Short battery life in some cases ( the extreme 2,5 hours )
The apple support forum is full of problems with the new hardware . I think I will wait little bit. Could be, that the new OS X version brings also solutions. I need a new computer, but I don't like to be a Release Candidate tester.