Return my new Macbook Pro 15, or not?

Discussion in 'MacBook Pro' started by Politis, Jan 6, 2011.

  1. Politis macrumors regular

    Nov 10, 2010
    Dear friends and amigos,
    I just bought a MacBook Pro 15'', high resolution, matt screen.
    I either want to give it back and forget about macs, or trade it.
    I use my computer MOSTLY for writing, internet research and downloading text files and images, and communicating through forums. Then a little DVDs and youtube, and a little picture editing. I was hoping for a bit of video editing.
    Yes, there are many things I like, but this is what I HATE:

    1/ TEXT SIZE: Apple has been senile or stingy with its high resolution, the letters are smaller, or very small. All my attempts to change their size are either time consuming or make many the letters look like overcooked spaghetti. I have tried everything.

    2/ KEYS: There are no keys for: home, end, page up, page down, forward delete!! Again, we have to use two hands for these operations. So it is more TIME-CONSUMING

    3/ FOLDER: When you open a folder you are stuck with limited possibilities of viewing and, visually, the file names inside it look squashed. For instance, if you wish to arrange the files by date, then you are obliged to select the date in 'show view options', so this crams the Folder box with endless details. Also, the files are shown in one column and they do not run in parallel columns. With PC you have a wider and cleaner choice to view your folders.

    4/ WEIGHT: It is heavier than anything else equivalent on the market.

    5/ OTHER? I could go for a Macbook pro 13'' or a lower resolution 15''. But... they only come with GLOSSY screens. Glossy screen tire the eyes and the black, reflective border is like a mirror. I dont want to shave in front of my computer but work on it.

    So I am thinking of going it PC :-(... I used to have Mac until 2000 and they had a great folder system and were more user friendly. I think Mac has gone for image and marketing and forgotten its word-processing, internet using users. Mac is trying to become all 3-dimentional with is dock icons, etc, too video-games friendly, too minimalistic. Grrrrr
  2. sydenham macrumors regular

    Dec 23, 2010
    You should definately go back to Windows. Go buy a Dell.
  3. croooow macrumors 65816


    Jul 16, 2004
    Based on your post I'd return it and get a PC.
  4. Richard1028 macrumors 68000

    Jan 8, 2009
    Change the mac's display resolution.

    Yes, macs are uber "mouse happy" compared to windows. You'll get used to it.

    You have tons of options to display your folder items. See the toolbar.

    Sorry, you are just dead wrong here. For a 15" laptop the MBP is pretty darned light and travel friendly. You would be a good candidate for the 13" (or even 11") Macbook Air.

    If you don't want a glossy screen then you won't be using the 13" MBP.

    Macs aren't for everyone. It took me probably 4-5 months to adapt.
  5. Shutterbug78 macrumors newbie

    Jun 15, 2010
    If you were willing to drop the cash on a 15" MBP, you can get a comparable PC, as far as specs go.

    I grew up on PCs, and the switch took about 12 hours for me to be a convert with no regrets. Like the above poster stated though, it isn't for everyone and there is nothing wrong with that.
  6. Politis thread starter macrumors regular

    Nov 10, 2010
    Claiming my rights :)

    Thank all.
    @Shutterbut, What did you get?

    I will look at text size and 'glossyness' on cheaper PCs to compare with my MBP 15. Will also look again at the lower resolution 13 and 15.
    What ultimately kills me is the letter size versus gloss conundrum. Letters in computers should be more or less the same size as in books, newspapers, journals. The tiny, small print is for lawyers.

    I feel that the millions of us word-processing users are losing out as gamers and film wachers take priority. We dont want 3-D experiences but a flat, user-friendly surface.
  7. Tomorrow macrumors 604


    Mar 2, 2008
    Always a day away
    This is another case of someone confusing "what I'm used to" for "inferior."

    Yes, migrating to using a Mac as your primary computer does take some getting used to, but I've actually found that many of these things are actually more intuitive than on a Windows machine, and actually faster in many cases.

    Still, if it's about your comfort level, and you either can't or aren't willing to adapt to the differences, then perhaps a Windows machine is best for you.

    Sorry you didn't enjoy the experience, but as one poster said, Macs aren't for everyone.
  8. Vantage Point macrumors 65816

    Mar 1, 2010
    New Jersey
    The higher resolution does make text, web images... smaller due to the higher pixel density. For some people, like myself, that was a deal breaker so I got the regular 15" version. But, I did want the anti-glare but they took that option out with the 2010 versions.

    perhaps a swap might help
  9. fehhkk macrumors 6502a


    Jun 11, 2009
    Chicago, IL
    For you to switch successfully, you have to be a pretty open minded about change. Otherwise, stick to what you already know.
  10. nateo200 macrumors 68030


    Feb 4, 2009
    Northern District NY
    I think you need one of those $250 netbooks..sounds like a better fit

    *This is supposed to make you say "No that's rediculous the MacBook series is a million times better" then make you keep the Macbook of course I could be wrong but i tried...:D
  11. mox123 macrumors 6502

    Jul 18, 2007
    You should definitely return the MBP and go back to PC!!
  12. Richard1028 macrumors 68000

    Jan 8, 2009
    I don't understand. Every word processor I know of has a zoom feature to enlarge the pages you are typing on.

    I'm over middle-aged, have crappy eyesight and use a 13" lowly macbook. On top of that, I came from a 22" windows desktop display. As a life-long windows user I brought up many of the complaints you cite at first but find the "minimalist" features of OSX to be preferable now. I also think the entire OS (including the fonts) is much easier on the eyes. Windows to me now looks like a Fisher-Price toy.

    1.) Try setting your mac's display resolution down to 1024x640. (System Preferences>Displays).

    2.) Under the Finder select View>View Options. Change your icon and folder text size.

    I really never lack for any room with these settings and just about every application easily and proportionately adapts to them. My desktop icons/text/folders are quite viewable.

    I'm not an Apple fanboy either. I could live with or without a macbook but for now I'm glad I switched and have no desire to go back to viral infections, trojans, DLL's, a system registry... etc.

    About the only thing I miss is Microsoft's "Alt-Key" combination for every component of the UI. It's much more keyboard friendly to me. (But since the "Ribbon" took over their Office package even that sucks now).
  13. raymondthimmes macrumors member

    Sep 15, 2008
    Columbus, Ohio
    i've got an old hp sitting around. win 98.

    I'll trade you.
  14. aCondor macrumors 6502

    Oct 20, 2010
    United States
    If you just bought it I would wait. Don't return it yet. It takes time to get used to it.

    If you still don't like it within the return-policy time-frame, return it!
  15. Politis thread starter macrumors regular

    Nov 10, 2010
    I think I found the solution

    Thanks to all for the info and the smiles :)
    Especially Richard1028

    This is what I think I'll do. I'll keep the 15 matt or change it for a 13'' and then buy a 21' external monitor (not a mac monitor). This should provide me with mobility and a large screen - with presumably larger letters - for the bulk of my computing at home.
  16. NickZac macrumors 68000


    Dec 11, 2010
    The initial switch over is usually not fun, but I would say on OS X, you can do things faster. There are literally thousands of commands you can use, and unlike the Windows which only opens a default bar, each control on OS X does a specific action. You learn them pretty fast. Check out the 'Mac Tips' Widget and check this out

    Most of the things you are using are virtually the same in Windows or OS X (Office, Browsers, communication systems) and so going to a PC may still be frustrating as Windows 7 has changed a bit too. A major advantage to OS X over windows which isnt discussed much is that it has been around for ages, and that each improved generation seems to eliminate virtually nothing and instead build upon it, which makes the transition very, very easy and you know that when the next OS comes out, upgrading it is no issue. Also, the OS X upgrade is like $25.

    As far as the screen goes, I hate high resolution screens so I feel your pain, although you can obviously reduce the res, but that computer is probably configured natively to run full res. The glossy/clear screen is IMO better for a few reasons: 1) it looks sharper than 99% of laptop displays...I mean it is sharp, 2) history has shown that it does not 'yellow' as some computers with soft screens do it to an annoying degree (see my old old Dell), 3) The glossy black border I find easier on the eyes because it creates a stable and neutral image which causes your eyes to focus better on the picture and not be constantly moving to observe the background. The eye sees the black in stationary and automatically does not focus on it nor images outside the screen. I'm on this thing 12 hours a day and I have not ever had any eye or head aches. 4) it has amazing puncture protection unlike most LCDs, and realistically, a screen puncture can happen to anyone. I don't have a lot of experience with the anti-glare screen, but I do not really like it and find the resolution to be wayyyy to small. With that said, others will tell you the exact opposite.

    The premium features of the MBP make it far worth learning its native operating system (remember, you CAN install and run Windows). I love my 13 inch MBP, and I had used Windows from the mid 90s through mid-2009. I would stick with the MBP because it has features that are not common in Windows laptops, and if you look at user reviews of the MBP by people who have it as their first Mac, they are overwhelmingly positive.

    If you can't take the 15 back, you will probably be able to find someone who will trade off their 13 plus a little cash. If you decide to sell outright, they hold their value so you won't take much of a loss. If you decide to go to a PC laptop, check out the Vaio Z Series. I would say they are built as well as the MBP (and their $4.5k flagship may be better), but they are not cheap whatsoever.
  17. Euroamerican macrumors regular


    May 27, 2010
    That's a good solution, considering you don't want to go with a glossy screen. I can SEE your point, as I was in the same dilemma. I finally just gave up and bought a 13 MBP though. I got used to the glossy screen and I use an external monitor when I want things to be "big".

    The Native Resolution Problem is real, and for some people the hirez screens make the fonts just a bit too small. I found that the glossy 13 inch screen was less of a hassle than I thought iw ould be.

    Another option for some would be the 13 inch Air or the 13 inch whitebook, if they don't want the "super-glossy" screen that the standard MBPs have. However, the 13" Air has a denser (smaller fonts again) screen.

    The 15 is heavy. Heck, I think the 13 MBP is heavy enough. If you want something truly light, you're going to need to switch to a 13 Air. However, you may be one of those people, again, who find the 13 inch screen real estate too restrictive.

    It sucks that we have so many choices!

    It takes a little while to get used to OS X if you are a Windows dude.
  18. NickZac macrumors 68000


    Dec 11, 2010
    It really isn't all that heavy. The 13 is about 4.5 pounds and the 15 about 5.5 pounds. Compared to other laptops in its class, it is pretty light. You can get a 15 inch with an i7; a lot of the i7 laptops are pretty heavy.

    Dell's 'paper thin' 13 is 3.5-4lbs depending on configuration; with that said, it uses the Intel Atom processor, which is inferior to the Core 2 Duo or iX series. Most laptops under the size of the MBP 13 are going to use the smaller, energy efficient processors at the expense of capability, as well as smaller batteries. 4.5 pounds seems to be about as light as a laptop can go and be a user's only computer. Obviously there are exceptions to everything I have said, but it's just things I've noticed; and the Air is just an exception to every rule and is well, unique to the rest of the laptop world.
  19. RT2020 macrumors regular

    Feb 18, 2010
    I love angry, irrational fanboy responses :rolleyes:

    To the original poster:

    It's natural to be frustrated when you are so used to doing things a certain way. Imagine a mac user to has who switch to windows... he will have the same kinds of irritations.

    For folder options, you should use the column view (make the columns default wider by holding alt/option and dragging) or use list view.
  20. Vantage Point macrumors 65816

    Mar 1, 2010
    New Jersey
    The regular 15" (not the high rez) and the 13" MBP have the same pixel density - 110 ppi (pixels/inch) for the 15" and 113 for the 13". The high res 15" is 128 ppi. (the 17" MBP is 133 ppi).

    110 is much easier on the eyes for a laptop but not for a larger monitor like the 27" iMac which is also 110 ppi. The difference is that a iMac being larger is placed further away and therefore the apparent size of the fonts are smaller - similar to what you have. That is why I had to get rid of my 27" iMac - my eyes just couldn't take it.

    So, what I recommend is either trying to exchange for the regular 15" MBP (which is about 50% more powerful with the iX CPU than a 13"). If power is important then the 15" is best else the 13" is nice as well.

    Regarding an external monitor a 24" monitor with a 16:10 ratio, or 1920 x 1200 pixel resolution will have a pixel density of 94 ppi which is more eye friendly. My external is 26" and has a pixel density of 89 and is non-glossy so I can look at it all day long without eye strain. a 21" external with 1920 x 1080, like the smaller iMac is about 102 ppi.

    One final point, when I sold my 13" MBP and 27" iMac to get my current setup (see signature) I also picked up the Magic Trackpad instead of a mouse to use in clamshell mode. The difference is the ability to use finger gestures to easily increase fonts - it is more difficult to do this with a mouse which is why I had all sorts of problems with my 27" iMac - my temporary solution was to change the native resolution of the iMac get larger fonts and pictures but using non-native resolution is not a defeats the purpose of the larger monitor. Too bad Apple discontinued the 24" iMac which was a perfect size and ration for many users.
  21. ~Wade~ macrumors newbie

    Jan 7, 2011
    Might return my 2010 MBP 17"

    On Mon the video card fried on my 6 yr old Dell, so I figured I would spring for a new laptop. I don't really have a lot of $, but I always try to spend a bit more and future proof a bit. The dell was 6yrs old on $1000 an lasted pretty well...
    So I was down at best buy looking at them, they sell everything now, and gravitated to the sony vaio i7, 6gigs ram, 1gig video, 1TB HD, blueray, hdmi out, firewire... $1200 I could handle that had a bit more than that saved after living in my parents basement for 2 years...but just opening the lid of the thing, the entire body flexed and bent. All the laptops there were like that, just very flimsy looking/feeling, and there's no shortage of complaints about them breaking in less than a year.
    So the dood there says, oh... you want a mac, they're way better and made of solid aluminum. An I'm like, oh **** here we go. So he brings this thing out and it's beautiful, solid, nice display, built like a tank. An I started thinking about how all the windows/motu audio combinations I've ever had/seen make that stupid high pitched squeal and drop out sometimes and firewire is a mac thing and I know a few ppl that rave about their macs and everyone on the ableton forum is always talking them up, so I went for it. This thing (MBP 17") was $1000 More, has an i5 instead of an i7, a 500 meg video instead of 1G, 4G ram instead of 6G, 500gHD instead of 1T, no hdmi output, no blueray, and I have to try and figure out if I can get mac versions of a bunch of programs. (no winamp, no @ almost every game I've ever bought/ would want) The store dood says "macs can do more than windows with less ram cus windows is a power hog". As far as I can tell, graphically, it's slightly slower than my 6yr old dell (had a 500M vid also). The ableton/audio side does seem pretty fast and overall a LOT less glitchy. I started noticing the internet was very slow, especially wireless, and now that I search, it's a known problem with a few different fixes that ..might.. work. And now that I'm a bit disgusted and searching, macs are actually consistently slower in Ableton Live audio tests on the forums. To make matters worse, they may be releasing a new macbook soon. There are some things I really like about it, that sort of even it out, but for that kind of money I feel like I should be so blown away that I can't stop smiling. I'm so not smiling. I do like the software side of it, and don't mind the pc to mac conversion... it's just SLOW! Love the physical design. Don't rly care about blueray I guess. Not too fond of having an adapter hanging off the side for hdmi..I'm actually considering paying a $400 restocking fee to return it. I don't even know if they'll take it now that I've installed 30 gigs of stuff on it. There's also no guarantee that a new one wouldn't be glitchy with motu/ableton..We'll see. Computers suck.
  22. Mac Composer macrumors member

    Oct 29, 2010
    I finally got my wife to switch to a Mac after using nothing but PC's. She's a writer and uses Word extensively. The lack of a forward delete key was always the reason that she wouldn't switch to a Mac.

    Simple solution, Quickeys. I used it to remap the "=" key, which she never uses while writing, into a forward delete. Now it's just a single keystroke at the upper right hand corner right next to the backward delete key. Try the Quickey demo and remap any of the awkward keystrokes into something more comfortable.
  23. Animalk macrumors 6502

    May 27, 2007
    Montreal Canada
    Almost all your issues are solvable by reading up on OS X. You simply haven't put time into learning your new machine and operating system and you are suffering for it.

    You can increase the fonts through a simple keyboard shortcut.

    All the keys you say are missing are in fact there. They have all been implemented through keyboard shortcuts. Much of my pleasure of using OS X derives from the exceptionally well thought out keyboard shortcuts for everything.

    I'm not sure I understand what your folder issues are but you definitely have lots of freedom in the way things are presented. Finder->View->Show View Options (or Command+J).

    Nothing I can do about weight. But seriously?

    Glossy takes a couple of hours to get used to but it is definitely less tiring than normal matte lcd surface from my experience.

    Good luck.
  24. mpt-matthew macrumors regular

    Aug 11, 2010

    For most of your problems, you claim they will be fixed in windows OS, e.g. windows, text size. Thought I have bad eyesight and have a high res, I dont know where the letter sizes are too small for you- maybe its because i know where everything is.
    I used a windows PC for most my life, then 4 months ago i switched to a mac, at first i had many of the problems you are having, no cut and paste etc.
    Took me about 3 weeks to properly get used to it, then about 3 months to use it instinctively (not thinking at all). Now things like the delete (forward) are instinctive i have no issue, because i touch type i have both hands on the keyboard so i doesn't take any longer to do forward delete.

    Weight wise, yes its a bit heavier (which it isnt, my old 15 inch was heavier), but it is way way better build, and by far the market leader in sturdiness (no plastic creaking, eugh:eek:).

    If your watching DVDs higher resolution will look better and sharper, and for video editing it will give you more screen to play with.

    Dont get rid!
    First persevere and keep at it for another 3 weeks, take the time to try work around things. If it still isnt going well then get windows 7 and install it on your mac.

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