S.O.S. - iMac i7 & Safari 'Shock & Desperation!'...

Discussion in 'iMac' started by ratGT, Mar 23, 2010.

  1. ratGT macrumors member

    ratGT

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2007
    Location:
    Greece & Sweden
    #1
    I'm a casual computer user with some extra commuter experience/knowledge. I use my Mac mainly for my work (Digital & DTP). Μy unnatural and pointless "perversion" is to have MANY windows open when I work and exposé - I mean MANY windows! (at least 30+ are REALLY needed in order for me to handle simultaneous CMS sites of mine) For example, Safari reaches +80 in tabs on a daily basis (have even reached at one point 215 tabs!), accompanied by Photoshop, Illustrator, Dreamweaver, Cyberduck, Transmission and iTunes (GOD I LOVE OS X ! ! ! :D )

    Until now I was mostly on the run, needing a notebook. My 2006 17" MBP lived past my expectations. It was a REAL workhorse. Sooner or later, I understood though that I would not be able to go by 2009 and get into 2010 with the same CPU (2.33GHz) , RAM (3GB), Adobe CS (3)/OS X (10.5) and screen estate of the external 20" monitor. For the sake of more proper work unit, I sacrificed my MBP (sold it), laid cash on the side (with great effort) and aimed for the king of the iMacs - The i7!

    After moths of a hopeless hunting of an i7 unit, I finally managed to literally snatch the last unit from retail seller! After 2 days of nail-biting await, it finally arrived bringing me a wave of happiness and a much needed relief. Unpacking it like crazy, I immediately place it in my work-space, which I of course had set-up according to my iMac.

    I hardly could forget the 2-year-ago experience I had in front of an 8-core Mac Pro. Thinking I would revive those moments of happiness, I eagerly booted up my i7 and went through the initial set-up (factory-installed SL).
    I remembered that the first boot was pretty slow, so blaming it to its virginal power-up I rebooted it, expecting now all the core power to push the machine to a "Mach-1 speed" of boot-up. And there was my first unexpected turn-off (yet a minor one, compared to the one that followed) - It took almost 2 minutes to get into Mac OS X (scaring me off to my guts, as it took more than 30 seconds to show the initial white-screen Apple-logo).

    After a moment of thoughts-flooding, I remembered the classic PRAM issue, so I rebooted resetting it. And there it was! No more than 20 seconds!… "Wowwwww" I thought to myself… I fiddled around almost childishly, just for the sake of seeing all my actions happening three-times (x3 +) the speed I was used to.
    So after a good hour of play-time and OS X tweaking & settings session, it was time for my crucial test - The Safari flooding! "Oh yeah…" I thought to myself, "Count those tabs and drool endlessly as they multiply by hundreds, you nasty little surfer!…"
    But no, the so much awaited crazy-tabbing session never lived up to my expectations - Heck, it was even worse than my previous Mac! Safari (4.04) could barely reach 60-80 tabs and already started getting the i7 down to its knees!!! (not to talk about the rest of the windows/applications, 'stuttering' in every exposé I made) What A MAJOR turn-off!!! "Wait I minute" I thought. "Let's give it a go from the beginning". So, without having installed anything extra on the Hard Disk, I rebooted, erased the HD and re-installed SL. As soon it finished and came back into OS X (really fast this time again), I immediately did ALL the updates, adding this time Safari 4.05 to its arsenal. Opening it up, reloading those 60-80 tabs is when experienced my COMPLETE turn-off - My i7 was just as sluggish as before! "WHAT THE @#$%&#^ !!!!" I screamed, full of pessimism and terror! I tried this again and again, repairing permissions, resetting Safari, erasing the Safari plist in Preferences, etc. but no matter what I tried, there was NO difference AT ALL…

    Now I'm at desperate point, not knowing what to do! Am I being a noob somehow? Is there any problem with the damn Seagate HD? (something that I don't even dare to imagine, as I wouldn't know when I would ever get back my i7 - My country's Mac service and i7 availability suck hard). Would Safari work up to its expectations if I booted up SL in 64 bit mode? (in which case I'm better off with another 4GB RAM)… I don't know… I'm running out of ideas and solutions…

    I BEG EVERYBODY reading this, from the bottom of my heart, PLEASE HELP me with any ideas/tips/solutions, as my situation can't get any worse… I'm really desperate and feel really helpless!!!…


    ...Than you! :(
     
  2. Hellhammer Moderator

    Hellhammer

    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2008
    Location:
    Finland
    #2
    Try another browser e.g. Chrome or Firefox. Snow Leopard's Safari is totally rewritten to 64-bit so that may be causing issues even though it shouldn't
     
  3. ratGT thread starter macrumors member

    ratGT

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2007
    Location:
    Greece & Sweden
    #3
    Yeah, I think too that it's the 64 bit version of Safari that's causing this! Trying the multitab-frenzy on Firefox, Chrome, Opera, etc. with 30+ tabs, it alls seems to be fine. The moment I do that on Safari, i7 gets almost knocked-down!

    I would REALLY want to 'replace' Safari until this situation 'clears up', but I really can't come up with any browser that comes in even close to Safari's native Mac OS X feel and 'legit' behavior, not to mention Safari's Developer menu, its Activity window, bookmark & top-sites handling, etc. (maybe Chrome & Opera are the closest ones...) Also, none of the other browsers can handle so well those crazy amounts of tabs...

    Sometimes I miss the Intel Core 2 Duo @ 2.33GHz days on Leopard (Oh, what an irony! :( ...)
     
  4. Hellhammer Moderator

    Hellhammer

    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2008
    Location:
    Finland
    #4
    There are Safari themes for Chroma and Firefox if that it what you want ;)

    Try running Safari in 32-bit mode (Open Finder -> Applications -> Right-click Safari and select show information -> Check "Open Safari in 32-bit mode"

    I don't know does 32-bit Safari available in Apple's site work but you could try that as well
     
  5. NiuFengLe macrumors member

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2009
    #5
    215 tabs is a lot o porn... Maybe it's so smart that it's getting distracted by what you are looking at.
     
  6. MacHamster68 macrumors 68040

    MacHamster68

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2009
    #6
    i guess it has also somthing to do with the fact of only 4 gb ddr3 ....once the ram is filled up with all the apps and websites you opened it is using your virtual memory and that is on the harddisc which is just a ordinary 7200rpm harddrive like in any other computer since 2004
    and with all the things you got open the fact that the i7 and the motherboard and ram could handle things faster you create a bottleneck by using a lot virtual memory


    modern operating systems need more ram to work proper so do modern apps
    the i7 with the 4gb ships really only with the minimum
    3 years ago 4gb had been a lot and worked well ,but today to run the same things in a modern form (means up to date apps and up to date OS) is just bare minimum

    so you got now three options
    option 1 : more ram i think the i7 is made for 16gb ddr3 ram
    option 2 : buy a ssd , you get now 500gb ssd's "ocz collosus" for example
    option 3 : option 1 and 2 together

    then it should handle most of what you throw at it (only limited by the graphics card )
     
  7. Hellhammer Moderator

    Hellhammer

    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2008
    Location:
    Finland
    #7
    That does not explain why it ran fine on 2.33GHz MBP with 3GB of DDR2 and very likely a 5400rpm HD running Leopard...

    It's something to do with the software because other browsers work fine under his heavy usage
     
  8. MacHamster68 macrumors 68040

    MacHamster68

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2009
    #8
    sure it does leopard needs less from everything to perform the same task compare to snow leopard

    i bought a macpro a couple days ago which had both installed leopard and snow leopard on separate hdd , leopard was quicker in every aspect , really not something i would keep , bought it only because i could make a good deal reselling it , because in real world every day tasks like simple opening word docs , webbrowsing , not really any noticeable speed advantage over my eMac with tiger
    ok it was faster yes, but realy only seconds so not worth mentioning
     
  9. Hellhammer Moderator

    Hellhammer

    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2008
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    Finland
    #9
    Snow Leo ain't heavier than Leopard, it's just rewritten, may be lighter actually... And it STILL doesn't explain why other browser do fine. It's very likely a bug in 64-bit Safari because i7 should have no problems handling even huge amount of tabs.
     
  10. MacHamster68 macrumors 68040

    MacHamster68

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2009
    #10
    maybe , but upgrading is always better
    and btw the i7 has hyperthreading and osx snow leopard can still not take full advantage of that , and most apps cant either , maybe in 2 years more apps can take advantage of it ,which would really speed things up then ,
    but at the moment ..... no point to buy a i7 really
     
  11. Hellhammer Moderator

    Hellhammer

    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2008
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    Finland
    #11
    Upgrading wouldn't help in this situation. Hardware can't fix software issues.

    i7 is definitely worth it. There are some apps already which can take advantage of Hyper-Threading and they show significant performance boost, up to 30% I guess. Within a year or so, there will be way more HT supporting apps, making the 200$ it costs well invested

    http://www.macworld.com/article/143970/2009/11/core15_imac.html
     
  12. MacHamster68 macrumors 68040

    MacHamster68

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2009
    #12
    i do not disagree,that it might be safari causing the problem

    i just say everything has to work together , the hardware the OS and the apps
    if one isn't able to the whole advantage is zero or even worth
     
  13. jkwuc89 macrumors member

    jkwuc89

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2006
    Location:
    Powell, OH
    #13
    LOL!!! A little humor goes a long way. Seriously, 215 tabs is a lot. Would like to see a screen shot of that.
     
  14. ratGT thread starter macrumors member

    ratGT

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2007
    Location:
    Greece & Sweden
    #14
    May I correct the picture here - Besides that we're talking about 215 tabs (with most sites including heavy javascripts & flash) (and NO,we're NOT TALKING about pr0n, unless I was designing such a site), there were also at least another 6-10 applications open, doing their thing (ripping, encoding, burning, audio playback and much much more...) and heck, I even had VMWare sometimes open simultaneously, running damn Win XP!!!

    That is what really 'shocks' me... Damn it, even the 2001 1GHz G4 did most of the above on Tiger, almost flawlessly!...

    I think that I'll agree with Hellhammer's approach rather than MacHamster68's... Not that the i7 isn't worth more RAM and a mighty fine SSD, but like I previously said, when I see the G4 doing all this joggling with hardware from another time & generation of the past, it really makes me feel stupid in front of the 60+ tabbed Safari on my i7.

    And hell, that's the reason why I chose Macs over Windowz in the first place... Cause of its REAL, CPU/RAM/GPU squeezing, flawless multitasking magic of Mac OS X.... Ahhh, those were SOME magical times!... :rolleyes:

    Anyway, I'll try to run Safari in 32-bit mode & in the tabs frenzy mode, and I will get back to ya...
     
  15. niuniu macrumors 68020

    niuniu

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2009
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    A man of the people. The right sort of people.
    #15
    In a similar vein I've switched from Safari after the SL upgrade because it wasn't running smoothly under heavy operation. I use Chrome and Firefox simultaneously now (need to use 2 different browsers to handle multiple accounts) and everything's going great. I used Safari as my no.1 browser for quite a while and always regarded it as the best out there - I'm just not sure what the problem is with it on my setup. Will try it again after the new MBPs are out..
     
  16. ratGT thread starter macrumors member

    ratGT

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2007
    Location:
    Greece & Sweden
    #16
    Yeah, most probably that's what I'll force myself to do - Switch for the time being to another set of browsers. Maybe not Firefox though and rather Opera + some other Webkit browser, like Chrome (as my multi-tab surfing experience has proven Webkit browsers & Opera to be capable to bare these kind of weights. Maybe not as old Safari, but good enough).

    Don't keep so many hopes though on any drastic changes on your new MBP when it comes to Safari - It's going to be more or less the same, unless the make a BIG change on 4.1 (or something) and bring it back to its 'old multitasking glory'...
     

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